Andromeda: Did Known Space need another Commonwealth?

[Crom]

I was reading reviews of Andromeda over at the Cynic's Corner and he brought up the question if Known Space really needed Dylan Hunt to save it? I'm not sure myself.

First of all, there's the Magog threat, but let's table that for a moment. The Dark Age in the post-Commonwealth universe doesn't seem that dark. People are still building spaceships capable of faster than light travel, there are still multiple world governments, corporations and interstellar trade. The warships of that time period do not seem drastically inferior to Andromeda.

The only areas that the Commonwealth seemed remarkably superior was in AI (no one seemed to have AI of Andromeda's level), botany (oddly enough), and medical technology. So did the universe need saving?

[spaceviking]

I would assume that the humans on Nietzschean slave planets would disagree. Known space as depicted in the show seemed to be a pretty terrible place.

[Thanas]

Yes, seeing as how nobody else would be capable of pulling such a great coalition together. At least that was the original plan.

[Crom]

I forgot about the roaming bands of Magog and Nietzschean slave worlds. Once Tyr reunites the Nietzscheans, do you think he would continue the practice of slavery?

[kaeneth]

The only threats worth destroying were the Magog, the Nietzscheans, and the Magog's Abyss-guy. I'm not sure a Commonwealth was required to put a stop to that. But it probably would take something on that scale...at which point, why not?

[Eternal_Freedom]

Well, there was the Triangulam Measles Harper had int he first episode. Which Rommie pointed out was easily curable in any Commonwealth medical facility.

Which means there are people around who are contracting, spreading and dying from dieseases that were readily curable under the commonwealth. I'd say that constitutes a Dark Age that's worth ending.

It's even more concerning as Harper was clearly someone who travels all over known space, not just some peasent on a backwater world.

[Thanas]

I forgot about the roaming bands of Magog and Nietzschean slave worlds. Once Tyr reunites the Nietzscheans, do you think he would continue the practice of slavery?

Why wouldn't he?

[Crom]

Those are all really good points. What if the Drago-Kazov had been willing to sign up for Dylan's Commonwealth contingent on maintaining their slave worlds, do you think Dylan would go for it? He was incredibly pragmatic at times.

[Crom]

Why wouldn't he?

I feel silly saying this, but because he's secretly a decent guy?

EDIT: And, just so I've got some actual argument, Tyr spent time amongst the slaves and actively aided them against the Nietzscheans.

[NecronLord]

Was there ever a mention of universal education in the Long Night? Because I'm pretty sure it's something the Commonwealth provided that many Long Night societies seem not to be up on.

[Thanas]

Those are all really good points. What if the Drago-Kazov had been willing to sign up for Dylan's Commonwealth contingent on maintaining their slave worlds, do you think Dylan would go for it? He was incredibly pragmatic at times.

IIRC they actually made that offer in the series. It was rejected. And of course, the prides that eventually signed gave up their slave worlds (not that slave worlds are actually that profitable in the first case).

Was there ever a mention of universal education in the Long Night? Because I'm pretty sure it's something the Commonwealth provided that many Long Night societies seem not to be up on.

There wasn't.

Why wouldn't he?

I feel silly saying this, but because he's secretly a decent guy?

Maybe, but he is also incredibly pragmatic. If it would risk his own position, why fight his powerbase?

EDIT: And, just so I've got some actual argument, Tyr spent time amongst the slaves and actively aided them against the Nietzscheans.

When he had his memories back he was quite willing to abandon them.

[CaptainChewbacca]

I think if the Drago-Katzov wanted a deal, Dylan would only go so far as 'All current slaves remain, but no new slaves' for a process of gradual manumission of slaves on Nietzchian worlds.

[Thanas]

I think if the Drago-Katzov wanted a deal, Dylan would only go so far as 'All current slaves remain, but no new slaves' for a process of gradual manumission of slaves on Nietzchian worlds.

I doubt that very much, considering the very idea of slavery is pretty much anathema to him.

[spaceviking]

Those are all really good points. What if the Drago-Kazov had been willing to sign up for Dylan's Commonwealth contingent on maintaining their slave worlds, do you think Dylan would go for it? He was incredibly pragmatic at times.

IIRC they actually made that offer in the series. It was rejected. And of course, the prides that eventually signed gave up their slave worlds (not that slave worlds are actually that profitable in the first case).

Do we know that slave worlds are not that profitable from the series or is this based on real world economics of slavery? If slave worlds are not profitable what is the point of them? To make Neitzeians feels like supermen?

[Thanas]

Maybe they are profitable in the all-around shittyness post-Fall where manual labor actually serves a goal. But just look at the slave worlds we see depicted in the shows - shitty places, little to no industrial value etc. So those slave worlds, I cannot really see why they are profitable in a universe which has nanobots etc.

However, after thinking about this, we have heard talk about at least two strong slave worlds who had the resources to maintain independence after gaining it. So maybe there are different kind of slave worlds - maybe it means tributary worlds whose citizens are "slaves", but not in the fashion we would normally think of it.

So my earlier claim did not take all the evidence into account.

[Crom]

I wonder how much of the Three Galaxies that made up the Commonwealth we actually saw. When I first watched seasons 1 through half of season 2, I assumed they were within one galaxy, but the way slipstream works that might not be the case. I was just thinking that a whole coalition of races might have sprung up on the other end of Known Space and they might never have crossed paths with Dylan.

[Thanas]

I wonder how much of the Three Galaxies that made up the Commonwealth we actually saw. When I first watched seasons 1 through half of season 2, I assumed they were within one galaxy, but the way slipstream works that might not be the case. I was just thinking that a whole coalition of races might have sprung up on the other end of Known Space and they might never have crossed paths with Dylan.

Doubtful, considering that slipstream courier services still worked. It is not unlikely, but I doubt it.