Defending the Federation(RAR)

[JasonB]

I say tactic MAD like during cold war. Talk Romulus to agreement to allow UFP use phase cloaking devices with Romuslan star empire. Have build enough long rank missile armed with Protomatter build and have phase cloaking device have them target all star system SWGalaxy on for each star system that Empire has and us quantum slipstream drive get them there.

[HMS Sophia]

I say tactic MAD like during cold war. Talk Romulus to agreement to allow UFP use phase cloaking devices with Romuslan star empire. Have build enough long rank missile armed with Protomatter build and have phase cloaking device have them target all star system SWGalaxy on for each star system that Empire has and us quantum slipstream drive get them there.

A) Learn to write English at least to a relatively good level.
B) Why does the Romulan Empire have a phase cloak now? Doesn't quantum slip stream not work? How would one missile destroy a star system?

[Eternal_Freedom]

I believe he is suggesting that the missiles with protomatter warheads would destroy the system's stars, as the Bashir-founder attempted to do to the Bajoran sun in "By Inferno's Light."

[HMS Sophia]

I believe he is suggesting that the missiles with protomatter warheads would destroy the system's stars, as the Bashir-founder attempted to do to the Bajoran sun in "By Inferno's Light."

Ok... that's one of my questions answered

[Batman]

So basically, all the Federation needs to do is
1) build a couple dozen million protomatter warheads (blithely assuming the can manufacture/harvest-I can't remember if the stuff existed naturally or not-enough protomatter for that),
2)build an adequate amount of slipstream-capable launch platforms (when we've seen them do so exactly never, they couldn't even get Transwarp to work, VOY's slipstream drive was scrounged alien technology and guess what-it originally destroyed her) which are equipped with a phas cloak they don't have for no apparent reason (since there's jack all we know about whether or not Trek cloaks work vs Wars sensors to begin with I don't see why the phase cloak would necessarily work any better-what made it unique was its ability to hide inside solid matter, not that it was in any way less detectable than ordinary cloaks), and
3) do so in time to matter. They better have a couple decade's worth of warning.

And I second the encouragement to improve your english, JasonB. Not everyone here is a native speaker and people are willing to make allowances for that, but while yours isn't the worst english I've seen around here, it's still pretty damn bad so far.

[mr friendly guy]

I say tactic MAD like during cold war. Talk Romulus to agreement to allow UFP use phase cloaking devices with Romuslan star empire. Have build enough long rank missile armed with Protomatter build and have phase cloaking device have them target all star system SWGalaxy on for each star system that Empire has and us quantum slipstream drive get them there.

A) Learn to write English at least to a relatively good level.
B) Why does the Romulan Empire have a phase cloak now? Doesn't quantum slip stream not work? How would one missile destroy a star system?

He is referring to the Romulans allowing the UFP to develop a phase cloak. The treaty of Algernon bans the development of a cloaking device by the UFP, and seems to not care what mechanism ie whether its phase cloak, or "conventional" cloak etc. The protomatter supposed to work by blowing up stars.

[JasonB]

I say tactic MAD like during cold war. Talk Romulus to agreement to allow UFP use phase cloaking devices with Romuslan star empire. Have build enough long rank missile armed with Protomatter build and have phase cloaking device have them target all star system SWGalaxy on for each star system that Empire has and us quantum slipstream drive get them there.

A) Learn to write English at least to a relatively good level.
B) Why does the Romulan Empire have a phase cloak now? Doesn't quantum slip stream not work? How would one missile destroy a star system?

For give me the Treaty of Algeron would not applied Romulas star Empire was for must part destroy star exploded. Also Treaty of Algeron might matter this case missile unmanned.

The Quantum slip steam works the problem is when the Quantum Matrix get overload cause the ship to fall out of the slipstream . That what cause USS Voyager crash into planet. The UFP would most likely would have over came that problem before 2387) Guessing the UFP does not have something more effective.

I think change plan have missile carry great deal red matter that has phase cloaking device flying center of the star war galaxy hit that giant black hole at the center. Cause black hole to suck up the rest Star War galaxy.

Then let Emperor be warn about plan. Tell him that if he send one warship into UFP space the UFP destroy star war galaxy with red matter.

Admiral Jason Belkin tactic plan deal Empere plan MAD.

I try check spelling with spell check I think did ok job.

[PhilosopherOfSorts]

The problem isn't actually the spelling, its the mixed up grammar and missing words.

[JasonB]

Other then slipstream drive that the UFP would need work on in order to us it safely. All other technology they already have. The UFP has already has built a working phase cloaking device and knowing sector 31 they are already using it because object cloak that has phase cloaking device can not be hit by normal weapons that the Empire has. The Empire pick it up with anti cloaking sensors will not matter much.

[HMS Sophia]

The UFP has already has built a working phase cloaking device

Working in that it killed the crew of the first ship it was on? Oh yeah, that works...

[Enigma]

The problem isn't actually the spelling, its the mixed up grammar and missing words.

If I am right I know who he is and I expect worse from him.

[JasonB]

The UFP has already has built a working phase cloaking device

Working in that it killed the crew of the first ship it was on? Oh yeah, that works...

When the phase cloaking device was used on USS Enterprise D did not end up destroying that ship.

[Eternal_Freedom]

It didn't kill them because of the strength of writer's fiat and character shields.

[tremors]

neat scenario, but what's rar stand for?

[Eternal_Freedom]

RAR is a forum shorthand for "Retarded Alternate Reality."

It cropped up describing a thread a few years back and the name kinda stuck. It's used for threads like this that put users in a certain hypothetical situation (like, "you've got an Executor class SSD at x time, what you do?") and see what happens as a result.

Dw, I had to ask the same thing when I first arrived. Perhaps we should create a thread listing all the acronyms used on the board.

[Crazedwraith]

RAR is a forum shorthand for "Retarded Alternate Reality."

It is no such thing.

http://www.stardestroyer.net/mrwong/wiki/index.php/Rar

RAR is not an acronym, so stop asking what it stands for. Some people have commented that is stands for "Read And Review." These people are however idiots. Others believe it to be an anthropomorphic sound of a roar. This is likely borne out by the context of Mayabird's post. It is also a type of downloadable file, used for compression or archiving of large items for easier transmission across the Interne

[Formless]

RAR is a forum shorthand for "Retarded Alternate Reality."

Wrong. Any and all acronyms for RAR are backronyms. The rest, however, is correct-- the biggest thing separating a RAR from an ordinary thought experiment or forum game is that a true RAR should be convoluted in some way. "Goddidit" level convoluted. If a scenario would look at place in "The Worst-Case Scenario Survival Handbook" or the Darwin Awards, its too realistic to be a RAR.

[Eternal_Freedom]

Sorry if I got the acronym thing wrong, but thats the answer I was given when I asked last April. I think it might have been Havok that answered

[Formless]

I suspect (though can't prove) there may be a certain part of the board populace that treats that question as a "have you lurked" litmus test/classic troll bait. Laughs are probably being had behind the scenes over your confusion. This is why I always direct people to the wiki-- TedC has too much integrity to fuck around with people just because they are newbs.

[Eternal_Freedom]

They may laugh all they like, I don't care what they think.

[Connor MacLeod]

It could be equipment or personnel. I dont think one could assume that just because Equipment is starting to fail it will just go on or off.. I know I've had car trouble where things start going wrong, but it can still operate. (I had a car where the electrical system was failing, but the car kept running fine. Right until the time I drove home from work and the damn thing caught fire just after I got home. LMAO.) It's also quite possible the phase cloak is less effective or ineffective at phasing through certain kinds of matter. Wasn't there an ep where a romulan, Ro, and I think Geordi got phase cloaked or something similar, and they could walk around on the floors, yet pass through walls and people n shit?

As far sa the superweapon tactics go, tens of millions of phase cloaked superweapons would onyl be needed as the 'sure-fire' route (completely ensure that retaliation is impossible, becuase if they don't cripple the Empire in that single strike, there would be retaliation.) That seems rather improbable, given we have zero information on the logistics involved (how much resources/how llong to build, etc.). The federation could probably get away with "only" thousands (or even hundreds perhaps) if they had good intel on what locales to hit in the Star Wars universe. (Hell, you could throw the Empire into chaos just by killing Palpatine and wiping out Coruscant. Precog is a huge unknown quantity in that attempt, but it could be done.) We saw in AOTC that the Separatists did represent some measure of threat (Economic, if nothing else) to the Republic if they broke away. It's more plausible than "millions", but It still relies on a bunch of logistical unknowns (as wlel as getting good intel.) and even then it may not prevent retaliation - one cannot simply assume that all would go right with such a complex plan (hell getting them to the SW galaxy has risks in itself too.)

This is probably why I most hate the "superweapon" approach to debating. It tries to rely on one-off game-winning strategies that in real life would be overly complicated and prone to failure, and needs complete disregard of real concerns (like logistics. Logistics is almost ALWAYS ignored in these cases. So are the long term impacts of tactics.) I don't care if its phase cloaked doomsday weapons or "Death Star's mass in von-neumanned droid armies/warships" they all tend to be conceived in the most retarded manner.

[Darth Tedious]

Back to Star Trek, sounds like the device needed the power. It could handle it, but the space!wires in the middle couldn't, so there's your explosion while keeping the device itself working.

(weird though: wouldn't the explosion cut power? Maybe it has an added draw to start up, like a lot of electric systems. (Motors, for example, take a lot more current getting up to speed than maintaining it.) This initial burst blew out one system, but the cloaking device still had enough power to work through other connections.)

Possibly the phase cloak's space!circuitry has phenomenal levels of capacitance.

[Batman]

Or maybe the phasing process only need power to trigger it, not to maintain it. Once the ship is phased, it will remain phased with no further power draw by the cloak until actively unphased again. That's pretty much what happened to Ro Laren and Geordi in episode whatsitsname-once they were phased, they remained phased despite the phenomenon that did it in the first place being long over.

[Eternal_Freedom]

It even fits with the descriptions. Being "phased" is a transition, so once you are there there would be no energy expenditure. Or if there was it would be utterly tiny. And those particles Data was using to fix the problem presumably exist across multilple "phases" allowing them to interact with Geordi.

[Darth Tedious]

Or maybe the phasing process only need power to trigger it, not to maintain it. Once the ship is phased, it will remain phased with no further power draw by the cloak until actively unphased again. That's pretty much what happened to Ro Laren and Geordi in episode whatsitsname-once they were phased, they remained phased despite the phenomenon that did it in the first place being long over.

That wouldn't explain why they un-phased in the middle of the asteroid, though... doing so should have required a transition back (and thus, more power). Unless it's a time-based thingy, but that raises further questions...