Earth in the 2nd to 30th Millenium (40k)

[Srelex]

So what if it's written from POV,he doesn't make hyperboles.

The mere fact that it's POV, from someone who does not display objectivism during the narrative, means that, given the way we treat fiction on this site, you can cast doubt on some things on it. Besides, if you want Taustomp in a non-POV way, there's the recent Courage and Honor novel, even if that basically handed the Tau a huge idiot ball by not having them exploit their orbital supremecy. But yeah.

Edit:Forgot quote.

[Srelex]

For the most part, Tau only really have a generic futuristic aesthetic

That is really the reason I always felt the Tau was out of place, theire aestheic was just rather genric futuristic, compared to the more stylized designs for all the other armies, they felt too genric by comparsion to the other powers.

Well, they do mix it up with the East Asian touches, but at least they don't look completely retarded like some Eldar or Imperium things. And the battlesuits do at least look cool IMHO.

[IvanTih]

For the most part, Tau only really have a generic futuristic aesthetic

That is really the reason I always felt the Tau was out of place, theire aestheic was just rather genric futuristic, compared to the more stylized designs for all the other armies, they felt too genric by comparsion to the other powers.

Well, they do mix it up with the East Asian touches, but at least they don't look completely retarded like some Eldar or Imperium things. And the battlesuits do at least look cool IMHO.

I always wondered why are the Imperial tanks looking like WW2 tanks.In this case ornamentation which hides technology doesn't apply.
Of all races Orks are my favorite.

[white_rabbit]

I don't like Tau models since they are like anime and what is anime doing in a universe with completely different style.

Don't be fucking silly.

For a start, 40k is all about inclusiveness, multiple aesthetic styles, sometimes clashing, sometimes complementary.

Plus, so what its anime ? Thats a genre as broad as any. I might hate some aspects of how the Tau are handled in the background, but I've come to appreciate that its mainly not because they are "anime", its the same reason any race's background irritates me, the lazy way they are "sold", every race jobs to the owner of the codex, and the Tau get a lot more of that, simply because they are worked in as a smaller civilisation, but still sell enough that GW want to push their models, which clashes a little with a race thats supposed to be stuck in the wilderness of the galaxy, there but for the grace of a distracted Imperium.

The happy fluffy aspect of the Tau is pretty much a veneer at this point, not to generalise, but the Sept in Deathwatch is full on Grim Dark. Explicit sterilisation of human populations, banning of religion, active "re-education" of dissidents, and rumours of psychological experimentation on capitive populations, as well as using their subject races as test subjects, willing or otherwise.

Plus, as a tangent, Kroot-Cows. MOOOOOO-SQQUAAAAWWK!!!

Also, Tau models are awesome. I drool over the Forgeworld battlesuits as much as I do the other stuff, and Firewarriors are great.

Hazard Suits would probably hit my top ten fav models.

Srelex

What 'style'? Each army has its own style. Hell, the Eldar are also sleek and smooth--are they 'anime'?

Its difficult to deny that there is some serious Anime DNA in the creative thought behind the Tau, hell, the big piccy they had up of some of the stuff they were looking at for the Tau at Gamesday years ago had a Gundam on it.

Watching Appleseed, I can see a lot of that in the Tau battlesuits and firewarriors. The proportions of the battle armours, the antennae and multi-lense sensors etc. Briarios in his suit wouldn't look out of place at all in a Tau army.

Its completely a coincidence, but the Air Caste guys have the body proportions of Code Geass people as well, which is pretty funny considering things.

Also, if you don't hear someone shrieking " ITS A GUNDAAAAM *KERSPLODE*" when you look at the Tau Commanders and Battlesuits, you probably don't recognise the visual cues for asian stuff in Eldar. (okay, this one might be a little more subtle, lets try Death Korps and WW1 ?)

[Black Admiral]

Besides, if you want Taustomp in a non-POV way, there's the recent Courage and Honor novel, even if that basically handed the Tau a huge idiot ball by not having them exploit their orbital supremecy.

I consider that just repayment for the Idiot Ball slipped the Imperium in IA3.

[Srelex]

Besides, if you want Taustomp in a non-POV way, there's the recent Courage and Honor novel, even if that basically handed the Tau a huge idiot ball by not having them exploit their orbital supremecy.

I consider that just repayment for the Idiot Ball slipped the Imperium in IA3.

IA3?

[white_rabbit]

Besides, if you want Taustomp in a non-POV way, there's the recent Courage and Honor novel, even if that basically handed the Tau a huge idiot ball by not having them exploit their orbital supremecy.

I consider that just repayment for the Idiot Ball slipped the Imperium in IA3.

IA3?

The Taros Campaign.

The Imperium achieves orbital superiority, but somehow gets kicked off the planet, despite having specialised orbital bombardment platforms, commanded by a guy from a chapter known for fairly impulsive action.

They then leave without firing a shot, abandoning the planet and the infrastructure they've died to secure in the hands of the Tau.

[Srelex]

The Taros Campaign.

The Imperium achieves orbital superiority, but somehow gets kicked off the planet, despite having specialised orbital bombardment platforms, commanded by a guy from a chapter known for fairly impulsive action.

They then leave without firing a shot, abandoning the planet and the infrastructure they've died to secure in the hands of the Tau.

Oh.

Well, that and CAH are just equally dumb IMO. At least handwave it with a stalemate in space or something.

[Connor MacLeod]

Ah yes, Taros. Taros happened because to have a tau vs Imperium battle it needed to be game balanced somehow, and that means in universe nerfing the Imperium, since if they both really went at it the Imperium's size and resources would outdo any technical advantage the Tau might have had. So Taros became a minor issue for the Imperium while for the Tau it was a serious military campaign (which is technically true in universe.) The "balance" was achieved in universe by exploiting the fact it WAS a small campaign that was heavily crippled by politics and distance (13th Black Crusade was going on, this being a minor conflict far away, resources were limited and competed over, etc.) This translates into the Imperium having shitty logistics (that is to say, almost none) while the Tau enjoyed a significant logisticla advantage (an intact planet with intact defenses). On top of that, the tau had near perfect intel and knowledge of the Imperium throughout the war, whilst the Imperium had virtually nil.

Minor details (like 4 warhound Titans being deployed without Skitarii support, under-utilization of Space Marines, Imperial tactics being shaped to fit perfectly into tau ones, or luck) are pretty minor compared to the logistics/information issue.

And its the fact that things have to be so carefully managed this way to enable the tau to break even much less win is why they tend to be annoying. That and the constant reference to how 'dynamic' they are (I swear, every source with the tau in them will never fail to mention how 'dynamic' they are.)

[jollyreaper]

For the most part, Tau only really have a generic futuristic aesthetic

That is really the reason I always felt the Tau was out of place, theire aestheic was just rather genric futuristic, compared to the more stylized designs for all the other armies, they felt too genric by comparsion to the other powers.

Every army in the universe clashes stylistically. I'm surprised nobody's complaining about the humor of the orks clashing with the grimdark.

[Ghost Rider]

For the most part, Tau only really have a generic futuristic aesthetic

That is really the reason I always felt the Tau was out of place, theire aestheic was just rather genric futuristic, compared to the more stylized designs for all the other armies, they felt too genric by comparsion to the other powers.

Every army in the universe clashes stylistically. I'm surprised nobody's complaining about the humor of the orks clashing with the grimdark.

They took out a lot of the Orks more interesting features to make them streamlined and thus getting rid of a lot of the humorous bits they had. They are still funny but the oddness of playing them is now reduced to basically playing a swarm army.

[Lonestar]

With all the gods of evil, I note a distinct lack of not evil gods. Has anyone tried to invent some?

A ...Ghost? Angel? Sent by the Emperor in one of the Gaunt's Ghosts novels pretty explicitly mentions "The Divine Powers" in a context that implied that there were other "good" gods out there, or at least powers opposed ot the Chaos Gods.

[Junghalli]

Just as a personal beef with most scifi and fantasy settings, we always get the cosmic gods of evil, hell dimensions, demons, etc, but we never get heaven dimensions, benign gods, extra-powerful paranormal or alien superscience entities you can feel happy about allying with. Seems a bit unbalanced. Usually the only bone thrown at us is that you get two super-powerful alien god factions that both suck but one might suck a little less, i.e. Vorlons vs. Shadows. You still wouldn't want anything to do with either of them.

An evil or amoral superpowerful entity would be a threat to the protagonists, a good one would help them out or at least not make things actively worse. Dramatic tension flows more easily from the former than the latter, so it's no surprise that it's what authors tend to go with. I suspect the concept of a good god also brings with it lots of potential social baggage involved in defining exactly what a good god would be and do that a lot of authors are reluctant to touch, whereas with an evil god you can make it fairly uncontroversial easily just by making it repulsive to anyone who isn't completely insane.

Even if you have a "god" (i.e. superpowerful) entity umambiguously on the protagonist's side the easiest way to milk the situation for drama is probably to make its goals and/or methods morally ambiguous, which gets you back to dick god.

[Connor MacLeod]

40K's depiction of the whole "evil gods and dimensions" thing can actually make sense (inasmuch as magic can make sense) if you are careful about the myth and superstition. Since the Warp is basically influenced by thoughts and emotions of living beings, especially those with strong connections to the warp, it alos follows that certain emotions will be more prevalent than others things like lust or fear that have a more biological or "animal" root to them will be easier to manifest because humans are, at the core, animals. We can rise above those base and primitive thoughts and feelings but it isn't easy to do so (and some simply don't want to or see no need to.)

That's a big reason why the Orks are so stable, or the 'Nids, or why the Hydra plan (nasty as it was) would have worked.