Toys 'R' Us Roof collapses...

Post by **haas mark** » 2003-02-22 12:44pm

http://www.msnbc.com/news/875969.asp?cp1=1

IT’S UNCLEAR how many people are inside the store in the Landover Hills area.
The area got more than a foot of snow last weekend, and it has been raining heavily since yesterday. A number of roofs in the Washington D.C.-area have caved in since the snowfall because of the weight of the snow.
Hugh Harris, fire marshall at the West Lanham Hills Fire Department, told NBC News that 40 percent of the roof of the single-story building collapsed.
Once this happened the evacuation alarm was sounded, but some people are currently trapped inside, he said.
Rescue teams and 12 medical units have been sent to the scene.
He said the store had been open for about four hours, so he thinks there are both employees and customers trapped inside.
The D.C. fire department is also sending a team to the scene.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2003-02-22 02:02pm

Bizarre.

Post by **AdmiralKanos** » 2003-02-22 02:07pm

Snow load is part of standard civil engineering constraints for public buildings. Somebody obviously fucked up.

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-02-22 02:31pm

AdmiralKanos wrote:Snow load is part of standard civil engineering constraints for public buildings. Somebody obviously fucked up.

Do you know if this is true even for areas that do not get snow. Like where I live for example? ( Just a few miles NE of Silicon Valley )

Does snow load assume a heavy wet snow?

ArmorPierce · Post by **ArmorPierce** » 2003-02-22 02:33pm

I don't think they would consider snow for your area if it doesn't get any snow. They would consider other natural factors though.

Post by **AdmiralKanos** » 2003-02-22 02:33pm

TrailerParkJawa wrote:
AdmiralKanos wrote:Snow load is part of standard civil engineering constraints for public buildings. Somebody obviously fucked up.
Do you know if this is true even for areas that do not get snow. Like where I live for example? ( Just a few miles NE of Silicon Valley )

Washington DC gets snow. They should have designed for it. Moreover, even areas which get infrequent show should design for it. Engineering risk is the probability of an event multiplied by the magnitude of that event.

Does snow load assume a heavy wet snow?

Yes. Obviously, you design for the worst-case scenario, just as skyscrapers are designed for high winds, not a mild breeze.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-02-22 02:35pm

Good lord, what is this, national disaster week? This makes three.

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-02-22 02:49pm

ArmorPierce wrote:I don't think they would consider snow for your area if it doesn't get any snow. They would consider other natural factors though.

Earthquakes are the main danger here. Landslides and wildfires are a big danger in some areas too. One of the big reasons we did not see widespread destruction in 1989 was good building codes.

Darth Balls · Post by **Darth Balls** » 2003-02-22 03:30pm

remember that blizzard back in 93? I was about to go to a borders book store, but i changed my mind at the last minute, I went to a mall instead, after leaving the mall I heard on the radio that the roof of the borders I was going to go to had collapsed for the same reason as this toys r us.
weird

Rubberanvil · Post by **Rubberanvil** » 2003-02-22 03:34pm

AdmiralKanos wrote:Snow load is part of standard civil engineering constraints for public buildings. Somebody obviously fucked up.

Just by not removing the snow off of the roof.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-22 04:47pm

Rubberanvil wrote:
AdmiralKanos wrote:Snow load is part of standard civil engineering constraints for public buildings. Somebody obviously fucked up.
Just by not removing the snow off of the roof.

If its the size of the Toys 'R' Us's where I am, you'd never be able to clear off the roofs unless you got a crane and put a snowplow up there.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2003-02-22 04:50pm

Odd that... I for a fact that my Local Toys R Us when I lived in North Carolina was designed to hold six feet of snow and a nearly another few PPS onto of that nevermind the record was roughly four and 1/2 feet of snow for that area
Considering thats NC I wonder how much lower the Standerds had to have been in DC which is much farther north

Post by **haas mark** » 2003-02-22 04:52pm

Mr Bean wrote:Odd that... I for a fact that my Local Toys R Us when I lived in North Carolina was designed to hold six feet of snow and a nearly another few PPS onto of that nevermind the record was roughly four and 1/2 feet of snow for that area
Considering thats NC I wonder how much lower the Standerds had to have been in DC which is much farther north

It's coastal, so there is actually a lot less snow, because it also is not in a mountain range. Probably, it would be somewhat lower, but in all sense, shouldnt' be too much.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-02-22 04:53pm

Durran Korr wrote:Good lord, what is this, national disaster week? This makes three.

It's the signs of the end times. Repent!

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-22 04:58pm

verilon wrote:
Mr Bean wrote:Odd that... I for a fact that my Local Toys R Us when I lived in North Carolina was designed to hold six feet of snow and a nearly another few PPS onto of that nevermind the record was roughly four and 1/2 feet of snow for that area
Considering thats NC I wonder how much lower the Standerds had to have been in DC which is much farther north
It's coastal, so there is actually a lot less snow, because it also is not in a mountain range. Probably, it would be somewhat lower, but in all sense, shouldnt' be too much.

There is less snow, from storms moving directly in from the west. But when they mopve up the coast, the storms have near unlimited mostier to pull out of the oceans and dump inland. Thats what gave the east caost its most recent heavy snowfall.

The Great Unbearded One · Post by **The Great Unbearded One** » 2003-02-22 05:12pm

America's having a rough week isnt it....

Montcalm · Post by **Montcalm** » 2003-02-22 05:13pm

Were they too lazy to shovel the snow off the roof.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-22 05:22pm

As an engineer, you cannot count on them shovelling snow off the roof in a timely fashion. Engineers must design for worst-case scenarios where public safety is concerned. It is the #1 rule of engineering ethics and law.

Rubberanvil · Post by **Rubberanvil** » 2003-02-22 05:22pm

Sea Skimmer wrote: If its the size of the Toys 'R' Us's where I am, you'd never be able to clear off the roofs unless you got a crane and put a snowplow up there.

Still cheaper and safer to do that instead of the alternative.

kojikun · Post by **kojikun** » 2003-02-22 05:35pm

I'm not an engineer and even I know that if you assume the worst you'll be prepared for damned near anything.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-02-22 05:44pm

The Great Unbearded One wrote:America's having a rough week isnt it....

We're having a rough couple of years, actually.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-02-22 05:51pm

Darth Balls wrote:remember that blizzard back in 93? I was about to go to a borders book store, but i changed my mind at the last minute, I went to a mall instead, after leaving the mall I heard on the radio that the roof of the borders I was going to go to had collapsed for the same reason as this toys r us.
weird

It was God. See he exists.