Can Federation destroy Death Stars

[Eternal_Freedom]

Does it really matter?
With it's size, mass and shields it should be sufficient to just ram each ST ship until all are dead.

Couldn't they just use small warp jumps to evade it then, assuming it actually has superior manueverability with conventional engines (I don't remember how the two settings stack up in terms of spacecraft manueverability)?

The Acclamator according to the ICS has a 3500G acceleration, I've heard someone say the Trek Manuals have been canonized again and if so that pegs the Galaxy-class at 1000G.

Though Warp jumping to avoid it seems reasonable enough to us, it doesn't seem to happen that often in Trek.

Even if the Acclamator had no guns, it could just open up the troop doors and let the AT-TE's and SPHA-T's on board fire up. We see in RotS that the SPHA-Ts are quite effective in ship-to-ship combat

[Kythnos]

It's actually surprisingly easy and simple, it'll go like this:

1.Ent-D/Ent-nil/Voyager/NX-Ent happen upon Death Star. Death Star fires on ST ships, but character shields hold at 100% since only Writers Fiat Torpedos and Executive Order Beamcannons can penetrate them and the SW ones have already all been fired to destroy the insidious Karendo Tra'viss

2.Geordi/Scotty/B'ellana/Trip reverse the quantum polarity of the phase variance on the third, fourth and nth quark ring, causing nadion bluepoint cascade effects in the subraum level three field that triaxilate the pre and non-existing baryon paricles in combobulatrous matrices. Data/Spock/Tuvok/T'Pol then activate the resonance field emitter deuterium navigator shield device which transmutes subatomic hyper tachyons into protonic transphasic thingamagic something. Picard/Kirk/Janeway/Archer says "Earl Grey/Lucy in the sky with Diamonds/Katharine Hepburn/Armor at 50%"!

3.Bullshit bullshit QUANTUM! bullshit Death Star explodes bullshit

4.Federation win!

Don't think that'll work? Then you haven't watched enough Star Trek.

I would agree if you add in that attacking ships lose 80% of the shields and at least a few dozen redshirts in the attack.

[lordpatthethird]

Yes, At least the first one.

The First death star had numerous gaps in its sheilds. These are large enough for a small fighter to fly hourght. Would also allow any ship with a transporter to beam a photon torpedo, resonance torpedo or even a chunk of anti mater into the core of the deathstar.

Alternatively, a large ship could allow istlef to be drawn in by tractor beam and , once inside deliberately set off a matter anti matter reaction, which depending on a number of factors coulkd od anything from breaching the hull of the death star, rupturing its ocre or totaly atomising it.

Still, theses are situations that could only occur under very specifi curcumstnces.

tl;dr
yes but onyl uder very rare curcumstances.

[Simon_Jester]

...Did you just necro a four month old thread to spam it up with something you couldn't even bother to spell-check, or for that matter eyeball to see it it was spelled vaguely right?

[Batman]

This might not be the worst spelled post around here, but it's definitely close. And since when does the DS I have large holes in its shields?

[Captain Seafort]

And since when does the DS I have large holes in its shields?

He's talking about the fact that fighters and the Falcon could pass through them, which I suppose could be considered "huge" depending on the scale you're using as a baseline.

[Connor MacLeod]

This might not be the worst spelled post around here, but it's definitely close. And since when does the DS I have large holes in its shields?

Since the first novel. And that depends on what oyu define "large" as. Starfighters aren't terribly big objects, and given the nature of SW shielding its quite possible to have gaps in it depend on how they're arranged/angled. There are tradeoffs.

[Batman]

It's been eons since I read the ANH novelization, but I can't remember there being a mention of holes in the DS' shields?

[Imperial528]

IIRC there are small gaps concentrated around the equatorial trench and very small ones in areas where one shield generator's range ends and a second shield begins, since they don't fully overlap. But it's not the kind of thing anything larger than the Millennium Falcon could fit through. And even then, you're still at the mercy of the surface guns if you get through.

[Simon_Jester]

The most plausible idea I ever heard for blowing up the Death Star using Federation technology comes out of this, and it relies very heavily on whether phasing cloaks work that way.

Aboard the Tanaka, Admiral Halsey knew that it was time. Time to sacrifice himself to save humanity. He may have disobeyed his own government, and murdered his own president, but History would remember him as the man who saved Earth. With the calm, satisfied tone of a man who had found his destiny, he gave the order. "Helmsman, set a course for the Death Star. Maximum warp. Prepare to drop out of warp and de-phase when we enter the reactor chamber." The Empire will rue the day ...

Fly through all the crap in the way to get at that central cavity and blow the thing up Episode VI style. But there's no guarantee at all that it would work.

[Rommel123]

IIRC there are small gaps concentrated around the equatorial trench and very small ones in areas where one shield generator's range ends and a second shield begins, since they don't fully overlap. But it's not the kind of thing anything larger than the Millennium Falcon could fit through. And even then, you're still at the mercy of the surface guns if you get through.

There are no gaps in DSI shielding, X-wings were mentioned specifically to be passing throught shields, not throught gaps in shields.

[Imperial528]

Ah, my mistake. It's been awhile since I read any novels related to the Death Star, or watched ANH for that matter, so my memory is a bit fuzzy.

[Captain Seafort]

It depends which source you're using. Some (such as Red Leader's statement during the approach) state that they passed through the shield, while others (including, IIRC, the novelisation and the EGVV) stated that they used "seams" in the shields. All that can be said for sure is that relatively slow-moving objects dozens of metres long are not stopped by the shields.

[Batman]

At least in the german translation, the ANH novel is pretty explicit about them passing through the shields, no mention of seams, and at least the original EGVV entry on the DS1 doesn't say beans about the entire issue. That would naturally be rendered moot if the new EGVV does.

[Purple]

Could it be that the shields from the fighters somehow reacted with the shields of the Death Star? Or perhaps the DS shields were not at full power since no one seriously expected the fighters to have a chance. Maybe they even wanted the fighters to get close thinking that the guns would take them apart. All of this is pure speculation thou.

[Batman]

Note:This is my personal theory only and not, as far as I know, backed up by any canon whatsoever.
But yes, personally, I pretty much assumed the 'We're passing through their magnetic field. Set deflectors to double front'/ the novel saying the fighters should power up their own deflectors when going through the DS' shields to mean they could pass those shields due to shield-on-shield interference.

[JasonB]

I am Pretty shore UFP sends every starship that UFP has against Death star simple no way single death star win. If not too many unknowns we might depend if first or second Death star if Defiant or Prometheus-class main defectors dish if is used weapon effect might have it. What Mars defense spacecraft armed with?

[Rommel123]

Number one, take some English lectures.

Number two, here are your answers:

What Mars defense spacecraft armed with?

Probably phasers and photon torpedoes, since it is standard for UFP ships of that era. But we never saw them fire, so we don't know for sure. As far as we know, these ships could be armed with fried chicken catapults.

I am Pretty shore UFP sends every starship that UFP has against Death star simple no way single death star win.

Depends what figures you take. If you take locally accepted figures, then DSI (since I presume it is one you are talking about) shruggs off attack and decimates entire Federation fleet in minutes. Other figures might make it possible for Feds to repeat Yavin scenario, that is, assault fighters flying throught and destroying Death Star. Provided they can locate vent (I at least think they could).

[Batman]

Doubtful. A capital ship attack is doomed to failure even more than it would have been in ANH, and the assault fighers have to a) locate the vent, b)figure out it's actually important somehow (the Rebels had the specs for the Death Star-the Federation does not), and c)manage to land a hit with considerably less maneuverable projectiles (I don't think I've ever seen a photon torpedo do a 90° turn at any speed, leave alone the one done by Luke's torpedoes in ANH) that the Rebels []with[/i] the more agile weapons needed a Jedi to achieve.
Well, and they of course need to live long enough to do so, but here I think the Federation has actually got an advantage: Trek small craft seem to be considerably better shielded than Wars fighters (at least going by the movies).

[Captain Seafort]

Well, and they of course need to live long enough to do so, but here I think the Federation has actually got an advantage: Trek small craft seem to be considerably better shielded than Wars fighters (at least going by the movies).

They've got vastly superior shields relative to their opposition. Whether or not they'd stand up to Wars fighter firepower is another matter. Given that a runabout (which can take on Fed attack ships on a roughly equal footing) was brought down by what was probably single-digit to low double-digit GJ firepower (for Battle Lines), while Wars fighters can put out high double-digit firepower (from Luke's strafing run on the DS), think we can safely say that the Feds would be in trouble.

[Rommel123]

Doubtful. A capital ship attack is doomed to failure even more than it would have been in ANH, and the assault fighers have to a) locate the vent, b)figure out it's actually important somehow (the Rebels had the specs for the Death Star-the Federation does not), and c)manage to land a hit with considerably less maneuverable projectiles (I don't think I've ever seen a photon torpedo do a 90° turn at any speed, leave alone the one done by Luke's torpedoes in ANH) that the Rebels []with[/i] the more agile weapons needed a Jedi to achieve.
Well, and they of course need to live long enough to do so, but here I think the Federation has actually got an advantage: Trek small craft seem to be considerably better shielded than Wars fighters (at least going by the movies).

Capital ship attack is out of question; as for firepower, that is exactly why I said depends on what figures you take. Both Star Wars and Star Trek have quite large - not to say enormous - gap between high-end and low-end firepower figures. But Star Trek sensors were always shown to be quite good, so it might be possible for them to locate vent (I think that subspace sensors probably won't be troubled by SW shields since - to my knowledge - SW doesn't use subspace technology, while Star Trek shields do have subspace component, according to screen display in Generations. It is still questionable whether subspace sensors are enough for the task.). So it can go both ways. As for less manouverable projectiles, dive-bomber tactics might still work.

[Eleas]

Locating the vent would not be the real problem. The real trick would be to scan the entire superstructure of the Death Star, determine the definitions of a weak point through familiarity with Imperial technology, and then to determine how best to utilize said weak point.

The rebels had plans, sufficient time to analyse them, a grounding SW galaxy technology and the military expertise required. That the same would hold true for the Federation strains credulity.

[Darth Tedious]

Capital ship attack is out of question; as for firepower, that is exactly why I said depends on what figures you take. Both Star Wars and Star Trek have quite large - not to say enormous - gap between high-end and low-end firepower figures. But Star Trek sensors were always shown to be quite good, so it might be possible for them to locate vent (I think that subspace sensors probably won't be troubled by SW shields since - to my knowledge - SW doesn't use subspace technology, while Star Trek shields do have subspace component, according to screen display in Generations. It is still questionable whether subspace sensors are enough for the task.). So it can go both ways. As for less manouverable projectiles, dive-bomber tactics might still work.

Actually, it's not SW shields that would cause a problem for ST sensors. The Imperials do have subspace technology, mostly used for scanning and, to a lesser extent, comms. Standard procedure (even for small patrol ships) is to jam subspace frequencies in any engagement, by blanketing them with static.* As a result of this, most comms used in SW are done by hyperwave.
The Death Star not only uses such jamming full-time, but employs it in sufficient amounts to cause a distortion in the space/time continuum around itself. The Rebels attacking the DS1 over Yavin were using hyperwave comms, and even then their signals were barely getting back to Massasi station. They were completely unable to detect enemy fighters coming in, even in visual range. While I agree that ST sensors are generally better than SW sensors (based on the vast majority of what we've seen), it is unlikely that ST sensors would be able to find the exhaust port, let alone scan into the core of the DS to figure out that it led to the main reactor.

* One interesting side effect of this is that the Borg would be unable to operate in the presence of Imperial jamming, as the hive mind is shared by means of subspace transmissions. Off-topic, but I this juicy little tidbit.

[Eleas]

<snip>

As arguments go that's a bit shaky, since to my knowledge there are few indications of Star Trek and Star Wars subspace being the same phenomenon.

[Havok]

Is sub-space properly explained in either franchise though? I thought for debate purposes, we take things like this as equal unless specifically explained as not?

Or like what ST calls sub-space, since we know is in English, that whatever SW basic calls the similar thing would be translated for us a 'sub-space'... if I am making a lick of sense.