Do Souls Exist?

[UltraViolence83]

Then this connection must also expand to the casual observers in the same area. Of course, there is much power in the mind of the loved one. A return to the death site of one's spouse could cause fainting due to the horrible memories.

[Zoink]

The smoke doesn't need to have a "soul." Most theories on paranormal activity suggest that scents are emotional connections related to the person in question and manifest as s/he appears as a ghost.

I beg your pardon now, as I am currently endeavoring to open a portal to/from Hell.

*mumbles mantra*

But what is the mechanism for manifesting specific emotional/sensory responses? How does a soul activate specific nerve receptors or create specific brain patterns? Especially since the "soul" did not have the knowledge or ability to do the same in life. The soul would need to be suddenly bestowed with this innate ability/knowledge upon death. To rationalize this, you need to pile assumption on assumption, and that's where Occam's Razor comes in the picture.

...and keep that hell portal closed! Didn't you watch those 80s horror movies! You'll let the ghoulies in!

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

The smoke doesn't need to have a "soul." Most theories on paranormal activity suggest that scents are emotional connections related to the person in question and manifest as s/he appears as a ghost.

I beg your pardon now, as I am currently endeavoring to open a portal to/from Hell.

*mumbles mantra*

But what is the mechanism for manifesting specific emotional/sensory responses? How does a soul activate specific nerve receptors or create specific brain patterns? Especially since the "soul" did not have the knowledge or ability to do the same in life. The soul would need to be suddenly bestowed with this innate ability/knowledge upon death. To rationalize this, you need to pile assumption on assumption, and that's where Occam's Razor comes in the picture.

Not necessarily. Have you ever tried to meditate? The reason I ask is that, for most people, meditating is pretty fucking difficult. The body just keeps getting in the way of the mind, and the mind gets in the way of the spirit. Once the body is gone, and the mind with it, the spirit may have abilities that just can't be experienced amid all the interference presented by these meat-puppets we walk around in.

In a nutshell: We don't gain these abilities when we die; we already have them. But when we die, the obstacle of the flesh is removed, allowing us to use these abilities. I'm sure Occam's Razor is satisfied by this explanation.

[Zoink]

Not necessarily. Have you ever tried to meditate?

Actually I have. Self hypnosis. Its really hard, very easy to be distracted , even by your own thoughts. In mediation the goal is to lower activity in parts of the brain that control your definition of "self", enabling you to have experiences "out-of-body", or are somehow connected to the universe. I have never reached *such* a state myself, but supposidly the quick way is to target these brain areas with a jolt of electricity (some doctors have done this experiment, think there are some threads on this)

In a nutshell: We don't gain these abilities when we die; we already have them. But when we die, the obstacle of the flesh is removed, allowing us to use these abilities. I'm sure Occam's Razor is satisfied by this explanation.

So when you meditate you have the ability to activate specific nerve sensors in other people? It maybe be an explanation, but it doesn't satisfy Occam's razor because its an unfounded assumption.

For Occam's Razor you want to minimize the assumptions, so that's why I would suggested looking into triggered memory (maybe emotions, or maybe a similar odour is trigggering this reaction, or as DW said: absorbed smoke) or medical reasons.

The reason being: we know these things exist, the only assumption is that these things are present. If multiple people have experienced this, then I would probably look at the possibility of similar odours, or absorbed odours, as this would be the easiest explanation.

In the case of ghostly explanations: we have to assume (1) the existance of life after death, (2) existance of ghostly abilities, and the (3) fact that these things are present in this situation.

Occam's Razor doesn't tell you which one is right, just which is mostly likely right, and thus, which you should investigate first.

The problem with this type of situation is because of the emotions involved, people tend to jump over (or give little thought) to the easier explanations, and latch onto the one they *want* to be true. I know that my co-worker is convinced that her brother (semi truck driver, was murdered a year ago while he slept) is watching everything she does. She couldn't handle the situation if she thought any different. I know enough not even to bring up the subject however (just nod my head) because its a downright sad situation, and this is how she is dealing with it.

[LadyTevar]

I'm not the only one to have smelled the pipe smoke either. . . my mom, both my brothers, and even my sister-in-law, who joined the family *after* my dad quit smoking. None have epilepsy, and only my mother has been on Prozac fr depression.

Please do not interpret this as insensitivity, but I have three questions:

1. Has anyone ever lived in the house who smoked? Cigarette and pipe smoke can infiltrate the materials of a house to the extent that it's almost impossible to extract them, and faint odours can remain through multiple subsequent homeowners.
2. How can you be sure that none of the people who smell this odour are aware of the fact that he smoked before his death?
3. Even if he had a soul, why would the cigarette smoke persist after his death? Did his pipe tobacco have an immortal soul too?

1) It's pipe smoke, not cigarette smoke. Entirely different smell. And all smokers, cigarette or pipe, had a thirty-year standing invitation to take it outside, and not in the house. (the house belonged to my maternal grandmother before my parents bought it from the estate) Now, his truck still smells like his pipe too, but that's because he was always smoking in it.

2) We all knew he smoked, it was something he'd done for 30-40 years. I have pictures of myself as a 2 year old with his (unlit) pipe in my mouth, trying to be like daddy.

3) That I have no answer to. His tobacco was given away to other pipe-smoking friends, so it's not in the house to be lit... but it was just part of him.

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

In a nutshell: We don't gain these abilities when we die; we already have them. But when we die, the obstacle of the flesh is removed, allowing us to use these abilities. I'm sure Occam's Razor is satisfied by this explanation.

So when you meditate you have the ability to activate specific nerve sensors in other people?

No. Meditation was being used as an example of how not only the physical body but the biochemical limitations of the mind are obstacles to the abilities of the spirit. Let's try it a different way. Imagine that your "soul" is a gun. Your "mind" is a sealed, locked case in which the gun is hidden. And your "body" is a 250 foot thick shell of Silly Putty encircling both.

Your soul may be evident inside the shell, but the shell restricts your soul's natural abilities. Do you see the equation I'm trying to make here? Does it make at least some twisted kind of sense?

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

I'm not sure if the soul and ghosts are the same thing. One is the essence... the other is just residue.

[UltraViolence83]

RDJ: Many metaphysical theories I've read about the subject suggest that your body helps you, since it's alive, nevermind an important part of you. The prevalent uh...life energy (out of a lack for a better term) is generated by your body, giving you uh...power. And since you need to train yourself to do those things (like meditating), it's a learned ability, not something completely natural to most people. After all, as a living thing can't you do more than some crummy old ghost/spirit? And I see ghosts, the kind that only do repetitive things over and over again, as residue, and the kind that actually seem to be able to move around and communicate I see as "souls," though they could be other...things...

I should probably come out and say it now: I'm an Occultist.
Phew. That was hard, like if I was coming out of the closet. (I'm NOT gay!)

*Ignores Zoink's plea, opens portal to Hell*

Hmm...shouldn't have done that...*Horrible scream*

[ArmorPierce]

Hmm..., I'm suprised..., lots of people that believes in souls but hates religion. Yeah, life is meaningless, just try to enjoy it the best you could.