Woman refuses to go to back of bus.

[SirNitram]

Haarentz

A woman passenger on a public bus from Ashdod to Jerusalem Friday was told by an ultra-Orthodox male passenger to move to the back of the bus. The man held the door of the bus open and would not allow it to move for approximately 30 minutes.

When other passengers began to complain about the delay, the driver called the police. The policeman who arrived on the scene spoke with the man and then also asked the woman, Tanya Rosenblit, to move to the back of the bus. When she refused, the man who had been holding the door alighted and the bus continued on its way.

Rosenblit, who said she was dressed modestly, was traveling on Egged bus 451 to get to work in Jerusalem. She said a Haredi man, who boarded two stops after she did, refused to allow the driver to close the door after he saw Rosenblit. Rosenblit said the man called her a derogatory word for a non-Jewish woman, and told the driver it was his right to have her sit in the back and that he had paid to be able to do so.

At that point, Rosenblit said other passengers called on the driver to intervene because they were late. Some wanted to get off the bus and have their money refunded. At that point, Rosenblit said, the driver called the police.

The policeman who arrived on the scene took the man aside for "a pleasant conversation," Rosenblit said, after which the policeman asked her if she would move to the back of the bus.

After Rosenblit refused, the man who had held the door got off and Rosenblit continued on her way. "The reason I am posting this story is not to declare that Orthodox Jews as pure evil ... I want to point out that this is a social and educational problem," Rosenblit wrote on her Facebook page.

Egged spokesman Ron Ratner condemned the incident, but said such incidents were increasing and that Egged's directives clearly prohibit the driver from "permitting or creating any separation on the bus unless it is voluntary," and instructing to call the police in such cases. Ratner advised Rosenblit to submit a complaint to Egged's ombudsman so the incident could be scrutinized more closely.

How dare a woman act like she's a person with rights.

[PhilosopherOfSorts]

Is this really news? I mean, yeah, that guy was an ass, but he didn't get his way and everything worked out, nobody got hurt, the worst that happened was that some people were late for work. At the end of the day, this is just some asshole making a scene on a bus, which probably happens hundreds of thousands of times daily.

[dantheman40k]

Is this really news? I mean, yeah, that guy was an ass, but he didn't get his way and everything worked out, nobody got hurt, the worst that happened was that some people were late for work. At the end of the day, this is just some asshole making a scene on a bus, which probably happens hundreds of thousands of times daily.

including right now.

[evilsoup]

Someone could find it disturbing that the policeman asked the woman to move to the back. I don't, it was probably more of a 'oh come on, just placate the nutter' thing.

The real question is: are the Orthodox Jew communities in Israel falling into this mindset? It's possible that this is simply a lone nutter, but it's also possible that this is part of a wider trend. Haven't the Israeli army started to introduce segregation by gender, due to the ultra-orthadox? I'm sure I remember some talk about banning women from singing at official events, as well.

[Broomstick]

The real question is: are the Orthodox Jew communities in Israel falling into this mindset?

"Falling"? Uh, no - the ultraorthodox Jews have been for strict gender separation for, oh, a few THOUSAND years. Seriously, nothing new at all about it. Whether they try to impose that on others does seem to depend on the century/conjunction of planets/whatever.

[Gandalf]

Someone could find it disturbing that the policeman asked the woman to move to the back. I don't, it was probably more of a 'oh come on, just placate the nutter' thing.

How common is this mindset of "placate the nutter"?

[evilsoup]

The real question is: are the Orthodox Jew communities in Israel falling into this mindset?

"Falling"? Uh, no - the ultraorthodox Jews have been for strict gender separation for, oh, a few THOUSAND years. Seriously, nothing new at all about it. Whether they try to impose that on others does seem to depend on the century/conjunction of planets/whatever.

What I meant was to do with them forcing others to obey their strict interpretation, for example it's only recently that they've been pushing for greater gender segregation in the Israeli army. Also, might this be similar to those 'cover women up in a full death shroud and don't let them out the house' fundie Muslims? By which I mean, they're taking a very hard line against the mixing of genders, even within the historical context of orthodox Judaism?

Someone could find it disturbing that the policeman asked the woman to move to the back. I don't, it was probably more of a 'oh come on, just placate the nutter' thing.

How common is this mindset of "placate the nutter"?

Well, the closest I've ever been to Israel was a two-week holiday in Turkey, so I have no idea. I was just speculating as to the policeman's reasons.

[Gandalf]

Well, the closest I've ever been to Israel was a two-week holiday in Turkey, so I have no idea. I was just speculating as to the policeman's reasons.

But is this based on your own place of residence?

The idea of asking the lady to go to the back of the bus for that reason bothers me.

[evilsoup]

Dude no, if someone tried to pull this shit in London they'd be asked to get off the bus, if the police got involved they'd probably be arrested. I was really trying to pre-empt any obnoxious 'ugh fuck da police' comments. Because I can see why he might say 'miss, could you maybe consider just giving way to the moron?', even though I think it was the wrong thing to do (if it were me, I'd arrest the idiot just for being abusive to the bus driver, plus for making all those people late).

[Lusankya]

Good on her. The result of too many women meekly giving up their rights to "placate" nutters like this guy, especially when the nutter is part of a wider group of nutters is to normalise such behaviour and ultimately take a step back in women's rights.

[RIPP_n_WIPE]

Doesn't really surprise me considering the same kind of people run the Der Tzitung newspaper, cropping Hillary Clinton and Audrey Tomason out of the "situation" room photo during the operation in which osama bin laden was killed.

Religious fundie from a shithole middle-eastern country shows just how stupid he is. News at 11.

EDIT: For grammar and formatting.

[Ace Pace]

Someone could find it disturbing that the policeman asked the woman to move to the back. I don't, it was probably more of a 'oh come on, just placate the nutter' thing.

How common is this mindset of "placate the nutter"?

Not very, outside the ultra-Orthodox community (and not the Orthodox one as Broomstick suggests).

The reaction to this news piece from the entire secular/Orthodox spectrum is pretty much positive "good on her". With the exceptions mostly going "well...there are practically gender segregated lines, she should be respectable of them in their environment."

[Eulogy]

The reaction to this news piece from the entire secular/Orthodox spectrum is pretty much positive "good on her". With the exceptions mostly going "well...there are practically gender segregated lines, she should be respectable of them in their environment."

That's a real dumb argument from the apologists dissenters. Why does the nads-for-brains and his backwards misogynist Jim Crow ways deserve respect?

[The Yosemite Bear]

The Ultra Orthodox don't accept Spielberg as Jewish, or muchless many others, though technically they would have to accept Harry Belefonte, and the Children of Charlie Parker as Jewish (not to mention Poitier's daughters)(all jewish moms)

[Broomstick]

Not very, outside the ultra-Orthodox community (and not the Orthodox one as Broomstick suggests).

Go back and fucking re-read what I said - I specially said "ultra-orthodox". Yeah, I get pissed when someone tries to twist my words into something I didn't say. Do you really think they're a new phenomena?

Not that the orthodox are much better. They, too, practice pretty strict gender separation, too. Like in the synagogue women have to sit behind a screen and shut the fuck up so their womanness doesn't "distract" the men who, like the men in so many middle-eastern origin cultures, apparently have no self-control and have to be shielded and protected from women. Not that I was going to bring that up, but please, regular orthodox are hardly a bastion of gender equality.

[Ace Pace]

Not very, outside the ultra-Orthodox community (and not the Orthodox one as Broomstick suggests).

Go back and fucking re-read what I said - I specially said "ultra-orthodox". Yeah, I get pissed when someone tries to twist my words into something I didn't say. Do you really think they're a new phenomena?

Not that the orthodox are much better. They, too, practice pretty strict gender separation, too. Like in the synagogue women have to sit behind a screen and shut the fuck up so their womanness doesn't "distract" the men who, like the men in so many middle-eastern origin cultures, apparently have no self-control and have to be shielded and protected from women. Not that I was going to bring that up, but please, regular orthodox are hardly a bastion of gender equality.

my apology. writing posts five minutes after wakeup leads to stupid mistakes.

[dragon]

Is this really news? I mean, yeah, that guy was an ass, but he didn't get his way and everything worked out, nobody got hurt, the worst that happened was that some people were late for work. At the end of the day, this is just some asshole making a scene on a bus, which probably happens hundreds of thousands of times daily.

Well it was considered news when Rosa Parks did it in 1955.

[fgalkin]

Is this really news? I mean, yeah, that guy was an ass, but he didn't get his way and everything worked out, nobody got hurt, the worst that happened was that some people were late for work. At the end of the day, this is just some asshole making a scene on a bus, which probably happens hundreds of thousands of times daily.

Well it was considered news when Rosa Parks did it in 1955.

Rosa Parks was defying an established social order. This woman was defying a single asshole. Big difference.

In fact, this thread is Nitram was just taking a cheap shot at Israel, implying it's similar to Jim Crow era America.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Thanas]

Well, to an outsider it looks as if the orthodox and nationalistic groupings are acting with more and more impunity. Incidents like this confirm this impression one gets when watching news about Israel - either it is about some settlers being dicks, the Israeli Government being dicks or certain fundies (like this one) being dicks.

What efforts are Israeli society taking to get some good news out there?

[fgalkin]

Does a cure for cancer count?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[dragon]

Is this really news? I mean, yeah, that guy was an ass, but he didn't get his way and everything worked out, nobody got hurt, the worst that happened was that some people were late for work. At the end of the day, this is just some asshole making a scene on a bus, which probably happens hundreds of thousands of times daily.

Well it was considered news when Rosa Parks did it in 1955.

Rosa Parks was defying an established social order. This woman was defying a single asshole. Big difference.

In fact, this thread is Nitram was just taking a cheap shot at Israel, implying it's similar to Jim Crow era America.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

incidents were increasing and that Egged's directives clearly prohibit the driver from "permitting or creating any separation on the bus unless it is voluntary

more than one ass

after which the policeman asked her if she would move to the back of the bus

.
Asshhole supported by the cops

[fgalkin]

Trying to resolve the situation is now assholes "supported by the cops?" The cop asked her if she would move. Not to move, but IF she would move. On her own. She said no, and the asshole left. Learn to read your own damn language.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Thanas]

Does a cure for cancer count?

I am sorry. I should have posted "in relation to these perceptions of the ultra-orthodox and nationalists running the show". I thought that would be clear, but apparently not.

[fgalkin]

How about the Chief Rabbi of Israel telling them to STFU?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Thanas]

How about the Chief Rabbi of Israel telling them to STFU?

Ah yes, he is in favor of instead running seperate bus lines. Much better. Though he does get props for defending the idea of a public company.