Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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fordlltwm
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Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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From CNN


http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/2 ... ?hpt=hp_t3
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EXCLUSIVE: Iran in "open war" with Israel

By Elise Labott and Michael Schwartz

Iran is in an "open war" with Israel, President Shimon Peres said Monday, as he pointed the finger at Iran and Hezbollah for last week's bombing in Bulgaria that killed five Israelis.

In an exclusive interview with CNN, Peres said Israel will act to prevent further attacks.

Peres said Israel has "enough" hard intelligence to link the Bulgaria attack to Iran and its proxy Hezbollah, and believes more attacks are being planned as part of what he called an "open war against Israel."

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said that Iran and the Lebanon-based Hezbollah movement were responsible for a number of attacks and attempted attacks against Israeli targets in Thailand, Georgia, India, Greece, Cyprus and other countries.

Asked whether the Bulgaria bombing and the other attempted attacks were revenge for the assassination of Iranian nuclear scientists, which Iran blames on Israel, Peres said that Israel has never claimed responsibility for the killings. But he noted that Israel has a right to prevent the killing of its citizens.

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We don't have an initiative of terror," Peres said. "We don't do it. But self-defense is the right and the must of every people."

He said Israel's policy is one of "prevention," rather than "retaliation."

"If you have enough information about a certain person which is a ticking clock that can explode a bomb that can endanger civilian life, clearly you have to prevent him from doing so," Peres said. He cited reports that the United States has killed as many as 3,000 people in drone strikes aimed at terrorist enclaves.

With neighboring Syria in a spiral of violence, Peres said Israel will be forced to seize Syria's chemical weapons if there is a risk President Bashar al-Assad would use them against Israel or that the arsenal could fall into terrorist hands.

RECOMMENDED: U.S. talking to Israel, others about Syria's chemical weapons

Over the weekend, Defense Minister Ehud Barak said he ordered the military to prepare contingency plans to attack Syria's chemical weapons arsenals, should the need arise.

"The use of chemical weapons is internationally forbidden ... and what do you do when somebody violates the law? You fight against it," Peres said. "You stop them. We shall not remain indifferent and tell them, 'Do what you want.'"

Asked how far Israel would go to secure Syria's chemical arsenal, Peres simply said: "Until it will stop being a danger."

The conflict in Syria has already led to nearly 80,000 Syrians fleeing to neighboring Jordan, Lebanon, Turkey and Iraq, according to U.N. relief agencies. So far, none have sought refuge in Israel - and Peres said Israel wants to keep control of its borders amid the crisis wracking its longtime foe.

"What will happen if Syrian refugees try to cross the Israeli border? Will you help them?" CNN asked Peres.

"No," he replied.

"Will you shoot them?"

"We will prevent them. I mean, you don't go straight to the rifle. There are other means to prevent them. We should prevent it. Because it will be a double tragedy for them and for us. They will become homeless and we shall become defenseless."

"If the Syrians start to come over the border, will you stop them by force?"

"First of all, until now none of them asked to come in," Peres said. "If they will come by force, we shall stop them by force. If they shall come in without force, we shall stop them the way any country defended her border with civilian means."

When CNN noted that the potential refugees are trying to escape bloodshed in their own country, not invade Israel, Peres said, "If they want to escape, they first of all have to appeal, ask for permission. None of them did it."

With Israel facing a potential influx of refugees, Peres said although no Syrians have tried to enter the country, Israel would not help any refugees who want to cross the border and would use force against any armed individuals.

"If they will come by force, we shall stop them by force," Peres said. "If they shall come in without force, we shall stop them the way any country defended her border with civilian means."

Peres spoke a day after Israel marked the 40th anniversary of the 1972 Olympic Games in Munich, Germany, where 11 Israeli athletes and coaches were killed.

While he wouldn't go into details, Peres said Israel was taking precautions to ensure Israeli athletes would not be targeted at the London Olympic Games, which start later this week. He argued, however, that if Israeli intelligence services been at Munich, they would probably have been able to prevent the attack.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Now is this just meaningless posturing or is Israel calling on America to begin launching strikes on Iranian interest and asking for permission to use Iraq airbases to launch attacks on Iran?

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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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It's Israel engaging in its usual saber rattling and trying to play up the innocent victim card for the foreign press. Best to ignore it as the self-aggrandizing blowhard propaganda it is.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

Post by Sea Skimmer »

If it was open war they'd go and sink or seize that Iranian freighter full of weapons for Syria waiting to pass through the Suez Canal as soon as it enters the Mediterranean. Maybe they will.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Straha wrote:It's Israel engaging in its usual saber rattling and trying to play up the innocent victim card for the foreign press. Best to ignore it as the self-aggrandizing blowhard propaganda it is.
Indeed. There are public sources in the news media, the ones in the West that usually always support Israel, with quotes from US intelligence sources that say Israel is bankrolling the terrorist organization that carried out the assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists.

"We don't have an initiative on terror" my ass. It's just the usual load of bollocks that has no factual weight whatsoever.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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I find it strange that a country that was founded in large parts thanks to terrorism against the british and others (Stern gang etc) tries to claim not to have an initiative on terrorism?
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Spoonist wrote:I find it strange that a country that was founded in large parts thanks to terrorism against the british and others (Stern gang etc) tries to claim not to have an initiative on terrorism?
You do? OF COURSE they're claiming that. Nobody sane is going to go "Yeah we'll totally fuck up their shit with terror attacks.", especially when they have been playing up the rocket and bomb attacks against innocent civilians.

It's the same principle why the US doesn't subjugate countries, it goes to war to defend freedom ;)
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Spoonist wrote:I find it strange that a country that was founded in large parts thanks to terrorism against the british and others (Stern gang etc) tries to claim not to have an initiative on terrorism?
Why is that strange? It's been over sixty years. Some countries do stop using terror tactics eventually, you know.

It would be ridiculous to say "your grandfather's revolutionaries shot 'enemies of the people' in their beds, so that means you must too!"

I'm not saying Israel has renounced terrorism, or done any particular thing at all, I don't even want to get into that. But I'm looking at you calling this 'strange.' And is it truly strange? Would the world somehow be an unlikely or confusing place if Israel, say, genuinely did not sponsor terrorism and said so? I think that would seem perfectly natural to us, if it were true.

So I don't understand where you're coming from with this.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Simon_Jester wrote:Some countries do stop using terror tactics eventually, you know.
Which ones? The only ones who do tend to do so because they have gotten their teeth kicked in and try not to provoke others anymore.
Simon_Jester wrote:Would the world somehow be an unlikely or confusing place if Israel, say, genuinely did not sponsor terrorism and said so?
Yes? Their entire raison d'être is "we are surrounded by enemies and have to do a lot of horrible things to stop them from attacking us and to take revenge".
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Huh, Simon?

Its always strange with historical revisionism. I find the historical revisionism of Japan, Russia, Turkey (and to some degree most western countries) to be strange as well. Why wouldn't it be in this case?

If you are speaking of a nation, then you kinda have to take that nations past into the equation.

If they would say "Israel doesn't do terrorism anymore" that is OK, then you take history into account.

If your family fortune came from a grandad who was a mobster, then I would find it equally strange if you claimed "only bad families do crime, mine is good family" regardless of whether your family currently aren't mobsters.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

Post by eyl »

Spoonist wrote:Huh, Simon?

Its always strange with historical revisionism. I find the historical revisionism of Japan, Russia, Turkey (and to some degree most western countries) to be strange as well. Why wouldn't it be in this case?

If you are speaking of a nation, then you kinda have to take that nations past into the equation.

If they would say "Israel doesn't do terrorism anymore" that is OK, then you take history into account.

If your family fortune came from a grandad who was a mobster, then I would find it equally strange if you claimed "only bad families do crime, mine is good family" regardless of whether your family currently aren't mobsters.
Yeah, but the statements here are more in the line of "your grandfather was a criminal, so it's strange you're complaining about crime"
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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The analogy however is very apt when the grandfather, his son and his grandchildren all continously engage in criminal activities.

It is not as if Israel has not used state-employed terrorism or terrorist methods all throughout its existence.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

Post by PeZook »

Thanas wrote:The analogy however is very apt when the grandfather, his son and his grandchildren all continously engage in criminal activities.

It is not as if Israel has not used state-employed terrorism or terrorist methods all throughout its existence.
Yeah, but none of them will ever ADMIT to running a criminal family if they're trying to get themselves elected president :)

Maybe I'm just too cynical, but playing the victim card (and thus glossing over any evil acts you do) seems like something out of the common political playbook, rather than anything strange.
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Re: Iran Vs Israel this time it's "open"

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Asked whether the Bulgaria bombing and the other attempted attacks were revenge for the assassination of Iranian nuclear scientists, which Iran blames on Israel, Peres said that Israel has never claimed responsibility for the killings. But he noted that Israel has a right to prevent the killing of its citizens.
Square deal, Israeli dude. It's only fun when it's consentual, something that Isreal and its allies don't seem to understand.

It's weird that when "we" do it, it's justified and necessary, but when "they" do it then it is barbaric bloodthirst. Oh, politics.
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