How Would You Reboot Stargate?

[CaptainChewbacca]

Guys, I was joking about the BC-304 -- or half joking, anyway. I really do like the design.

Here's another thought: CaptainChewbacca's Stargate: 1939 would also make an interesting reboot scenario.

Stick with the basic plot of the film, but set it during the 1930's after Langford's brought the gate over.Throw in a Nazi Germany that's pursuing their own Stargate program (the New Swabia expedition finds the Beta Gate) and things might get interesting.

Believe it or not, I'm still gonna get back to that someday. I've been working on 'Secret of Osiris' for a while and it should be ready in a month or two.

[Thanas]

Guys, I was joking about the BC-304 -- or half joking, anyway. I really do like the design.

Here's another thought: CaptainChewbacca's Stargate: 1939 would also make an interesting reboot scenario.

Stick with the basic plot of the film, but set it during the 1930's after Langford's brought the gate over.Throw in a Nazi Germany that's pursuing their own Stargate program (the New Swabia expedition finds the Beta Gate) and things might get interesting.

Heck no.

Americans can't write Germans if their life would depend on it (hint: not everything is a) named after medieval counties long dissolved, b) not everyone has a von, c) just because it sounds menacing does not make it German).

So really, just leave it alone. Nazies in space is both ridiculous and borderline offensive.

[Sarevok]

It is also campy and the last thing a Stargate reboot needs is continue the 90s camp found in the original series.

[Shroom Man 777]

ITT we know that the last thing Stargate reboot needs is Sarevok's advice.

Stargate hit the shitter when it started getting all woo-woo with the religulous Ori shtick and the save the universe shtick and the deus ex machina shtick and the epic space opera galactic whatever shtick. Weren't the earlier Stargate seasons, particularly the ones with O'Neill and RDA still hanging around and being whacky, considered some of the best in the show? Window of Opportunity was an awesome episode, and yet that was also pretty campy. Stargate had a quirky sense of humor, RDA was its heart, and this distinguished it from stuff like Star Trek and other sci-fis that take themselves too seriously, like nBSG or whatever.

I'd focus on humour and cameraderie instead of listening to the nerds.

STRAK is rite. One of the best things about SG-1 was the interplay between the four main characters. They were awesome. Those moments where you can cry with the characters are more powerful when those characters are the same ones you've laughed with. This was what made Window of Opportunity's resolution so resonant, despite its suddenness.

I also have no problem with Space Nazis. Don't tell me you didn't like Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, Thanas?

[Zaune]

I'm not all that familiar with the series, but adam_grif's ideas sound a lot more entertaining that what I've heard of the original. One minor addition I'd suggest is the SG team back-engineering Gou'ald small arms into something a bit more practical, crudely at first -bolting the sights and furniture from an AT-4 onto a staff weapon?- but with increasing sophistication as the series progresses. Without making a big thing about it, mind you, just as background detail.

And for that matter, why not have the Gou'ald start copying terrestrial weapons and tactics if they work better?

[JME2]

Believe it or not, I'm still gonna get back to that someday. I've been working on 'Secret of Osiris' for a while and it should be ready in a month or two.

Good, good...

Weren't the earlier Stargate seasons, particularly the ones with O'Neill and RDA still hanging around and being whacky, considered some of the best in the show? Window of Opportunity was an awesome episode, and yet that was also pretty campy. Stargate had a quirky sense of humor, RDA was its heart, and this distinguished it from stuff like Star Trek and other sci-fis that take themselves too seriously, like nBSG or whatever.

I recall Michael Shanks saying that he considered SG-1 a comedy masquerading as a drama; I'm trying to find the interview...

But yeah, the humor was key part of the show and by extension, the franchise. The golfing scene in "Window of Opportunity", for example, still cracks me up anytime I think of it. Same with goes with "Tangent" and Daniel identifying himself in Goa'uld as "the Great and Powerful Oz".

[Coyote]

Having the SG program be more international would be good, as would having vehicles. They'd start off with motorcycles and ATVs at first, the graduate to things like the Alvis FV-101 family.

Another thing I'd like would be the inclusion of groups like the Genii, a fairly large and organized group of humans that have tech anywhere from the 30's to the 50's fighting a desperate, ongoing war against the Gou'auld-- Mauser and Thompson-style smallarms and light tanks/tankettes with riveted plate armor... --and they don't want to be supplanted by the Earth forces since they've been fighting this war for decades and now the Earth folks are coming to take the glory and real estate they've fought for.

Most importantly, I'd rather see the Earth forces raising "Foreign Legions" of troops from Stargate worlds. That would make it easier to explain how they kept the massive war infrastructure secret back on Earth. One problem I had with the final seasons of SG1 and all of SGA was the knowledge that the infrastructure needed to build a half-dozen massive spaceships, crew them, fight and lose people would be in the millions, and it would be impossible to keep secret. Raising former slaves of the Gou'auld into Foreign Legions would make more sense, especially once off-plant manufacturing sites for weapons & radios got built. Plus the former slaves would certainly be motivated for the fight, and the threat of retaliation on their homeworlds/families would provide some ongoing tension and the occasional arc.

[andrewgpaul]

Make it an international project, not just an american one. Have one of the key issues be the distribution of advanced technology among the Earth nations. This also allows for more character development and plots among the team.

Agreed, but it should probably start as purely an American one, and then become international fairly early on when it becomes clear that it can't be kept a secret, and is too much for just America to handle.

At the same time I wouldn't force so much hamfisted morality into the show,

As an addendum to this, no more episodes with third act Soylent-Green-is-People reveals, the "oh cool they finally got some cool tech to beat the goa- oh wait never mind it's fueled by baby's tears and Jackson is giving a speech about how it should be destroyed now" is fucking shit. It's been done, and not just in Stargate either.

Perhaps you could have the gate originally discovered and activated by some non-superpower small nation - like Thailand (or Egypt, I suppose); they got the gate up and running somehow, and managed to keep it secret for six months or a year - long enough for them to make alliances with some off-world groups - before the US and Russia and whoever else muscles their way in. By this time, the big boys want to take ovre, but the important aliens are already allied with the original discoverers, so they need to be kept in the picture.

[Revy]

Forget finding the Stargate in Egypt - have them find Atlantis sunk to the bottom of the Atlantic ocean or burried under the ice of Antarctica (as they originally intended) and have the new, international SGC run from the Lost City. This gives them a Stargate, DHD and address list right from the get go, along with enough advanced tech that they can actually stand up to the Goa'uld from the start. I'd have some kind of translator implant to eliminate the language problem (beats just saying everyone speaks English and leaving it at that).

Make the Jaffa just human soldiers, perhaps augmented by Goa'uld genetic enhancements but not carrying the snakes around in their guts everywhere they go. Have them as fanatically devoted to the Goa'uld as the human Ori followers were, but still have enough doubters to start up a rebel movement. Ditch the Unas completely, I think they were just stupid.

Either kill Apophis off at the end of the first season or just don't have him in it at all, I didn't like him much either. Don't bother with the Nox, but introduce the Furlings just because they never really showed up in the original show. Either have them as Earth allies or make them a threat to the entire Galaxy when an SG team accidentally wakes them up/lets them out of something. Don't bother introducing the Reetou or the Crystal Skull aliens unless something is actually done with them beyond one single episode. Oh! And bring back the Foothold aliens but as a recurring villain. Maybe redesign their look, but have the same kind of MO.

I'd have the Ancients be a precursor human race just as the show originally did, but have them wiped out by some mysterious enemy that is only alluded to (the Ori, who can be introduced if the show runs past the demise of the Goa'uld). I'd still have ascended beings, but not Ancients. I'd have Oma and a handful of her followers be the ascended club, and have no rules or problems with blasting the crap out of anyone they don't like (as we saw Oma do initially). I'd have Anubis turn up as a full-fledged Ascended being, not a half one, and Oma can't lower him back so all she can do is stop him from zapping entire planets on a whim. He is still able to use his ascended powers to imitate a god far better than the Goa'uld as well as use much more advanced tech, which allows him to curbstomp the System Lords entirely. I'd still have some Goa'uld join his side to avoid destruction (such as Ba'al).

If I had the Asgard in the reboot, I'd still have them be clones but as someone else said I'd do away with the stupid genetic degredation thing. I'd also have Asgard that upload their minds into human clone bodies so we can have human actors portraying Asgard characters, and have one of those be a regular cast member.

[NecronLord]

Gotta love the suggestions about the staff weapons. No one in the regular audience would give a crap about what kind of grip it has. If you want the jaffa to be able to hit things, just show them hitting things. Internet analysis geeks will rationalise it as grav-assist and HUDs or whatever.

That said, my nerd-sense demands more cool animal-head helmets. I'm sure the CGI in 2030 can manage to have every jaffa have one.

The snake-in-the gut should probably go, or at least be less common.

[Darth Hoth]

Ba'al isn't Egyptian, but Ba'al was worshiped in regions very close to it. It might be worth making an exception just for him because he's a fan favorite

There is actually historical/archaeological evidence of the ancient Levantine deities having a presence in Egypt; 'Anat and 'Athtart are both attested, and if I recall correctly there is evidence for syncretistic identification of Set with Hadad (=Ba'al, basically). Although that would be much later than when Ra canonically left Earth (no certain indications before Hyksos times, I believe).

Although I would not mind including a couple of those deities, anyway; Ba'al and 'Anat were pretty cool in their mythologies, if the Ras Shamra texts are to be taken as representative. Perhaps they could be neutral parties or reluctant allies with the Ra-loyalist Goa'uld equivalents in their battle against Apep?

If so, their imagery should be noticeably different from the general Egyptian one. In the series as it stood it became ridiculous with every Hellenistic or Chinese godling using the same Egyptian shtick as everyone else. (And yes, I know that was due to budgetary constraints, but the point remains.)

[Jeremy]

Twelve thousand years ago, an Ancient Symbiotic Civilization had spread to a handful of star systems when their home system was catastrophically destroyed by a naquadria experiment. Fortunately, their technology required little manual labor and one of the survivors was Ra who had just carted thousands of enslaved Humans from resource poor Earth to his secret resource base Abydos.

Since Human make better hosts than the Unas (who look like Asgard as in the Movie) the Goa’uld change bodies. Ra's fellow travelers become his feudal System Lords, collectively known as Goauld. The Goauld conquer the Oranians, Reol, and Ohne before being stopped by an alliance of Tokra, Gadmeer, Nox, and Furlings.

Thousands of years later, the Nox and Furlings are gone, the Gadmeer's sun is destabilizing, and the System Lords are chafing. Some human populations such as the Aschen, Orbanians, and Tollan, develop immune responses to implantation and throw off their masters. The Tokra incite rebellion among Humans and Jaffa. Stragoth, Serrakin, and Reetou are also causing trouble for the System Lords. Finally, Ra takes a day off from Chulak and is killed on Abydos.


SEASON ONE: More for us, fuck you.
Ra’s lieutenant, Apophis, tries to take over but is opposed by Heruur. The SG Teams use Tealc to investigate the Gate System, recover advanced technology, and terrorize Apophis. In a cliff hanger, Apophis attacks Earth.

SEASON TWO: We’re in too deep.
The USA is secretly confronted by world powers at a G-8 meeting with evidence of Star Gate Command. The SG Teams are confronted with growing numbers of refugees from the Goauld. SGC finally makes allies of some aliens. The outcast Sokar takes advantage of the infighting of the System Lords. In a cliff hangar Sokar destroys the Star Gate.

SEASON THREE: The fruits of our labors.
Demands are placed on the SGC from its new allies, the resettled Human refugees, domestic politics, and the international community. Some of the recovered technology is starting to be employed on Earth.The System Lords negotiate Earth’s neutrality with the Gadmeer so they can focus on Sokar. In a cliff hangar the Replicators are introduced.

SEASON FOUR: The jig is up.
Earth’s technological backwardness is an increasing handicap for the SGC. Earth’s allies become undependable and sundry types begin to take advantage of this. The SGC’s is straining ever harder to keep its cover on Earth and conduct meaningful interstellar operations. In a cliff hanger the SGC is exposed to the public while Sokar deploys a superweapon and then is knocked off by Apophis.

SEASON FIVE: The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Between the Replicators and Apophis, the System Lords are in disarray. The power vacuum is filled by various hostile factions. The SGC attempts to restore the ancient alliance to defend the galaxy. Earth experiences a renaissance as more alien technologies are deciphered though the politics on Earth become very ugly. Attempting to recreate a naquadria power source, will the Earth face the cataclysm that befell the Goauld?


No Spirit aliens, no psychic crap, no time travel, no parallel dimension, and only the Milky Way Galaxy!

[Darth Hoth]

As for my own original ideas, I would stick closer to the original storyline, and/or that in the original novel series. Basically:

*Ra's empire is The Big Boss, and he actually rules/ruled it effectively with very minor rebellions/backstabbing, and most of even this part of the distant past. It is an ancient feudal realm, slowly decaying due to the reactionary nature and declining numbers of the alien elite. Essentially, one of those classical, decadent and otiose alien empires. Human functionaries and/or possibly robots do most actual work, with aliens occupying only the highest offices. Technology is effectively magical but highly unevenly applied. The higher human priest castes and such might be given magical artefacts/holy relics that make them biologically immortal, give them effective telekinesis and so on, while the basic farmers still do most work by hand. As a rule, however, technology is in slow but certain decline.

*The "divinity" of the Goa'uld equivalents and their exalted position is really hammered home. Per above, they will be mostly distant, brooding overlords, and all initial human interaction should be with their soldier and priest castes. (Vaguely like the Ori are portrayed in the later seasons.) When they are approached by their servitors, it will be more "High Priest fasts for two weeks before entering the Holy of Holies, fearful of the Lord's Wrath that will strike all his people if he displeases him" and less "Reporting in, Master". Writers get to read Exodus and Numbers in the Holy Bible to get the style right. It should be a moment of awe when we actually see a "god" in person for the first time, and a definite "Oh, shit" moment when he speaks of his displeasure with the irritant of Earth. (Which, by the way, is not called "Tau'ri")

*The Goa'uld equivalents are not snake/fish/monster things, but aliens more like the original Ra. They are also less human in their "host" personalities; more like Ra in the first film, aloof and mostly emotionless. Another partial model for their character will be Jehovah from the Pentateuch: completely overbearing, talking down to humans as though they were ants, demanding total obedience, with perhaps some occasional fondness for favoured servants/pets. Human and likeable villains (series Ba'al, for example) will rather be human flunkies and janissaries.

*Either no or very few other alien species besides the Goa'uld equivalents. There may be other "throwback" or rebellious human civilisations in various stages of development, from cliché mediaeval societies to something more like the Aschen. One effective story arc might be Earth interacting with one of these and feeling like China against the British in the 19th century . . . only to then have that civilisation stomped on by the local governor from the Empire of Ra.

*Technobabble is severely restrained. There is no time travel. There are no "wormhole physics" of the Carter variety. If it can be helped, there is no "mass lightening," no event horizons, no zero point whatever. If alien technology must be explained it should be done so in generalities. Basic things can be tolerated (e.g., the "mineral" from the original film is a catalyst for powerful atomic reactions.) Mostly the technology is too much way ahead to be understood, but can only be tested empirically for effects.

*Humanity America is battling for its life. This will affect the mood of the setting. Not necessarily Gritty Grimdark GRIMDARK, but there will be actual drama and less of the Star Trek-like morality. If the bad guy wants to defect to Earth and brings with him the technology required for effective cold fusion, he will be accepted, not killed because he was so evil. And so forth.

***

Some additions from reading this thread so far:

*Correct Egyptian speech, or at least something that sounds vaguely like it. The series suffered extremely in this regard when compared to the film.

*Absolutely no transhumanism/singularity stuff of any kind, or allusion to it. That shit infests way too much of fiction already. The problem of the Ancients is solved by them not ever being there at all; their role as predecessor race is taken over by Ra's race.

*Preferably no international programme. The characters on an "international" team are nearly always stereotypes and uninteresting, it becomes forced, and the political bickering more likely than not comes to dominate the scene. America is diverse enough that one can have multicultural characters if one absolutely must anyway, and politicking can be done enough with the dastardly MacNamara Senators/SecDefs/unsympathetic officers.

[JME2]

There's one other cardinal rule I'd put into place and it's more of a production rule: NO crossovers with the Prime reality. Mythology gags are fine, but do not attempt to draw solid links back as Star Trek XI did via time travel or what not. Keep it isolated -- though I would have nothing against old actors involved in some way ala Richard Hatch in NBSG.

[StarshipTitanic]

Forget finding the Stargate in Egypt - have them find Atlantis sunk to the bottom of the Atlantic ocean or burried under the ice of Antarctica (as they originally intended) and have the new, international SGC run from the Lost City. This gives them a Stargate, DHD and address list right from the get go, along with enough advanced tech that they can actually stand up to the Goa'uld from the start. I'd have some kind of translator implant to eliminate the language problem (beats just saying everyone speaks English and leaving it at that).

I don't mean to start a big thing over this but I think it's pretty fucking hilarious how your first suggestion is to rob the show of seasons worth of drama and plot advances for the sake of coolness when you slam Star Trek: Voyager for literally the same problem in your sig:

"And the writers sayeth unto the firmament: let there be a hokey plot convenience! And lo, I sayeth it shall be a curse upon Voyager, and all the people who dwell within, and they shall surely feeleth like a collection of jackasses."

Your "reboot" is starting the story where it leaves off in SG: Atlantis.

[Drooling Iguana]

First of all, I would not retcon the bit in the movie about Ra being the last of his species. The basic Stargate premise ("We've found a magic door that lets us travel through a network of similar magic doors littered throughout the galaxy") allows for a huge variety of diverse plots, which the producers of the TV series flushed down the toilet almost immediately by making everything All Go'auld, All The Time.

There would still be recurring aliens and civilizations and long-term story arcs involving Earth's interactions with them but there would be no single race dominating the entire series the way the Go'auld did.

Secondly, I'd take a Law and Order approach to casting and rotate the lead characters frequently. This would allow the show to remain fresh longer and not be absolutely reliant on the same half dozen or so cast members remaining on contract. Hell, the show is about a military installation so you'd expect frequent turnaround with characters being promoted, re-assigned, killed in action, finishing their enlistment period and going home, etc.

Beyond that I'd just assemble a team of the most talented science fiction/military writers I could find and see what they could come up with, with an overriding directive to keep the rebooted Stargate universe as flexible as possible so that a wide variety of stories can be told.

[adam_grif]

Nox, and Furlings.

Space Hippies and Koala Bears?

Tbh I would remove the Nox and Furlings entirely. They might be good for a one off gag though, where Jackson is visiting a science team examining the ruins of some civilization and the lead scientist has translated their name to "Furlings", which Daniel quickly corrects to something else on account of that being a ludicrous name

Absolutely no transhumanism/singularity stuff of any kind, or allusion to it. That shit infests way too much of fiction already.

Pah, the idea is to briefly acknowledge that it exists, but to get it out of the way so it doesn't intrude on the story. It also helps handwave why we aren't being constantly visited from other galaxies even though FTL is in effect - most of the civilizations either die out or cut themselves off.

Technobabble is severely restrained. There is no time travel. There are no "wormhole physics" of the Carter variety. If it can be helped, there is no "mass lightening," no event horizons, no zero point whatever. If alien technology must be explained it should be done so in generalities.

Agree and disagree. I think the alien tech and the magic physics should be rigidly constructed and consistently employed, however, the audience should not be bored with it. It would be a writers tool, useful as a reference for deciding what can and cannot be done with certain tech in stories, and to keep things consistent over the series run. But there won't be any speeches in the show where Carter explains about how the subspace transmitter works unless it's somehow vital to the episode, which should be very rare if it's present at all.

Then we release those details in the form of a tech manual for all us fat nerds to scan and use in Vs debates.

Preferably no international programme.

We're trying to avoid strainging SoD here, America conquers the universe is a bit much

Also, Hoth, just an fyi, but there should be a mob of angry pitchfork wielding fans arriving at your doorstep any moment now to lynch you for discussing the possibility of a Gate reboot that doesn't feature the Asgard / Replicators, and Ba'al reduced to a functionary. And I wish them the best of luck in their endeavor

Gotta love the suggestions about the staff weapons. No one in the regular audience would give a crap about what kind of grip it has. If you want the jaffa to be able to hit things, just show them hitting things. Internet analysis geeks will rationalise it as grav-assist and HUDs or whatever.

Nobody in the audience would care if we saw the return of the psychic vampires that drained people's "Life force" (What does that even mean, anyway?) either, but I think we all agree that we should leave that shit out if we have any say in it.

Making staff weapons more practical by the end of the series would be a nice touch to show that the writers actually thought about their series.

That said, my nerd-sense demands more cool animal-head helmets.

I showed Children of the Gods to a buddy a few weeks back, when the Animal helmet guys showed up on screen he descended into fits of laughter. That shit is cheese to the max

Most importantly, I'd rather see the Earth forces raising "Foreign Legions" of troops from Stargate worlds. That would make it easier to explain how they kept the massive war infrastructure secret back on Earth.

I think I suggested about a page back that Earth should take in refugees from a more advanced civilization (just starting to get early shields and primitive hyperdrives). There might be some sort of Beta-site type place that acts as a sanctuary for these and rescued slave populations from other worlds, who can help set up factories and provide manpower for our Foreign legions in our glorious ascendancy to dominate the Known Galaxy

Heck no.

Americans can't write Germans if their life would depend on it (hint: not everything is a) named after medieval counties long dissolved, b) not everyone has a von, c) just because it sounds menacing does not make it German).

Wait wait, so you're saying that Baron Freidrich Von Schnitzelhousen is not an authentic German name?

:O

[Darth Hoth]

Pah, the idea is to briefly acknowledge that it exists, but to get it out of the way so it doesn't intrude on the story. It also helps handwave why we aren't being constantly visited from other galaxies even though FTL is in effect - most of the civilizations either die out or cut themselves off.

One could leave it at the "die out" bit as far as I am concerned. Or perhaps the Goa'uld equivalents killed off all life in the local supercluster fifty thousand years ago. Or intelligent life is just naturally very rare. Putting it there at all in the first place is just asking the writers to turn it into the usual brainbug. Kind of how it happened with the psychic powers/whatever in the first series. Or time travel, for that matter. (The latter in particular, now that I think of it. One can have a minor plot device that fits perfectly as a one-shot, as in the S1 time travel episode, and then still have idiots turn it into the same staid, old bullshit/reset button/general lameness.)

Agree and disagree. I think the alien tech and the magic physics should be rigidly constructed and consistently employed, however, the audience should not be bored with it. It would be a writers tool, useful as a reference for deciding what can and cannot be done with certain tech in stories, and to keep things consistent over the series run. But there won't be any speeches in the show where Carter explains about how the subspace transmitter works unless it's somehow vital to the episode, which should be very rare if it's present at all.

Then we release those details in the form of a tech manual for all us fat nerds to scan and use in Vs debates.

Well, obviously there would be consistent thought about it beforehand. That is so much a mainstay on this board that I kind of took it for granted. I meant more that the technology needed not be described in detail onscreen, as you said.

And lol to SG:ICS

We're trying to avoid strainging SoD here, America conquers the universe is a bit much

Will an international effort necessarily do better, though? I am not entirely sure that any reasonable economic or military contribution from other powers would outweigh the huge bickering that would follow. Cooperation is generally only useful when all parties have something to contribute, and in this case America more or less has everything it needs by itself. Since they will be limited by the gate in their logistics (at least initially), that puts much more of a cap on their actual operations than any budgetary concerns.

Also, Hoth, just an fyi, but there should be a mob of angry pitchfork wielding fans arriving at your doorstep any moment now to lynch you for discussing the possibility of a Gate reboot that doesn't feature the Asgard / Replicators, and Ba'al reduced to a functionary. And I wish them the best of luck in their endeavor

May the Force protect me!

Although when I say flunky, that is still kind of relative. High priestly officials in the ancient countries (and religions) were not exactly unassuming civil servants. Think more along the lines of Moses, Joshua or King David from the Bible - powerful individuals in their own right, besides that they speak for Jehovah. And if we want conniving backstabbery in the good, old Ba'al style we could perhaps include some corrupt priests/generals who see through the charade, as well. (The Bible and other ancients books have those, too, after all; Egyptian Book of the Dead, anyone?) Though that, of course, would also depend on just how distant the "gods" are most of the time.

The point was, I want the aliens to be genuinely awesome, scary, sinister, and alien, like Ra was in the original film. That is hard to combine with Ba'als character; series Goa'uld act much too human, in my opinion, and are quickly reduced to a dime a dozen for random uninteresting warlords.

The other alien races I can honestly do without, regardless of the pitchforks. Since I saw the film first, my impression of the franchise was formed from that, and I feel the other aliens detract from the awesomeness and uniqueness of Ra and his empire. As well, the Replicators are, in my book, honestly lame.

[Darksider]

The other alien races I can honestly do without, regardless of the pitchforks. Since I saw the film first, my impression of the franchise was formed from that, and I feel the other aliens detract from the awesomeness and uniqueness of Ra and his empire. As well, the Replicators are, in my book, honestly lame.

The replicators were an interesting and unique alien threat until they came up with the human-forms. Then they just got lame. It's a good thing they dealt with them shortly after that.

Then atlantis re-hashed the whole plot with the Asurans. Hell, they even started calling them Replicators (something I refuse to do) even though they were from a completely different technology base and had a completely different society.

[JME2]

First of all, I would not retcon the bit in the movie about Ra being the last of his species. The basic Stargate premise ("We've found a magic door that lets us travel through a network of similar magic doors littered throughout the galaxy") allows for a huge variety of diverse plots, which the producers of the TV series flushed down the toilet almost immediately by making everything All Go'auld, All The Time.

There would still be recurring aliens and civilizations and long-term story arcs involving Earth's interactions with them but there would be no single race dominating the entire series the way the Go'auld did.

That would be more interesting this time around.

The point was, I want the aliens to be genuinely awesome, scary, sinister, and alien, like Ra was in the original film. That is hard to combine with Ba'als character; series Goa'uld act much too human, in my opinion, and are quickly reduced to a dime a dozen for random uninteresting warlords.

The other alien races I can honestly do without, regardless of the pitchforks. Since I saw the film first, my impression of the franchise was formed from that, and I feel the other aliens detract from the awesomeness and uniqueness of Ra and his empire. As well, the Replicators are, in my book, honestly lame.

As much as I love Ba'al, I agree with you. . Ra was genuinely threatening and terrifying and none of the Goa'uld actors (or the writers) managed to truly reach the bar Jaye Davidson set with the film.

Secondly, I'd take a Law and Order approach to casting and rotate the lead characters frequently. This would allow the show to remain fresh longer and not be absolutely reliant on the same half dozen or so cast members remaining on contract. Hell, the show is about a military installation so you'd expect frequent turnaround with characters being promoted, re-assigned, killed in action, finishing their enlistment period and going home, etc.

Didn't JMS do something similiar with Babylon 5's character? I've never watched the show, so I don't know.

The replicators were an interesting and unique alien threat until they came up with the human-forms. Then they just got lame. It's a good thing they dealt with them shortly after that.

Then atlantis re-hashed the whole plot with the Asurans. Hell, they even started calling them Replicators (something I refuse to do) even though they were from a completely different technology base and had a completely different society.

I started banging me head every time the Asurans were called Pegasus Replicators or Replicators. Their introduction was easily among the top mistakes the series made.

I agree that if they are Replicators are reintroduced, then stick only with the Legos from Hell. Do not go beyond the bugs. No more human form Replicators.

Let me repeat myself.

No. More. Fucking. Human. Form. Replicators.

Got that? Good.

[Darksider]

Honestly, I wouldn't have been too annoyed with the human-forms if the team had actually been able to kill a few of them without using magic ancient Deus Ex Machina device #334559. The original legobug replicators were clearly a dangerous threat, but they weren't completely invincible. If you hit them with enough force they would shatter like glass. It was even implied that the Asgard were able to start destroying Replicator ships once they got the O'neil class into production. Then along came the human forms which were made of magic neutronium and were completely invulnerable to harm from anything other than the magic beams that turn them into silver sand. Their ships became completely invincible to anything that was thrown at them, (an ability later extended to the Ori) and the only way to stop them was with yet another Ancient tech DeM.

The Asurans were invulnerable to bullets right from the get go, and ronon's gun only slowed them down. Towards the end, they even started to show a borg-like "adaptation" to the ARGs which had been used effectively in the past. The only saving grace was that their ships weren't invincible, and could be destroyed by superior numbers or firepower. If there's one thing i've hated about the Stargate franchise lately, it's the way the producers try to make an enemy superior by making them magically immune to weapons fire until the good guys find a DeM to wipe them out once and for all or an ancient tech power-up to boost their weapons. Look at the battle in Camelot. There was no tension in that fight, because you knew that no matter what happened the Ori were going to slaughter the allied fleet with no losses in return. How much more dramatic would the battle have been if the allies had been able to destroy one or two of the Ori ships with concentrated firepower or ramming tactics?

[adam_grif]

The invincible badguys were always kind of part of it though, the Goa'uld themselves had the personal forcefields that blocked everything until they worked out how to slip things through, the Ha'Taks were untouchable because the humans had no ships until several seasons in, and so on.

I think there is a real inability for writers of conventional SciFi shows to actually write compelling action or battle sequences. Too often it falls into the trap of Dragon Ball Z power escalation, where it's just one invincible ship that the characters have to LEVEL UP to beat after another. And then there is always a bigger fish.

Actually having characters and factions on a war footing with actual conventional battles instead of the endless invincible > DeM > Invincible > DeM cycle would be such a refreshing change of pace.

Will an international effort necessarily do better, though? I am not entirely sure that any reasonable economic or military contribution from other powers would outweigh the huge bickering that would follow. Cooperation is generally only useful when all parties have something to contribute, and in this case America more or less has everything it needs by itself. Since they will be limited by the gate in their logistics (at least initially), that puts much more of a cap on their actual operations than any budgetary concerns.

Well like I said, it should go America only > Gets out of their league > Becomes international effort but America is still technically 'In charge'.

When it's early days of commando raids and stuff America can handle it just fine. But when the time comes to mass produce 304's and perform large scale research projects on advanced Alien tech, bringing in the best minds from Asia and Europe could really be a help. Europe specifically seems to be on the cutting edge of particle physics with CERN and ITER etc. When it becomes a true international threat that must be dealt with immediately (i.e. "Oh my god 200 ships are going to be here in three months time what do we fucking do"), the potential to momentarily put international rivalry on the backburner will present itself.

Of course, after the threat is dealt with, there is going to be political fallout regarding the Americans not keeping them in the loop for the past 2 years when the entire planet has been in danger.

One could leave it at the "die out" bit as far as I am concerned. Or perhaps the Goa'uld equivalents killed off all life in the local supercluster fifty thousand years ago. Or intelligent life is just naturally very rare. Putting it there at all in the first place is just asking the writers to turn it into the usual brainbug. Kind of how it happened with the psychic powers/whatever in the first series.

Well, the reason I want other civilizations (the Asgard and Ancients minimum) to exist in the universe is so we have advanced tech lying around that the humans can use to get an advantage over the Goa'uld superfleets since there's no way in hell we're going to be able to outmuscle them conventionally, and "there is a galactic empire but they can only spare one ship to attack us" kind of gets stale and is fairly unbelievable.

If there are races more advanced than the Goa'uld, they have to be either dead or uninvolved for some reason. Now, if you just have the Asgard, why aren't they helping? Because they're busy with the Replicators. But either humans help them defeat the replicators (HOW?), or they beat them on their own. In the latter case it just seems a little strange for them to be like "Oh the replicators? Yeah we finished them off like six months ago. Sorry we didn't get in contact sooner, we got pretty drunk in the victory celebrations. We'll help you now that it's the Season finale." Getting the humans to help fix the problem, at least partially, is a more interesting story, but then you have to come up with a reason why humans can help them at all. I really didn't like the "We're too smart to think of dumb things like you humans can" take on them that SG1 had, but the humans devoting resources that the Asgard can't spare to get into contact with the Ancients / find a cache of ancient tech from before their "ascension" / destruction (doesn't really matter) that is useful for combating the replicators provides us with an ability to help, and by extension, an ability to be involved in that plotline.

If the humans never get a tech advantage from anywhere, then you end up with a David vs an entire army of Goliaths situation. I mean yeah, you can get civil war plotlines going, but any one system lord should still effortlessly be able to crush us. I think the other option is better personally.

Although when I say flunky, that is still kind of relative. High priestly officials in the ancient countries (and religions) were not exactly unassuming civil servants.

I think I prefer the System lords setup, i.e. that many Goa'uld are "Gods" of their own domain, but they answer to Ra, who is also individually the biggest and most powerful. I suppose I wouldn't die if Ba'al was some sort of 2ic for a system lord, and then siezes power when the guy gets axed, but would he still even be a Goa'uld or just a random human?

As well, the Replicators are, in my book, honestly lame.

[Jeremy]

adam_grif's idea on the lingua franca and Darth Hoth's unreachable god idea are two points which the series really did suffer from lack of.

Space Hippies and Koala Bears?

Tbh I would remove the Nox and Furlings entirely. They might be good for a one off gag though, where Jackson is visiting a science team examining the ruins of some civilization and the lead scientist has translated their name to "Furlings", which Daniel quickly corrects to something else on account of that being a ludicrous name

Cultures can take a nose dive so that's a fair assessment.

My favorite episodes center on post Goauld Human societies. Instead of letting the Space Nazi thread die, go back in a few years and find out that it was actually one of the nations on Langara, and now we get a chance to meet Jonas.

I wish they had made Aris Boch a Tollan and brought him back more. Play him off of Baal or Yu for best affect.

[Marcus Aurelius]

I have to say that I wouldn't reboot the original SG1 at all. Reboots and remakes mostly suck. Sure, there have been some good reboots like nBSG, which kept the basic concept but changed the focus group from kids to teens and young adults. NuTrek was an okay space action movie, but I don't really see where it could go from here. Perhaps if they keep it action-oriented it could be more or less okay.

Anyways, I don't see why they should reboot Stargate. If you must have more Stargate franchise stuff, then make Stargate the Next Generation, which would be set up in near future, say somewhere around 2030-2050 and keep the history of the original SG1 series, but not as something so very essential to the plots that it would baffle and intimidate new viewers. You could have space opera with starships every now and then, but the main form of travel would still be the stargates. With better CGI you could perhaps show some other cultures and more aliens than the medieval village types...

[adam_grif]

Ehh, the series already has too much baggage, and Stargate Universe was already an attempt at SG TNG, what with it's distancing itself from the mythos and making it more accessible to newcomers. And it's shifting towards the grimdark spectrum. And being generally sub-par. SG1 had 10 seasons, then 5 of SGA, whereas TNG was coming off what, 3 seasons of TOS? SG1 had done all the kinds of SciFi monster of the week plots and then some, whereas TNG was for the most part still extracting oil from the same well that TOS was. The SG well is dry. I mean, what are they gonna do? More Goa'uld system lords appearing from nowhere? The replicators return AGAIN? Another ascended Ori style enemy? The Lucian alliance are not enough to carry that sort of series.

A reboot allows you to correct mistakes instead of just retconning/ ignoring them, and revisit / improve some things that really worked well without simply recycling the same plot in the same setting at a later date. Since it's a total reboot, there is ZERO baggage from previous series since you're going to be throwing stuff out, keeping the good and retelling the story from the start. New viewers can watch a cool new scifi show, and old viewers will (hopefully) appreciate the similarities to the old story and the divergences that it's taking.