Teams of scientists using the Large Hadron Collider at the European Organization for Nuclear Research, or CERN, announced in Geneva this morning that they have detected evidence of a new subatomic particle that bears the hallmarks of the elusive and highly sought after Higgs boson. In layman's terms, the Higgs is referred to as the "God Particle" because the field it produces gives atoms its mass. Were it not for the Higgs, the world we know would be completely different — there would be no chemistry, no architecture, no us. It would be a massless mess of aimless particles running around at light speed.
CERN spokesman Joe Incandela said the scientists had observed a new particle, but he stopped short of saying it was indeed the Higgs boson. That is the likely conclusion.
"We have quite strong evidence that there's something there. Its properties are still going to take us a little bit of time," Incandela said in a video accidentally released on Tuesday by CERN. "This is the most massive such particle that exists, if we confirm all this, which I think we will ... It's something that may, in the end, be one of the biggest observations of any new phenomena in our field in the last 30 or 40 years, going way back to the discovery of quarks"
To make the observations, scientists at the LHC sent particles crashing at tremendous speeds to try to create Higgs. Then, because the particle only exists for a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second, scientists looked for its signature decay. The scientists said they had detected what are likely Higgs trails — a bump in their data — with a great degree of certainty.
The announcement is one of the biggest scientific breakthroughs in decades and could put the finishing touches on Standard Model particle physics.
So it decomposes into two photons and then four leptons, and it's at the predicted place... Very exciting. When I was watching the livecast, the applause was a little bit contagious.
Are you accusing me of not having a viable magnetic field? - Masaq' Hub, Look to Windward
So...If we can find a way to FUCK with the Higgs Boson...
JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up
It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small. - NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11
Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.
MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
PeZook wrote:So...If we can find a way to FUCK with the Higgs Boson...
That's human kind for you. When a new discovery is made the first thing we do is find ways to have sex with it.
It has become clear to me in the previous days that any attempts at reconciliation and explanation with the community here has failed. I have tried my best. I really have. I pored my heart out trying. But it was all for nothing.
You win. There, I have said it.
Now there is only one thing left to do. Let us see if I can sum up the strength needed to end things once and for all.
Yeah, yeah, I know - discovery and knowledge about the universe, but seriously. If mass is actually caused by particle interactions...then we can, potentially, maybe someday...mess with mass.
JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up
It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small. - NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11
Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.
MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
Yeah, yeah, I know - discovery and knowledge about the universe, but seriously. If mass is actually caused by particle interactions...then we can, potentially, maybe someday...mess with mass.
You mean..mass effect? You know someone was going to go there eventually.
Never underestimate the ingenuity and cruelty of the Irish.
Now naturally, that fucking with it is out of the question, standard human question #2.
How can we stop the foreigners from having these elemental particles and turning them into a destructive new weapon? We cannot allow, a boson gap!
Joking aside, awesome. Glad they finally got it to work this time, since it was going to be a sort of last-chance at experimentally confirming the existence of the Higgs. Otherwise, their required power estimates would be off by so much, that it'd require a collider of 10 times the diameter, which is... well. Absurd, given the LHC's already massive size.
PeZook wrote:So...If we can find a way to FUCK with the Higgs Boson...
Mass Erect?
I'd wager it's already a porn movie by now, with neon signs and a lot of blue paint, and concerns itself with the Higgs bosom and not the boson, but nice try.
Nephtys wrote:Joking aside, awesome. Glad they finally got it to work this time, since it was going to be a sort of last-chance at experimentally confirming the existence of the Higgs. Otherwise, their required power estimates would be off by so much, that it'd require a collider of 10 times the diameter, which is... well. Absurd, given the LHC's already massive size.
Too bad the SSC never got built...
I do wonder though, how much would the necessary computing infrastructure have cost in the 90s? Lots, probably.
As for what we can do with it -- well, hopefully it turns out weirder than we thought.
Dr. Trainwreck wrote:
Chirios wrote:
PeZook wrote:So...If we can find a way to FUCK with the Higgs Boson...
Mass Erect?
I'd wager it's already a porn movie by now, with neon signs and a lot of blue paint, and concerns itself with the Higgs bosom and not the boson, but nice try.
What, no "element ten inches"?
Are you accusing me of not having a viable magnetic field? - Masaq' Hub, Look to Windward
For the interested, there's a $1000000 prize for whomever can make sense of the "mathematics" they use.
A Government founded upon justice, and recognizing the equal rights of all men; claiming higher authority for existence, or sanction for its laws, that nature, reason, and the regularly ascertained will of the people; steadily refusing to put its sword and purse in the service of any religious creed or family is a standing offense to most of the Governments of the world, and to some narrow and bigoted people among ourselves.
Memnon wrote:Too bad the SSC never got built...
I do wonder though, how much would the necessary computing infrastructure have cost in the 90s? Lots, probably.
A lot, but SSC was designed for lower luminosity and might not haven needed quite as much compute power. LHC, designed in competition against the SSC and with a smaller tunnel, went for a lower-energy/higher-luminosity design.
Nephtys wrote:Glad they finally got it to work this time, since it was going to be a sort of last-chance at experimentally confirming the existence of the Higgs. Otherwise, their required power estimates would be off by so much, that it'd require a collider of 10 times the diameter, which is... well. Absurd, given the LHC's already massive size.
I dont' see how it was a "last-chance" - Higgs is pretty much right where a bunch of people expected it (assuming it fit the Standard Model).
The ship disintegrates into individual particles all moving at light speed in random directions?
JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up
It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small. - NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11
Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.
MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
Well if we managed that we'd never have to worry about alien invasions.
Baltar: "I don't want to miss a moment of the last Battlestar's destruction!"
Centurion: "Sir, I really think you should look at the other Battlestar."
Baltar: "What are you babbling about other...it's impossible!"
Centurion: "No. It is a Battlestar."
Corrax Entry 7:17: So you walk eternally through the shadow realms, standing against evil where all others falter. May your thirst for retribution never quench, may the blood on your sword never dry, and may we never need you again.
Solauren wrote:Question: If the Higgs Boson is confirmed, and is is what imparts most mass to the universe....
What would happen if we found a way to repel, or shield against them in matter? i.e
"Zap! This ship no longer has mass!"
That's not how bosons work, really. Bosons are the particles that mediate interactions with fields. Higgs bosons serve the same purpose as photons- they mediate the interaction between massive particles and the Higgs field. So if we found a way to decouple massive particles from the Higgs field, they would instantaneously accelerate to the speed of light while maintaining the same direction of velocity. Not particularly useful unless you have a fetish for strange and unusual explosions.
If we could alter coupling with the Higgs field, and thus affect the mass of fundamental particles- well, for one thing, we would probably end up messing with chemistry as the responsiveness of particles to electromagnetic forces would increase with less mass and decrease with more mass. So if we altered the coupling around a human body, it would probably end up dying and melting into a series of bizarre molecules as the very nature of electrochemical bonding was fundamentally altered. Again, not particularly useful, unless you have an even weirder set of fetishes.
Invited by the new age, the elegant Sailor Neptune!
I mean, how often am I to enter a game of riddles with the author, where they challenge me with some strange and confusing and distracting device, and I'm supposed to unravel it and go "I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE" and take great personal satisfaction and pride in our mutual cleverness?
Memnon wrote:Too bad the SSC never got built...
I do wonder though, how much would the necessary computing infrastructure have cost in the 90s? Lots, probably.
A lot, but SSC was designed for lower luminosity and might not haven needed quite as much compute power. LHC, designed in competition against the SSC and with a smaller tunnel, went for a lower-energy/higher-luminosity design.
Plus, advancing technology makes increased luminosity easier- you can upgrade the same accelerator to run at higher luminosity if you're clever. So the SSC would probably be better now than it was designed to be in 1990.
Bakustra wrote:
If we could alter coupling with the Higgs field, and thus affect the mass of fundamental particles- well, for one thing, we would probably end up messing with chemistry as the responsiveness of particles to electromagnetic forces would increase with less mass and decrease with more mass. So if we altered the coupling around a human body, it would probably end up dying and melting into a series of bizarre molecules as the very nature of electrochemical bonding was fundamentally altered. Again, not particularly useful, unless you have an even weirder set of fetishes.
Or we could perhaps produce bizarre materials with as of yet unknown, but highly interesting properties
JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up
It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small. - NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11
Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.
MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
Sarevok wrote:So what does it mean in terms of practical use ? Mass effect fields and FTL are possible ?
Is this a 'for real' question, or a 'whoa, I typed that' question?
They've been narrowing down the area this effect could be observed in for years, but its still good they're getting somewhere. Its a bit of a shame that media reporting is so ignorant and full of shit, though.
Bakustra wrote:So if we found a way to decouple massive particles from the Higgs field, they would instantaneously accelerate to the speed of light while maintaining the same direction of velocity. Not particularly useful unless you have a fetish for strange and unusual explosions.
Looks are unimportant. What would be the effects of this as a bomb? Yeld approximations (assuming you managed to decouple 100% particles)?
Yes, standard human question #3. How useful would this be to blow up something I hate?
I'm nobody. Nobody at all. But the secrets of the universe don't mind. They reveal themselves to nobodies who care. -- Stereotypical spacecraft are pressurized. Less realistic spacecraft are pressurized to hold breathing atmosphere. Realistic spacecraft are pressurized because they are flying propellant tanks. -Isaac Kuo -- Good art has function as well as form. I hesitate to spend more than $50 on decorations of any kind unless they can be used to pummel an intruder into submission. -Sriad
Go outside and get some fresh air. Meditate on the world for a little while, and I think that you will soon see the true answer to the question.
Invited by the new age, the elegant Sailor Neptune!
I mean, how often am I to enter a game of riddles with the author, where they challenge me with some strange and confusing and distracting device, and I'm supposed to unravel it and go "I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE" and take great personal satisfaction and pride in our mutual cleverness?
As far as I am aware, the only thing you could possibly do is reduce or increase mass, and that's just judging it from the whole "gives mass" part. I have no idea if it is plausible (or even possible) to manipulate the Higgs boson in such a manner, but I'm betting it's extremely implausible.
No kinetic barriers or such things, just making things heavier or lighter (read: more or less mass), if it's possible at all and even if it is, then you'd have to find a way to prevent adverse reactions, such as those already mentioned in the thread.
That's human kind for you. When a new discovery is made the first thing we do is find ways to have sex with it.
