Donald Trump is a birther.

[bobalot]

e “Donald Trump Gets Weirder,” by Gail Collins (column, April 2):

Even before Gail Collins was with the New York Times, she has written nasty and derogatory articles about me. Actually, I have great respect for Ms. Collins in that she has survived so long with so little talent. Her storytelling ability and word usage (coming from me, who has written many bestsellers), is not at a very high level. More importantly, her facts are wrong!

As far as her comments on the so-called “birther” issue, I don't need Ms. Collins's advice. There is a very large segment of our society who believe that Barack Obama, indeed, was not born in the United States. His grandmother from Kenya stated, on tape, that he was born in Kenya and she was there to watch the birth. His family in Honolulu is fighting over which hospital in Hawaii he was born in-they just don't know.

He has not been able to produce a “birth certificate” but merely a totally unsigned “certificate of live birth”-which is totally different and of very little significance. Unlike a birth certificate, a certificate of live birth is very easy to obtain. Equally of importance, there are no records in Hawaii that a Barack Hussein Obama was born there-no bills, no doctors names, no nurses names, no registrations, no payments, etc. As far as the two notices placed in newspapers, many things could have happened, but some feel the grandparents put an ad in order to show that he was a citizen of the U.S. with all of the benefits thereto. Everybody, after all, and especially then, wanted to be a United States citizen.

The term used by Ms. Collins-“birther”-is very derogatory and is meant in a derogatory way. Had this been George Bush or almost any other President or Presidential aspirant, they would never have been allowed to attain office, or would have been thrown out of office very quickly.

For some reason, the press protects President Obama beyond anything or anyone I have ever seen. What they don't realize is that if he was not born in the United States, they would have uncovered the greatest "scam" in the history of our country. In other words, they would become the hottest writer since Watergate, or beyond.

Open your eyes, Gail, there's at least a good chance that Barack Hussein Obama has made mincemeat out of our great and cherished Constitution!

DONALD J. TRUMP
New York, April 7, 2011

I know he has been outed for a while, but I decided to post his response to someone calling him out on his bullshit.

I wonder if the average American realise how they look to the outside world with government shutdowns, birthers, teabaggers, scaremongering about "death panels", Glenn Peck, Sarah Palin, etc.

[SCRawl]

bobalot, I'd like to see a link please.

I love how Trump suggests that Collins is such a hack writer. I'm not familiar with her work, but if this screed is among the best that the Donald can manage, he really shouldn't be throwing stones.

You know, I had no idea that Trump was a birther (and of *course* it's a derogatory term -- it describes a credulous, idiotic person after all), and if this isn't the death-knell for his candidacy, my opinion of the Republican voters will drop even further.

[Edi]

bobalot, I'd like to see a link please.

I love how Trump suggests that Collins is such a hack writer. I'm not familiar with her work, but if this screed is among the best that the Donald can manage, he really shouldn't be throwing stones.

You know, I had no idea that Trump was a birther (and of *course* it's a derogatory term -- it describes a credulous, idiotic person after all), and if this isn't the death-knell for his candidacy, my opinion of the Republican voters will drop even further.

Just o to Salon.com and you'll find plenty of articles about his birtherism, SCrawl. It's a well known fact that he is one, real or pretend. Whether he's using it for just personal publicity or actually believes it is immaterial, he's been peddling that bullshit for a good while now.

[Dalton]

Well-known or not, links are required for articles.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

Well-known or not, links are required for articles.

Donald Trump's response to NYTimes columnist Gail Collins' original op-ed piece. The OP quoted Donald Trump's response.

It seems to have been making its way around the internets since it first came out; earning praise from the usual radical right-wing mouth-breathers who like to post in blog and news comment sections and eye-rolling scorn from higher-evolved forms of life, such as nematodes.

[FSTargetDrone]

And Collins' response to his letter:

April 8, 2011
Donald Trump Strikes Back
By GAIL COLLINS

Donald Trump has written a letter complaining about me.

“Her storytelling ability and word usage (coming from me, who has written many bestsellers), is not at a very high level,” he penned.

Although Trump and I have had our differences in the past, I never felt it was personal. In fact, until now, I have refrained from noting that I once got an aggrieved message from him in which he misspelled the word “too.”

But about the letter. Mainly, it’s a list of alleged evidence that Barack Obama was not born in the United States. Trump has made this the centerpiece of his faux presidential campaign, falling further and further into the land of the lunatic fringe. I find this a disturbing spectacle — a little like seeing a guy you know from the neighborhood suddenly turn up in the middle of Times Square with his face painted blue and yelling about space aliens.

“Bill Ayers wrote ‘Dreams From My Father,’ I have no doubt about it,” Trump told Joe Scarborough, who reported on Politico.com.

Ayers is the former ’60s radical who became a huge Republican talking point in 2008 because he had once given a house party for Obama when he was running for state senate. It’s a pretty big jump from coffee and cookies to writing an entire book, but I guess that’s what neighbors are for.

“That first book was total genius and helped get him elected,” Trump continued. “But you can tell Obama did the second book himself because it read like it was written by somebody of average intelligence with a high school education.”

Did I mention that, in his letter, Trump complained about my calling him a “birther” because the word was “very derogatory and meant in a derogatory way”? Obama, of course, graduated from Columbia University and Harvard Law School — if you can believe Columbia and Harvard Law.

“Three weeks ago I thought he was born in this country. Right now I have some real doubts. I have people that actually have been studying it, and they cannot believe what they’re finding,” Trump announced on “Today.”

Trump does not actually seem to have people studying, or even Googling. Still, he sounds very self-assured. This is because before he was a reality-show host, he was in the New York real estate business, a profession in which it is vital to be able to say imaginary things with total certainty. (“I have five other people who are begging me to sell them this property. Begging.”)

Let’s run over some of his arguments:

THE GRANDMOTHER STORY “His grandmother in Kenya stated, on tape, that he was born in Kenya and she was there to watch the birth,” Trump wrote. This goes back to a trans-Atlantic telephone call that was made in 2008 by Ron McRae, an Anabaptist bishop and birther, to Sarah Obama, the president’s 86-year-old stepgrandmother. He asked her, through an interpreter whether she was “present when he was born in Kenya.” The translator responded: “She says, yes, she was. She was present when Obama was born.”

It is at this point that some of the tapes floating around the Web stop, which means that the listener doesn’t get to hear the follow-up, which makes it very clear that Sarah Obama misunderstood. The full conversation ends with the interpreter saying, for the umpteenth time: “Hawaii. She says he was born in Hawaii. In the state of Hawaii, where his father, his father was learning there. The state of Hawaii.”

THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE If only Hawaii made its birth records public, and charged people a thousand dollars a pop to look at them, the state’s budget problems would be solved by the conspiracy theorists. However, it doesn’t. If you were born in Hawaii and request a copy of your birth certificate, you get a certification of live birth, which the federal government accepts for passports. Barack Obama requested his in 2007, and his campaign posted it on the Internet.

“A certificate of live birth is not even signed by anybody. I saw his. I read it very carefully. It doesn’t have a serial number. It doesn’t have a signature,” said Trump on “Today.”

The document has the stamped signature of the state registrar. The University of Pennsylvania’s FactCheck.org made a pilgrimage to the Obama campaign headquarters, examined the document, felt the seal, checked the serial number and reported that it looked fine.

THE EMPTY PHOTO ALBUM “Our current president came out of nowhere. Came out of nowhere,” Trump told the Conservative Political Action Conference to great applause. “In fact, I’ll go a step further. The people that went to school with him, they never saw him; they don’t know who he is. It’s crazy.”

This week on CNN, Suzanne Malveaux played Trump clips of Hawaiians reminiscing about the schoolchild Obama for a documentary the network had done on the president.

“Look, I didn’t say that ... If he was 3 years old or 2 years old or 1 year old and people remember him, that’s irrelevant,” Trump responded. “You have to be born in this country.”

Recent polls have shown Trump running second among potential Republican primary voters. I believe this is not so much an indication of popularity as a desperate plea to be delivered from Mitt Romney.

[Sinanju]

Does anyone else find it funny that he lambasts somebody for poor "storytelling ability and word usage" while using 'is' instead of 'are'? Glass houses, stones, etc. I'm also kind of surprised by how...well...generic his arguments sound. You'd think after dragging this back into the limelight he'd have something new to add, or some new way to spin it...instead he's just parroting the same crap that's been floating around for 2-3 years.

[Isolder74]

How come we have so many people that have no clue what natural born actually means?

All that is required to qualify to be a natural born citizen of the United States is to have one of your birth parents be a citizen of the United States no matter where the person is born. That's the law. It's not hard. In this case since Obama's mother is a US citizen he is one no matter who his father is and no matter where he was born. He could be born on the moon for as much as the law cares. Yes being born on US soil makes it no question but that doesn't change a thing.

Besides, the document they love desputing is a birth certificate as issued in Hawaii at the time Obama was born.

[Knife]

How come we have so many people that have no clue what natural born actually means?

All that is required to qualify to be a natural born citizen of the United States is to have one of your birth parents be a citizen of the United States no matter where the person is born. That's the law. It's not hard. In this case since Obama's mother is a US citizen he is one no matter who his father is and no matter where he was born. He could be born on the moon for as much as the law cares. Yes being born on US soil makes it no question but that doesn't change a thing.

Besides, the document they love desputing is a birth certificate as issued in Hawaii at the time Obama was born.

Because it's not about that, it's about US versus THEM and he doesn't look like US. It's all coded racist bullshit.

[CaptainChewbacca]

How come we have so many people that have no clue what natural born actually means?

All that is required to qualify to be a natural born citizen of the United States is to have one of your birth parents be a citizen of the United States no matter where the person is born. That's the law. It's not hard. In this case since Obama's mother is a US citizen he is one no matter who his father is and no matter where he was born. He could be born on the moon for as much as the law cares. Yes being born on US soil makes it no question but that doesn't change a thing.

Thats not exactly true. At the time Obama was born, 'natural born' was legally defined as having one or more parents who had been US citizens for and residents of the United States for at least two years after the age of 18. His mother was 17 or 18, and his father wasn't a citizen, so it actually IS necessary for him to have been born in the US to qualify as a US Citizen.

[The Kernel]

I'm amazed by how many people honestly think that Donald Trump is doing this in order to get elected. He's doing this for the same reason he does everything: to generate more publicity for himself.

Incidentally, I love this whole birther thing. It really does a great job of proving to the saner elements of society just how crazy the extreme right wing really is. That's the real reason that mainstream politicians won't touch the issue--they know that it makes them look ridiculous and they are hoping that it will just go away into the ether.

Donald, you're doing favors for liberals everywhere with this crap. Keep it up.

[Kodiak]

How come we have so many people that have no clue what natural born actually means?

All that is required to qualify to be a natural born citizen of the United States is to have one of your birth parents be a citizen of the United States no matter where the person is born. That's the law. It's not hard. In this case since Obama's mother is a US citizen he is one no matter who his father is and no matter where he was born. He could be born on the moon for as much as the law cares. Yes being born on US soil makes it no question but that doesn't change a thing.

Thats not exactly true. At the time Obama was born, 'natural born' was legally defined as having one or more parents who had been US citizens for and residents of the United States for at least two years after the age of 18. His mother was 17 or 18, and his father wasn't a citizen, so it actually IS necessary for him to have been born in the US to qualify as a US Citizen.

That's a good point, and actually is missed by a lot of people. Our grandfather (mine and Chewie's) was born to an American woman and a Canadian father. At that time in the US (1910's) if a woman under a certain age married a foreigner she forfeited her US citizenship. As a result, my grandfather had to become a naturalized citizen as a child even though he was born in the United States- he was born a Canadian in Multnomah County in Oregon.

To answer Isolder's question- it's because the law today and the law that a lot of people in DC grew up with are not the same.

[UnderAGreySky]

I've a gut feeling based on absolutely nothing, that Trump is going to - at some point in the next few months - reverse his position on Obama and birth certificate. He'll conclude that after all his investigations into the matter, he is now convinced that Obama is a natural-born citizen and a legitimate president.

This will allow him to 1) Endear himself to the moderates and so-called independents who will think that "Gee, he is maybe a nice guy after all, he is ready to change his mind". 2) still hold on to votes of Republicans because he has positioned himself as a neocon with respect to foreign relations and a 'fiscal conservative' (*spit*). The tea partiers will vote for him because they always vote R.

It will be a very good move if he actually is serious about running. If he just wants ratings bumped for 'Celebrity Apprentice' or associated shite, that's a different story.

[bobalot]

bobalot, I'd like to see a link please

Bugger, my mistake. GrandMasterTerwynn has posted the link above as well.

I find it funny that, despite the fact that Obama has posted his birth certificate online years ago, people still say "ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS SHOW THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE!".

No matter how much proof is given to these morons, nothing will suffice.

[Serafina]

.I find it funny that, despite the fact that Obama has posted his birth certificate online years ago, people still say "ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS SHOW THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE!".

No matter how much proof is given to these morons, nothing will suffice.

No, you see, they expect him to step in front of the entire nation and pull out a framed document that looks exactly like their own birth certificate (screw state- or time-based differences), and then let a hundred forensic scientists state that it is not a forgery.

No, that was not sarcasm, that's actually what they expect to happen. I suppose there is a hidden 0th amendment that the president must got to ridiculous lengths to disprove and and all challenges to his office or something.

[Patrick Degan]

I suppose there is a hidden 0th amendment that the president must got to ridiculous lengths to disprove and and all challenges to his office or something.

That's only if you're not a white Christian Republican —with the particular emphasis on the "white".

[Serafina]

I wanted to add that, but that would have sounded too sarcastic, despite being true. Like a lot of (american) politics, and all bigotry everywhere.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Isn't the issue that the doccument people want to see isn't the one Obama posted but a more detailed hospital/official record?

I've heard speculation that they want to keep it hidden not because he wasn't born in the US, but because it might have something 'damaging' like his birth ethnicity is 'white' or his religion (if they put that on a birth certificate) is 'muslim'.

[Phantasee]

Nobody puts religion on a birth certificate as far as I know. I really doubt Hawaii did.

But then, I've only seen birth certificates from the past 30 years from four Canadian provinces and two US states, and one from a state in another country, but never one from Hawaii.

[FSTargetDrone]

It doesn't matter if you can "prove" that he has an actual, legal birth certificate. The people who believe otherwise will never be convinced, just like any other kind of conspiracy-theorist. Trying to satisfy these clowns is a waste of time.

[CaptainChewbacca]

You know, people say 'satisfying them is a waste of time', but if you actually GAVE them the damn thing then they'd have to resort to even stupider claims or shut up.

[K. A. Pital]

There's a newspaper announcement in a Honolulu newspaper than Barack Obama was born. What else do they need? That's just idiotic.

[The Kernel]

There's a newspaper announcement in a Honolulu newspaper than Barack Obama was born. What else do they need? That's just idiotic.

What's funny is that whenever that is brought up a birther will normally just talk about the lack of hard evidence required to print such an announcement.

Yes, apparently the fact that it's not technically impossible for a birth announcement to be a fake means that it makes it plausible for a decades long conspiracy to make a half black child from Hawaii the future president of the United States likely.

[eion]

Chewie, they've released a copy of the birth certificate (you can't release the original in Hawaii to anyone without a tangible interest in it), they've got the director the State Department of Health stating he's seen the original vital records and they all match, plus the TWO birth announcements in the papers that are issued directly by the state board of health (N.B. they were not taken out by the grandparents).

What more could they do exactly? There's more documentation of Barrack Obama's natural born citizenship than the last 20 presidents' I bet. HELL, there's a better argument for John McCain not being a natural-born citizen of the U.S. since he was born in Panama. The only reason to be a birther is pure racism, nothing more.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Is it that they can't release the original TO anyone, or they can't release the original without the authorization of child or parent? If they can't give it TO anyone, that makes sense.

The John McCain thing is a red herring, since BOTH of his parents were US Citizens and he was born on 'American Soil' in the panama canal zone.