How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Moderator: NecronLord
How Would You Reboot Stargate?
With the recent announcement of SGU's cancellation, it seems likely that this will be the end of the franchise's current iteration and the canon that the shows have built up since 1997.
Anyway, it got me thinking. For fun, let's assume a decade or two goes by and MGM decides to give the franchise another go. The decision is made to reboot it ala Star Trek XI and Casino Royale and creative control rests with you. Knowing what did and didn't work, what would you differently this time around?
In my case, I would keep the basic story of the original movie and "Children of the Gods" intact, but with two major alterations:
1. Limit the Ra and the other Goa'uld to only the Egyptian pantheon. I've acknowledged before that it got ridiculous tying them to every single global mythology.
2. Kawalsky would still end up with a snake in the head, but instead of trying to escape, the symbiote would instead remain a covert threat for a while, a sleeper agent ala nBSG Boomer.
Anyway, it got me thinking. For fun, let's assume a decade or two goes by and MGM decides to give the franchise another go. The decision is made to reboot it ala Star Trek XI and Casino Royale and creative control rests with you. Knowing what did and didn't work, what would you differently this time around?
In my case, I would keep the basic story of the original movie and "Children of the Gods" intact, but with two major alterations:
1. Limit the Ra and the other Goa'uld to only the Egyptian pantheon. I've acknowledged before that it got ridiculous tying them to every single global mythology.
2. Kawalsky would still end up with a snake in the head, but instead of trying to escape, the symbiote would instead remain a covert threat for a while, a sleeper agent ala nBSG Boomer.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Well, going by this, would you follow the route of the Asgard and attribute other mythologies to other alien races? You definitely have to get a villain with the same level of complexity as Baal. Thoth maybe?
I think the importance of the group dynamic between the members of SG-1 is vital to the success of the show-the 'crew' were friends in the same sense the crew of the Enterprise in the original Star Trek were friends, and forgetting that would be a poor idea.
I think the importance of the group dynamic between the members of SG-1 is vital to the success of the show-the 'crew' were friends in the same sense the crew of the Enterprise in the original Star Trek were friends, and forgetting that would be a poor idea.
"I'm sorry, you seem to be under the mistaken impression that your inability to use the brain evolution granted you is any of my fucking concern."
"You. Stupid. Shit." Victor desperately wished he knew enough Japanese to curse properly. "Davions take alot of killing." -Grave Covenant
Founder of the Cult of Weber
"You. Stupid. Shit." Victor desperately wished he knew enough Japanese to curse properly. "Davions take alot of killing." -Grave Covenant
Founder of the Cult of Weber
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
I'd focus on humour and cameraderie instead of listening to the nerds. At the same time I wouldn't force so much hamfisted morality into the show, and would attempt a series of arcs around threats to Earth bought about by the Stargate project and the international coalition the is formed to exploit it.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Make it an international project, not just an american one. Have one of the key issues be the distribution of advanced technology among the Earth nations. This also allows for more character development and plots among the team.
Have different factions (scientists, military, politicians) instead of one unified team. Have Earth colonize the planets...in short make it more large scale about humanity's steps into space and the problems of it instead of just earth.
Oh, and if there must be a team, have a better female-male ratio.
Do not make it too gritty and have payoffs. A reason the first seasons of BSG were so good was that there were plot developments with consequences. If necessary, look to Farscape to find out how a show can still have episodes of the week and still have longer arc.
In the same context, do not make the villains retarded. If you must have a galactic-wide threat, make it a real threat not just some macguffin.
Have different factions (scientists, military, politicians) instead of one unified team. Have Earth colonize the planets...in short make it more large scale about humanity's steps into space and the problems of it instead of just earth.
Oh, and if there must be a team, have a better female-male ratio.
Do not make it too gritty and have payoffs. A reason the first seasons of BSG were so good was that there were plot developments with consequences. If necessary, look to Farscape to find out how a show can still have episodes of the week and still have longer arc.
In the same context, do not make the villains retarded. If you must have a galactic-wide threat, make it a real threat not just some macguffin.
Whoever says "education does not matter" can try ignorance
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A decision must be made in the life of every nation at the very moment when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat. Then, it seems that the only way to survive is to use the means of the enemy, to rest survival upon what is expedient, to look the other way. Well, the answer to that is 'survival as what'? A country isn't a rock. It's not an extension of one's self. It's what it stands for. It's what it stands for when standing for something is the most difficult! - Chief Judge Haywood
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My LPs
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A decision must be made in the life of every nation at the very moment when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat. Then, it seems that the only way to survive is to use the means of the enemy, to rest survival upon what is expedient, to look the other way. Well, the answer to that is 'survival as what'? A country isn't a rock. It's not an extension of one's self. It's what it stands for. It's what it stands for when standing for something is the most difficult! - Chief Judge Haywood
------------
My LPs
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Use the kids:
1) Young Jack O'Neill - Team leader
2) Teal'c's son - Muscle
3) Cassandra - Mind
4) Ally - Rogue
5) Lya - Scientific knowledge
(not that much international, but for intersystem it seems a good mix)
Potential enemies:
1) Lucian Alliance - space capability
2) Aschen - bioweapons sneaky
3) Various other groups with Goa'uld and Ori technology exploiting other planets
You use existing and known characters (even the same actors?) to deal with problems around the galaxy. Make it where the group has to deal with problems that affect others, and have minimal benefit to Earth. Essentially, showing that helping others is the reward, vs the accountants trying to cut costs. Maybe partway through they have to set up a separate location, off earth. This cuts them off their main supply source, but they get to trade with others. Have their base change over time, using various tech from around the galaxy to replace what wears out.
Show what a clever group of individuals working together can accomplish when cut off from their supply base, and is forced to trade with others. (aka showing what Voyager could have been, and sticking a thumb in Braga' eye)
1) Young Jack O'Neill - Team leader
2) Teal'c's son - Muscle
3) Cassandra - Mind
4) Ally - Rogue
5) Lya - Scientific knowledge
(not that much international, but for intersystem it seems a good mix)
Potential enemies:
1) Lucian Alliance - space capability
2) Aschen - bioweapons sneaky
3) Various other groups with Goa'uld and Ori technology exploiting other planets
You use existing and known characters (even the same actors?) to deal with problems around the galaxy. Make it where the group has to deal with problems that affect others, and have minimal benefit to Earth. Essentially, showing that helping others is the reward, vs the accountants trying to cut costs. Maybe partway through they have to set up a separate location, off earth. This cuts them off their main supply source, but they get to trade with others. Have their base change over time, using various tech from around the galaxy to replace what wears out.
Show what a clever group of individuals working together can accomplish when cut off from their supply base, and is forced to trade with others. (aka showing what Voyager could have been, and sticking a thumb in Braga' eye)
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Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
This could be a major part of the show in itself. The world could be in a war because the US is hogging all of the tech and doesn't want to share it, eventually using it to take over, as in that alternate universe episode, only from the start.Thanas wrote:Make it an international project, not just an american one. Have one of the key issues be the distribution of advanced technology among the Earth nations. This also allows for more character development and plots among the team.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
To succeed the show needs a reasonable start position, and not one that people can't repare to and limits the show.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
I've been thinking about a Stargate reboot for quite some time now
(The following post has been classified "Fuck No" for Inappropriate Changes to a beloved series. Viewer discretion is advised.)
First there would be a made-for-TV movie to kick off the series, a remake of the original Stargate film, but built to be more series-friendly (so there aren't any shameless retcons). I'd plan the show for a 5 season arc, beginning with Apophis, then moving on to Anubis for season 3/4, then moving on to Ba'al and a Goa'uld power vacuum in S5 or beyond if the evil studio execs demand the undead franchise continue for 5 more seasons.
As far as the universe is concerned, I'd make some pretty radical changes, namely:
[General changes and series structure]
- Jafa and slave human populations all speak Goa'uld in addition to native languages, which is essentially enforced by the System Lords. The Goa'uld being essentially masters of this galaxy makes this lingua franca for contact with all new Alien species, and generally they will speak this instead of English. People don't like subtitles? People can fucking deal with it. Teal'c learned English from captured SGC personnel in the Pilot movie prior to the series, and as the series goes on it becomes a more widespread Language amongst the SGC's enemies and diplomatic liaisons from other species.
- There are exactly zero psychic powers in the series, and any person on the writing team who even suggests using the phrase "more evolved human" or "ten percent of the brain" will be shot on sight.
- Less episodes will be devoted to monster of the week and more to story arcs. Specifically, the goal early on is for the SGC to acquire samples of Goa'uld technology to send back to Area 51 / equivelant. Early on they will capture a death-glider, then perhaps a two-aparter can be dedicated to capturing an Al'kesh or Ha'Tak or something.
- There are five or six "SG teams", i.e. 4 man reconnaissances / commando units, however there are several specialized teams that are much larger, 12+ men, that are dedicated assault or securing stargates on planets.
- There will be a "Gateway fighting vehicle", a specialized version of some existing IFV (probably the Stryer) designed specifically for breaching heavily defended gateways / combating the goa'uld, that will be introduced at some point.
- Gate physics are rigid and established early on. For one, no more "matter transporter through a tiny wormhole", it's actually a real wormhole, the "Puddle" is just the sophisticated force fields that prevent you from getting smooshed as you go through. The Kawoosh is something to do with turbulence during connection or some other handwave. It's not that the gates can't send things two ways, they just don't let you. All wormholes are two way, however the gate only permits things passing through one way, except for radio signals as it has always been.
- There will not be any Genghis Khan in space, Romans in space, Greeks in space, or anything else. The human populations were taken from egypt, period, and the racially diverse humans from Earth are prized as hosts because they are so different from the Jafa / slave human populations, phenotypically.
- As above, only the Egyptian gods have Goa'uld impersonators.
- Continuing the above two, there will be none of this "ALL MYTHS ARE TRUE" nonsense. Deviation from normal Egyptian mythology is permitted and even encouraged to show that the history books didn't always get it right, and further that things have changed.
- There will be NO PARALLEL REALITIES OF ANY KIND.
- There will be NO TIME TRAVEL OF ANY KIND.
- There will be some new Alien species (non human) in the process of being destroyed by Apophis, who encounter the Tau'ri and seek refuge on Earth. This is what warns us about Apophis coming to attack Earth instead of the parallel reality stuff in season one, and further they provide us with Naquadah generators / primitive hyperdrive in exchange. They will be instrumental in the construction of the Prometheus in late S2 / Early 3.
- Goddamn BC-304 porn. I love that ship design so much. There can never be enough of it on-screen.
- Starship porn will be extremely long ranged, unlike classic Gate battles. Look to "Starship Operators" or possibly even Andromeda for inspiration about how this can be visually interesting.
[The Goa'uld]
- Largely unchanged.
- I would specify that the Goa'uld have not technologically progressed beyond what they have had for thousands of years because they were unchallenged, not because they couldn't. They essentially had everything they needed with Ra in control, and now that he's dead suddenly there is civil war and power struggles. This would be represented by having classic 'Gate stuff early on (Staff Weapons, Ha'Tak's, death gliders) that are all designed to be very intimidating, and serve secondary functions as actual weapons. As the series progressed, these would start to be supplemented by and eventually replaced by more practical versions of these technologies. This allows for the Tau'ri to have an early advantage in that although they are technologically far below the Goa'uld, their equipment and personnel are designed and trained to fight real wars, and not just police actions on primitive populations.
- I'm not sure if this was ever explained in the series, but the Goa'uld should be specified as keeping human populations of their slave worlds down to small preindustrial levels, with planets rarely exceeding a few million people, and generally not covering most of its surface.
- No Manchurian candidate brainwashing episodes, please. I think we had three or four in the series and I didn't like any of them.
[The Ancients]
- The Ancients are an alien species with a radically non-human design.
- The Ancients have nothing to do with humans, specifically, and never interacted with us in the way that the current SG lore suggests (interbreeding, ugh...)
- They did not suffer a deadly plague that they couldn't cure for some fucking reason.
- The ancient's didn't "ascend", rather they cut themselves off from the rest of the universe somehow, either they phased their whole solar system out, or they have some kind of Revelation Space style barrier around a giant artificial construct that they all live on, or they warped the space around them such that they live in an externally inaccessible region. The exact method isn't really important. They live there minding their own business, living hedonistic lives until they get bored of living and kill themselves. They were not the only civilization to do this, nor were they the first, the galaxy would have perhaps hundreds of such inaccessible regions, representing the civilizations that have sprung up and endured for the last several billion years. I'm thinking that they are all plugged into a big shared virtual reality thing, either as mind-uploads or just with their physical bodies wired in and maintained by advanced machines.
[The Asgard]
- They have the means to technologically "ascend" like the Ancients, but reject that lifestyle and seek to let worlds develop on their own / protect them from schoolyard bullies like the Goa'uld.
- They don't actually realize there are any active civilizations in the milky way aside from the Goa'uld, who they last encountered prior to transplanting and enslaving human populations. Some event in Season 2 or so gets the Tau'ri into contact with them, as before.
- They want to help, but are busy fighting the replicators as in the original series.
- Whether or not they clone+mind transfer or not I don't really care, but there is no "clone degradation" problem or equivelant.
- Once the replicators are dealt with, they devote their remaining forces to curb stomping Ba'al / the remaining system lords.
- After the Goa'uld are effectively destroyed, they suicide as they do in SG-1, not because they're going to die anyway, but because their immediate job is effectively done, and that was the only reason they were hanging on that long anyway. They feel that passing their mantle on to the humans is appropriate, and then they wave goodbye.
I'm sure there's stuff I've missed, but this post is long and rambly enough as it is.
(The following post has been classified "Fuck No" for Inappropriate Changes to a beloved series. Viewer discretion is advised.)
First there would be a made-for-TV movie to kick off the series, a remake of the original Stargate film, but built to be more series-friendly (so there aren't any shameless retcons). I'd plan the show for a 5 season arc, beginning with Apophis, then moving on to Anubis for season 3/4, then moving on to Ba'al and a Goa'uld power vacuum in S5 or beyond if the evil studio execs demand the undead franchise continue for 5 more seasons.
As far as the universe is concerned, I'd make some pretty radical changes, namely:
[General changes and series structure]
- Jafa and slave human populations all speak Goa'uld in addition to native languages, which is essentially enforced by the System Lords. The Goa'uld being essentially masters of this galaxy makes this lingua franca for contact with all new Alien species, and generally they will speak this instead of English. People don't like subtitles? People can fucking deal with it. Teal'c learned English from captured SGC personnel in the Pilot movie prior to the series, and as the series goes on it becomes a more widespread Language amongst the SGC's enemies and diplomatic liaisons from other species.
- There are exactly zero psychic powers in the series, and any person on the writing team who even suggests using the phrase "more evolved human" or "ten percent of the brain" will be shot on sight.
- Less episodes will be devoted to monster of the week and more to story arcs. Specifically, the goal early on is for the SGC to acquire samples of Goa'uld technology to send back to Area 51 / equivelant. Early on they will capture a death-glider, then perhaps a two-aparter can be dedicated to capturing an Al'kesh or Ha'Tak or something.
- There are five or six "SG teams", i.e. 4 man reconnaissances / commando units, however there are several specialized teams that are much larger, 12+ men, that are dedicated assault or securing stargates on planets.
- There will be a "Gateway fighting vehicle", a specialized version of some existing IFV (probably the Stryer) designed specifically for breaching heavily defended gateways / combating the goa'uld, that will be introduced at some point.
- Gate physics are rigid and established early on. For one, no more "matter transporter through a tiny wormhole", it's actually a real wormhole, the "Puddle" is just the sophisticated force fields that prevent you from getting smooshed as you go through. The Kawoosh is something to do with turbulence during connection or some other handwave. It's not that the gates can't send things two ways, they just don't let you. All wormholes are two way, however the gate only permits things passing through one way, except for radio signals as it has always been.
- There will not be any Genghis Khan in space, Romans in space, Greeks in space, or anything else. The human populations were taken from egypt, period, and the racially diverse humans from Earth are prized as hosts because they are so different from the Jafa / slave human populations, phenotypically.
- As above, only the Egyptian gods have Goa'uld impersonators.
- Continuing the above two, there will be none of this "ALL MYTHS ARE TRUE" nonsense. Deviation from normal Egyptian mythology is permitted and even encouraged to show that the history books didn't always get it right, and further that things have changed.
- There will be NO PARALLEL REALITIES OF ANY KIND.
- There will be NO TIME TRAVEL OF ANY KIND.
- There will be some new Alien species (non human) in the process of being destroyed by Apophis, who encounter the Tau'ri and seek refuge on Earth. This is what warns us about Apophis coming to attack Earth instead of the parallel reality stuff in season one, and further they provide us with Naquadah generators / primitive hyperdrive in exchange. They will be instrumental in the construction of the Prometheus in late S2 / Early 3.
- Goddamn BC-304 porn. I love that ship design so much. There can never be enough of it on-screen.
- Starship porn will be extremely long ranged, unlike classic Gate battles. Look to "Starship Operators" or possibly even Andromeda for inspiration about how this can be visually interesting.
[The Goa'uld]
- Largely unchanged.
- I would specify that the Goa'uld have not technologically progressed beyond what they have had for thousands of years because they were unchallenged, not because they couldn't. They essentially had everything they needed with Ra in control, and now that he's dead suddenly there is civil war and power struggles. This would be represented by having classic 'Gate stuff early on (Staff Weapons, Ha'Tak's, death gliders) that are all designed to be very intimidating, and serve secondary functions as actual weapons. As the series progressed, these would start to be supplemented by and eventually replaced by more practical versions of these technologies. This allows for the Tau'ri to have an early advantage in that although they are technologically far below the Goa'uld, their equipment and personnel are designed and trained to fight real wars, and not just police actions on primitive populations.
- I'm not sure if this was ever explained in the series, but the Goa'uld should be specified as keeping human populations of their slave worlds down to small preindustrial levels, with planets rarely exceeding a few million people, and generally not covering most of its surface.
- No Manchurian candidate brainwashing episodes, please. I think we had three or four in the series and I didn't like any of them.
[The Ancients]
- The Ancients are an alien species with a radically non-human design.
- The Ancients have nothing to do with humans, specifically, and never interacted with us in the way that the current SG lore suggests (interbreeding, ugh...)
- They did not suffer a deadly plague that they couldn't cure for some fucking reason.
- The ancient's didn't "ascend", rather they cut themselves off from the rest of the universe somehow, either they phased their whole solar system out, or they have some kind of Revelation Space style barrier around a giant artificial construct that they all live on, or they warped the space around them such that they live in an externally inaccessible region. The exact method isn't really important. They live there minding their own business, living hedonistic lives until they get bored of living and kill themselves. They were not the only civilization to do this, nor were they the first, the galaxy would have perhaps hundreds of such inaccessible regions, representing the civilizations that have sprung up and endured for the last several billion years. I'm thinking that they are all plugged into a big shared virtual reality thing, either as mind-uploads or just with their physical bodies wired in and maintained by advanced machines.
[The Asgard]
- They have the means to technologically "ascend" like the Ancients, but reject that lifestyle and seek to let worlds develop on their own / protect them from schoolyard bullies like the Goa'uld.
- They don't actually realize there are any active civilizations in the milky way aside from the Goa'uld, who they last encountered prior to transplanting and enslaving human populations. Some event in Season 2 or so gets the Tau'ri into contact with them, as before.
- They want to help, but are busy fighting the replicators as in the original series.
- Whether or not they clone+mind transfer or not I don't really care, but there is no "clone degradation" problem or equivelant.
- Once the replicators are dealt with, they devote their remaining forces to curb stomping Ba'al / the remaining system lords.
- After the Goa'uld are effectively destroyed, they suicide as they do in SG-1, not because they're going to die anyway, but because their immediate job is effectively done, and that was the only reason they were hanging on that long anyway. They feel that passing their mantle on to the humans is appropriate, and then they wave goodbye.
I'm sure there's stuff I've missed, but this post is long and rambly enough as it is.
Last edited by adam_grif on 2010-12-19 01:54am, edited 1 time in total.
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
You could probably get away with a whole season with the 'alien' threat being unseen, humans using the Star Gate, but carefully as to not attract attention from the 'aliens'. In this way you could do the human v human story arcs, multiple nations competing for the technology and various character developments. Do a season finale where the bickering between nations ends because their bickering has attracted the attention of the 'aliens' and now they have to pull together to fix that problem.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
I think the idea of politics in the Stargate Exclusion Zone overseer committee and the tensions caused by the varying fortunes of the established colonies is a bit more interesting than 'funny shaped man with mythical name does something stupid again'. The focus the writers put into inane details about how the stargate worked and all the daftness would be better placed in other elements of drama/comedy. The baggage of the Stargate 'formula' really limited the show.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Agreed, but it should probably start as purely an American one, and then become international fairly early on when it becomes clear that it can't be kept a secret, and is too much for just America to handle.Make it an international project, not just an american one. Have one of the key issues be the distribution of advanced technology among the Earth nations. This also allows for more character development and plots among the team.
As an addendum to this, no more episodes with third act Soylent-Green-is-People reveals, the "oh cool they finally got some cool tech to beat the goa- oh wait never mind it's fueled by baby's tears and Jackson is giving a speech about how it should be destroyed now" is fucking shit. It's been done, and not just in Stargate either.At the same time I wouldn't force so much hamfisted morality into the show,
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Or the nineteen episodes about how they can't use xyz technology because THE PEOPLE WITH IT ARE EVIL, and all the other Stargate standbys.
Simply eliminating the baggage of bizarre alien races and backstory and nonsense (of course not removing aliens from the show) would lower barriers to entry, as well; by 4-5 season SG1 was nigh incomprehensible to anyone who didn't know their ZPM from their Tau-ri.
Simply eliminating the baggage of bizarre alien races and backstory and nonsense (of course not removing aliens from the show) would lower barriers to entry, as well; by 4-5 season SG1 was nigh incomprehensible to anyone who didn't know their ZPM from their Tau-ri.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
The worst was the Space-Nazi episode, where they were literally about to get access to their shit before they suddenly bailed out.
They could have at least brought a team through the gate and captured all their tech first, then surrendered them to the other faction on the planet. It's not like they were screening them for weapons when they came through the gate.
They could have at least brought a team through the gate and captured all their tech first, then surrendered them to the other faction on the planet. It's not like they were screening them for weapons when they came through the gate.
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Yes -- and incidentally I assume Devlin and Emmerich intended to follow a similiar track had they moved forward with their planned sequels -- and unfortunately Ba'al would not be a Goa'uld this time around. Granted, we'd lose the franchise's best antagonist, so Thoth would be a nice workaround.Slacker wrote:Well, going by this, would you follow the route of the Asgard and attribute other mythologies to other alien races? You definitely have to get a villain with the same level of complexity as Baal. Thoth maybe?
Absolutely; that has to remain intact.Slacker wrote:I think the importance of the group dynamic between the members of SG-1 is vital to the success of the show-the 'crew' were friends in the same sense the crew of the Enterprise in the original Star Trek were friends, and forgetting that would be a poor idea.
Incidentally, I'd also keep Catherine Langford around this time as a civilian overseer; this would especially work if the project goes international early on this time. She could also provide a larger civilian/military conflict in her dealings with Hammond.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Ba'al isn't Egyptian, but Ba'al was worshiped in regions very close to it. It might be worth making an exception just for him because he's a fan favorite
EDIT:
I liked the Genii in SGA (although I didn't like SGA generally), because it put us in role reversed positions with the traditional alien contact. Might be interesting to have something inspired by them.
EDIT:
I liked the Genii in SGA (although I didn't like SGA generally), because it put us in role reversed positions with the traditional alien contact. Might be interesting to have something inspired by them.
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
-
- Jedi Master
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Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
There should be an entire society of Goa'uld. Humans and Jaffa never build, repair, or maintain advanced technology, and they never hold positions of great power. A ship is crewed by Goa'uld, with humans allowed only as servants, menial workers, and foot soldiers. Jaffa might be like NCO's, with Teal'c the equivalent of a sergeant major. The real commanders are Goa'uld. Only they get the fancy masks, with Jaffa having simple helmets. Re's guards in the film were all Goa'uld.
Jaffa do not carry larval Goa'uld. Humans are promoted to sacred warriors and implanted with a device that makes them stronger and healthier, but requires a periodic signal to keep functioning. Without this signal, the Jaffa will gradually sicken and die. A lord would usually have something on his person transmitting the signal, and transmitters would be built into idols that the Jaffa must venerate regularly. A Goa'uld might be able to command the device to give pleasure or pain. It could be used to subtly manipulate the Jaffa's emotions by giving him a sense of calm or pleasure when in the presence of Goa'uld. The signals should be sent by some means that the Earthlings cannot copy or understand. It will take long time for their science to catch up, so simply interfering with the devices en masse is not an option for our heroes.
The Tok'ra created anti-idols that can disable the control device. These are smuggled into Jaffa ranks in the hopes of an eventual Jaffa rebellion. Bra'tac and Tea'lc used an anti-idol to free themselves. Initially the source of the anti-idols should be unknown, so the discovery of the Tok'ra would be spread out over many episodes.
Above all else, the Goa'uld maintain the illusion that they are gods, and that their technology is magic. Humans, including Jaffa, are kept away from contexts where they might realize that their gods' powers could be emulated by anyone with the right knowledge and tools. There is at least one planet populated exclusively by Goa'uld, many of whom are normal civilians. Most would probably live like rich play-boys, others would be engaged in the scientific and mechanical work necessary for the maintenance of an interstellar empire, some might be artists or even merchants and artisans. This would be the City of the Gods or the Otherworld of myth.
The Goa'uld are not in a constant state of cold war and rivalry. The Great Lords do sometimes feud, but over-all Re was able to maintain a stable if decentralized government for thousands of years. With Re's death, the system has become destabilized, but they have not quite fallen into all out war.
Some of the Goa'uld characters would be renamed. Apophis' role should be played by Set, and Sokar's by Apep. Set should be a reluctant vassal who tried to undermine Re and increase his own power, perhaps someday aspiring to ascend to the throne, but kept in check by Re, and rallying to the common cause whenever they Goa'uld face a real threat. Apep is outside of the System Lord hierarchy and has his own empire. He seeks to destroy Re's order. He might not be evil, but wants to free humans from Goa'uld enslavement. His host might not be human.
I would bring in a linguist to recreate the original Egyptian names as well as is possible, so Ri‘a, Wos’ir, Yinepu, Sutah, etc. instead of their Hellenized names. Ideally, they should coach the actors playing non-earthlings on the correct pronunciation. Words should not have apostrophes thrown in randomly to make them look "alien." The heroes would still use the Greek names out of convenience.
There are no Ancients, or at the very least they weren't human. The stargates were invented by the Goa'uld, or are of a uniquely Goa'uld design. If a previous species invented them, the originals look very different than the Goa'uld model.
The Goa'uld are much, much too powerful for the earthlings to even consider taking on. For this reason, they are rarely engaged. Earth is too far away and too insignificant for the System Lords to bother with, especially with the disruption caused by Re's death. There might be petty lordlings on the fringes of Re's order or even outside of it altogether who can antagonize Earth, but it should be made clear from the outset that even the weakest Great Lord could sterilize Earth with a single medium sized warship, and there is nothing we could do to stop it. In fact there might be an episode or two where the heroes manage to win a substantial victory over a minor lord, only to learn that they were manipulated and facilitated by a more powerful lord. Mostly the heroes would be striking against petty, independent lords or finding allies. The System Lords would be a distant threat for the first several seasons, like Star Trek's Dominion. Perhaps over time the earthlings find several advanced societies and build up an alliance, and this is what eventually convinces the Goa'uld to lash out and expand beyond their ancient empire. When they do decide to start expanding again, it should be like SG1's Ori, with massive ships that no-one can hope to defeat head-on, and giant armies of tens of millions of Jaffa. Their final defeat would require some very skilled writing, but this way we wouldn't have so much villain decay.
Jaffa do not carry larval Goa'uld. Humans are promoted to sacred warriors and implanted with a device that makes them stronger and healthier, but requires a periodic signal to keep functioning. Without this signal, the Jaffa will gradually sicken and die. A lord would usually have something on his person transmitting the signal, and transmitters would be built into idols that the Jaffa must venerate regularly. A Goa'uld might be able to command the device to give pleasure or pain. It could be used to subtly manipulate the Jaffa's emotions by giving him a sense of calm or pleasure when in the presence of Goa'uld. The signals should be sent by some means that the Earthlings cannot copy or understand. It will take long time for their science to catch up, so simply interfering with the devices en masse is not an option for our heroes.
The Tok'ra created anti-idols that can disable the control device. These are smuggled into Jaffa ranks in the hopes of an eventual Jaffa rebellion. Bra'tac and Tea'lc used an anti-idol to free themselves. Initially the source of the anti-idols should be unknown, so the discovery of the Tok'ra would be spread out over many episodes.
Above all else, the Goa'uld maintain the illusion that they are gods, and that their technology is magic. Humans, including Jaffa, are kept away from contexts where they might realize that their gods' powers could be emulated by anyone with the right knowledge and tools. There is at least one planet populated exclusively by Goa'uld, many of whom are normal civilians. Most would probably live like rich play-boys, others would be engaged in the scientific and mechanical work necessary for the maintenance of an interstellar empire, some might be artists or even merchants and artisans. This would be the City of the Gods or the Otherworld of myth.
The Goa'uld are not in a constant state of cold war and rivalry. The Great Lords do sometimes feud, but over-all Re was able to maintain a stable if decentralized government for thousands of years. With Re's death, the system has become destabilized, but they have not quite fallen into all out war.
Some of the Goa'uld characters would be renamed. Apophis' role should be played by Set, and Sokar's by Apep. Set should be a reluctant vassal who tried to undermine Re and increase his own power, perhaps someday aspiring to ascend to the throne, but kept in check by Re, and rallying to the common cause whenever they Goa'uld face a real threat. Apep is outside of the System Lord hierarchy and has his own empire. He seeks to destroy Re's order. He might not be evil, but wants to free humans from Goa'uld enslavement. His host might not be human.
I would bring in a linguist to recreate the original Egyptian names as well as is possible, so Ri‘a, Wos’ir, Yinepu, Sutah, etc. instead of their Hellenized names. Ideally, they should coach the actors playing non-earthlings on the correct pronunciation. Words should not have apostrophes thrown in randomly to make them look "alien." The heroes would still use the Greek names out of convenience.
There are no Ancients, or at the very least they weren't human. The stargates were invented by the Goa'uld, or are of a uniquely Goa'uld design. If a previous species invented them, the originals look very different than the Goa'uld model.
The Goa'uld are much, much too powerful for the earthlings to even consider taking on. For this reason, they are rarely engaged. Earth is too far away and too insignificant for the System Lords to bother with, especially with the disruption caused by Re's death. There might be petty lordlings on the fringes of Re's order or even outside of it altogether who can antagonize Earth, but it should be made clear from the outset that even the weakest Great Lord could sterilize Earth with a single medium sized warship, and there is nothing we could do to stop it. In fact there might be an episode or two where the heroes manage to win a substantial victory over a minor lord, only to learn that they were manipulated and facilitated by a more powerful lord. Mostly the heroes would be striking against petty, independent lords or finding allies. The System Lords would be a distant threat for the first several seasons, like Star Trek's Dominion. Perhaps over time the earthlings find several advanced societies and build up an alliance, and this is what eventually convinces the Goa'uld to lash out and expand beyond their ancient empire. When they do decide to start expanding again, it should be like SG1's Ori, with massive ships that no-one can hope to defeat head-on, and giant armies of tens of millions of Jaffa. Their final defeat would require some very skilled writing, but this way we wouldn't have so much villain decay.
"Can you eat quarks? Can you spread them on your bed when the cold weather comes?" -Bernard Levin
"Sir: Mr. Bernard Levin asks 'Can you eat quarks?' I estimate that he eats 500,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,001 quarks a day...Yours faithfully..." -Sir Alan Cottrell
Elohim's loving mercy: "Hey, you, don't turn around. WTF! I said DON'T tur- you know what, you're a pillar of salt now. Bitch." - an anonymous commenter
"Sir: Mr. Bernard Levin asks 'Can you eat quarks?' I estimate that he eats 500,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,001 quarks a day...Yours faithfully..." -Sir Alan Cottrell
Elohim's loving mercy: "Hey, you, don't turn around. WTF! I said DON'T tur- you know what, you're a pillar of salt now. Bitch." - an anonymous commenter
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
That ship is probably my favorite starship design in all of sci-fi, so I approve this message.adam_grif wrote:Goddamn BC-304 porn. I love that ship design so much. There can never be enough of it on-screen.
Yeah, that's another possible work around.adam_grif wrote:Ba'al isn't Egyptian, but Ba'al was worshiped in regions very close to it. It might be worth making an exception just for him because he's a fan favorite
I always liked the Genii for the same reasons and I was disappointed that they more or less got ignored after Cowen's death in Season 2.adam_grif wrote:I liked the Genii in SGA (although I didn't like SGA generally), because it put us in role reversed positions with the traditional alien contact. Might be interesting to have something inspired by them.
Anyway, a similiar antagonist would be a nice foil for a rebooted SG-1.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
You're crazy. The 304 is a) fuck ugly and b) is responsibly for the last several years of SG1 sucking shit. Avoiding the writing traps that led to its inclusion is essential.
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Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
That was fucking baffling. They get the Stargate working and within a decade they're churning out massive fucking starships? The reverse engineered glider was neat because it was just a glider with human additions. Going from there to the Prometheus is a bizarre step in such a timeframe.JME2 wrote:That ship is probably my favorite starship design in all of sci-fi, so I approve this message.adam_grif wrote:Goddamn BC-304 porn. I love that ship design so much. There can never be enough of it on-screen.
Part of what I liked about the show was the idea that Earth was essentially the Alice Springs of the galaxy. It'd be like LoTR ending with the foundation of the Hobbit Empire and their conquest of everything west of the Anduin.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"
- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist
"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"
- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist
"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Guys, I was joking about the BC-304 -- or half joking, anyway. I really do like the design.
Here's another thought: CaptainChewbacca's Stargate: 1939 would also make an interesting reboot scenario.
Stick with the basic plot of the film, but set it during the 1930's after Langford's brought the gate over.Throw in a Nazi Germany that's pursuing their own Stargate program (the New Swabia expedition finds the Beta Gate) and things might get interesting.
Here's another thought: CaptainChewbacca's Stargate: 1939 would also make an interesting reboot scenario.
Stick with the basic plot of the film, but set it during the 1930's after Langford's brought the gate over.Throw in a Nazi Germany that's pursuing their own Stargate program (the New Swabia expedition finds the Beta Gate) and things might get interesting.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Was the Stargate program ever cash-strapped in the show? I never watched more than a handful of it relative to other shows, but I seem to recall liking the early years more than the later years because in the early years the Stargate teams were like 4 guys with backpacks and rifles and that's it. Then at the end of the show - which is like ten years later - they're flying star destroyers or some bullshit.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Didn't they have episodes about public servants or military guys wanting to cancel them and shit, especailly at the start?
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Yeah I vaguely recall something like that, also something about corruption in the SG teams, some teams were being sent out to steal tech/act like assholes, which I thought was an awesome idea.
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
The Prometheus was hacked together using naval engineering and stolen Goa'uld parts. The hyperdrive was the example of this we saw on screen, but it stands to reason that other parts were in a similar sort of situation (as in, they don't know how to make them, but they do know how to use them). The Naquadah engines were given to Earth by the humans from the protected planet thing.The reverse engineered glider was neat because it was just a glider with human additions. Going from there to the Prometheus is a bizarre step in such a timeframe.
IMO it wouldn't have been jarring at all if it had been markedly inferior to a Ha'tak, but from memory it was "just as good" except for hyperdrive speed etc. It wasn't until the Asgard gave us a bunch of new toys and the ability to make as much of them as we wanted that mass production actually took place, presumably because bottleknecks relating to needing to salvage the parts from captured enemy vessels were relieved.
I would be so down for that.It'd be like LoTR ending with the foundation of the Hobbit Empire and their conquest of everything west of the Anduin.
Stick with the basic plot of the film, but set it during the 1930's after Langford's brought the gate over.Throw in a Nazi Germany that's pursuing their own Stargate program (the New Swabia expedition finds the Beta Gate) and things might get interesting.
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
Re: How Would You Reboot Stargate?
Though I like all your ideas, I think you should also consider what made the show a success for some time: Diversity.
SG1 is centered around the exploration of all the possible evolution of our own civilizations from cavemen to semi-ascended beings. Different technological levels but also different mindsets.
While the core of the Goa'uld dominion is probably heavily influenced by Ancient Cultures, the fringes of their territories could be home to more diverse populations: Goa'uld affiliated cultures like the Tok'ra, Unas, Sodan ; banished Goa'uld themselves; abandonned colonies which developed on their own like the Tollan or Aschen ; smugglers like the Lucian alliance ; ancient outposts of the older races ; etc.
Make it look like the galaxy or at least the more advanced parts of it are heavily populated. And that even if the Goa'ulds are clearly not the nicest guys around, they do participate in maintaining some kind of balance. And that is why even the Tok'ra are taking their time to deconstruct their empires.
That could fit very well with the Replicator invasion at the end of s8. And lead to a new redistribution of power after that (since everyone is in really bad shape) with Earth being finally more involved into galactic politics instead of being the terrorist of the week.
SG1 is centered around the exploration of all the possible evolution of our own civilizations from cavemen to semi-ascended beings. Different technological levels but also different mindsets.
While the core of the Goa'uld dominion is probably heavily influenced by Ancient Cultures, the fringes of their territories could be home to more diverse populations: Goa'uld affiliated cultures like the Tok'ra, Unas, Sodan ; banished Goa'uld themselves; abandonned colonies which developed on their own like the Tollan or Aschen ; smugglers like the Lucian alliance ; ancient outposts of the older races ; etc.
Make it look like the galaxy or at least the more advanced parts of it are heavily populated. And that even if the Goa'ulds are clearly not the nicest guys around, they do participate in maintaining some kind of balance. And that is why even the Tok'ra are taking their time to deconstruct their empires.
That could fit very well with the Replicator invasion at the end of s8. And lead to a new redistribution of power after that (since everyone is in really bad shape) with Earth being finally more involved into galactic politics instead of being the terrorist of the week.
Future is a common dream. Past is a shared lie.
There is the only the 3 Presents : the Present of Today, the Present of Tomorrow and the Present of Yesterday.
There is the only the 3 Presents : the Present of Today, the Present of Tomorrow and the Present of Yesterday.