Computer problems, please help

[HMS Sophia]

So, it turns out I'm not quite as good with computers as I thought.
My wife's desktop (which is quite old), isn't working. I've tried fixing it before when the problem wasn't so severe, but now I have no idea.
It used too turn on, get to the desktop, give a few minutes of use and then shut down (or restart). I've had this problem with my laptop before, which I fixed by doing a system restore, but no luck here.
Anyway, trying again. I switch it on, get to the black and white... I think its the BIOS screen? and then it goes *dink* and the screen goes black. It's still lit, so it's not the screen, but it wont respond to anything.
Any help would be great.

(Oh, its XP I think... no other details)

[Stormin]

Do you have a spare power supply? If testing with spare power supply doesn't work disconnect everything non essential from the motherboard and then try running it.

[HMS Sophia]

No spare power supply.
Im'a have to open this beggar up aren't I....

[Dave]

By *dink*, do you mean a beep, or is that just the sound of all the power and fans turning off at once?

[HMS Sophia]

Okay, so I popped the covers to have a look, booted it with no panels, and now it's working...
weird...
it might be about to crash out again though... in that event, what is it I should be disconnecting (I have not really done this before)

Dink is the switch off sound yeah, all power and fans going.

[HMS Sophia]

Grrr... bastard thing just crashed again and now isn't working.
Yeah, some help on what I should be unplugging would be great...

[HMS Sophia]

Could heat be doing this?
Because the first turn on works fine-ish. the second and further get progressively worse as time goes on, until i leave it for half an hour, then go back to it. I'm now wondering whether the fan isn't working properly, and that it's getting too hot very fast.
THe other thing pushing me in that direction is that as soon as I got the stacks panels off it worked better than it had in a while...

[HMS Sophia]

I think it is now I say that.
I just checked, and the main 12v fan isn't working. Only the little one that appears to be attached to the motherboard is spinning. Maybe a new fan is on the cards?

[Stormin]

So the fans are running even when the screen is not displaying? Might be the graphics card if you have one. Pull that out and plug the monitor into the motherboard then try running the computer.

If that doesn't solve the problem you have a bit of work ahead. Disconnecting components is quite easy, you unplug the hard drives, disk drives, pull the ram and test one piece at a time and one plug at a time. If it's still not working your motherboard could be screwed and it might need replacement if you want to bother.

An XP computer might not be worth repairing, some searching will probably turn up a $300 or so new-ish machine from one of the stores in your area that sells prebuilts. Look around for clearance models if you don't want to get something expensive and fancy.

[HMS Sophia]

The fans are not running (well, one very small one is, the main one isn't.). and when I tried to pull the main one after about one minute of activity, it was burning hot (the heat sinks were).

I don't think we want to replace it. We both have laptops now (and two spares). It's just got some data that we'd like to save. Fixing it is the preference.

[Stormin]

Saving the data is easy, you pull out the hard drive, plug it into another computer then copy what you want to a flash drive. Run Magic Jellybean or another program to get the install keys for any Office or whatever programs you want to keep but lost the codes for.

I'm really suspecting the graphics card right now. Just pull that if you can then see if the machine works with the monitor plugged into the main board.

[HMS Sophia]

I doubt it has one. It's quite old, and certainly not built with one. I think its mostly integrated graphics.

Not heat problems then? damn.

[starslayer]

No, it probably is heat problems. Mobo and CPU fans should be running all the time, as should GPU fans. If they aren't, something is very wrong. At this point, I would worry about heat damage to the mobo. Since you guys both have laptops as your main machines (plus spare laptops!), I don't see why the computer is really worth the effort to save. Grab the data off the HDD, put it on an external drive, and then trash the computer.

[Zaune]

Oh, yeah, just as an aside, when was the last time you cleaned the inside of this thing?

I know I'm not going to like the answer to this...

[TheHammer]

Oh, yeah, just as an aside, when was the last time you cleaned the inside of this thing?

I know I'm not going to like the answer to this...

If you do clean it, DO NOT use a vaccuum cleaner

As an aside, a case fan should be able to be gotten pretty cheaply and easily. Many modern motherboards will automatically shutdown in the even of overheating to prevent serious damage, and it appears that may well be the case here, so replacing the fan may fix everything.

[HMS Sophia]

Oh, yeah, just as an aside, when was the last time you cleaned the inside of this thing?

I know I'm not going to like the answer to this...

Your not. It's never been cleaned internally (my wife is asthmatic, and I've only been around for about a year), and she's had it for maybe 3-4 years. And no, I wont use a vacuum on it

I'll nip down to a comp shop in the next few days, get a new fan.
With removing the current one, I cant see any screws or anything, so is it simply a case of pulling it off and pushing a new one on? it may have some connecting wires as well...

Since you guys both have laptops as your main machines (plus spare laptops!), I don't see why the computer is really worth the effort to save

Cos my wife wants me too, and doing stuff to please my wife makes me happy
But yeah, its not a big deal.

[Zaune]

You're not. It's never been cleaned internally (my wife is asthmatic, and I've only been around for about a year), and she's had it for maybe 3-4 years. And no, I wont use a vacuum on it

Bloody hell. No wonder the fan quit! While you're out getting a new case fan, buy some canned air and a packet of lint-free cloths. Take it outside and make sure the windows are shut so you won't set your wife's asthma off; you can't easily wear an anti-static wrist strap outside, so make sure you keep one hand on the casing at all times in order to earth yourself.

And normally I'd say this only needs doing once or twive a year, but the less dusty the machine is when you crack it open, the less chance of setting her asthma off. Once every three or four months would probably be a good minimum.

[HMS Sophia]

Sounds plan like... I'll certainly get some compressed air.
Anti-static wrist strap... huh. Never even considered it.

[Zaune]

I only bother with them when I'm working on someone else's machine, and in five years of doing this stuff I've yet to wreck any electronic component by handling it while carrying a static charge. Still, my textbooks say it's theoretically possible.

[Lord Baal]

Ditto here. By the way it seems totally like a heat trouble, my recommendations would be the same, clean the thing (outside, use a blower, not a vacuum) and replace the fan cooler, they are fairly cheap.

[Dave]

Your not. It's never been cleaned internally (my wife is asthmatic, and I've only been around for about a year), and she's had it for maybe 3-4 years. And no, I wont use a vacuum on it

I'll nip down to a comp shop in the next few days, get a new fan.
With removing the current one, I cant see any screws or anything, so is it simply a case of pulling it off and pushing a new one on? it may have some connecting wires as well...

Yeah, as others have said, get a bottle of canned air, take off the sides of the case and blow most of the dirt and dust out of it. Don't use the can upside down (freezing cold liquid comes out, bad idea) and be aware that you will see a LOT of dust come out -- definitely not for an asthmatic. Pay special attention to blowing out the fans, the heat sinks (the metal blocks with fins) and grills in the case. Also don't forget to blow some canned air in the power supply -- those tend to attract dirt as well and are generally part of the airflow pattern for your computer.

If the fan doesn't have visible screws, look for plastic tabs that clamp the fan down. (Or ask the nice people at the computer shop.) Fans are generally connected with two to four small wires with a little plug on the end that plugs directly into some pins on the motherboard.

And, in the future, I'd recommend cleaning it out like this say about once a year.

[HMS Sophia]

Thanks for all your help guys. I'll get the fan replaced and get it cleaned out, then I'll report back. With a bit of luck it'll start working