114,500 GRT cruise ship capsized in Italy

[Eternal_Freedom]

That course map is just mind-boggling. I can look at that with precisely zero maritime experience and say "that's a stupid idea." These people have been trained properly? Where they high or something?

[Sea Skimmer]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... e-air.html

The FLIR video from an Italian coast guard helicopter has come out, showing the ship capsized but much higher in the water then it is now, down by the stern and with 50-100 people still on the side of the hull climbing down a rope ladder into the water. A huge bullet of absurd incompetence was dodged in all these people not just being dead.

[Sky Captain]

The middle of that channel is 10 meters deep but the port and starboard sides would have only been in 6 meters of water. The Costa Concordia draws 8.2 meters. It was physically impossible for her to make that passage without tearing open both port and starboard as the deeper area is too narrow, and absurdly unsafe besides.

I don't believe the ship intentionally went through the gap between those two rocks, that map showing the supposed course must be wrong. I could believe it if the channel was actually deep and wide enough for ship to pass through with little margin for error, but helmsman fucked up and hit the rocks. I mean even a first semester marine academy dropout would recognize it is physically impossible to pass through that gap. Maybe they hit some rocks before recognized the ship will soon sink and then steered into that gap hoping the ship will get stuck there but it squeezed through or something like that.

[Spoonist]

That course map is just mind-boggling. I can look at that with precisely zero maritime experience and say "that's a stupid idea." These people have been trained properly? Where they high or something?

Uhm, they have passed through that specific channel before. There are several pics of the Concordia passing very close to the exact same town "Giglio" that its close to now.
In fact they passed through there a week before the crash. Lets see if I can find that...

I just googled for it and got a face hit by irony.
The top hit is:

Costa Cruise Ships, Costa Concordia Cruise, Cruise Vacation
http://www.costacruise.com/usa/costa_concordia.html
Cruise Ships at Costa Cruise. Experience the Costa Concordia cruise ship for a cruise vacation you will never forget.

Back to the search results:

As one can see they passed there on the 6th of jan, but then they deviated from the similar course on the 13th.

[AniThyng]

I don't really see your point, the deviation is very very significant, and if i'm reading right chart eternal freedom is referring to, that's covering an area that's about 1cm*1cm on your map.

[Spoonist]

I don't really see your point, the deviation is very very significant, and if i'm reading right chart eternal freedom is referring to, that's covering an area that's about 1cm*1cm on your map.

My mistake if that was what eternal freedom was refering to. If so my apologies. I thought the reference was against the "normal" approach.

[El Moose Monstero]

I'm not pasting the full article, as most of it is recycled and the key point is just the image at the bottom of the page - the crucial bit is that Lloyds List reports that on August 14th, the cruise ship took an authorised detour on virtually the same route, deviating by 100m or so at the critical point and coming even closer (230m) to the island itself.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16606405

[Broomstick]

200 meters can be crucial.

In many ways, how close he came to the island either this voyage or a prior one doesn't matter - it's how close he came to the rocks under the water. If they drained the water away from those images so you could clearly see the bottom one of those two very similar routes might look at LOT safer than the other.

[El Moose Monstero]

Oh sure - the point of interest for me was the fact that previous deviations have been made and authorised by the company, where they were also less than truthful (i.e. reporting no closer than 500 m to the island when it was 253m). It doesn't remove any blame from the captain, but it suggests that there may also be some due to the company as well.

[CJvR]

Uhm, they have passed through that specific channel before. There are several pics of the Concordia passing very close to the exact same town "Giglio" that its close to now.
In fact they passed through there a week before the crash. Lets see if I can find that...

Well they didn't need to go between the islands to get close to the town, which is why I am somewhat hesitant about the accuracy of the plot. Such a course would not just be criminal - it would be insane, and I hope someone on the bridge would notice if the captain started chewing on the furniture.

[Sea Skimmer]

The captain has confirmed he was in command on the bridge at the time, and while its unclear in this case, its been said he also had a well known habit of taking the wheel himself. If he decided to steer into that passage very few people would be around to notice, a liner is only going to have 2-3 people on the bridge, and more often two then three. It is rather unlikely that a random underling would stop the captain from doing whatever the hell he wanted.

[Sea Skimmer]

Well so the captain has now admitted he ran the ship onto the rocks navigating by sight

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16620807

8 January 2012 Last updated at 15:03 ET
Italian captain 'turned too late'
The captain of the cruise ship that capsized on Friday, killing at least 11 people, has admitted making a navigation mistake, Italian media say.
Captain Francesco Schettino told investigators he had "ordered the turn too late" as the luxury ship sailed close to an island, according to a leaked interrogation transcript.
The Costa Concordia ran aground with about 4,200 people on board.
More than 20 are still missing but the search for survivors has been halted.
According to the leaked transcript quoted by Italian media, Capt Schettino said the route of the Costa Concordia on the first day of its Mediterranean cruise had been decided as it left the port of Civitavecchia, near Rome, on Friday.
The captain reportedly told the investigating judge in the city of Grosseto that he had decided to sail close to Giglio to salute a former captain who had a home on the Tuscan island.
"I was navigating by sight because I knew the depths well and I had done this manoeuvre three or four times," he reportedly said.
"But this time I ordered the turn too late and I ended up in water that was too shallow. I don't know why it happened."
'Saving lives'
The ship's owners, Costa Crociere, said earlier this week that the change of route had not been authorised.
On Tuesday, Capt Schettino's lawyer said his client had told the judge that lives had been saved thanks to the manoeuvre he made after the ship hit rocks.
Previous
Captain told to 'get back on ship' Ship's previous close pass of Giglio Captain 'said he was in command' Man's search for missing brother Night vision footage of rescue Aerial footage shows gash in hull Lifeboat panic caught on film Monti: 'Terrible' disaster
Next
The captain is under house arrest on suspicion of multiple manslaughter. Prosecutors have also accused him of fleeing the ship before evacuation was complete.
A recording of a call between him and a port official after the crash appears to support this, though Capt Schettino denies the claims.
In the recording, released by the Corriere della Sera newspaper, Livorno Port Authority chief Gregorio De Falco can be heard repeatedly telling the captain to get back on board to help passengers.
"Schettino, maybe you saved yourself from the sea, but I'll make you have trouble for sure. Go aboard," says Mr De Falco.
The captain appears to refuse, replying first that there are rescuers already on board, and then that it is dark and difficult to see.
Coastguards believe he never went back to the ship. He was arrested on the island shortly afterwards.
During the hearing, the captain reportedly said he could not get on board the vessel because it was lying on its side.
Italian media also quote him as telling the judge he had left the ship accidentally after tripping and falling into a rescue craft.
Search suspended
The BBC's Alan Johnston on Giglio island says that if the reports of the captain's answers under questioning are correct, then this amounts to an admission of the most reckless incompetence.
Meanwhile, the first dead victim to be identified was a 38-year-old Hungarian violinist, Sandor Feher.
His body was found in the wreck and identified by his mother, Hungary's foreign ministry said on Wednesday.
The search for survivors has been suspended, with officials saying there is a risk of the Costa Concordia sinking completely in rough seas.
Officials are hoping to begin salvage work soon, including pumping oil off the wreck. There are fears the vessel might slip into deeper water off the Tuscan coast.
A specialist team from a Dutch salvage company is preparing to pump more than 2,300 tonnes of fuel from the ship's 17 tanks.
Italian Environment Minister Corrado Clini said it should take about 10 days to pump all the fuel out of the ship, depending on the weather. He said if the fuel could not be contained the local environment was at risk.
"You can imagine. If we consider 2,400 tonnes of fuel, the damage could be terrible," he said.
Mr Clini said the government would declare a state of emergency later this week to release state funds to deal with any environmental problems.

[Dalton]

He also "tripped" and "fell into a lifeboat"[1]. He's like the anti-Sully. What kind of coward tries that hard to avoid responsibility for his fatal errors? Maybe he should run for political office.


[1] msnbc.com

[Isolder74]

I was about to post that article.

That reminds of how the owner of the White Star Line acted on the night the Titanic sank.

Hang him from the yard arm I say.

[Sky Captain]

Here is a recreation of Costa Concordia route before and after the first grounding based on AIS data
http://vimeo.com/35351659

It appears this fiasco did not end with huge loss of life only because current and wind pushed the ship back to shore where it came to rest on rocks and couldn't capsize and sink completely and many people were able to swim directly to shore. Had the wind or current be different direction likely result is Costa Concordia would have capsized and sunk in deep water which coupled with chaotic evacuation effort would led to massive loss of life.

[Wing Commander MAD]

Apparently Carnival is offerring the survivors 30% of future cruises as compensation. Not surprisingly, the passengers are not thrilled and there is talk of a class action lawsuit in the works. Also, the insuruance costs are apparently approaching one billion USD.

[folti78]

Apparently Carnival is offerring the survivors 30% of future cruises as compensation.

According to local news, they pester survivors daily, with calls about their well being too.

[Broomstick]

Sometimes you have a fuck-up so bad you just can't gloss over it no matter how much you try damage control.

[Darth Tanner]

Would not the actions of the captain and going off course without proper navigation or authorisation violate their insurance?

[CJvR]

Probably only if it was done with permission or explicit instructions from the company itself.

[Thanas]

German news radio is now reporting that there is a possibility that the cruise company might have ordered similar popularity stunts in the past.

[CJvR]

Some underwater pics late in this BBC video of hull plate left behind on the reef and folded up like a soft slice of cheese!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-16695140

[Beowulf]

Apparently Carnival is offerring the survivors 30% of future cruises as compensation.

According to local news, they pester survivors daily, with calls about their well being too.

I think it's better that they call every day, than they not have called at all. At least they're attempting to show they care about the survivors (even if they don't actually care).

[folti78]

Apparently Carnival is offerring the survivors 30% of future cruises as compensation.

According to local news, they pester survivors daily, with calls about their well being too.

I think it's better that they call every day, than they not have called at all. At least they're attempting to show they care about the survivors (even if they don't actually care).

Depends how they handling it. If they just cold call people every day, without opting out it just makes the victims' trauma worse. If they had done the usual thing of offering counsel services, with opt in, this wouldn't make any news.

[VarrusTheEthical]

So I just found a reconstruction of the time leading up to the disaster by a USCG Licensed Master Mariner. It shows what the ship was doing just before and just after it struck the rocks.