Fatass Forces Passenger to Stand for 9 hr Flight

[Flagg]

I tried pointing out that the original article has only the one view point of pissed off customer earlier, they don't want to entertain that view point. They're too busy with the one sided fat ass story.

You also blatantly lied about a salient fact in the article and never responded when it was pointed out, so you can take your opinion and shove it up your ass.

I didn't lie about jack shit, asshole. Just about every fucking thing in that article was from pissed off customer's point of view. The only thing from the flight crew was a throw away line from the company about how the pissed off customer 'refused the jump seat.' I fully acknowledge pissed off customer said he wasn't offered one. That small exchange was the only balanced, two points of view, piece of information in the article.

When I pointed it out, all you did was quote the article where pissed off customer said he was denied, as if it erases the part where the flight crew said he refused it. Fuck off.

He was never offered it you lying sack of shit. You point to the article where the airline says he was offered a jumpseat or fucking concede.

[Knife]

Refer to edit.

[Knife]

lol, but don't let the one sided articles one point of view from someone else but pissed off customer ruin your 'fat guys sucks' rant.

[Flagg]

lol, but don't let the one sided articles one point of view from someone else but pissed off customer ruin your 'fat guys sucks' rant.

It's so one sided they quote the airline repeatedly. That's really one sided, right?

[Spoonist]

CNN had a follow up article with more details.

As the flight was filled to capacity, and as passengers are not permitted to sit in the flight attendants' jump seats, Berkowitz found himself strolling through the cabin for hours. Flight attendants apparently asked him to remain seated and fasten his seat belt, but he said the co-passenger was seated on his seat belt fastener, making this impossible.

That meant that, though he did manage to wedge himself into his seat for the takeoff and landing, he was unable to comply with the requirement that his seat belt be fastened at those times.

After months of unsuccessful communication, he said, he went to the FAA, which notified him that US Airways considered the matter closed.

"We have attempted to address this customer's service concerns, but offering increasing amounts of compensation based on a threat of a safety violation isn't really fair -- especially when the passenger himself said he didn't follow the crew members' instructions and fasten his seat belt," US Airways said in a written statement. "If there was a safety issue -- we will address that professionally and with the proper attention toward preventing it from happening again. We have already provided feedback on the service issues with the team involved, and thank Mr. Berkowitz for making his concerns known."

[Flagg]

So it basically confirms the other story about him not being able to be buckled, but says he could sit down if he "wedged himself in". It puts a slightly different angle on it, but what the airline did is still totally unacceptable.

[Knife]

So... no one could figure out to ask fat ass to stand up so pissed off guy could buckle his seat belt and then have fat ass sit down again? Or swap seats? Is the buckle always on the left or right?

Look, obviously pissed off guy got the raw deal, bad service, and in general a fucking bad experience. Still, seems he could 'fit' in his seat and just didn't like being there (not an unfair position I think) but if the whole thing is that he couldn't buckle his seat belt because fat ass was sitting on it, that's just stupid. How did fat ass buckle his, presumable he was sitting on his own buckle?

[Kanastrous]

As a matter of principle, don't you think that buying a seat means that you are entitled to the full use of one seat? Not one-and-one-quarter or one-and-one-half, or three-quarters or seven-eigths, but one seat. I don't care whether my belt buckles or not, if I have paid for one seat but only have the use of half, and the fellow next to me has paid for one, and is using all of his plus half of mine, that's unacceptable.

[Knife]

As a matter of principle, don't you think that buying a seat means that you are entitled to the full use of one seat? Not one-and-one-quarter or one-and-one-half, or three-quarters or seven-eigths, but one seat. I don't care whether my belt buckles or not, if I have paid for one seat but only have the use of half, and the fellow next to me has paid for one, and is using all of his plus half of mine, that's unacceptable.

I agree, pissed off guy got screwed. But that is customer satisfaction. Technically, he bought passage, and got to where he was going. The concept of 'I bought/rented this seat it's mine' is silly; do you only get half the arm rest that straddles the two seats? The safety concerns are valid, but then again, if it was all because fat ass was sitting on the buckle, why didn't the flight crew have fat ass stand or lean waaaaay over to the side so pissed off guy could buckle his belt for take off and landing?

But it mostly seems like PR and customer service. The company made their pitch for compensation, pissed off guy said no. Fuck it, it's done. Pissed off guy can fly another company next time. Or try Greyhound, their seating is smaller, closer, and just shittier than airline seating (which is saying something). Or pony up the cash for first class and get a foot massage while the plebs are squished into crappy seats in the back. Hell, in first class, they might actually let you buy a seat so it's yours after the flight.

[Ryan Thunder]

So... no one could figure out to ask fat ass to stand up so pissed off guy could buckle his seat belt and then have fat ass sit down again? Or swap seats? Is the buckle always on the left or right?

Obviously, they did not fucking fit into only two seats. What part of this do you not understand?

[Kanastrous]

I agree, pissed off guy got screwed. But that is customer satisfaction. Technically, he bought passage, and got to where he was going. The concept of 'I bought/rented this seat it's mine' is silly; do you only get half the arm rest that straddles the two seats?

When you purchase the use of a rental car, you don't expect to share it with someone who's rented a separate car. When you purchase the use of a condo, you don't expect to share it with someone who's rented a different condo. When you purchase the use of an airline seat, while you certainly expect to share or relinquish the use of one or another of the arm rests, you don't expect to share the seat with another ticketed passenger.*

The safety concerns are valid, but then again, if it was all because fat ass was sitting on the buckle, why didn't the flight crew have fat ass stand or lean waaaaay over to the side so pissed off guy could buckle his belt for take off and landing?

Not good enough. What about when the larger passenger is not leaning waaaaay over? Why is it right for the smaller passenger to have to have another body slopping over on him - at all - during the flight? Brushing past you while getting up or sitting down or walking the aisle is one thing. Another passenger overflowing into the seat that you have purchased for the duration of a flight is extraordinary. Well, the nation's getting fatter. Maybe it's only extraordinary for the time being.

But it mostly seems like PR and customer service. The company made their pitch for compensation, pissed off guy said no. Fuck it, it's done.

Depends upon how you look at it. Last time I was dissatisfied with an airline's service, it wasn't over until I was satisfied with the compensation they offered me. Possibly I had a bit more leverage to apply than this fellow, because in truth I wasn't so badly screwed as he was, and I got what I demanded within a half-hour of rolling into the AA office at my destination.

*EDIT* more to the point, because you have not -contracted- to share. Your ticket is a contract, and sharing the designated seat is not a part of that contract.

[Batman]

^What he said.
Even if none of the safety regulations violations had happened, even if the poor sod had suffered through 7 hours on a fraction of the seat he paid for in full, the very least he'd be entitled to is a full refund. He didn't pay for three quarters of a seat, or half, or 87 percent, he paid for the full seat.
That doesn't mean it's the landwhale's fault. Ignoring the fact that the airline already basically admitted they screwed up when they didn't make him buy two seats for all we know he did inform them and the airline just decided that 'what the hell, the flight isn't fully booked anyway, we'll just park him somewhere where there's nobody sitting next to him and look good by not making him pay double' only to eventually find out that actually, urm, yes it is, which left the crew in in an awkward situation.
Still, as others have mentioned, instead of doing the right thing (getting Fatso off the plane and, since this absolutely was the airline's fault, making the second seat on the next available flight complimentary-and making triply sure that it will absolutely positively not be occupied) the crew apparently decided to ignore safety regulations in the hopes of not having the airline appear anti-fat guys.

[Kanastrous]

I would like to think that if I knew that I was spoiling someone else's flight and intruding into the seat for which they had paid, I would have the basic decency to say 'you know what, there's no reason for -you- to suffer for -my- poor planning. I'll take another flight.'

[Oni Koneko Damien]

Like... for real? I'm not even responding to you anymore.

You know... I actually wrote a big ol' response, but I think I have decided to just stick by you being a fucking idiot and just not responding to you anymore.
At least until you learn how to fucking read.

I love you man. You're such an insecure poser the comedy writes itself. Please, write another response about how you're not responding to me any more.

Anyways, after seeing the followup story, I now feel a lot more lenient to the flight attendants, it sounds like they really had no better option. One safety reg is getting violated when he doesn't wear a seat-belt, I'm sure another is getting violated if he's sitting in a crew-member's jumpseat outside of an emergency situation. This lands firmly on the more administrative end of things for allowing this fuck-up to happen in the first place.

So... no one could figure out to ask fat ass to stand up so pissed off guy could buckle his seat belt and then have fat ass sit down again? Or swap seats? Is the buckle always on the left or right?

Going by the average airliner seat, I'm guessing there's simply no room for fat-ass to stand while in the seats, at least not in a fashion that would remove his bulk from the seat-buckle unless he went all the way into the aisle, and then there would be no way for him to get back in because the other guy's now in the way. In my experience, even smaller people have to outright get into the aisle for any seat-shifting/switching to take place. And as far as switching goes, from the sound of it not-fat-ass had the aisle seat while fat-ass had the interior seat and a half. I'm guessing not-fat-ass rightfully didn't want to spend the entire flight risking suffocation sandwiched firmly between the window and a mountain of flesh.

I agree, pissed off guy got screwed. But that is customer satisfaction. Technically, he bought passage, and got to where he was going. The concept of 'I bought/rented this seat it's mine' is silly; do you only get half the arm rest that straddles the two seats?

Would you be pissed if you stopped at a motel, got a room for the night, and found out without prior warning that you had to share a bed with a random stranger? Why? The motel fulfilled its contractual obligation to provide you shelter for your stay, the comfort of your own bed isn't a part of that, the concept of 'I bought/rented this bed it's mine' is silly.

[CaptainChewbacca]

So... no one could figure out to ask fat ass to stand up so pissed off guy could buckle his seat belt and then have fat ass sit down again? Or swap seats? Is the buckle always on the left or right?

If the guy was fat enough (and it sounds like he was) he would have been sitting ON the skinny guy in that situation. As to how he buckled his seatbelt, they have seatbelt extenders on airplanes.

[Todeswind]

Can someone please explain to my why airlines don't set guidelines for the weight / size of a "single occupant" of a seat in coach flight? It cannot possibly be that hard to say "if you weigh over x lbs or have a waist size of more than x inches you the must either purchase two seats or the airline reserves the right to cancel your flight for safety reasons."

[weemadando]

I'm giant fat fuck, but I also fit in a seat, don't need a belt extender and honestly, the larger concern is that my knees bury into the seat in front and my shoulders are wider than the standard seat. So setting arbitrary waist or weight measures don't fully address the problem.

That said, I am conscious of my bulk and give myself horrible fucking cramps by turning myself into a crushed pretzel so as to not impinge on the people next to me.

So fat cunts don't understand or bother with any of this. Probably because having to get forklifted into the plane because the stairs were too much hard work was their exercise for the day.

[Spoonist]

Can someone please explain to my why airlines don't set guidelines for the weight / size of a "single occupant" of a seat in coach flight? It cannot possibly be that hard to say "if you weigh over x lbs or have a waist size of more than x inches you the must either purchase two seats or the airline reserves the right to cancel your flight for safety reasons."

The smart one does, the other ones cater to people who think like Havoc. But they are not required to, so some don't, like US Airways. While others have only changed their Contract of carriage while not informing the public about it, this so that they can refuse people who break the CoC but don't necessarily have to admit that they do.

Flying in EU I've never seen anyone refused boarding for obesity and I've seen plenty of obese here as well so its not that, but it seems that more people here seem aware that they need big seats and do not book a small one. Flying in Asia I've seen several americans being asked to upgrade to business or to be refused travel while equal sized asians was let onboard, so either they know the local policies better or they have a prefered treatment.
Haven't flown in the US since your airlines started changing policies, but before it was indeed scary since they let anyone onboard and the american public seemed to have an entitlement complex that the airline should cater to them regardless of size for the same price.

Worst such situation for me was flying when half the plane was body builders, returning a bit intoxicated from a competition...

This is the airline that threw off Kevin Smith.
http://www.southwest.com/html/generated ... y_faq.html
"We could no longer ignore complaints from Customers who traveled without full access to their seat due to encroachment by a large seatmate whose body extended into the neighboring seat. These Customers had uncomfortable (and sometimes painful) travel experiences, and it is our responsibility to seek resolution to prevent this problem."



The most clear and straightforward one is Continental:
http://www.continental.com/web/en-US/co ... fault.aspx
"A customer flying in the economy cabin who is not able to safely and comfortably fit in a single seat is required to purchase an additional seat for each leg of their itinerary. The second seat may be purchased for the same fare as the original seat, provided it is purchased at the same time. A customer who does not purchase an extra seat in advance may be required to do so on the day of departure for the fare level available on the day of departure. The customer may instead choose to purchase a ticket for First Class/Business/BusinessFirst®, or elect to pay for an upgrade to the front cabin if there is availability to do so. Continental Airlines is not required to provide additional seats or upgrades free of charge.

A customer is required to purchase an additional seat or upgrade if they do not meet one of the following criteria:
1.The customer must be able to properly attach, buckle and wear the seatbelt, with one extension* if necessary, whenever the seatbelt sign is illuminated or as instructed by a crew member.
2.The customer must be able to remain seated with the seat armrest(s) down for the entirety of the flight.
3.The customer must not significantly encroach upon the adjacent seating space. See our seat maps.

Continental Airlines will not board a customer who declines to purchase a ticket for an additional seat or upgrade for each leg of their itinerary when required."

[LaCroix]

2.The customer must be able to remain seated with the seat armrest(s) down for the entirety of the flight.

To be honest, me and my spouse have tried to lift the armrest between us during flights, and have yet not succeeded in doing so. They might be immobile in some airlines (Lufthansa, Austrian Airlines), or we just failed to grasp the (very well hidden) mechanism.

[Kanastrous]

Can someone please explain to my why airlines don't set guidelines for the weight / size of a "single occupant" of a seat in coach flight? It cannot possibly be that hard to say "if you weigh over x lbs or have a waist size of more than x inches you the must either purchase two seats or the airline reserves the right to cancel your flight for safety reasons."

Particularly when you consider that they didn't have any trouble figuring out the principle, where carry-ons are concerned: if it doesn't fit in a box measuring whatever x whatever x whatever, it can't enter the cabin.

EDIT

The second seat may be purchased for the same fare as the original seat, provided it is purchased at the same time.

I find this a bit unclear. Does this mean that the passenger may have the second seat at no additional charge, or that they may have it at the same dollar amount as, and in addition to, their first seat?

[Thanas]

The same amount I would think.

[Kanastrous]

-edited for late-breaking reading comprehension-

[Broomstick]

The second seat may be purchased for the same fare as the original seat, provided it is purchased at the same time.

I find this a bit unclear. Does this mean that the passenger may have the second seat at no additional charge, or that they may have it at the same dollar amount as, and in addition to, their first seat?

If purchased at the same time, a fat person can purchase the second seat for the same price as the first seat. If, however, said fat person waits until they are actually boarding the airplane the second seat will have to be purchased at the price in effect that day - which will likely be MUCH greater in price than if he had purchased it at the same time as the first ticket.

But the second seat is not free.

[SCRawl]

Second seat was full fare when I worked at QANTAS.

You could get a super special for one seat, but your fat arse, precious double bass or bottle of wine always pay full fare for the second one.