The most polluted capital in Asia is...

N&P: Discuss governments, nations, politics and recent related news here.

Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital

Post Reply
User avatar
mr friendly guy
The Doctor
Posts: 11235
Joined: 2004-12-12 10:55pm
Location: In a 1960s police telephone box somewhere in Australia

The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by mr friendly guy »

Hint, its not Beijing anymore
November 21, 2011, 7:20 am
New Delhi, Now More Polluted Than Beijing
By HEATHER TIMMONS

India has recently pulled far ahead of China on one dubious development marker – air pollution in the country’s capital.

The air quality in New Delhi on Monday afternoon was significantly worse than the air quality in Beijing, according to real-time air monitors run by the Indian and U.S. governments in both cities.

New Delhi, a landlocked, fast-growing metropolis of more than 16 million people, is regularly shrouded by haze and smog (sometimes euphemistically referred to as fog) in winter months, as barometric pressure and cooler air mix with construction dust, smoke from cow dung fires and car exhaust, which then hover over the city for days.

But this year, the air quality in New Delhi has seemed noticeably worse than previous years as the summer heat dissipates. On Monday, a thick gray haze hung over Delhi’s taller buildings, and a visible film formed quickly on stationary objects, leaving a chemical taste and grime on the skin.

The air feels thick because it is heavy with debris and pollution.

According to a Web site (use the “Air Quality online” link) run by the government of India’s Ministry of Earth Sciences that takes air quality samples hourly from several spots around New Delhi, Air Quality Index, or A.Q.I. measures for the tiniest measures of particulates, known as PM 2.5, were well above 300 on Monday afternoon, a level judged to be “very poor” in India and “hazardous” in other countries.

These particulates, so named because they are 2.5 microns or smaller, are especially dangerous because they can travel deep into the lungs, causing serious respiratory problems. They can be caused by car exhaust, burning coal and chemical plants.

Cooling temperatures are trapping air pollution created by a rising number of cars, which is being supplemented by dusty winds from the northwest, said G. Beig, the program director of the air monitoring program at the Indian Institute of Tropical Meteorology.

The A.Q.I. is an index used to measure various different pollutants which ranges from 0 to 500, with 500 being the highest level of pollution. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency classifies an overall A.Q.I. over 201 as “very unhealthy” and any A.Q.I. over 301 as “hazardous.” A.Q.I. levels over 301 “would trigger health warnings of emergency conditions,” the E.P.A. says, with the “entire population” likely to be affected.

When related specifically to particulate pollution, the EPA considers any AQI figure over 151 “unhealthy,” and over 201 as “very unhealthy,” and cautions older people and children should stay indoors, and everyone should avoid heavy exertion.

The A.Q.I. for PM 2.5 at the India Meteorological Department’s headquarters in central Delhi was 320 on Monday afternoon, the Indian Web site said, and the A.Q.I. at the National Center for Medium Range Weather Forecasting in Noida, a Delhi suburb, was 380.

In Beijing, in contrast, the A.Q.I. for these small particulates on Monday was below 200 for much of the day, according to a Twitter feed run by the U.S. Embassy in Beijing, which measures air hourly.

A database recently published by the World Health Organization also shows New Delhi with higher pollution levels than Beijing, but that database relies on official government figures. Beijing’s government has been criticized for down-playing the city’s pollution problems, and recently began tours of its air monitoring facilities.

Delhi’s Pollution Control Board did not immediately respond to calls for comment Monday afternoon.
I will be very interested whether this is just a once off, or a sign of things to come.
Never apologise for being a geek, because they won't apologise to you for being an arsehole. John Barrowman - 22 June 2014 Perth Supernova.

Countries I have been to - 14.
Australia, Canada, China, Colombia, Denmark, Ecuador, Finland, Germany, Malaysia, Netherlands, Norway, Singapore, Sweden, USA.
Always on the lookout for more nice places to visit.
User avatar
Haruko
Jedi Master
Posts: 1114
Joined: 2005-03-12 04:14am
Location: California
Contact:

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Haruko »

I would be very interested to see the short term effects of a serious policy of clean-up in that city. My memory is vague, but did not New York City have a dramatic improvement in sanitation and air quality in a relatively short time in the late 1800s?
If The Infinity Program were not a forum, it would be a pie-in-the-sky project.
Faith is both the prison and the open hand.”— Vienna Teng, "Augustine."
User avatar
CaptainChewbacca
Browncoat Wookiee
Posts: 15746
Joined: 2003-05-06 02:36am
Location: Deep beneath Boatmurdered.

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by CaptainChewbacca »

In the case of New York, it was the implementation of working sewage and public trash collection. In 1880 in New York, you could literally empty a chamber pot out your front door. By 1910, that was no longer the case.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
ImageImage
DarkArk
Padawan Learner
Posts: 163
Joined: 2010-10-08 10:38am
Location: Seattle

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by DarkArk »

When I was in Beijing I considered the air to be neigh on unbreathable. It felt like I was constantly smoking a light cigarette. To think that New Delhi is worse is, uggh.

I think this is a sign of things to come though. Both populations want an increase in economic ability and the political clout that it will bring.
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Simon_Jester »

Enough days like that, though, and they'll start enacting smog controls.

It's entirely practical for a city to be rich and still have breathable air, after all.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
User avatar
mr friendly guy
The Doctor
Posts: 11235
Joined: 2004-12-12 10:55pm
Location: In a 1960s police telephone box somewhere in Australia

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by mr friendly guy »

Japan had pollution in the 60s and London had the great smog. If the trend continues, industrialising nations eventually, and I stress that word, eventually clean up their mess.
Never apologise for being a geek, because they won't apologise to you for being an arsehole. John Barrowman - 22 June 2014 Perth Supernova.

Countries I have been to - 14.
Australia, Canada, China, Colombia, Denmark, Ecuador, Finland, Germany, Malaysia, Netherlands, Norway, Singapore, Sweden, USA.
Always on the lookout for more nice places to visit.
Teebs
Jedi Master
Posts: 1090
Joined: 2006-11-18 10:55am
Location: Europe

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Teebs »

mr friendly guy wrote:Japan had pollution in the 60s and London had the great smog. If the trend continues, industrialising nations eventually, and I stress that word, eventually clean up their mess.
This. When you're worrying about hunger and running water you don't give a damn about air pollution. Once you've got the basics in life sorted out it becomes an issue.
User avatar
UnderAGreySky
Jedi Knight
Posts: 641
Joined: 2010-01-07 06:39pm
Location: the land of tea and crumpets

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by UnderAGreySky »

New Delhi's is a winter nightmare. The stuff just clings to the surface. It's nowhere near as bad in summer, oddly. There are factories surrounding the capital (not inside, but not far away) and the land is relatively flat so weather doesn't play much of a role in alleviating it.

Also, Delhiites are far more tolerant in accepting imperfection / shoddiness / pollution IMO.

Bombay has it much better in many ways: a continuous sea breeze, reduction of factories in urban areas thanks to the levy of an octroi tax, conversion of all taxis and autorickshaws (and most buses) to run on Compressed Natural Gas... Bombay in the early 90s was so polluted you couldn't see across town from a skyscraper. None of that shit now, only the odd sea haze.

(disclaimer: I grew up in the latter city so I'm biased!)
Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies,
Tongue-tied and twisted, just an earth-bound misfit, I
User avatar
madd0ct0r
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 6259
Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by madd0ct0r »

I'm pretty sure the dehli taxis, ricksahws ect run on natural gas as well.

cooking fires I'd suspect are a major source of the probelem
"Aid, trade, green technology and peace." - Hans Rosling.
"Welcome to SDN, where we can't see the forest because walking into trees repeatedly feels good, bro." - Mr Coffee
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Simon_Jester »

Electrification and increased natural gas use will help with that.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
User avatar
madd0ct0r
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 6259
Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by madd0ct0r »

cooking on electricity is expensive (actually so and relatively much more so), and even natural gas (although convenient) is still more expensive then shit coal in a bucket.

The charcoal crud blocks used around here are preferred when you need a high, constant heat for a long time - boiling water, restaurants and cafes ect.
"Aid, trade, green technology and peace." - Hans Rosling.
"Welcome to SDN, where we can't see the forest because walking into trees repeatedly feels good, bro." - Mr Coffee
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Simon_Jester »

madd0ct0r wrote:cooking on electricity is expensive (actually so and relatively much more so), and even natural gas (although convenient) is still more expensive then shit coal in a bucket.

The charcoal crud blocks used around here are preferred when you need a high, constant heat for a long time - boiling water, restaurants and cafes ect.
Hmm. I see the problem.

Although as the air quality gets worse, and the standard of living improves, you may see that being actively regulated.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
User avatar
Metahive
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2795
Joined: 2010-09-02 09:08am
Location: Little Korea in Big Germany

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Metahive »

I spend most of the last year in Beijing and especially in November and December, when there wasn't rain for weeks breathing felt like inhaling from a car exhaust. When I left I could see an enormous cloud of smog covering the city and most of its surrounding area as high as a mountain from the plane. I must say I found that almost more impressive than the Great Wall.

I shudder at the thought that some other city has now topped that.
People at birth are naturally good. Their natures are similar, but their habits make them different from each other.
-Sanzi Jing (Three Character Classic)

Saddam’s crime was so bad we literally spent decades looking for our dropped monocles before we could harumph up the gumption to address it
-User Indigo Jump on Pharyngula

O God, please don't let me die today, tomorrow would be so much better!
-Traditional Spathi morning prayer
User avatar
UnderAGreySky
Jedi Knight
Posts: 641
Joined: 2010-01-07 06:39pm
Location: the land of tea and crumpets

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by UnderAGreySky »

Metahive - I've been to Delhi often and I can't say I've ever felt like that. And I do have a yardstick to compare it to since I live in a small town in the UK. Delhi has never been choke-your-lungs-up bad to me.

Maybe it's the Chinese fudging their data? :D
Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies,
Tongue-tied and twisted, just an earth-bound misfit, I
User avatar
Lusankya
ChiCom
Posts: 4163
Joined: 2002-07-13 03:04am
Location: 人间天堂
Contact:

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Lusankya »

The article says that the Chinese information is based on information gathered by the US.
mr friendly guy wrote:according to real-time air monitors run by the Indian and U.S. governments in both cities.
The thing about Beijing is that the air quality is worse than it otherwise should be based merely on the amount of industry in the area, because it's surrounded by mountains and often has a temperature inversion. That's why the air quality was so bad for the first part of the Olympics, even though they'd actually closed down a lot of the pollution sources a few weeks earlier: air pollution from a week ago was still refusing to year.

It could be that Delhi is producing more pollution on a daily basis, which means that during periods when Beijing's air pollution does manage to disperse, or during periods where Delhi's pollution doesn't manage to disperse, Delhi's pollution index becomes higher than Beijing's.
"I would say that the above post is off-topic, except that I'm not sure what the topic of this thread is, and I don't think anybody else is sure either."
- Darth Wong
Free Durian - Last updated 27 Dec
"Why does it look like you are in China or something?" - havokeff
User avatar
UnderAGreySky
Jedi Knight
Posts: 641
Joined: 2010-01-07 06:39pm
Location: the land of tea and crumpets

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by UnderAGreySky »

Yeah, I'm not really keen on defending Delhi anyway :mrgreen:
Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies,
Tongue-tied and twisted, just an earth-bound misfit, I
User avatar
Spice Runner
Jedi Knight
Posts: 767
Joined: 2004-07-10 05:40pm
Location: At a space station near you

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Spice Runner »

Wow, how times have changed. When I was last in New Delhi I experienced very little to no smog/pollution. Then again that was a decade ago :)
User avatar
Phantasee
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
Posts: 5777
Joined: 2004-02-26 09:44pm

Re: The most polluted capital in Asia is...

Post by Phantasee »

I was in Delhi in 96, and I recall being amazed that Islamabad was a cleaner city overall than New Delhi.

Of course, I was in grade 3 then. Now I know better; pollution means industry, generally. Islamabad was clean, but empty, compared to Delhi.
XXXI
Post Reply