SDNW5 Map Discussion Thread

[Crossroads Inc.]

You know, is it just me or does the map seem crowded even without a large chunk of the people who are playing? Wasn't there 30 or so nations (counting the micronations)? That could become a problem depending on the remaining nations size (I know Arcadia and the SPACE VIKINGS aren't a problem being 8 sectors put together...)

Agreed, We may end up needing a much bigger map. Lord knows many of the spots I want get snatched.

[Simon_Jester]

I'll look into it after compiling the next map iteration over the weekend.

[White Haven]

Eh, at last call there still vast swathes of space unused...more than enough room to densen things up. Densen? Whatever. Anyway, nations nearly eyeball-to-eyeball can be good for tension and HIGH-STAKES DIPLOMANCY! My early-warning network can see your fleets massing, man, back off or I'll preemptively defend the shit out of you!

[Rabid]

Eh, at last call there still vast swathes of space unused...more than enough room to densen things up. Densen? Whatever. Anyway, nations nearly eyeball-to-eyeball can be good for tension and HIGH-STAKES DIPLOMANCY! My early-warning network can see your fleets massing, man, back off or I'll preemptively defend the shit out of you!

"Mang, I'm only preparing an attack against those fucking pirates in the Shoals. Chill the fuck out !"

[Simon_Jester]

Umerians:

"Yeah, antipiracy! Do you want to come along? We're handing out free jetpacks..."

[Rabid]

*Fleija, Captain of the DN[Doxa's Navy] Gently Backstabbing You Escort-Cruiser of the Terminus Sector Fleet*

"Fuck yeah we do ! Raiders make good target practice, and I've got to train my apprentice ; the kid only has twenty years of experience in active duty so far."

[Skywalker_T-65]

'Sure, why not, we could use the practice. After all, we have the SPACE VIKINGS to deal with too' (Arcadian)

'You're just asking to get yourself shot now...' (Furling)

[Simon_Jester]

Let's carry this over to commentary, okay?

[Imperial528]

Does anyone have issues with this placement?

[Skywalker_T-65]

I don't see a problem, though it does confirm my suspicion of the maps size (or lack thereof). It will be quite interesting once it starts though, with everyone clustered down there...

[Rabid]

It'd be cool if there was more people up there, cuz right now the Hub is a bit out of the way... :sadpanda:

[Simon_Jester]

Hm.

One: Charcoal gray is a bad color for a nation on a black map. I'll fix that in the next draft of the map.

Two: Cernans, you're a recent arrival from distant galactic space... but so are the Chamarrans. It seems a bit unlikely that you'd end up in almost the same place. They're coming from the next spiral arm out toward the rim; how about you coming in from the coreward side of the map and being near the 'top?'

Three: The Hub isn't as isolated as all that. Several nations placed themselves in that neighborhood since I made the last draft of the map a week ago. If I remake the map, it will look less desolate. Also, the Hub makes more sense as a trading nexus if it's actually some distance away from the nearest major powers- ships that reach the Hub have been traveling long enough it makes sense for them to stop there, and long enough that it makes sense to use the place as a trans-shipment point for goods. If there was a major power nestled right up against the Hub sector, then it would be hard to explain why the Hub hasn't been assimilated into that major power's control, and also hard to explain why the shipping traffic isn't stopping there. It makes it harder to answer the obvious question: "what's so special about the Hub, anyway?"

[Rabid]

"what's so special about the Hub, anyway?"

Some of the best shipyards in the Known Galaxy (new merchant ship fabrication / old ships repair & retrofitting), and the constant fabrication of new civilian hulls of good performances & fabrication at affordable prices ;
Thousands of years as a merchant "nation" in its own right, which allow merchants from the whole galaxy to use the place as a meeting ground - there's a permanent Fair on Cradle where business-people from the whole Known Galaxy showcase their latest products ;
And relatively few questions asked as to what exactly you are shipping through there - just the minimum to know if it risk damaging the harbor's installations.

A bit like a Space-Venice, in short.

[Imperial528]

I can switch it to a lighter gray, although it's your call color wise, I would just prefer a gray. And I think I will move it toward the top, that was my first choice but it seemed a bit isolated.

Also, while they are more recent arrivals then the older powers, they've been here for at least a few centuries. I haven't quite decided just how long, but it'd be more like "new, but the beginning is only remembered by the really old folks" instead of "Hey, remember when those guys showed up a few decades ago?" like it is with the Chammarans.

If anything the only reason why they would seem new is because outside of close neighbors they wouldn't have been really trying to contact anyone for a good chunk of their history.

How would this be:

[Simon_Jester]

"what's so special about the Hub, anyway?"

Some of the best shipyards in the Known Galaxy (new merchant ship fabrication / old ships repair & retrofitting), and the constant fabrication of new civilian hulls of good performances & fabrication at affordable prices ;
Thousands of years as a merchant "nation" in its own right, which allow merchants from the whole galaxy to use the place as a meeting ground - there's a permanent Fair on Cradle where business-people from the whole Known Galaxy showcase their latest products ;
And relatively few questions asked as to what exactly you are shipping through there - just the minimum to know if it risk damaging the harbor's installations.

A bit like a Space-Venice, in short.

Right, but the question is: why is the Hub where it is? Why is this specific place a sensible one for traders to stop, even if it's a little out of the shortest-path route to their destination?

People stopped in Venice to trade for specific reasons; Venice would not have become a major trading port if it didn't have a good location.

If there were competing major worlds near the Hub, it would detract from the Hub's status.

[Rabid]

Well, there's the theory that thousand and thousand of years back it was the commercial center of a vast Empire, which has faded away since then ; or that it was at the crossroad of vast empires which have fallen since then ? I dunno. Basically, I want to give the impression of a very old world, which may have seen brighter days sometime in its past, but which still maintain an important portion of its former glory.


If some people know the RPG "Fading Suns", my (really vague) inspiration for Cradle is Byzantium Secundus.


As to WHY do modern-day traders stop there... Well, I would see it in the same way as ports like Shangai or Hamburg : container ships unload containers, load containers, others ships load the previously unloaded containers after having unloaded their own, etc...
Sea-Trade these days use big ships, who travel on specific routes, and I'd tend to see Space-Trade doing the same : common goods don't go directly from point A to point B, they transit from place to place.
The Hub is a place where a good chunk of the Space-Trade routes in the Known Galaxy stops to load and unload goods.

[Simon_Jester]

Well, there's the theory that thousand and thousand of years back it was the commercial center of a vast Empire, which has faded away since then ; or that it was at the crossroad of vast empires which have fallen since then ? I dunno. Basically, I want to give the impression of a very old world, which may have seen brighter days sometime in its past, but which still maintain an important portion of its former glory.

Sure, I'm OK with that, though you may have to work out some of the details with our card-carrying elder races.

As to WHY do modern-day traders stop there... Well, I would see it in the same way as ports like Shangai or Hamburg : container ships unload containers, load containers, others ships load the previously unloaded containers after having unloaded their own, etc...
Sea-Trade these days use big ships, who travel on specific routes, and I'd tend to see Space-Trade doing the same : common goods don't go directly from point A to point B, they transit from place to place.
The Hub is a place where a good chunk of the Space-Trade routes in the Known Galaxy stops to load and unload goods.

Yes, this makes sense- but, that being the case, it really helps if it's a well-placed "container port" and the only such port within a long distance. If some major stellar nation made the investment to create a similar port a short distance away, it might threaten the Hub's primacy and status.

Which would be an interesting thing if we wanted to set it up, but I wouldn't think you'd want that imposed on you by default by, say, sticking a macronation capital sector right next door to the Hub.

[Skywalker_T-65]

Would I be one of said elder races? (or rather, the Furlings are)

If so, I'm perfectly fine with that view of the Hub.

[Force Lord]

I want my grid colors to be exactly the same as they were for SDNW4, that is, a dark hue of blue. No sense choosing black because the grids are black.

[Rabid]

I hope no one here is colorblind ?

[Force Lord]

You guys are...

*puts on Gay-Bans*

... seeing red.

YEEEEEEAAAAH

[Rabid]

Gay-Bans

Seriously, now ?

[Force Lord]

Gay-Bans

Seriously, now ?

Let me explain, in the previous game there were sunglasses named exactly like that. It's not my idea.

[Simon_Jester]

Shroom thought of it, Rabid. It wasn't an expression of homophobia, it was just arbitrarily sticking the syllable "gay" wherever it would fit.

I think it originally came up in the context of a rather homoerotic Battlestar Galactica parody.

I hope no one here is colorblind ?

If they are, I can devise a truly eye-searing grayscale map for them. But that's a low-order priority.

[Simon_Jester]

[delete please]