Minnesota Metrodome collapses under snow

[Lonestar]

Them Minnesotoans just can't figure out snow

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - The Minneapolis Metrodome, where the Minnesota Vikings play, has collapsed during a snowstorm.

The Metrodome is operated by the Metropolitan Sports Facilities Commission. Its executive director, Bill Lester, said Sunday morning the damage is being assessed and the agency will issue a statement later. He says he has no details yet on what happened.

Minneapolis and much of the upper Midwest have been hit by a blizzard that has dumped up to 20 inches of snow in some areas.

The Vikings' Sunday NFL football game against the New York Giants had already been pushed to Monday. It is not clear what will happen to the schedule now.

Seriously, how does this happen in Minnesota?

[RedImperator]

The Metrodome roof is fabric and held up by air pressure inside the stadium. Dump enough wet snow on there and it will overwhelm the system and cave the roof in.

[Norade]

I shudder at what the repair and cleanup costs will be for this mess.

[Lonestar]

The Metrodome roof is fabric and held up by air pressure inside the stadium. Dump enough wet snow on there and it will overwhelm the system and cave the roof in.

Whoops. I thought it was more robust.

[ShadowDragon8685]

The Metrodome roof is fabric and held up by air pressure inside the stadium. Dump enough wet snow on there and it will overwhelm the system and cave the roof in.

Whoops. I thought it was more robust.

At least repair is probably going to be pretty simple, since it'll just consist of hoisting the roof back into place and sewing up the tears - or at the worst case, fabricating a new one.

Clean-up will, of course, be the big motherhumper since the house just came down and there's white shit everywhere turning into water.

[Talhe]

I shudder at what the repair and cleanup costs will be for this mess.

If Pawlenty was still in power he'd probably insist on taxing us. As of now, I'm not sure who's going to end up footing the bill.

[JME2]

I shudder at what the repair and cleanup costs will be for this mess.

Same here. It'll be at least in the millions range.

[Phantasee]

We have an indoor golf facility similar to that, except it's all a dome without the seating as a wall. Ours collapsed a few years ago after a heavy snowfall too. It's not the ideal structure for heavy snow but they fail so rarely maybe they didn't take it into account.

[Sea Skimmer]

Its only a partial collapse, a couple of the air bags burst and so the roof is hanging lower then it should with a hole, but its still well above field level. They may have to deflate the whole thing in ordered to repair it though.

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/news/photo ... 890828.jpg

[Dave]

Clean-up will, of course, be the big motherhumper since the house just came down and there's white shit everywhere turning into water.

I'm not seeing how this would be an issue. Wouldn't there be some kind of drainage system for the bleachers and the field? I mean, people spill drinks and stuff, and it'd be really easy to just hose it off if you have metal/plastic seating. For the field, that would also have a drainage system, since Astroturf needs some filler underneath it which would trap liquids if not drained. The system would have to drain water, sweat/blood/tears plus the "hit the coach with the Gatorade" gag.

Sure there's a lot of it, but you can either let it melt slowly to avoid overflowing the drains or shovel it into bins and dump it outside.

[aerius]

And a video of the collapse. I gotta say it was pretty cool to watch.

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/12/12/vide ... collapses/

[Phantasee]

Seeing the damage, it's not too bad. Dave is right, it might delay the game but it'll be fixed up within a week on the outside if they have a contingency plan for this (which they should).

[FSTargetDrone]

Seeing the damage, it's not too bad. Dave is right, it might delay the game but it'll be fixed up within a week on the outside if they have a contingency plan for this (which they should).

Those giant speakers and other gear suspended from roof will have to be checked. They were swinging about back and forth as the roof dropped and the areas they were attached to might have been stressed.

[Darth Fanboy]

Whoops. I thought it was more robust.

There hasn't been a problem like this since the early 80's (IIRC it was in April of 1983 and it caused postponement of a baseball game) , that fabric usually holds up quite well. This storm however is epic even by Minnesota's standards.

The Vikings can't be happy with the money they are losing out on from missing this game but I think the chances of them getting a new stadium increased. The Dome is a lot older than people realize.

[PeZook]

Seriously, how does this happen in Minnesota?

Dude, we get pretty nasty winters, too, and people had to be forced under threat of nasty fines to actually clean snow off supermarkets, convention halls and similar large-area structures after one catastrophic collapse and one near-catastrophe.

Turns out people are greedy and short-sighted, although in this case it seemed to be a genuine accident.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Seriously, how does this happen in Minnesota?

Dude, we get pretty nasty winters, too, and people had to be forced under threat of nasty fines to actually clean snow off supermarkets, convention halls and similar large-area structures after one catastrophic collapse and one near-catastrophe.

Turns out people are greedy and short-sighted, although in this case it seemed to be a genuine accident.

Erm. I think Lonestar's point is that Minnesota gets pretty bad winters, with temperatures hitting -30 deg C on average.

This is a state where rivers and lakes become frozen enough for trucks to drive over. See: Grumpy Old Men.

[PeZook]

Yeah, and we get lots of snow every year, too, and had several roof collapses, yet people still penny-pinched and failed to clean the snow off until the government threatened to instill savagely punitive fines on them.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Yeah, and we get lots of snow every year, too, and had several roof collapses, yet people still penny-pinched and failed to clean the snow off until the government threatened to instill savagely punitive fines on them.

PeZook, go google for an image of the stadium to see how stupid the idea of clearing a dome of snow that large and made of air sounds.

[PeZook]

PeZook, go google for an image of the stadium to see how stupid the idea of clearing a dome of snow that large and made of air sounds.

You know, we seem to be talking past each other a lot

That dome is obviously impossible to clear of snow, though it should be pretty resistant to it because of its shape, so this was a genuine accident. My point was that heavy winters don't mean people take all the basic precautions, even if the winters happen again and again and again. It has nothing to do with being unable to figure out snow

[erik_t]

...

On Sunday, standing inside the frosty structure, Maki said he was on the Dome's roof from 11 a.m. Saturday to about 6 p.m. When the winds grew too strong, he ordered the seven crew members off the roof.

"The wind was so strong, it nearly knocked me on my butt," said Maki, who got a call from crews about 5 a.m. Sunday that the roof had collapsed. He got there by 5:30.

"There was an overstress of fabric due to snow and ice. Certainly we had snow thicker than 24 inches collecting in between some of the [roof] valleys," Maki said, his breath forming steam in the cold air. Looking around the sagging, ripped roof, he insisted that it "is certainly salvageable."

...

"It was an extraordinary situation involving Mother Nature that the Dome's roof couldn't handle," Terwilliger said. He added that "normal procedures" had been followed during the blizzard, as workers on the roof used steam and hot water to melt and remove snow.

Heat inside the Dome was also turned up. Hot air was pumped into the in-between layers of the roof, all in an effort to save the inflated roof. "That didn't work," Terwilliger said.

...

http://www.startribune.com/local/111748539.html

In the interest of letting facts get in the way of a good argument.

[Phantasee]

That explains the water that came down in the video.

[Broomstick]

PeZook, go google for an image of the stadium to see how stupid the idea of clearing a dome of snow that large and made of air sounds.

You know, we seem to be talking past each other a lot

That dome is obviously impossible to clear of snow, though it should be pretty resistant to it because of its shape, so this was a genuine accident. My point was that heavy winters don't mean people take all the basic precautions, even if the winters happen again and again and again. It has nothing to do with being unable to figure out snow

Fingolfin and PeZook, several TV interviews with the manager of the stadium have mentioned roof clean up crews. I am not clear on the details, but apparently, yes, you CAN clear snow off a fabric dome, and there are people employed to do exactly that.

During this recent storm, with winds gusting to 80-100 kph (that's as high as 60 mph for us Americans) and plunging temperatures it was judged too dangerous for the men who clear the roof to continue, so the crews were taken off the roof allowing more snow than usual to accumulate. No doubt this contributed to the collapse but you really can't expect people to continue to work on top of a building in a genuine blizzard.

Speaking of winds - I have to wonder if part of the problem wasn't just the snow load but also the wind load - air has mass, after all, and can exert a lot of force once it gets moving. So... was it snow load + wind that contributed to this? In my area we get winds that high several times a year, so our building codes take that into account. Does Minnesota also experience similar wind conditions as often? If not, then this might be a case of everything conforming to a reasonable code running into unusually harsh conditions for the area.

[Darth Fanboy]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, this storm is one of the worst Minneapolis has ever experienced, and the first time in 27 years they have had problems with the teflon roof.

link

Metrodome roof collapse rekindles stadium debate
Posted: Dec 13, 2010 10:46 AM
Updated: Dec 13, 2010 9:26 PM

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - Frigid air whipped through a desolate Metrodome on Monday as crews began inspecting the Minnesota stadium's nearly three decades-old roof after it collapsed under the weight of heavy snow that pounded the Twin Cities and forced the Vikings to move their game to Detroit.

Sunday's roof collapse was the fourth since the 29-year-old facility opened, and it has rekindled the debate about whether the cash-strapped state should build a new venue using taxpayer money.

"It's an aging facility. We all know that. This actually ramps up that part of the discussion," said state Sen. Julie Rosen, who said she will introduce a new stadium bill when the Legislature convenes in January.

The Vikings have lobbied lawmakers for more than 10 years for a new stadium, arguing the Metrodome is outdated and doesn't generate enough revenue. The team's lease runs through the 2011 season and they have said they won't renew it. The NFL team is the stadium's only major tenant after the Minnesota Twins and University of Minnesota moved into new facilities, which received public subsidies, in the past two years.

The stadium's Teflon roof gave way early Sunday after a storm pounded the region, dumping 17 inches of snow on the city - the fifth heaviest in state history. No was hurt, but the Vikings' Sunday game was moved to Monday night in Detroit and it wasn't clear when the stadium would reopen.

Three executives from Amherst, N.Y.-based contractor Birdair, Inc. met with stadium officials Monday. Pat Milan, a spokesman for the Metropolitan Sports Facilities Commission that operates the Metrodome, said they assessed the position and the size of the tears in the roof to figure out whether to repair or replace damaged panels.

"Everyone is going as quickly as they can and as safely as they can," Milan said.

Vikings vice president for public affairs and stadium development Lester Bagley said the team is "determined" to host the Chicago Bears next Monday night "in front of our fans." He says they'll likely take a "dual-track approach," trying to get the Metrodome ready while also preparing TCF Bank Stadium on the University of Minnesota campus to play outside if necessary.

When the Metrodome was built, its design was considered state-of-the art - and its Teflon roof was less expensive than a solid one. Though some domes with similar designs still are used in Detroit, Vancouver and Syracuse, N.Y., new stadiums have been built over the years and the inflated-type domes have given way to shinier models.

The last time the Metrodome's roof gave way was 27 years ago, forcing the postponement of a Minnesota Twins game in April 1983. Since then, building staff have learned a few tricks about dealing with snow storms - including blasting the roof with hot water to melt the snow and pumping hot air between two layers of fabric that make up the roof, said Steve Maki, MSFC director of facilities and engineering.

Those techniques were used during the weekend, but strong winds made it too dangerous for crews to continue working to clear the snow, he said.

The roof collapse dominated talk radio in the Twin Cities on Monday and striking video of a truckload of snow dumping on the field nearly 200 feet below was in heavy rotation on television.

"The images on TV can't help but have an influence on public perception," Rep. Keith Downey, a Republican from Edina who said he opposes both new taxes and state general fund spending for the Vikings.

But there may be little financial support for a new stadium - especially as Minnesota faces a budget deficit projected at $6.2 billion. State leaders have said there's little they can do for the team until they solve the budget woes, though the Vikings are working on a new proposal to present to the next Legislature.

The Vikings previously pledged roughly one-third of the cost for a new stadium, estimated at $700 million or more depending on the model and the site, but they've had difficulty getting support for public money to pay for the rest.

Rosen, a Republican from Fairmont, wouldn't give specifics about the bill she planned to propose next year, but she said no state funds would be used. Instead user fees and other revenue streams would pay for it, she said.

Gov.-elect Mark Dayton's spokeswoman, Katie Tinucci, said the roof collapse hasn't changed Dayton's position on stadium legislation. His stance has been that the public benefits of a new stadium would have to outweigh the public cost, but he hasn't spelled out details.

"We expected it to be an issue this session no matter what," Tinucci said Monday, adding that the Democrat will look at stadium proposals after he takes office in three weeks.

Despite the hoopla, stadium critic Phil Krinkie of the Minnesota Taxpayers League said replacing the Metrodome because of storm damage makes about as much sense as replacing the New Orleans Superdome because it was damaged by Hurricane Katrina. And because the last time the roof collapsed was in 1983, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with the roof design, he said.

"If it doesn't happen for the next 20 years, I think we still have an extended period of useful life of the facility," Krinkie said.

Melissa Ferderer, 41, a Spanish teacher in the Minneapolis Public Schools said Monday she opposed using taxpayer money for a new stadium for the Vikings.

"I just think that the public spending should go toward things that are good for the general public as opposed to a special section, and I feel there's too much private profit made off that industry. I would like to see this place revamped," she said of the dome.

But Jeffrey Evander, 32, a graphic designer from Bloomington, said keeping the Vikings was "crucial" and worth a tax increase.

"Part of a metropolis, a true city, is having your sports teams," he said.

[PeZook]

I stand mercilessly corrected by those pesky "fact" things

Still, it does mean they could "figure out snow", doesn't it? It's just that there was so goddamned much of it...