Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

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Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Crossroads Inc. »

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From states across the country, Americans have filed petitions on the White House Web site seeking to secede from the union and form new state governments.

While most of the petitions come from states that supported Mitt Romney in last week’s election, a few swing states and even the deep blue Northeast are represented.

Petitions have been filed for Alabama, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Oregon, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Texas.

“We petition the Obama Administration to peacefully grant the State of Alabama to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own new government,” reads the Alabama petition. The following text is the same in most of the 20 filed so far:

As the founding fathers of the United States of America made clear in the Declaration of Independence in 1776:

“When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.”

“…Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or abolish it, and institute new Government…”

Most of the petitions have a few thousand signatures; many signers appear to be from other states. Under the “We the People” program, launched last year, the White House will respond to any petition that receives 25,000 or more signatures within 30 days. Anyone over the age of 13 can create a petition. Previous popular petitions demanded the White House beer recipe (success) and marijuana legalization (no success).

The petitions from Louisiana and Texas, however, are approaching the threshold for a response. They were the first two states represented, followed by Alabama. Petitioners only have to put a first name and last initial on the site.

Texas Gov. Rick Perry (R) raised the idea of secession back in 2009, but he has since made clear that he has no interest in it. Tennessee Rep. Zach Wamp (R) suggested in 2010 that some states might have to “consider separation from this government” should the leadership in Washington not change. ”I hope that the American people will go to the ballot box in 2010 and 2012 so that states are not forced to consider separation from this government,” he said.
Once again I am reminded of Republicans in the closing days of the election, crowing about how
"WHEN Obama looses, the Demo-rats will get so mad they will all want to leave America and Secede!"
Ah, such classic projecting...
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Captain Seafort »

Well, this could get interesting.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Block »

They should let Alabama secede and tell anyone from any of the other states that if they want to go the government will pay for their relocation to Alabama. Then seal the border and good riddance.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Crazedwraith »

I'm pretty sure that if any of the petitions reach the right number and the white house will indeed respond; 'on your bikes, mate' and that will be the end of it.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Esquire »

Captain Seafort wrote:Well, this could get interesting.
Could, but won't. Such a thing would have to be done by referendum if it wanted any legitimacy whatsoever, which would never pass - and anyway, it's been clearly demonstrated that the Federal government will not stand for such nonsense.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Zaune »

So... How many of those states would you actually miss?
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Skywalker_T-65 »

Considering I live in Missouri with no way to leave the state...I very well would be unhappy if it went through here :P

But like Esquire pointed out, even if the petitions went through, the Feds wouldn't actually let a state secede. And really...should they? 25k people isn't all that much.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Crazedwraith »

Zaune wrote:So... How many of those states would you actually miss?
Yeah. The US totally wouldn't miss a little thing like that state of New York.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Gandalf »

Ooh, petitions. They'll work.

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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by FaxModem1 »

Well, I'm in the state of Texas. If this happened, and hell was having snowball fights, I'd be a little bit of a refugee.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by General Zod »

I'm more than a little surprised to see New York in that list, but if they want to let NYC stay with the US proper I'm okay with that.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Captain Seafort »

General Zod wrote:I'm more than a little surprised to see New York in that list, but if they want to let NYC stay with the US proper I'm okay with that.
Isn't there a movement for NYC to secede from NY anyway ?
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Dr. Trainwreck »

These online petitions are many. They are also hilarious. If Those On High wanted your opinion (and I mean yours specifically, dear petitioners) beyond the elections, you'd already know their cell phones and private e-mail addresses to pester them directly. But since they have people for that job, and since all you do is pester, your petitions are looked at by a bored board admin who has a good chuckle at you.

But fuck it, say they secede. The rest of the states will have to prepare for a massive influx of (mostly illegal) immigration. Those that leave will see their new countries turn into third world shitholes and, umm, what else? Excluding New York, of course.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Simon_Jester »

Block wrote:They should let Alabama secede and tell anyone from any of the other states that if they want to go the government will pay for their relocation to Alabama. Then seal the border and good riddance.
It isn't even "Alabama" asking to secede. It's some random people in Alabama.

Also in, for example, New York and Oregon, which are both states Obama won handily. That should give you an idea of how tiny a minority it takes to do this. A few dozen random idiots can start a petition saying "let my state secede!" It doesn't mean they speak for anyone.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by General Zod »

Captain Seafort wrote:
General Zod wrote:I'm more than a little surprised to see New York in that list, but if they want to let NYC stay with the US proper I'm okay with that.
Isn't there a movement for NYC to secede from NY anyway ?
I have no idea. It wouldn't surprise me though, upstate New York is like a totally different country from NYC.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Block »

Simon_Jester wrote:
Block wrote:They should let Alabama secede and tell anyone from any of the other states that if they want to go the government will pay for their relocation to Alabama. Then seal the border and good riddance.
It isn't even "Alabama" asking to secede. It's some random people in Alabama.

Also in, for example, New York and Oregon, which are both states Obama won handily. That should give you an idea of how tiny a minority it takes to do this. A few dozen random idiots can start a petition saying "let my state secede!" It doesn't mean they speak for anyone.
I'm well aware, thanks. :roll:
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Zaune »

Crazedwraith wrote:Yeah. The US totally wouldn't miss a little thing like that state of New York.
Okay, okay. Apart from New York*, do any of those states contain things the rest of the Union would miss? Most of them seem to be ex-Jim Crow states, states who've been flipped the bird by the Invisible Hand, or both. Oh, and New Jersey. The phrase "be careful what you wish for" springs to mind.

* Assuming of course that there's no overlap between the New York state residents wanting to secede and the ones wanting NYC declared a separate entity; see the thread on Hurricane Sandy.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by The Duchess of Zeon »

Mississippi and Alabama are totally useless except for their coastlines, which, as it happens, were parts of the Spanish colony of West Florida which were given to them so they could have coastlines. So we could just take the coast-line back and let them form a landlocked "New Confederacy" dependent on the US for trade.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Raw Shark »

Zaune wrote:So... How many of those states would you actually miss?
Wikipedia on Colorado wrote: The Bureau of Economic Analysis estimates that the total state product in 2010 was $257.6 billion.[58] Per capita personal income in 2010 was $51 940, ranking Colorado 11th in the nation.[59] The state's economy broadened from its mid-19th century roots in mining when irrigated agriculture developed, and by the late 19th century, raising livestock had become important. Early industry was based on the extraction and processing of minerals and agricultural products. Current agricultural products are cattle, wheat, dairy products, corn, and hay.

The federal government is also a major economic force in the state with many important federal facilities including NORAD (North American Aerospace Defense Command, United States Air Force Academy, Schriever Air Force Base located approximately 10 miles (16 kilometers) east of Peterson Air Force Base, and Fort Carson, both located in Colorado Springs within El Paso County; NOAA, the National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) in Golden, and the National Institute of Standards and Technology in Boulder; U.S. Geological Survey and other government agencies at the Denver Federal Center near Lakewood; the Denver Mint, Buckley Air Force Base, and 10th Circuit Court of Appeals in Denver; and a federal Supermax Prison and other federal prisons near Cañon City. In addition to these and other federal agencies, Colorado has abundant National Forest land and four National Parks that contribute to federal ownership of 24,615,788 acres (99,617 km2) of land in Colorado, or 37% of the total area of the state.[60] In the second half of the 20th century, the industrial and service sectors have expanded greatly. The state's economy is diversified and is notable for its concentration of scientific research and high-technology industries. Other industries include food processing, transportation equipment, machinery, chemical products, the extraction of metals such as gold (see Gold mining in Colorado), silver, and molybdenum. Colorado now also has the largest annual production of beer of any state.
Bolding mine. We also went for Obama, overall, so the crybabies can leave if they don't like it.

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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Dalton »

General Zod wrote:
Captain Seafort wrote:
General Zod wrote:I'm more than a little surprised to see New York in that list, but if they want to let NYC stay with the US proper I'm okay with that.
Isn't there a movement for NYC to secede from NY anyway ?
I have no idea. It wouldn't surprise me though, upstate New York is like a totally different country from NYC.
The only movement I've heard of is for Long Island (that is, Nassau and Suffolk counties) to form their own state.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by ryacko »

According to Texas v. White, unilateral secession is illegal.
Personally I like that supreme court decision for laying a precedent for quoting documents prior to the Constitution as constitutional law.

Not sure on what basis would a secession proceed, but I assume it would be a negotiation between state legislatures and congress.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Atlan »

ryacko wrote:According to Texas v. White, unilateral secession is illegal.
Personally I like that supreme court decision for laying a precedent for quoting documents prior to the Constitution as constitutional law.

Not sure on what basis would a secession proceed, but I assume it would be a negotiation between state legislatures and congress.
You might have heard of the prior case: Union vs. Confederacy, which also ruled unilateral secession illegal. Personally, I find that it made for a more definitive case than Texas vs. White.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Panzersharkcat »

Atlan wrote:
ryacko wrote:According to Texas v. White, unilateral secession is illegal.
Personally I like that supreme court decision for laying a precedent for quoting documents prior to the Constitution as constitutional law.

Not sure on what basis would a secession proceed, but I assume it would be a negotiation between state legislatures and congress.
You might have heard of the prior case: Union vs. Confederacy, which also ruled unilateral secession illegal. Personally, I find that it made for a more definitive case than Texas vs. White.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Zaune »

Philosophically sound or not, "the final say on what the law does and does not mean goes to whoever's got the bigger army" is a legal precedent dating back to... Well, probably very soon after we even invented the concept of law in the first place. C'est la vie.
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Re: Obama wins White House, Red States petitions to Secede.

Post by Alferd Packer »

Zaune wrote:
Crazedwraith wrote:Yeah. The US totally wouldn't miss a little thing like that state of New York.
Okay, okay. Apart from New York*, do any of those states contain things the rest of the Union would miss? Most of them seem to be ex-Jim Crow states, states who've been flipped the bird by the Invisible Hand, or both. Oh, and New Jersey. The phrase "be careful what you wish for" springs to mind.

* Assuming of course that there's no overlap between the New York state residents wanting to secede and the ones wanting NYC declared a separate entity; see the thread on Hurricane Sandy.
The net amount of money New Jersey pays to the federal goverment in tax revenue could almost completely subsidize all economic activity in Wyoming. Oh, and there would be an eggplant shortage.
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