Star Wars Universe vs. Halo Universe

[ThePerson5]

The whole point of the Flood is that they take your technology, and mass reproduce their own versions.

[Formless]

With what, wankmeister? The wet dreams of fat nerds?

[Agent Sorchus]

A nuke can kill almost all of their shit. Size is irrelevant if they can't pull the firepower enough to actually fight vs any imperial vessel and fuck it if the bitchass weak UNSC ships weren't able to destroy a Halo easily.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y33tLMmVPEU (0:58)

Obviously sub-kilotons!

Dumb ass strawman. I fucking never said it was subkilo, rather that it was some good old nuclear sized explosion. Since the Pillar of Autumn can't lift it's own fucking weight out of a gravity well without booster stages we could calc out a good limit. However, Reach happens to be more cannon at the moment than H:CE since cannon is based on newer > older for Halo. Besides it could have been the same sort of jumpdrive overload from Reach that causes all the shiny lights in your video, but we can't know that.

There is no indication of firepower for the Forerunners greater than the detonation of the reactor on board the Pillar of Autumn being more than enough to defeat them. Period end of story Forerunners are bitchass weak and there is no evidence for them to be better than that.

Yes, so I'm assuming you just ignored my comments about blowing up suns, brute-force destroying entire Halos, slipspace weaponry (which can't be blocked by shields), shuffling planets through slipspace, and all that other stuff.

None of which matters since a weak and old UNSC cruiser is more than enough to defeat any one Halo, and is a bitch compared to a TIE BOMBER.

Besides you complete fucking moron you never intended to debate the entirety of the STAR WARS universe, otherwise you are faced with the sun crusher, the Celestials I'll ignore them for now because the rest of these are available to the empire, but still the fact that you call this a star wars universe vs halo universe and ignore all aspects of star wars except one is stupid enough I'm leaving this here, Centerpoint station and it's ability to shoot across the majority of their galaxy and wipe out SW fleets, and the Galaxy gun that has all the defeating of shields and ability to fire through hyperspace as any of the Forerunners abilities.

[ThePerson5]

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Flood#Biology

You know, it's better if you actually know about the side that you are arguing against.

[Formless]

Wrong answer, dumbfuck, I agreed they were essentially plague zombies. That's the problem-- modern fucking societies should have no problem dealing with the flood because, and here is the point you completely missed, they cannot reproduce guns bombs and starships. At no point do we see them do this; at all times their technology comes from the corpses of their enemies. Yeah real great strategy when you're facing an intergalactic civilization like the Empire, but apparently the Forerunners lack the basic competence of the CDC.

[ThePerson5]

Dumb ass strawman. I fucking never said it was subkilo, rather that it was some good old nuclear sized explosion. Since the Pillar of Autumn can't lift it's own fucking weight out of a gravity well without booster stages we could calc out a good limit. However, Reach happens to be more cannon at the moment than H:CE since cannon is based on newer > older for Halo. Besides it could have been the same sort of jumpdrive overload from Reach that causes all the shiny lights in your video, but we can't know that.

So, why don't you provide some calcs for that 'weak ass explosion?' Because it looks to be gigatons at the very least.

None of which matters since a weak and old UNSC cruiser is more than enough to defeat any one Halo, and is a bitch compared to a TIE BOMBER.

So, I'd like to see your proof that a Tie fighter is a superior combatant to a UNSC cruiser. I mean, the UNSC is boned hard, but you are pulling stuff out of your ass now.

Besides you complete fucking moron you never intended to debate the entirety of the STAR WARS universe, otherwise you are faced with the sun crusher, the Celestials I'll ignore them for now because the rest of these are available to the empire, but still the fact that you call this a star wars universe vs halo universe and ignore all aspects of star wars except one is stupid enough I'm leaving this here, Centerpoint station and it's ability to shoot across the majority of their galaxy and wipe out SW fleets, and the Galaxy gun that has all the defeating of shields and ability to fire through hyperspace as any of the Forerunners abilities.

The Forerunners utilize slipspace to even greater effect than the Empire uses hyperspace. Anyway, say hello to http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Line_Installation_1-4

It destroyed an entire Covenant fleet while it was in slipspace.

The sun crusher? All it does it create supernovas which, as I've states so many time before, is standard procedure for Forerunner ships.

And yeah, you've pretty much ignored all of the other quotes and weapons I've posted so instead of repeating myself again, I suggest you read my previous posts again.

[ThePerson5]

Wrong answer, dumbfuck, I agreed they were essentially plague zombies. That's the problem-- modern fucking societies should have no problem dealing with the flood because, and here is the point you completely missed, they cannot reproduce guns bombs and starships. At no point do we see them do this; at all times their technology comes from the corpses of their enemies. Yeah real great strategy when you're facing an intergalactic civilization like the Empire, but apparently the Forerunners lack the basic competence of the CDC.

They take over an entire planet, though everything appears to be normal at first, as the Flood started out as a fucking disease! They then make their way onto ships and infect more people, off planets etc. etc. etc. Eventually when they've infected enough people, your friends the combat forms start appearing, as well as other, massive creatures which basically consume planets in their biomass, while taking over and reproducing your own technology. The Flood had their own fleet!

This whole debate about the flood is irrelevant anyway; the Forerunners will view the EMpire as a conventional combatant, and not treat them like a disease, and they will attack with their full might, obliterating them.

[Serafina]

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Flood#Biology

You know, it's better if you actually know about the side that you are arguing against.

Hmm, let's see:

The Flood, a virulent species of parasites, is an anomaly in all known biology, and an anomaly to regular life. This may be explained by its nature as an extragalactic species, originating from a different galaxy.[1] It is extremely adaptive, and mutates hosts through different stages of accelerated "evolution", where the body of biomatter accelerates its own evolution to the point of a massive biological breakdown, where by the infection can first take place. The species can reproduce without host bodies, though this is described as a last ditch effort, and only performed by pure Flood forms.

Technobabble, technobabble, technobabble and yet more technobabble. No substance except for the information that they are parasites (gee, never seen those anywhere!) and can reproduce on their own (hmm, completely unknown to biology!)

The only known pathway for Flood reproduction and survival is by the infestation and assimilation of other species. They do this through a form of cellular reproduction known as lysogenic replication where the viral cells infect host cells with their own genetic code which mutates the host cells into viral forms.

A contradiction (so they can only reproduce via infection, but also on their own?) and also technobabble technobabble. No substance.

Capable of surviving extreme environments ranging from -75 to +53 degrees Celsius and even underwater (in early stages of life), the Flood can withstand harsh environments of all known colonized planets.

Is that suppsoed to be impressive? They can be killed by boiling water!

It would seem that the Flood can infest any living organism, but that they prefer hosts with a large brain capacity to accelerate the formation and expansion of the Gravemind hive intelligence and the Flood intelligence as a whole. They are only as intelligent as the beings they infect; the more cunning the enemy, the more dangerous the Flood will be.

So despite the fact that they break down the hosts cells via "massive biological breakdown", the hosts biology somehow influences the outcome?

Yeah screw that article i won't even go further. There is some content in it, but all of it is unimpressive. They can be stopped by cold and low humidity, they reproduce via easily stoppable spores (just wear proper NBC-equipment, such as Stormtrooper armor). Other than that it's just technobabble and more contradictions.

[Formless]

There is absolutely no goddamn way anyone over the age of ten could fail to see the problems with a zombie plague killing off an entire galactic civilization without that civilization being made of self destructive zombies themselves. Real life does not work like a comic book, idiot.

[ChosenOne54]

In every Forerunner debate, the Flood inevitably gets brought up. The thing most people fail to realize is that the Flood started out as a disease, and the Forerunners treated it as such, not fully understanding it. It is only that that caused them to lose; if they had declared war straightaway, realizing what they were fighting, the Flood would have been obliterated, but only in continuity did they lose.

The Forerunners are certainly incompetent, but not to the extent some people are suggesting.

[R.E.G.I.S Mk. V]

On Forerunner Vs Flood: The Forerunners lost because their most advance AI (which is noted as being in-charge of the defense of the entire galaxy in times of emergency) Spoiler

was hacked by the last of the Precursors. The Precursor was released from its prison during the test firing of a Halo in the former human capital system, it then somehow boarded the ring and disappeared for 43 odd years, and when it finally returned M. Bias' was under his control. The first strike was against the Forerunners' Jupiter-size artificial capital world, used M. Bias' to quickly disable Forerunner defenses for a short time and take control of half the Halo rings located in orbit (which is noted as a massive security violation a bit earlier in the book), and the fired them directly into the capital, destroying it.

It also somehow destroyed/closed off the Metarchy and Domain networks (likely running on Slipspace solid energy tech). The first is a network for the Forerunners' AI, the second the repository of knowledge and full minds of Forerunners. Forerunners spend their entire life in their armor suits, constantly able to access the Domain. Forerunner civiliazation was completely dependent on the above two networks. In addition to the lost of the above networks the Precursor also somehow massively slowed down FTL travel and comm. throughout the entire galaxy.

Before the Precursor decided to fuck them over the Forerunner had been effortlessly stomping out Flood infestations as they appeared.

[Serafina]

They take over an entire planet, though everything appears to be normal at first, as the Flood started out as a fucking disease! They then make their way onto ships and infect more people, off planets etc. etc. etc. Eventually when they've infected enough people, your friends the combat forms start appearing, as well as other, massive creatures which basically consume planets in their biomass, while taking over and reproducing your own technology. The Flood had their own fleet!

This whole debate about the flood is irrelevant anyway; the Forerunners will view the EMpire as a conventional combatant, and not treat them like a disease, and they will attack with their full might, obliterating them.

Oh, hey, they started out as a disease.

Gee, we're a hyperadvanced civilization (say, 21th-century earth). People start dying due to some disease, to which we have no treatment. Perhaps we should put up isolation wards, screen for it, boil our water before we drink it, or wear filter masks?
Naah, we're the Forerunners and are too stupid to do that! Instead we let sick people run around and infect everyone

The "it started out as a disease"-argument is NO EXCUSE. Anything resembling a modern (never mind space-age) civilisation knows how to fight a disease, regardless of whether there is a treatment or not! You simply focus on limiting the spread of the infection by putting people in isolation wards and cutting off the avenue of infection (be it by body fluids water or air).
And they WOULD fight the disease, because, hmm, maybe because it kills people?

A modern-day country could stop the flood, nevermind a supposedly intelligent interstellar civilization.

[Formless]

@ ChosenOne54: Uh huh. No. Its precisely the fact that the Flood are a disease (not an army, a disease) that makes the Forerunner's demise look like something out of a silver age comic book. There is no excuse for that, the only way it can be explained is that the Forerunners must have been on the verge of collapsing anyway. Oh yeah, that's a real threatening civilization!

[ChosenOne54]

Gee, we're a hyperadvanced civilization (say, 21th-century earth). People start dying due to some disease, to which we have no treatment. Perhaps we should put up isolation wards, screen for it, boil our water before we drink it, or wear filter masks?
Naah, we're the Forerunners and are too stupid to do that! Instead we let sick people run around and infect everyone

The "it started out as a disease"-argument is NO EXCUSE. Anything resembling a modern (never mind space-age) civilisation knows how to fight a disease, regardless of whether there is a treatment or not! You simply focus on limiting the spread of the infection by putting people in isolation wards and cutting off the avenue of infection (be it by body fluids water or air).
And they WOULD fight the disease, because, hmm, maybe because it kills people?

A modern-day country could stop the flood, nevermind a supposedly intelligent interstellar civilization.

Hey, I never said they were competent, it was their own fucked-up political system, and retarded belief in the Mantle that delayed all-out war for 300 years.

However, in this case, the Galactic Empire isn't a disease, and the Forerunners aren't going to treat them as such. The Galactic Empire is, well, an empire, and the Forerunners will most certainly declare war straightaway.

[ThePerson5]

Hey, I never said they were competent, it was their own fucked-up political system, and retarded belief in the Mantle that delayed all-out war for 300 years.

Uh, how was their political system system 'fucked up?' They quarantined the disease, and did everything modern day Earth would do to stop a disease outbreak.

[Serafina]

Hey, I never said they were competent, it was their own fucked-up political system, and retarded belief in the Mantle that delayed all-out war for 300 years.

Uh, how was their political system system 'fucked up?' They quarantined the disease, and did everything modern day Earth would do to stop a disease outbreak.

Then they must have done it in an utterly incompetent fashion.

[Formless]

And what is stopping the Empire from using bioweapons, exactly? I mean, the usual assumption in VS debates is that everyone has done at least basic intelligence gathering on their enemies, and such a crippling problem as not having a functioning CDC analogue is not an easy thing to hide.

[ChosenOne54]

In this debate, the tech disparity is simply too large. These are the guys that mount star-kersploding weapons on their standard ships, use technobabble slipspace weaponry, and a whole bunch of other wankfest retarded stuff like punting planets through slipspace etc. etc. etc.

A single Sun Crusher gone rogue was devastating for the Empire, what could an entire fleet of them do? That's basically what the Forerunners have in store.

[Serafina]

However, in this case, the Galactic Empire isn't a disease, and the Forerunners aren't going to treat them as such. The Galactic Empire is, well, an empire, and the Forerunners will most certainly declare war straightaway.

True, but i don't care about that part of the debate because we simply do not know about the Forerunners to make a good comparison.

And if i were the Empire, i'd throw some bioweapons at the Forerunners. If they are that incompetent at basic quarantine procedures, i'll probably kill them off.

[ChosenOne54]

Just curious, but what bioweapons have we seen the Empire use in the past?

[Formless]

Which? The Empire or the Forerunners?

Edit: never mind, see next post.

[ThePerson5]

Can the Empire create and deploy said bio-weapons fast enough before their suns start getting popped like balloons?

[Shroom Man 777]

If you're including the shitty Forerunners who are pretty much dead, then the Warsies can include the Hyperspace Aliens who arranged the Corellian system, who arranged the black holes at Maw, and the race that designed Centerpoint Station, and Exar Kun can surf around blowing up suns with his awesome Sith mind bullets.

If those Forerunner guys got killed by a bunch of stupid Floods who even have trouble with Space Vietnam War Marines with Space M16s, well, maybe a bunch of Ewoks can stone them to death with styrofoam rocks since they're all that stupid. Unless Person5 posts a screencap of some Forerunners blowing up a British flat.

Capable of surviving extreme environments ranging from -75 to +53 degrees Celsius and even underwater (in early stages of life), the Flood can withstand harsh environments of all known colonized planets.

Is that suppsoed to be impressive? They can be killed by boiling water!

Maybe Person5 was mistaken for bringing up weaker Parting of the Ways Flood and he will change the scenario to include the much more awesomer Journey's End Flood to pwn all j00 Star Warsie-Os!

Hey, can we get some awesome screencaps of some Flood guys blowing up some British apartment?

[ThePerson5]

If you're including the shitty Forerunners who are pretty much dead, then the Warsies can include the Hyperspace Aliens who arranged the Corellian system, who arranged the black holes at Maw, and the race that designed Centerpoint Station, and Exar Kun can surf around blowing up suns with his awesome Sith mind bullets.

Someone was clearly not reading the OP, when it specifically mentioned 'A New Hope' era. So no, they don't.

[Shroom Man 777]

If you're including the shitty Forerunners who are pretty much dead, then the Warsies can include the Hyperspace Aliens who arranged the Corellian system, who arranged the black holes at Maw, and the race that designed Centerpoint Station, and Exar Kun can surf around blowing up suns with his awesome Sith mind bullets.

Someone was clearly not reading the OP, when it specifically mentioned 'A New Hope' era. So no, they don't.

Someone was clearly not reading the previous thread he just posted last month.

Anyway, so the Star Wars guys are limited to one period, whereas the Haloids get all their assholes from past, present and future? Even the long dead extinct assholes who got killed by the Flood because they were utter idiots? Hah.

What's the matter? Dalevromasterassilonilek couldn't cut it, and it turns out the Parting of the Ways Forerunners were insufficient in the last thread, so you wanted to see how the Journey's End Forerunners (along with all the other Haloids) fare? Where's the screencap of a Forerunner blowing up a British house?