Europe is warning us!

[Surlethe]

Some target practice from the National Review. Enjoy.

Rome — If Americans think fuel and food prices are high, they should try Europe, where both can be nearly double those in the United States, while salaries are often lower.

Italy, like most of the now-broke southern-European countries, is desperate to privatize bloated public-owned utilities. Politicians are trying to curb pensions and encourage the private sector to hire workers and buy equipment, as a way of attracting wary northern Europeans, acting in loco parentis, to lend such perpetual adolescents more bailout money.

In theory, Italians accept that they are going to have to be a lot more like the Germans, and less like the Irish, Portuguese, and Spaniards. In reality, they may end up like the Greeks, who are still striking and occasionally rioting because too few foreigners wish to continue subsidizing their socialist paradise. Red graffiti on Italian streets still speak of socialist solidarity, while Italian politicians talk capitalism to foreign lenders.

The European Union, like the 19th-century Congress of Vienna, can point to one achievement: a general absence of war in Western Europe for more than 60 years. Otherwise, almost all the socialist promises of an equality of result are imploding before Europeans’ eyes.

The higher taxes go, the more people cheat on them, and the less revenue comes in. There are sometimes two prices in Italy (and elsewhere in Europe) — the official price that the unwary pay, which includes a high value-added tax, and the negotiated, under-the-table, tax-free price that the haggling shopper obtains.

Europe is essentially defenseless, as governments further trim defense budgets to keep their shrinking spread-the-wealth entitlements alive. The French and British — the continent’s two premier military powers — have been trying for nearly three months to defeat Moammar Qaddafi’s ragtag nation of less than 7 million, itself rent by civil war. The descendants of Wellington and Napoleon so far seem no match for Qaddafi and the Taliban. Both nations will soon be leaving Afghanistan in frustration.

Subsidized wind and solar power have not led to much of an increase in European supplies of electricity, but have helped make power bills soar. Highly taxed gas runs about $10 a gallon, ensuring tiny cars and dependence on mass transit. Central planners love the resulting state-subsidized, high-density European apartment living, without garages, back yards, or third bedrooms. Yet the Japanese tsunami and accompanying nuclear contamination have reminded European governments that their similarly fragile models of highly urbanized, highly concentrated living make them equally vulnerable to such disasters.

Popular culture may praise the use of the subway and train, but about every minute or two, some government grandee in a motorized entourage rushes through the streets as an escort of horn-blaring police forces traffic off to the side. A European technocratic class in limousines that runs government bureaus and international organizations — the class that includes the disgraced former International Monetary Fund chief, Dominique Strauss-Kahn — live like 18th-century aristocrats at Versailles as they mouth socialist platitudes.

Throughout Western Europe, a subordinate class of unassimilated North African, sub-Saharan African, and Pakistani immigrants hawk wares and do menial labor — and are increasingly despised by Europeans as times get rougher. A growing proportion of the working class is getting fed up that the welfare state means sky-high fuel and food costs, small and expensive apartments, and limited disposable income for the masses — but lots of aristocratic perks for the technocrats who oversee the redistributive mess. The notion of a large and esteemed class of self-made, independent-thinking business people and empowered upper-middle-class entrepreneurs is a concept that seems foreign, if not downright subversive.

An acknowledged despair now seems to permeate Western Europe. A glorious past is associated with tourist dollars, not appreciation of the Renaissance or the Enlightenment. Majestic churches are more moneymaking museums and tourist stops than honored hallmarks of past culture and current faith. Christendom often helped to preserve humanity through horrific crises, but you would never learn that from the average cynical European, who appears either indifferent to or apologetic about both his religion and the hallowed European origins of Western civilization, responsible for much of what is good in the world today.

All this European turmoil raises a paradox. If dispirited Europeans are conceding that something is terribly wrong with their half-century-long experiment with socialism, unassimilated immigrants, cultural apologies, defense cuts, and post-nationalism, why in the world is the Obama administration intent on adopting what Europeans are rejecting?

Maybe after a couple of days I'll get the mods to vote on the best response and give a little internet cookie to whomever does the best job.

[Crossroads Inc.]

Ok, later today I am going to work on my own personal response to this, there is SO much to take on.
But for right now I just have to say, the people who write these sort of articles must never actually LOOK at Europe.
Since according to them it is some sort of bleak economic cesspool that is falling apart at the seams and on the verge of utter anarchy.

[Big Phil]

There are some kernels of truth among a cesspool of shit and distortions. There does seem to be more corruption (tax evasion and the like) in Europe than in the US.

I'm surprised there's no mention of Germany and Switzerland's decision to eliminate nuclear power.

[Thanas]

There are some kernels of truth among a cesspool of shit and distortions. There does seem to be more corruption (tax evasion and the like) in Europe than in the US.

The US ranks at 22 in the corruption index, well below Germany (15) but ahead of France (25). So it is not as clear IMO.

[Big Phil]

There are some kernels of truth among a cesspool of shit and distortions. There does seem to be more corruption (tax evasion and the like) in Europe than in the US.

The US ranks at 22 in the corruption index, well below Germany (15) but ahead of France (25). So it is not as clear IMO.

I was thinking southern Europe (Italy, Greece, and Spain) more than northern Europe. These are often reflected in cultural differences (such as Italian's inability to stand in an orderly line).

[Crossroads Inc.]

The problem is with people like this, is they effectively try and whitewash all of Europe with the problems in a few areas. It is the same as pointing to financially failing States like Texas and California and saying that all of America is on the bring of collapse.

Ok, so that may be true anyways... But the point remains. I like that phrase by the way Sanchez ""kernels of truth among a cesspool of shit and distortions"". I'll have to use that again. There are so many outright lies and assertions in that it is sickening.

I am working on a counter post, using his as a template and doing a point by point similar write up using the failings of the US as a warning to Europe

Right now I am writting how the money from low taxes is being consumed by an out of control private Health care system, and how the sprawling expansive houses and surburbs force people to buy more and more cars, thus negating any savings via "cheap" gas.

[K. A. Pital]

Otherwise, almost all the socialist promises of an equality of result are imploding before Europeans’ eyes.

Some nations which have the highest percentage of GDP in the state sector - Norway, Sweden and Finland - are not even barely close to anything like "implosion". GINI is universally low in Europe, even in poorer nations, which means more people have a decent standard of life. Yeah, that makes the Americans angry, because even with a 30-40% difference in per capita GDP, America suffers to reach the same HDI and the problems of poverty in the USA are much more glaring than in Europe.

Popular culture may praise the use of the subway and train, but about every minute or two, some government grandee in a motorized entourage rushes through the streets as an escort of horn-blaring police forces traffic off to the side.

Therefore we should crush public transport. Destroy socialism! LIBERTY PRIME... Nevermind the actual efficiency. Everyone should use automobiles and further worsen the situation.

Christendom often helped to preserve humanity through horrific crises, but you would never learn that from the average cynical European, who appears either indifferent to or apologetic about both his religion and the hallowed European origins of Western civilization, responsible for much of what is good in the world today.

Typical God-warrior blurb.

This whole article is full of shit. And no, there are no "nudgets of truth" there, only lies and massively huge generalizations lumping all of Europe into a monolithic opressive entity with dull and cynical people that is contrasted with the land of fluffy bunnies, "self-made enterpreneurs" (god I fucking absolutely hate this) and capitalism.

Maybe I'll tear some statements apart later.

[Big Phil]

This whole article is full of shit. And no, there are no "nudgets of truth" there, only lies and massively huge generalizations lumping all of Europe into a monolithic opressive entity with dull and cynical people that is contrasted with the land of fluffy bunnies, "self-made enterpreneurs" (god I fucking absolutely hate this) and capitalism.

I'm not sure exactly what crawled up your ass and died, but at a quick glance, here are just a few "nuggets of truth." Don't throw a tantrum just because you think the conclusions are bullshit (which we're in agreement they are, by the way).

If Americans think fuel and food prices are high, they should try Europe, where both can be nearly double those in the United States,

Red graffiti on Italian streets still speak of socialist solidarity, while Italian politicians talk capitalism to foreign lenders.

The European Union, like the 19th-century Congress of Vienna, can point to one achievement: a general absence of war in Western Europe for more than 60 years.

There are sometimes two prices in Italy (and elsewhere in Europe) — the official price that the unwary pay, which includes a high value-added tax, and the negotiated, under-the-table, tax-free price that the haggling shopper obtains.

[Serafina]

There are sometimes two prices in Italy (and elsewhere in Europe) — the official price that the unwary pay, which includes a high value-added tax, and the negotiated, under-the-table, tax-free price that the haggling shopper obtains.

At least that part is a blatant LIE. Or a distortion.
Yes, there is some haggling in Italy. It's not about "let's drop the tax", it's just normal haggling. Which, ironically, is a highly capitalist idea yet this guy seems to be unfamiliar or uncomfortable with it.

The rest aren't "nuggets of truth". They're just random facts thrown into this pile of garbage. They demonstrate neither knowledge nor understanding about Europe.

[Simon_Jester]

If I make up some crazy diatribe about how the Moon landings were faked, and insert into the diatribe "NASA says that Neil Armstrong was the first man to walk on the Moon," that's not a "nugget of truth." That's just me nodding in the general direction of the truth while proceeding to drown it in bullshit.

It's very rare for any document to be false in every single word; there are nearly always some true statements thrown in with the nonsense and lies. I would normally reserve "nugget of truth" for cases where some portion of the document's point is sound- where there are accurate sentences or paragraphs that give clear pictures of what the hell is going on, even if the overall tone and thesis of the work is nonsense.

[Lonestar]

The European Union, like the 19th-century Congress of Vienna, can point to one achievement: a general absence of war in Western Europe for more than 60 years.

This is too good. Does anyone else want to shoot this to ribbons, or should I?

[K. A. Pital]

If Americans think fuel and food prices are high, they should try Europe, where both can be nearly double those in the United States,

Prices should be estimated only relative to wages. Never relative to each other. That's the principle of PPP comparisons. Hence why this whole thing is full of fucking shit and is created only to fill brains with shit. Meaningless facts without analysis.

Red graffiti on Italian streets still speak of socialist solidarity, while Italian politicians talk capitalism to foreign lenders.

What is the problem? The graffiti are aimed against those politicians, aren't they? It creates an impression that the street graffiti and the politicians in charge are one and the same. That's crazy.

The European Union, like the 19th-century Congress of Vienna, can point to one achievement: a general absence of war in Western Europe for more than 60 years.

How about visaless travel in all of Europe, sanctionless employment for foreigners etc.? Um... economic benefits? Industrial and scientific benefits? That is too much for the idiot piece of crap who wrote this. But hey, he comes from the same nation which wants to build a huge wall between the US and Mexico.

There are sometimes two prices in Italy (and elsewhere in Europe) — the official price that the unwary pay, which includes a high value-added tax, and the negotiated, under-the-table, tax-free price that the haggling shopper obtains.

That's bullshit and people already told you why.

So look, all of the noted "nuggets" turned out to be a smelly piece of shit. Wow. I didn't expect this, honestly, but now I'm even more firm in my conclusions - that entire thing is just crap. Pure, refined. If anyone wants to eat it, he should understand he's eating crap from beginning to end.

[Thanas]

The European Union, like the 19th-century Congress of Vienna, can point to one achievement: a general absence of war in Western Europe for more than 60 years.

This is too good. Does anyone else want to shoot this to ribbons, or should I?

Feel free, I about lost interest when he told me that the christian church saved western Europe.

[Lonestar]

Feel free, I about lost interest when he told me that the christian church saved western Europe.

There wasn't a "general absence of war for over 60 years in Western Europe" after the Congress of Vienna. Besides the Italian Wars of Independence(which included two great powers fighting) & Franco-Prussian War, you had the Carlist Wars, and the Belgian revolution. I'm sure there are others, but this is just off the top of my head. Even if this meets whatever his insane criteria of "general absence of war" is, there has been NO* war in Western Europe since WW2. If the only thing that the EU has done is prevent a repeat of the frequency of wars during the 19th Century, then I would say it's a net benefit to Europeans.



*although I'm sure he would probably claim that the Cod War or Northern Ireland counted as a war.

[Thanas]

Oh man. That gets me thinking.

There also were the revolution/wars of 1832, the German part of 1848, the French revolutions (which included such fun things like french artillery using grapeshot on citizens of Paris), the Danish-Slesvig war, the second Danish war, the war of 1866 between Prussia/Austria and several "police actions" in Poland.


Plus, there were these little things called the wars of Greek independence and this small, neglectable event called the Crimean war...I heard these were fun.

[Lonestar]

Plus, there were these little things called the wars of Greek independence and this small, neglectable event called the Crimean war...I heard these were fun.

No no, that isn't in WESTERN Europe.

[Thanas]

The rest is though.

[Lonestar]

The rest is though.

I know, my point was that(and I confess I am making a huge leap here) that he sat at his computer, said "hmm what wars happened in Europe in the 19th Century. Well, the one that had the Charge of the Light Brigade...I better change that to Western Europe!"

[Thanas]

Oh crap, I just realized that the author of this is Victor Davis Hanson.

You know, the "historian" (I'll never understand how he got his degree - well, I do, but the implications are less than good for Stanford) who also claims that the USA is directly comparable to Greek city democracies and that is why they will win the war against terror.

And who also wrote one of the most idiotic books about Greek warfare I had ever seen.

[Lonestar]

Oh crap, I just realized that the author of this is Victor Davis Hanson.

I didn't realize that either. Since the Greeks are the progenitors of Western Civilization(tm) then presumably he would have know about the Greek War of Independence.

[Thanas]

Oh crap, I just realized that the author of this is Victor Davis Hanson.

I didn't realize that either. Since the Greeks are the progenitors of Western Civilization(tm) then presumably he would have know about the Greek War of Independence.

My mind is still blown how somebody with a Ph.D. in history can write such utter crap about there being a "general abscence in war" in Europe for 60 years after the Congress of Vienna, which presumably would include the period up to and including 1875. And even if you only count those wars with declerations of war being made as wars, that still leaves us with a lot of wars he should know about.

I mean, how can a professor of history not know about the Franco-German, German-Austrian or German-Danish war?

....I guess he just wanted to write a pointless dig at the EU by equovicating it with the Congress of Vienna. Presuming he is one of those idiots who think the congress a failure.


Or alternatively, he is as huge an idiot as he was during the Bush years.

[folti78]

Oh man. That gets me thinking.

There also were the revolution/wars of 1832, the German part of 1848, the French revolutions (which included such fun things like french artillery using grapeshot on citizens of Paris), the Danish-Slesvig war, the second Danish war, the war of 1866 between Prussia/Austria and several "police actions" in Poland.


Plus, there were these little things called the wars of Greek independence and this small, neglectable event called the Crimean war...I heard these were fun.

So were the 1848 revolutions in the Habsburg Empire especially the Hungarian one, which had to be put down by Russian troops. These revolutions broke Metternich's hold on power and nearly succeeded to break apart the Habsburg Empire.

[KhorneFlakes]

Oh crap, I just realized that the author of this is Victor Davis Hanson.

I didn't realize that either. Since the Greeks are the progenitors of Western Civilization(tm) then presumably he would have know about the Greek War of Independence.

My mind is still blown how somebody with a Ph.D. in history can write such utter crap about there being a "general abscence in war" in Europe for 60 years after the Congress of Vienna, which presumably would include the period up to and including 1875. And even if you only count those wars with declerations of war being made as wars, that still leaves us with a lot of wars he should know about.

I mean, how can a professor of history not know about the Franco-German, German-Austrian or German-Danish war?

....I guess he just wanted to write a pointless dig at the EU by equovicating it with the Congress of Vienna. Presuming he is one of those idiots who think the congress a failure.


Or alternatively, he is as huge an idiot as he was during the Bush years.

Henceforth why I would like to dickstab Victor Davis Hanson. So any woman who he tries to woo is safe from his madness. Unless the woman is also Batfuck Insane.

Then that's....well, bad.

[bobalot]

Why does it appear that American conservative "intellectuals" seem to wallow gigantic generalisations and utter ignorance? It's not like the reality of the situation is hidden away in some secret EU database.

We only just had that retarded article by David Brook's about England, in which revealed he only had a superficial understanding of England's social development.

[Thanas]

David Brooks is not a "bona fide" professor of history, that is why I am a bit astounded at that.