The Occupation of Wall Street Spreads

[Alkaloid]

America needs an act of horror to open its' eyes. a hundred protestors going alight or hari kiri in protest of wallstreet (& the 2 party system) would be a far more powerful message that flower children & peace. (They needn't actually give their lives either, just the act of dramatic self-injury would be enough to horrify the media to where it CAN'T ignore their message!)

You're probably right. However, people would be much more likely to listen to you were you to horrifically mutilate yourself publicly to bring attention to your cause.

[Temujin]

It doesn't help when the sound bite thats getting played nonstop on the news networks goes like this:

Newsman: What is your goal?
Uninformed Kid: We want to abolish Capitalism.
Newsman: What do you want to replace it with?
Uninformed Kid:

This march doesn't have a leader, a message (beyond things suck), or a motivation.

Olbermann read their first official statement last night:

[Temujin]

And some of the action from last night:

Here’s Video of a Senior NYPD Officer Beating Protesters With His Club

This is the scene at Occupy Wall Street Wednesday tonight, where a few hundred protesters continued the day's even larger demonstration with another march on Wall Street.

Last time we checked in, a tense standoff had emerged between cops—at least one of whom was looking forward to using his nightstick—and protesters, who'd been contained and blocked from the street with that ubiquitous orange netting and the old-school metal barriers.

Judging by the video coming out of downtown Manhattan, it seems clear that containment strategy doesn't seem to have worked particularly well. These two videos (the first uploaded to YouTube, the second taken by Fox 5), show a white-shirted NYPD lieutenant beating protesters back with a baton.

As far as we know it's the first time that's happened at occupation, which is now in its third week. And it wasn't just protesters, either; Fox 5 reporter Dick Brennan was hit with a nightstick and cameraman Roy Isen was maced. AP photographer Craig Ruttle was also right there—it's not clear if he took the brunt of the swing he managed to capture.

Videos in Question:





Link to the Fox 5 story and video: Occupy Wall Street Arrests; Fox 5 Crew And Protesters Hit By Pepper Spary, Batons

[The Yosemite Bear]

I heard tha FOX got beaten and maced....

[Todeswind]

Should be interesting what kind of spin they try to put on their reporters getting knocked the fuck out by the cops.

[Block]

Should be interesting what kind of spin they try to put on their reporters getting knocked the fuck out by the cops.

They're basically two seperate News organizations. Fox local affiliates have nothing to do with Fox News other than being owned by the same overall corporation. The local affiliates operate by the same rules as ABC, CBS, NBC, etc.

[FaxModem1]

The term I'm hearing batted around most for the average person is that the protestors are 'hippies'. So for the average person, if they've even heard of this, is that its just a bunch of whiny college kids.

[Broomstick]

Is anyone else troubled by the almost comical way the mainstream media is covering this story?

Nope. The mainstream media has been ignoring all the really troublesome economic shit that's affecting people outside the big Wall Street powerful in this country for at least 4 years. Why should they change? The unemployed and poor don't have money to buy advertising and/or influence so why care about them?

There are thousands of people camped out in Wall Street for 3 weeks now, 700 people were arrested on the Brooklyn Bridge and the media here in NY relegates these to second string stories, page 10 in the paper, brief sound bites, etc.

The strategy is to minimize publicity - see, we reported on your little protest and it was ignored and ineffective, now go away and stop bothering your overlords!

This strikes me as odd.

It strikes me as both the mid-1960's and the 1930's.

Look up the "Bonus Army" of 1932 - 40,000+ protesters camped out in Washington, DC, eventually dispersed by the contemporary army using, among other things, six tanks against the protesters which included women and children as well as army veterans. There were both injuries and fatalities. The government used the army because the Federal district of DC is not covered by the Posse Comitatis Act which normally forbids using the military as a domestic police force (and there's another reason for doing this somewhere other than DC). The infantry moved in with fixed bayonets and used a vomiting-inducing gas on the protesters originally developed for the battlefield.

Funny, most people never hear about that sort of thing in history class in the US, do they? These sorts of things have happened before. I'm sure they will again.

When there is coverage it focuses on the fact that these are young people, people without focus or direction, one political cartoon points out that they are smelly kids holding up signs like "Pie in the Sky". As if asking for economic fairness is just plain silly.

Don't listen to those unwashed hippies with their long-haired men and women who don't even shave their legs or wear bras! Of course the establishment is trying to discredit the protestors. If they acknowledged they have legitimate grievances they might actually feel like maybe possibly something should be done to fix the situation.

When young people occupied Tahiri square in Egypt to complain bitterly about joblessness and economic strife they were hailed as brave heroes and taking their part in the Arab spring. When American young people complain about essentially the same thing, they are smelly, listless, trouble makers looking for their pie in the sky.

That's because it's OK for foreigners to get uppity but OUR peasants/serfs/underlings need to remember their place!

Yes, I'm being exceedingly cynical this morning. The above snark should be seen as sarcasm and not my actual position on matters.

[K. A. Pital]

You're not being simply cynical (aside from the fact that cynism is not automatically a negative quality), you have extremely well demonstrate the hypocrisy of America's ruling class and how opression at home can coincide with support of revolutionary activity abroad. It is rather natural that the ruling class would seek to erase certain events from history; Orwell has only described and demonstrated the process but he did not "invent" it - it was invented long before him and used efficiently for just as long.

[Crossroads Inc.]

Outside of news sourcesl ike NPR and (sometimes) MSNBC, the 'coverage' of the riots has almost universially been "Mobs of out of work college kids' or "unemployed dirty hippies" or more recently "Union backed trouble makers" The riots are getting coverage now because it is all but imossible to ignore, but the large (corporate owned) media is going out of its way to paint the movement to make it as easily dismissable as possible.

All hail corporate owned America.

[Broomstick]

Outside of news sourcesl ike NPR and (sometimes) MSNBC, the 'coverage' of the riots has almost universially been "Mobs of out of work college kids' or "unemployed dirty hippies" or more recently "Union backed trouble makers" The riots are getting coverage now because it is all but imossible to ignore, but the large (corporate owned) media is going out of its way to paint the movement to make it as easily dismissable as possible.

Yes, like I said - welcome to the 1960's. The protests of that era were likewise attributed to troublemakers, hippies, and spoiled kids.

This won't end until there is more blood on the ground. If not this cycle of protests, then some other. The official history likes to emphasize peaceful and nonviolent protesting and its alleged effectiveness, but alongside every nonviolent protest that's successful is at least one that either incorporates or threatens real violence.

[Zaune]

Yes, like I said - welcome to the 1960's. The protests of that era were likewise attributed to troublemakers, hippies, and spoiled kids.

This won't end until there is more blood on the ground. If not this cycle of protests, then some other. The official history likes to emphasize peaceful and nonviolent protesting and its alleged effectiveness, but alongside every nonviolent protest that's successful is at least one that either incorporates or threatens real violence.

Not to mention that in the Sixties, the US armed forces had less of a reason to be unconditionally loyal to their political masters, Vietnam or no Vietnam. Nowadays they're better off than most of the middle class, much less the proletariat.

[Broomstick]

Tell me, how much are you paying for the stupid pills?

As already quoted by a marine participating on Wall Street, the US armed forces do not pledge loyalty to a person or political party, they pledge to uphold the constitution, which is supposed to apply equally to all. Remarkably enough, quite a few of the US armed forces take that notion seriously.

Second, while many of the '60's military were draftees, there were also a significant percentage of career military. Since then we've abolished the draft, true, but in a cost-cutting measure the powerful downsized the career segment of the military and have come to rely more and more on National Guard units, the "citizen soldiers" who, outside of being sent to war zones and disaster areas, live in the civilian world, work alongside civilians, in civilian jobs, and are integrated into the community. While there is no question the National Guard, along with the rest of the US military, will generally obey orders in other parts of the world, they are far less likely to be raising a gun to their literal neighbors and co-workers.

On top of that, your assertion that "Nowadays they're better off than most of the middle class, much less the proletariat" is bullshit and false. Military pay is significantly lower than civilian work of comparable education, skill, and experience. Granted, it is somewhat offset by military housing and provision of healthcare, but there are military families on food stamps because their incomes are insufficient to meet the cost of living where they are stationed. This state of affairs has prevailed for a few decades. Cite. Cite. Cite. Cite. And that should be enough, though there are plenty more out there.

While most military families are not on such aid, clearly some are and it's an indication that, in fact, the military rank and file are NOT doing better than the "proletariat". Add on multiple back-to-back deployments and the problems the wounded and disabled having in accessing proper care, and the fact that returning veterans leaving the military are having no more success at finding work than anyone else, and the notion that the US military is composed of unthinking servants of the rich and powerful really should be re-examined. There are a lot of pissed-off, frustrated people in the US military at present who are none to happy at being sent overseas to shoot other people, much less possibly being asked to restrain/shoot/whatever their fellow citizens in the near future.

[The Yosemite Bear]

You're not being simply cynical (aside from the fact that cynism is not automatically a negative quality), you have extremely well demonstrate the hypocrisy of America's ruling class and how opression at home can coincide with support of revolutionary activity abroad. It is rather natural that the ruling class would seek to erase certain events from history; Orwell has only described and demonstrated the process but he did not "invent" it - it was invented long before him and used efficiently for just as long.

Nor did Niccolo Machevelli invent it, but he handedly described how it worked centuries before Orwell...

Hey they taught us about the bonus army in junior high over in left coast california, as well as the coal wars, and the dustbowl. they did not cover our treatment of the oakies in the golden state, nor our state's treatment of the Chinese....

[Companion Cube]

Here's a photo roundup of protests from across the US.

Someone should really get on with changing that thread title, lol.

[Zaune]

Bloody hell. Point conceded; I was under the impression that they were at least paid a bit over the minimum wage!

[Simon_Jester]

They are.

The minimum wage in the US is low. Add to this that most military families (not counting senior officers and noncoms) are very young, in their early twenties or even teens... which means that in this economy, it's very hard for military spouses to find work, and even harder to find work that pays well.

But the army isn't a pampered elite in the US by any standards. Those big defense budgets go to procuring military hardware, not to paying the troops.

[Crateria]

http://s3.amazonaws.com/kym-assets/phot ... 1317856453

I couldn't resist.

[JME2]

http://s3.amazonaws.com/kym-assets/phot ... 1317856453

I couldn't resist.

LMAO.

[Kamakazie Sith]

A group of a couple hundred people began occupying SLC a couple days ago. They followed established protesting laws and the city worked with them to ensure that they were heard and guess what? No arrests. No OCs use. No baton use. Amazing what happens when people follow the law.

In contrast to NYPD; when SLC had spontaneous protest break out (several years ago) law enforcement utilized tear gas and 40mm rubber bullets.

[Thanas]

I'll gladly accept your evidence that the persons the cop is hitting with his baton broke the law now.

[Highlord Laan]

I'll gladly accept your evidence that the persons the cop is hitting with his baton broke the law now.

It'll be the same defense used every time an American cop nightsticks a protestor or pedestrian to the pavement, pepper sprays someone not doing anything, kicks in the ribs of a recently tazered shoplifter, or shoots a sleeping seven year old. "I thought I was in danger." Magic phrase spoken, the officer will be free from any consequences and anyone who disagrees is an unamerican commie-pinko islomofascist traitor that refuses to see the square-jawed defenders of all that is right and true in glorious 'merrica as the upstanding shields of the people that they really are.

[Shroom Man 777]

You guys heard of that dog in Greece? The one who accompanies protesters in their, uh, protests? God, imagine if someone tried that in the USA. The police would probably send a SWAT team to open up on the dog with shotguns loaded with white phosphorus buckshot, or bayonets.

[Kamakazie Sith]

I'll gladly accept your evidence that the persons the cop is hitting with his baton broke the law now.

I'll gladly accept your evidence that I was specifically referring to any video.

I can guess for you. Perhaps they were protesting in an unapproved zone, perhaps the officer was attacked, perhaps the people were given a lawful order to move and failed to respond. Protesting zones exist so businesses, organizations, etc can continue to function. Basically, the right of the people to assemble does not give them the right to prevent the right of others to work.

[Kamakazie Sith]

I'll gladly accept your evidence that the persons the cop is hitting with his baton broke the law now.

It'll be the same defense used every time an American cop nightsticks a protestor or pedestrian to the pavement, pepper sprays someone not doing anything, kicks in the ribs of a recently tazered shoplifter, or shoots a sleeping seven year old. "I thought I was in danger." Magic phrase spoken, the officer will be free from any consequences and anyone who disagrees is an unamerican commie-pinko islomofascist traitor that refuses to see the square-jawed defenders of all that is right and true in glorious 'merrica as the upstanding shields of the people that they really are.

Ironically enough Officer Weekely, the police officer that shot Aiyana Jones, that seven year old, has been indicted on charges of involuntary manslaughter, reckless endangerment, and reckless use of a firearm. I apologize for letting facts get in the way of your content-less post.