Top 5 technologies to use against the Empire

[Velthuijsen]

What top 5 technologies seen in ST movies and shows would even the fight against the Empire the most (genesis bombs, transwarp etc)?

Never mind if it is 'lost' tech or not.

Transporters and holoprojector technology.
There have to be considerations why those are not used in the way I'm proposing otherwise I'd be astounded that such commonsense applications of those technologies have not been done.

1) Transporters

Transporters don't require a lot of energy (compared to the amount of energy they move). This can be extrapolated from Nemesis. In Nemesis the warpcore is offline, and they have only 4% of normal powergeneration (after everything needed to keep the ship operating is taken into account) left. Still that is enough to initiate a transportation of Picard from the bridge of the Scimitar. This is the upper limit needed to transport about 80kg of mass. The lower limit would be really insignificant as that would assume that an entire transporter including a form of power generation or storage would be stuck in the emergency transporter thingie.
Using the 20 GW figure derived from the reasoning that a federation ship needs around so much power to achieve warp 1 and they can't do that without a warpcore it means that at most 0.8 GW is available (and seeing that they need to power lifesupport and such on it less) to pump into the transporter.
With that amount of power they can move terrajoules (if picard mass is 80Kg, around 7.2TJ)

Given these numbers why isn't the Federation using transporters to power their ships, seeing that this is almost near 100% conversion efficiency compared to all the energy that has to be diverted to keep a m/a-m reaction under control and safe to be next to.

From the episode where Picard beams himself out in the form of energy we can conclude that a transporter just takes the energy stored by converting mass and project it into a pattern (usually the pattern of the mass converted earlier but that is not a rigid rule).

The result is a weapon capable of projecting terajoules of energy, in any direction from a point of origin that lies in a globe that has a radius of about 30 000 Km.
Note: I use Joules because the amount of power a transporter can provide depends on the speed of the conversion (does it take 1/10 a second? does it take 10 seconds?)


I got to go now, if people are still interested I'll go after the holoprojector technology later.

[Darth Servo]

Transporters and holoprojector technology.

1) Transporters are useless against a shielded ship.
2) Exactly how would holoprojector technology be useful in a fight against ships with advanced sensor technology that can distinguish between holograms and real objects?

With that amount of power they can move terrajoules (if picard mass is 80Kg, around 7.2TJ)

Given these numbers why isn't the Federation using transporters to power their ships, seeing that this is almost near 100% conversion efficiency compared to all the energy that has to be diverted to keep a m/a-m reaction under control and safe to be next to.

Because transporters CONSUME power, not generate it.

The result is a weapon capable of projecting terajoules of energy, in any direction from a point of origin that lies in a globe that has a radius of about 30 000 Km.

To bad for you that the upper limit figure you came up with (7.2TJ) won't even scratch a SW cap ship's shields.

I got to go now, if people are still interested I'll go after the holoprojector technology later.

I'd be very interested to see what kind of battle plan you come up with for this one.

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

Just my two cents as a new guy...

Mobility: According to the ST TNG: TM the Ent-D has an acceleration of up to 10,000 m/sec². This is not poor or great compared to what we see SW vessels doing in the movies, so relatively even as is when dealing with sublight. At FTL, the Federation can alter course while in warp, but their warp is much slower. Their only attempts at transwarp failed.

Not sure precisely what you're trying to say here, but mobility is indeed crucial. I would implement faster, more efficient IDF systems and new ship designs centered around the idea of multiple target engagement. I would then set the navigation and helm systems in such a way that Reaction-Control thrusters do not restrict the ship's movements to the "WWII Fighter Plane" style of flight, but allow for inertial drift to assist in dogfights.

WMD: For the Federation to use such would be to ignore the very foundation of the entire organization.

Sorry, but that's crap -- ideals are usually the first thing to disappear when the survival of your way of life is at stake.

It would take the Empire destroying a world, etc., which would force their hand. The only thing the Federation could do would be to attack systems the Empire would be using as staging areas, since warp is hopeless as to try moving from the Milky Way to the SW galaxy.

Industry: Even with industrial replicators, the Federation's 150 worlds could not match the millions of worlds of the Empire when it comes to industrial capacity. Coruscant alone has enough industry for several worlds.

Durability: The Federation would have to build an entirely new class of ship with many times more shiled generators in place along with much thicker hulls to even attempt to compare, but it would still be a losing battle. Like the Israelis do with tanks, the UFP would be better off designing ships to last as long as possible but allowing people to escape to fight another day.

Firepower: The Federation's phasers are only 4.8-5.1 MW for the top of the line, but they do a lot of damage to physical matter as long as it is not too dense. Photon torpedoes can also be good weapons against hulls, but against shileds they are lacking. The one hope would be to use cloaking devices to get the first hits in during most battles and then run. This would only work until CGT sensors came into use to counter such attack tactics.

Conclusions: The Federation's starships have fairly equal sublight speeds, but that's it. When it comes to industry, durability and weaponry, the Empire wins out on all counts. The Federation, Klingons, Romulans, Cardassians, Breen, etc., etc., could all band together and still not be able to match the millions of worlds of the Empire. The Star Trek races cannot even reach the Empire's main holdings, so that is a moot point. Empire wins out.

You're forgetting that we can use even "one-hit wonders" here. And may I presume that that includes "Endgame" tech? Nemesis having dropped the batmobile armor and transphasic torpedoes, I think they now qualify as "WWNSIA" ordinance. lol

[Velthuijsen]

Transporters and holoprojector technology.

1) Transporters are useless against a shielded ship.
2) Exactly how would holoprojector technology be useful in a fight against ships with advanced sensor technology that can distinguish between holograms and real objects?

1) Never intended to use them to zap something into a shielded space.
2) Then please explain what the difference is between a holodeck bullet (the holodeck has the don't kill recreators safety off) and a real bullet.

With that amount of power they can move terrajoules (if picard mass is 80Kg, around 7.2TJ)
Given these numbers why isn't the Federation using transporters to power their ships, seeing that this is almost near 100% conversion efficiency compared to all the energy that has to be diverted to keep a m/a-m reaction under control and safe to be next to.

Because transporters CONSUME power, not generate it.

Hmm, I just point out that (using the stardestroyer.net assumptions on powergeneration in Federation ships) it costs them at the most 0.8 GJ/s to get 7.2TJ energy back. So to make this cost more energy then it brings in that transporter would need 9 million seconds to convert 80Kg of mass into energy. Even if we'd use the full 20GJ/s it would still take 360 000 seconds before the gains would outweigh the costs.

Please point out errors in my calculations, the assumptions I based my calculations on or bring in some other evidence about why I am wrong, just don't make unsubstantiated claims.

The result is a weapon capable of projecting terajoules of energy, in any direction from a point of origin that lies in a globe that has a radius of about 30 000 Km.

To bad for you that the upper limit figure you came up with (7.2TJ) won't even scratch a SW cap ship's shields.

Not nice, not nice at all.
Trying to put words in my mouth.
You DO know that you just about ignored every Star Trek movie and episode where they moved more then 80Kg of mass by trying to make it look like I am claiming that that is the upper a limit to a transporters capacity is 80Kg which I didn't. I only used the transportation of Picard (which I put at a guestimated 80Kg of weight) to show the amount of energy the system can generate.

[SirNitram]

You're a bit stupid, aren't you? That 7.2TJ isn't appearing or disappearing: It's coming from Picard's body. There's some lost in the transfer, of course, but the reactor, which generates a few TW at least, can pick up some slack. That's where the consumption of power comes from.. Not to mention the displays, compensating for differences in potential energy, the sensors.. Are you really this stupid?

[Darth Servo]

1) Transporters are useless against a shielded ship.
2) Exactly how would holoprojector technology be useful in a fight against ships with advanced sensor technology that can distinguish between holograms and real objects?

1) Never intended to use them to zap something into a shielded space.

Ah, yes, you think they can get 0.8 GJ/s to get 7.2TJ energy back. Where does this energy come from? Energy from no where? Nice violation of conservation of energy.

2) Then please explain what the difference is between a holodeck bullet (the holodeck has the don't kill recreators safety off) and a real bullet.

Who cares? You still haven't shown how Fed holograms would be useful in a fight, in spite of your promise to do so. And Fed holograms don't work outside the confined area of the holodeck.

Hmm, I just point out that (using the stardestroyer.net assumptions on powergeneration in Federation ships) it costs them at the most 0.8 GJ/s to get 7.2TJ energy back.

They DON'T get 7.2 TJ back. Beaming Picard away from one ship to another produces a change of precisely ZERO joules of energy.

So to make this cost more energy then it brings in that transporter would need 9 million seconds to convert 80Kg of mass into energy. Even if we'd use the full 20GJ/s it would still take 360 000 seconds before the gains would outweigh the costs.

Where did these numbers come from again?

just don't make unsubstantiated claims.

What unsubstantiated claims?

The result is a weapon capable of projecting terajoules of energy, in any direction from a point of origin that lies in a globe that has a radius of about 30 000 Km.

To bad for you that the upper limit figure you came up with (7.2TJ) won't even scratch a SW cap ship's shields.

Not nice, not nice at all. Trying to put words in my mouth.

I simply quoted your own figure. I thought I was being quite civil. Even if your conclusion is right and we scale the energy figure up by a dozen orders of magnitude, that still won't scratch SW cap ship shields

You DO know that you just about ignored every Star Trek movie and episode where they moved more then 80Kg of mass by trying to make it look like I am claiming that that is the upper a limit to a transporters capacity is 80Kg which I didn't. I only used the transportation of Picard (which I put at a guestimated 80Kg of weight) to show the amount of energy the system can generate.

The most a transporter has handeled was in ST4 beaming a couple of whales and the surrounding water. The effort was a TREMENDOUS strain on the ship AND it only elevated them by a few dozen meters.

Name ONE episode where the Feds transported something significantly larger than a person and the warp core was off line like it was in Nemesis, which is the whole center of your argument. You can't use an extraordinary case like Nemesis to "prove" that Transporters some how magically generate 7.2TJ per 80kg object everytime they transport something. Do you know what a hasty generalization fallacy is?

Maybe the reason they don't use it as a weapon is because your analysis is logically invalid.

[Velthuijsen]

SirNitram please no attacks on the person.

In Nemesis there is a single hit on the area that houses the warp core.
The protective field around the warp core (which probably prevented it go go critical as is normal for warpcores that get hit) goes down and at the same time they lose the ability to sustain warp flight. For me that was a good indication of them losing the energy generation of the warp core.

As is pointed out on the website this forum is attached to the remaining powergeneration cannot exceed the limit needed to get to warp 1

Before I forget in that scene they also say that after you take into account the lifesupport they have only enough energy generation left to go to 4% of full impulse, further limiting the amount of energy available

This means that an absolute upperlimit to the power needed to activate a transporter is 20 GJ/s and probably a much lower limit (guess how I got to 0.8 GW)

Next time please substantiate your claims of terajoules of power please.

Also why are you trying to claim that I want to generate 7.2TJ out of nothing. If you can convert mass into energy (as they have done in the past with a transporter) why not keep that energy in the system instead of projecting it out again?

[SirNitram]

SirNitram please no attacks on the person.

Thin skinned? I'm sorry, ignoring CoE and logic makes you stupid. So I will call you such. If you feel this is somehow unfair, feel free to run off crying, but it will not make your argument any more valid.

In Nemesis there is a single hit on the area that houses the warp core.
The protective field around the warp core (which probably prevented it go go critical as is normal for warpcores that get hit) goes down and at the same time they lose the ability to sustain warp flight. For me that was a good indication of them losing the energy generation of the warp core.

No, it's an indication they can no longer go to Warp due to damage. Leaping in logic to full power loss is stupid, not to mention there is no reason the backups can't power the transporters.

As is pointed out on the website this forum is attached to the remaining powergeneration cannot exceed the limit needed to get to warp 1

Which is an unknown and might be a hundred times that required to transport.

Before I forget in that scene they also say that after you take into account the lifesupport they have only enough energy generation left to go to 4% of full impulse, further limiting the amount of energy available

Do you have any concrete numbers? You certainly seem to claim them in your conclusions...

This means that an absolute upperlimit to the power needed to activate a transporter is 20 GJ/s and probably a much lower limit (guess how I got to 0.8 GW)

Reference this. I remind you they don't need to provide all the energy that makes up the body, because that energy is still around.

Next time please substantiate your claims of terajoules of power please.

The Dauphin and the Masterpeice Society. Quotes in both indicate TW power generation from the Warp Core.

Also why are you trying to claim that I want to generate 7.2TJ out of nothing. If you can convert mass into energy (as they have done in the past with a transporter) why not keep that energy in the system instead of projecting it out again?

I don't know, because it doesn't work like that? What evidence do you have that transporters convert to energy? As I recall, the phrase 'matter stream' keeps getting thrown around.

[Velthuijsen]

1) Transporters are useless against a shielded ship.
2) Exactly how would holoprojector technology be useful in a fight against ships with advanced sensor technology that can distinguish between holograms and real objects?

1) Never intended to use them to zap something into a shielded space.

Ah, yes, you think they can get 0.8 GJ/s to get 7.2TJ energy back. Where does this energy come from? Energy from no where? Nice violation of conservation of energy.

I'll guess I'm talking to someone who has read a bit about this kind of stuff. Otherwise you wouldn't claim I'm violating conservation of energy.
There is no energy added to the whole system, just a conversion from one type to another.

2) Then please explain what the difference is between a holodeck bullet (the holodeck has the don't kill recreators safety off) and a real bullet.

Who cares? You still haven't shown how Fed holograms would be useful in a fight, in spite of your promise to do so. And Fed holograms don't work outside the confined area of the holodeck.

You are right. The first time I thought of the idea it seemed doable by using holodeck technology, after reading up on how those things are supposed to work I had to scratch it.

Hmm, I just point out that (using the stardestroyer.net assumptions on powergeneration in Federation ships) it costs them at the most 0.8 GJ/s to get 7.2TJ energy back.

They DON'T get 7.2 TJ back. Beaming Picard away from one ship to another produces a change of precisely ZERO joules of energy.

You don't get it do you?
If you want to use a transporter as energy generator you DO NOT beam out the energy you have collected.
But I'm not even talking about retaining the energy.
I'm suggesting to use it. If you use the transporter as a giant beamweapon 7.2 TJ of whatever particle makes up a phaserbeam then the beam would be about a factor thousand stronger then the total phaseroutput of the Enterprise.
Not bad for shoving in 80Kg of matter.

So to make this cost more energy then it brings in that transporter would need 9 million seconds to convert 80Kg of mass into energy. Even if we'd use the full 20GJ/s it would still take 360 000 seconds before the gains would outweigh the costs.

Where did these numbers come from again?

You know where they come from otherwise you wouldn't be asking me to restate my entire original post.

just don't make unsubstantiated claims.

What unsubstantiated claims?

Sigh, before you go about that check back

The result is a weapon capable of projecting terajoules of energy, in any direction from a point of origin that lies in a globe that has a radius of about 30 000 Km.

To bad for you that the upper limit figure you came up with (7.2TJ) won't even scratch a SW cap ship's shields.

Not nice, not nice at all. Trying to put words in my mouth.

I simply quoted your own figure. I thought I was being quite civil. Even if your conclusion is right and we scale the energy figure up by a dozen orders of magnitude, that still won't scratch SW cap ship shields

I wasn't talking about that and you know it. I was talking about you trying to maneuvre me into the situation where it looked like I was claiming that a transporter has an upper limit of 80Kg. As can be seen in the next part of the quote you split in two to make it look like I was making a claim to the contrary while I ignored your "it cannot scratch a Starwars shield"-argument since that wasn't being discussed here.

You DO know that you just about ignored every Star Trek movie and episode where they moved more then 80Kg of mass by trying to make it look like I am claiming that that is the upper a limit to a transporters capacity is 80Kg which I didn't. I only used the transportation of Picard (which I put at a guestimated 80Kg of weight) to show the amount of energy the system can generate.

The most a transporter has handeled was in ST4 beaming a couple of whales and the surrounding water. The effort was a TREMENDOUS strain on the ship AND it only elevated them by a few dozen meters.

Thank you for bringing that to my attention I was afraid you would jump on me if I'd started suggesting to shove a cubic meter of lead into a transporter to up the amount of energy you can feed into a beam by a few magnitudes.

Name ONE episode where the Feds transported something significantly larger than a person and the warp core was off line like it was in Nemesis, which is the whole center of your argument. You can't use an extraordinary case like Nemesis to "prove" that Transporters some how magically generate 7.2TJ per 80kg object everytime they transport something. Do you know what a hasty generalization fallacy is?

Maybe the reason they don't use it as a weapon is because your analysis is logically invalid.

[/quote]

I don't need to prove that the feds can transport larger stuff with a damaged warpcore. I merely used a ship on which the warpcore was disabled to get an unknown quantity out of the equation.`

Sorry but I'm not going to fall into your burden of proof trap.

Also you are doing it again, twisting my words. I never create energy, I merely convert it from one form to another.

To prevent this thing into mushroomin into an ever larger did/did not argument I want you to suggest ways of why it would not work instead of attacking me by attacking my math or understanding of physics.
Also stop the implicit assumption that I convert something to energy and then at the same time keep that energy while using that same amount of energy recreating the matter I converted to energy.

This is my challenge to you.
Disprove that a transporter can be used as a weapon.
Disprove that a transporter can be used as an energy generator.

underlying assumptions
1) Warpcore is out of action as can be attributed to the comments on them losing warpcapabilites and the comments on the amount of energy generation left
2) Secondary energy generation cannot exceed 20 GJ/s (otherwise as ship can reach warp 1).
3) a person weighing 80Kg can be seen as 7.2TJ of energy (based on E=Mc^2)
4) Mass can be converted into energy using a transporter.

[Velthuijsen]

SirNitram please no attacks on the person.

Thin skinned? I'm sorry, ignoring CoE and logic makes you stupid. So I will call you such. If you feel this is somehow unfair, feel free to run off crying, but it will not make your argument any more valid.

Not thin skinned but calling your opponent an ass will not remove credibility/validity from his/her arguments if there is any. Just as it will not add to your own arguments.

I gave two, not 1 but 2 reasons why the warp core is out of action and not providing energy.
You at most half killed off one of the two by suggesting that the warpcore is intact but they somehow lost the ability to transport energy from warpcore to the nacelles
You didn't do anything about the conflict of a warpcore that still functions but a ship that is so low on energy that after lifesupport is taken into account there is only enough left to go at less then 1/10 full speed ahead.
Especially since in your scenario the energy normally going to the warpengines doesn't go there suggesting an excess of energy.

For that I think I can make a reasonable claim that the warpcore is not providing any energy to the ships powergrid.

I did mention the secondary power reactors.
Which are not strong enough to push a ship into warp. You can find the reasons here.
Go down to Ship Fusion Reactors to see where I got that from.
It also defines the max energy output of the secondary energy generation.

I hope this compensates for the appeal to authority I tried to pull of earlier.

The Dauphin and Masterpiece Society episode do not apply here.
Using them as evidence requires a functional warpcore.
Which I still claim (as seen above) is not working.

Even though I suspect you know which episode I am reffering to (seeing that you shake Dauphin and Masterpiece out of your sleeve)

Evidence for transporters turning matter into energy:
TNG Season 1, episode 8 "Lonely among us", Picard beams himself away in the form of energy.

[SirNitram]

SirNitram please no attacks on the person.

Thin skinned? I'm sorry, ignoring CoE and logic makes you stupid. So I will call you such. If you feel this is somehow unfair, feel free to run off crying, but it will not make your argument any more valid.

Not thin skinned but calling your opponent an ass will not remove credibility/validity from his/her arguments if there is any. Just as it will not add to your own arguments.

I never claimed it did. I simply call you what you are, stupid.

I gave two, not 1 but 2 reasons why the warp core is out of action and not providing energy.
You at most half killed off one of the two by suggesting that the warpcore is intact but they somehow lost the ability to transport energy from warpcore to the nacelles

Or that it's power output was reduced by battle damage. But no, let's hand-wave that away, since you want to.

You didn't do anything about the conflict of a warpcore that still functions but a ship that is so low on energy that after lifesupport is taken into account there is only enough left to go at less then 1/10 full speed ahead.

Again, we do not know how much energy is required for 1 10th Impulse, nor transport. Claiming you do had better be backed up by solid numers.

Especially since in your scenario the energy normally going to the warpengines doesn't go there suggesting an excess of energy.

So the warp engines aren't engaged, so it must be overloading? Or what are you failing to say?

For that I think I can make a reasonable claim that the warpcore is not providing any energy to the ships powergrid.

But without proof, it's not reasonable.

I did mention the secondary power reactors.
Which are not strong enough to push a ship into warp. You can find the reasons here.
Go down to Ship Fusion Reactors to see where I got that from.
It also defines the max energy output of the secondary energy generation.

Yet still does not provide numbers for transporters, so you cannot prove they could not transport on those reactors. Have a very nice day, dipshit.

I hope this compensates for the appeal to authority I tried to pull of earlier.

The Dauphin and Masterpiece Society episode do not apply here.
Using them as evidence requires a functional warpcore.
Which I still claim (as seen above) is not working.

Even though I suspect you know which episode I am reffering to (seeing that you shake Dauphin and Masterpiece out of your sleeve)

Evidence for transporters turning matter into energy:
TNG Season 1, episode 8 "Lonely among us", Picard beams himself away in the form of energy.

Quote, please.

[Darth Negation]

Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

[Darth Wong]

If you can convert mass into energy (as they have done in the past with a transporter) why not keep that energy in the system instead of projecting it out again?

Standard dumb-ass Trekkie idea. If they could convert mass into energy with the transporter, they would have absolutely no need of a dangerous and complex matter/antimatter reactor. We do NOT observe them turning mass into energy; we only observe them teleporting mass from one place to another; the inference that it must be converted to pure energy and routed through the ship's systems in the process is a theory which does NOT fit the facts, particularly given Riker's "cloning" incident.

PS. Picard beaming himself away as "energy" is not established either; since it is dispersed, it could just as easily be a dispersed cloud of matter. We have seen repeatedly that the Trek characters do not understand the definitions of matter and energy, as evidenced by their characterization of anything that glows and floats, even if it's not moving at c, as pure energy.

[Kerneth]

Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

If the Feds could 1) build a functioning slipstream drive 2) build them extremely cheaply and quickly and 3) if an object in the quantum slipstream or whatever the hell a Slipstream drive does will affect an object in normal space, then such an attack might be successful.

However, given that the Federation has yet to meet requirement #1, I'd have to say this tactic is a bust.

[f16falcon]

1.lots of stuff with the word quantam
2. vulcans that can play mind games
3. transwarp drive
4. cloaking
5. lots of white flags for surrendering

[Darth Negation]

Kerneth wrote:

Darth Negation wrote:
Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

If the Feds could 1) build a functioning slipstream drive 2) build them extremely cheaply and quickly and 3) if an object in the quantum slipstream or whatever the hell a Slipstream drive does will affect an object in normal space, then such an attack might be successful.

However, given that the Federation has yet to meet requirement #1, I'd have to say this tactic is a bust.

They do have the ability to build a functioning slipstream drive for the purposes intended here. All they need to do is get within range (possibly towed by a Soverign or something), aim (using a secondary drive, like simple jet propellant attached to the computer) then go to slipstream. From what I've heard here, Voyager COULD activate the drive. It just could not slow down safely. I would say that slowing down a ramming ship like this is an Imp problem.

"Captai-"

BOOM



The only problem is getting to the damn ISDs or any SD or even to a planet before the crew dies of old age.

[T-1000]

Slipstream is the best bet. Technology currently available can be modified to support it and it is at most a decade away from beginning practical and safe application.

I disagree gravity fields would have the best affect on slipstream vessels, as Voyager nearly fell apart in slipstream, intense sudden gravity fields might stress a fragile balance that appears to exist in slipstream.

The power use is actually manageable, where as transwarp appears beyond current Federation technology.

Actually, if we are talking about lost tech here, the absolute best bet would be spatial fletchers. We saw Q's younger mortal son use them in "Q2". He claimed that they were some kind of hole in space. What little we saw of them indicates that they allow a vessel to open a whole in space from one location to another and traverse the distance instantly. Q junior was actually able to generate one of these using the standard equipment on the Delta Flyer. Furthermore, the journey did not seem to affect any of the shuttle's systems in any strenious way and there appeared to be no health risks involved with the process.

If this technology is as it appears, this would allow the Federation to attack Imperial star systems with trilithium weapons regardless of whether or not the Empire had secured the entrance to the wormhole.

[JodoForce]

Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

Don't think that it would make any difference...
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=13766

[Silencer_7]

1. Ram ships!

pack all their ships with explosives, and point them in the direction off the imperial flaat. and then maybe just maybe they can kill enought stardestroyers to win, if not beg for mercy.

2. Picard

They could send picard accross to bore them to death about the prime directive

3. the white flag

the second the imperial fleet attacks wave the white flag, live again to fight another day

4. hook up with the rebellion

hook up with the rebelion and use their tactics

If all the above fail

5. Mass suicide

all federation personal committ mass suicide in shame, because their great and powerful "cough" federation doesnt stand a chance

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

1. Ram ships!

pack all their ships with explosives, and point them in the direction off the imperial flaat. and then maybe just maybe they can kill enought stardestroyers to win, if not beg for mercy.

2. Picard

They could send picard accross to bore them to death about the prime directive

3. the white flag

the second the imperial fleet attacks wave the white flag, live again to fight another day

4. hook up with the rebellion

hook up with the rebelion and use their tactics

If all the above fail

5. Mass suicide

all federation personal committ mass suicide in shame, because their great and powerful "cough" federation doesnt stand a chance

And which technologies would they be using in these tactics? Brainless troll.

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

Don't think that it would make any difference...
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=13766

What about setting a warp or QS equipped warhead to reenter realspace half an inch (give or take) inside the target? Warp might be interdicted, though... but what about QS? Does anyone have enough of an idea how that works to know whether it even has an AMRE or if it can be interdicted artificially?

[SirNitram]

Er... Is it possible to install a slipstream drive on a huge lead weight the mass of, say, a Hoth asteroid, and just ramming an ISD?
That would be a lot of KE for the shields to absorb.

If the Federation made around 100 drone flying battering rams they could take out around 100 ships.

Lead weight + Slipstream drive + Cheap targeting computer = damage

Don't think that it would make any difference...
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=13766

What about setting a warp or QS equipped warhead to reenter realspace half an inch (give or take) inside the target? Warp might be interdicted, though... but what about QS? Does anyone have enough of an idea how that works to know whether it even has an AMRE or if it can be interdicted artificially?

There's not enough evidence, though QS resembles Hyperdrive in some respects. It may be interdicted like hyperdrive.. But that's conjecture. There's simply not enough info. Thus, we fall back on the fact an ISD will pick up even a QS drive ship a long way off, and be able to move.

[Silencer_7]

oh u mean technologies, well then they've had.

Serously though

1. Quantum torps
2. cloaking device
3. that weapon from Nemesis, the one that picards clone (Sinzon ) was going to use on earth
4. albatic armour
5. Transport (for ground ops)

It took me a while to think of the last one

[Raoul Duke, Jr.]

oh u mean technologies, well then they've had.

Serously though

1. Quantum torps
2. cloaking device
3. that weapon from Nemesis, the one that picards clone (Sinzon ) was going to use on earth
4. albatic armour
5. Transport (for ground ops)

It took me a while to think of the last one

Let me take just a minute to explain something to you, Silencer, and I'll try not to be unkind... look around the debates here for awhile. You'll find very few people using the "neener-neener" playground style debating techniques here. Those that do tend to receive sparkling new anuses in short order. I've given and received, myself.

I sense trolldom in you, my child, and if indeed you are so, I'll not stay the hordes from your flesh.

[Ghost Rider]

oh u mean technologies, well then they've had.

Serously though

1. Quantum torps
2. cloaking device
3. that weapon from Nemesis, the one that picards clone (Sinzon ) was going to use on earth
4. albatic armour
5. Transport (for ground ops)

It took me a while to think of the last one

Okay because Raoul did warn you here's a few thoughts for you.

1. 128 MT won't do shit.
2. Detected.
3. 7 minute egg cooker is pointless.
4. Won't stop 200MT damage some large missles can do let alone 200GT a MTL does.
5. Now give them some training...and oh yeah penetrate planetary shields.

Now do you understand why Ivan asked for lost tech or otherwise?