NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA.

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NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA.

Post by Alyrium Denryle »

Ladies and Gentlebeasts, the shit has hit the fan.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/08/1 ... l=facebook
Hearing someone cry out in distress is difficult for many to endure. When the distress is caused by a gang with badges accountable to no one it is difficult to protect anyone. A judge made an effort to calm a situation that should not have happened.

A homeless man already in restraints was being attacked by police.

The police response, hide the evidence and lie to the district attorney. Shop owners were threatened not to show security footage of the man being attacked. Responsible citizens gathering evidence with their cameras were pushed out of range to hide the misdeeds of the NYPD.

A seventy year old judge was struck in the neck by an officer intent on hiding the criminality of his peers. The ER told the judge he had a crushed larynx. The police who have no medical license told the DA the judge had a sore throat from yelling.

And from what appears to be standard, the video evidence of the misdeeds was not even considered when the NYPD investigated themselves and found no wrongdoing.
In the 43-page lawsuit, Raffaele claims he went to help a homeless man in the neighborhood who was being attacked by police.
Raffaele says he heard the handcuffed homeless man pleading with unknown officers, "I beg you please stop, I beg you please stop," while police assaulted him in front of a swelling crowd...

...He claims police arrived and threatened many in the crowd who were filming the attack with cell phones. He says police threatened local shop owners not to provide security footage of the incident.
An unknown officer "charged up" to the judge, shoved him and then "using a karate chop-like" hit him in the neck, Raffaele says in the complaint.
He claims police refused to take an official statement from him that he had been attacked, and then tried to hide the unknown officer's identity.
The judge says he went to the hospital that night and was diagnosed with a crushed larynx.
http://www.courthousenews.com/2013/08/19/60398.htm
BROOKLYN, N.Y. (CN) - New York City police crushed the larynx of a Queens County Supreme Court judge with a karate chop and then conspired to cover up the attack, the judge claims in Federal Court.
Queens County Supreme Court Judge Thomas D. Raffaele, 70, claims in a $300,000 lawsuit that the New York City Police Department and Queens District Attorney's office conspired to cover up the June 1, 2012 attack on him in Jackson Heights.
In the 43-page lawsuit, Raffaele claims he went to help a homeless man in the neighborhood who was being attacked by police.
Raffaele says he heard the handcuffed homeless man pleading with unknown officers, "I beg you please stop, I beg you please stop," while police assaulted him in front of a swelling crowd.
Raffaele says he called police and urged the crowd to move away from the man being assaulted.
He claims police arrived and threatened many in the crowd who were filming the attack with cell phones. He says police threatened local shop owners not to provide security footage of the incident.
An unknown officer "charged up" to the judge, shoved him and then "using a karate chop-like" hit him in the neck, Raffaele says in the complaint.
He claims police refused to take an official statement from him that he had been attacked, and then tried to hide the unknown officer's identity.
The judge says he went to the hospital that night and was diagnosed with a crushed larynx.
One month later, Raffaele says, he met with the New York City Civilian Complaint Review Board, Queens County Assistant District Attorney Daniel O'Leary and the NYPD's Internal Affairs Bureau. He says assistant District Attorney Peter A. Crusco told him, "There was not enough evidence to prosecute," though the entire incident was caught on security cameras.
Raffaele says the DA's office was told that he had aggressively charged into the perimeter of a crime scene, that an officer merely touched him once on the chest and that the reason his throat hurt was because he was yelling during the incident.
The Queens District Attorney's Office issued a statement in August 2012 that Raffaele had entered the "safety perimeter that police officers attempted to establish around the incident" and merely tried to separate him from the growing crowd, according to the lawsuit.
Raffaele claims Commissioner Ray Kelly failed to investigate the incident "after stating to the press that he would 'check into it.'"
Although Kelly was quoted in The New York Times as saying that an investigation was ongoing, Raffaele claims Kelly never contacted him.
He seeks $300,000 for conspiracy, unreasonable force, battery and violations of his constitutional rights.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Thanas »

How many of those incidents do we need to consider this SOP for cops in the USA?
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Zwinmar »

Well when half the country lives in fear that the minority will bust in their doors, and does not trust most of them...

It seems it already is SOP.

This is the feeling I get having had dealing with the myriad of sides (yes I have had some police training) and the reason I will not be a cop.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Crown »

Man, even the Mob thought twice before targeting a judge ...
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Covenant »

Thanas wrote:How many of those incidents do we need to consider this SOP for cops in the USA?
The USA is more than NYC, thankfully. That's a broad assessment for the entire country. NYC has unique problems, to which they've created police forces that are entirely staffed with Berserkers from the Cult of Odin. The NYPD is also an organization that is currently and historically known for this kind of insane behavior, and at the same time many individuals look to NYC as an example of a city that has gotten crime "under control," in what has to be the most myopic assessment available. I don't think this is SOP at a nation-wide scale, but I do think it is fair to say that this is the kind of behavior that police themselves glamorize, idealize, and strive to be able to get away with. Be it NYPD style gang activity or small town militias taking over, the idea of control is huge and corrosive.

The USA has a very confused opinion about what they want police to be, and the idea of being "tough on crime" and "tough on criminals" is a constant drumbeat that drives people who want to "be tough on crime/criminals" into the force. You get enough people who join up looking to be "tough" and you end up with a street gang with a mind for enforcement and no respect for anyone outside of the gang colors. It isn't about helping people anymore, that's more of the Fire Department, but I've worked with the police in my home town before and they are honest, decent individuals on the balance just trying to make sure everyone can go about their day peacefully, but still come down like a ton of bricks when people make relatively minor infractions. The culture of "getting the bad guys" is crippling to any kind of positive reaction to the police, so they make all the rest of us the enemy.

What's that quote about wise leaders not using a military as police, because when you do you turn your people into the enemy? It feels like the 80's had such a militarizing effect on the police, which was only accelerated into the 00's, that the police have ended up as a domestic military force that treats average citizens as an untrustworthy, occupied enemy force.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Patroklos »

Thanas wrote:How many of those incidents do we need to consider this SOP for cops in the USA?
Given they are near all local organizations with at best state wide affiliation if even that, infinite?
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

Source
My office has concluded its investigation into the events that transpired at approximately
12:10 a.m. on June 1, 2012, at 74th Street and 37th Road in the Elmhurst section of Queens County
involving New York State Supreme Court Justice Thomas D. Raffaele, 69, Charles Menninger 47,
and various police officers assigned to the New York City Police Department’s 115th Precinct and
its Transit District 20.

Specifically, police officers were confronted with an individual – Mr. Menninger – who was
reportedly chasing individuals while armed with a metal pipe. It is Mr. Menninger’s allegation that
officers used excessive force in removing him from the scene. Afterwards, my office learned that
Justice Raffaele also alleged being struck by a police officer at the same scene and that a sergeant
would not take his complaint.

After an extensive and thorough investigation of the facts and circumstances of the matter
– that included multiple witness interviews and reviews of police reports and medical records – my
office has concluded that the facts do not warrant the filing of criminal charges.


All of the credible evidence supports the findings that Mr. Menninger was acting in a violent,
erratic and uncontrolled manner by attempting to strike two transit police officers with a metal pipe
and that the officers used necessary force to subdue an individual who they determined to be an
emotionally disturbed person. We find that there is insufficient evidence that excessive force was
utilized in restraining Mr. Menninger.

In the second instance, Justice Raffaele alleged that, while at the scene of the incident where
Mr. Menninger was being restrained, he was assaulted by one of the police officers. The alleged
assault occurred in a safety perimeter that police officers attempted to establish around the incident
to contain Mr. Menninger and separate him from the growing crowd. We find that there is
insufficient evidence of criminality to support a charge that the police officer acted with intent to
injure or that physical injury (as defined by statute and case law) occurred. The People would have
the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the police officer intentionally and
unjustifiably struck Justice Raffaele and that the Judge sustained physical injury. Based on our
investigation, we are unable to sustain that burden. We also find no criminality regarding the alleged
failure of a police sergeant failing to take a report from Justice Raffaele.

We have referred this entire matter to the Civilian Complaint Review Board and to the New
York City Police Department to review the conduct of the subject officers for any possible violation
of New York City Police Department rules or procedures and to take such action, if any, as they
deem appropriate. We express no opinion as to whether any such violations may have occurred.
Alyrium Denryle do you have a copy of the judges medical report. If someone in the ER said he had a "crushed larynx" then this information would have been in the medical documentation. Have you seen the medical reports? I mean because if you or the Daily Kos does or Courthouse News Service has that information and it shows a crushed larynx then I think you just caught the DA red handed covering for these cops. However, if there is no such documentation or video evidence then all we have is a sensationalized story with no evidence.

By the way...attempting to strike two transit officers with a metal pipe means that deadly force would have been justified if used. Food for thought.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by TheFeniX »

Wouldn't that be perfect time to use a taser? Also, one report says the suspect was already handcuffed, so it'd be a real hard sell for a "it was self-defense" line. Note: the officer in this video did get suspended for 10 years, so that's something.

Anyways, here's a news report showing a few pictures. Odd that there is no video footage of the incident considering the amount of bystanders.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Agent Fisher »

NYPD does not carry or issue tasers to their patrol officers, IIRC.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

TheFeniX wrote:Wouldn't that be perfect time to use a taser?
It would depend on the specifics of the encounter. Studies into taser effectiveness show their effectiveness ranges anywhere from 69% to 82%. Not odds that I would bet my life on. If you're too close the probes won't spread far enough apart and therefore not enough muscle will be effected to incapacitate. If you're too far then you stand a much greater chance of one of the probes missing. Both must hit for it to be effective.

In my six years I've used my taser maybe four times. It only worked once. So, if someone comes charging at me with a metal pipe, or any other dangerous weapon, I'm probably not going to be thinking about tasing them.
Also, one report says the suspect was already handcuffed, so it'd be a real hard sell for a "it was self-defense" line. Note: the officer in this video did get suspended for 10 years, so that's something.
Agreed.
Anyways, here's a news report showing a few pictures. Odd that there is no video footage of the incident considering the amount of bystanders.
Yeah, that is odd. Especially when there are no allegations of police seizing recording devices. If there were allegations of them seizing recording devices then that could explain why the video isn't available.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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Kamakazie Sith wrote:It would depend on the specifics of the encounter.
As always. But, if your first instinct is to wrestle a suspect into submission, I don't have any problems with a taser being used in it's stead, even if the suspect is unarmed. Kind of moot if cops aren't issued tasers. If deadly force is the proper response, then you use it.

There just seems to be this idea that, once you've resisted, you're always resisting or that resistance means that any non-deadly force is justified in response.

I remember this one old video I watched of like 4 cops beating some handcuffed black guy because he was "resisting." Which was true, he was flailing about and kicking at the officers. So, in response, they just kind of wailed on the guy with punches and kicks until he finally gave up. When asked why they didn't just let him flop around like a fish for a bit and just make sure he didn't get to his feet and run away, the comment from the police chief was something like "he could have hurt himself if we didn't subdue him further." Which is also true. But how is kicking the suspect in the face and putting a knee into his back any better?

I laughed so hard at that comment (and feel kind of bad about laughing) because it was so fucking insulting he could give that line with a straight face.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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Kamakazie Sith wrote:Alyrium Denryle do you have a copy of the judges medical report. If someone in the ER said he had a "crushed larynx" then this information would have been in the medical documentation. Have you seen the medical reports? I mean because if you or the Daily Kos does or Courthouse News Service has that information and it shows a crushed larynx then I think you just caught the DA red handed covering for these cops. However, if there is no such documentation or video evidence then all we have is a sensationalized story with no evidence.
The judge filed a lawsuit alleging the injury, so unless you think the judge was lying we can be pretty sure the medical report exists.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Highlord Laan »

Crown wrote:Man, even the Mob thought twice before targeting a judge ...
Citizen, are you questioning the veracity and integrity of our valorous and honorable police forces? I think you may be in need of some re-education to set you back on track to being a Proper American.
Agent Fisher wrote:NYPD does not carry or issue tasers to their patrol officers, IIRC.
More visceral and satisfying to beat people senselessness, death or simply shoot them. It's what John Wayne would have done. Besides, if they hadn't done anything wrong, they wouldn't be getting their just deserts, right?

And I'm surprised that my estimate of the time it would take for KS to show up saying there was nothing to see here and we should trust our great zero effective oversight thugs in blue was off. I thought it would be under an hour.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Thanas »

Can we not discuss tasers in here? There are good arguments for why they are actually a bad thing to issue to police and equally good arguments why they serve a purpose. So please do not derail this thread.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Alyeska »

Dominus Atheos wrote:
Kamakazie Sith wrote:Alyrium Denryle do you have a copy of the judges medical report. If someone in the ER said he had a "crushed larynx" then this information would have been in the medical documentation. Have you seen the medical reports? I mean because if you or the Daily Kos does or Courthouse News Service has that information and it shows a crushed larynx then I think you just caught the DA red handed covering for these cops. However, if there is no such documentation or video evidence then all we have is a sensationalized story with no evidence.
The judge filed a lawsuit alleging the injury, so unless you think the judge was lying we can be pretty sure the medical report exists.
At this point we have "he said she said" situation. What is actually in the medical report is the only way to resolve the issue. One side is lying. And its not the first time people have lied about police misconduct. Everyone can lie. Even a judge.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

TheFeniX wrote:
Kamakazie Sith wrote:It would depend on the specifics of the encounter.
As always. But, if your first instinct is to wrestle a suspect into submission, I don't have any problems with a taser being used in it's stead, even if the suspect is unarmed. Kind of moot if cops aren't issued tasers. If deadly force is the proper response, then you use it.

There just seems to be this idea that, once you've resisted, you're always resisting or that resistance means that any non-deadly force is justified in response.

I remember this one old video I watched of like 4 cops beating some handcuffed black guy because he was "resisting." Which was true, he was flailing about and kicking at the officers. So, in response, they just kind of wailed on the guy with punches and kicks until he finally gave up. When asked why they didn't just let him flop around like a fish for a bit and just make sure he didn't get to his feet and run away, the comment from the police chief was something like "he could have hurt himself if we didn't subdue him further." Which is also true. But how is kicking the suspect in the face and putting a knee into his back any better?

I laughed so hard at that comment (and feel kind of bad about laughing) because it was so fucking insulting he could give that line with a straight face.
Placing a knee and your weight in to the back is effective in controlling a resisting handcuffed person as long as you are monitoring their breathing. Kicking a handcuffed person in the face though...that's felony assault.
Dominus Atheos wrote: The judge filed a lawsuit alleging the injury, so unless you think the judge was lying we can be pretty sure the medical report exists.
The DA also filed a report saying there was no evidence of an assault. I don't know about you but I would consider a crushed larynx evidence of intent to harm another person since such an act would require a very quick strike. If there is such a medical report then like I said before it would be strong evidence of the DA participating in a coverup.

---------------------------

Highlord Laan, you should know that my estimate of the time it would take for a person to come in and make a content less post was spot on. Your post reads like a +1 post with a dash of some vendetta. Would you care to explain in detail how saying that there might be good hard evidence of a coverup from the DA is saying that there is "nothing to see here". I look forward to your reply. Would it be fair to say that your IQ suddenly drops while participating in police related threads?
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Channel72 »

Alyesha wrote:At this point we have "he said she said" situation. What is actually in the medical report is the only way to resolve the issue. One side is lying. And its not the first time people have lied about police misconduct. Everyone can lie. Even a judge.
I'm inclined to believe the judge. The judge has no motivation to make up a story about police misconduct. The police, however, have everything to gain by lying.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by TimothyC »

Channel72 wrote:I'm inclined to believe the judge. The judge has no motivation to make up a story about police misconduct. The police, however, have everything to gain by lying.
Politics. The Judge in question was elected. I'd not put it past a politician to do what he/she thinks will help win him/her an an election.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

Channel72 wrote:
Alyesha wrote:At this point we have "he said she said" situation. What is actually in the medical report is the only way to resolve the issue. One side is lying. And its not the first time people have lied about police misconduct. Everyone can lie. Even a judge.
I'm inclined to believe the judge. The judge has no motivation to make up a story about police misconduct. The police, however, have everything to gain by lying.
I don't find your inclination to believe the judge unreasonable. He is a judge and therefore has earned a position of greater trust through many years of hard work and higher education. Though you're inability to find motivation seems naive.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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TimothyC wrote:
Channel72 wrote:I'm inclined to believe the judge. The judge has no motivation to make up a story about police misconduct. The police, however, have everything to gain by lying.
Politics. The Judge in question was elected. I'd not put it past a politician to do what he/she thinks will help win him/her an an election.
Although true, NY Supreme Court justices are elected to 14 year terms. I'm not sure how long ago his election was held. On the other hand, the NYPD has a known issue with misconduct, and as such, the Judge's story is believable to me.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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Kamakazie Sith wrote: I don't find your inclination to believe the judge unreasonable. He is a judge and therefore has earned a position of greater trust through many years of hard work and higher education. Though you're inability to find motivation seems naive.
Okay. Then perhaps you'll at least agree that it's a lot EASIER to deduce motivation behind the police covering up their own shenanigans than a judge inventing a story about police misconduct as part of some campaign agenda to score political points against the NYPD. (Hint: bad-mouthing the NYPD usually doesn't earn you political capital, because something something 9/11 something. New Yorkers aren't exactly out in the streets protesting NYPD misconduct (except for a few Occupy Wallstreet zealots); they're more likely to support the NYPD because they're afraid of things like bombs going off in subways)

Shit. I just typed "bomb" and "subway" on the Internet. I guess I can expect an NYPD raid promptly. Damn you, NSA.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

Channel72 wrote: Okay. Then perhaps you'll at least agree that it's a lot EASIER to deduce motivation behind the police covering up their own shenanigans than a judge inventing a story about police misconduct as part of some campaign agenda to score political points against the NYPD. (Hint: bad-mouthing the NYPD usually doesn't earn you political capital, because something something 9/11 something. New Yorkers aren't exactly out in the streets protesting NYPD misconduct (except for a few Occupy Wallstreet zealots); they're more likely to support the NYPD because they're afraid of things like bombs going off in subways)
The NYPD. Sure. The DA? That isn't as easy.

Still, I don't find the inclination to believe the judge over the DA unreasonable either for the reasons I listed.
Shit. I just typed "bomb" and "subway" on the Internet. I guess I can expect an NYPD raid promptly. Damn you, NSA.
I certainly hope so. A police raid on your home builds character and puts hair on your chest...if you want it.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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Covenant wrote:
Thanas wrote:How many of those incidents do we need to consider this SOP for cops in the USA?
The USA is more than NYC, thankfully. That's a broad assessment for the entire country. NYC has unique problems, to which they've created police forces that are entirely staffed with Berserkers from the Cult of Odin. The NYPD is also an organization that is currently and historically known for this kind of insane behavior, and at the same time many individuals look to NYC as an example of a city that has gotten crime "under control," in what has to be the most myopic assessment available. I don't think this is SOP at a nation-wide scale, but I do think it is fair to say that this is the kind of behavior that police themselves glamorize, idealize, and strive to be able to get away with. Be it NYPD style gang activity or small town militias taking over, the idea of control is huge and corrosive.
You know, while you're painting with that very wide brush, I know a number of guys on the NYPD who are good, honest, hard-working people who are actually out to help the community. Yeah, there are assholes, and probably a lot of them. It's a police department with 35,000 uniformed officers in the biggest city in the US. And it bugs me that I have to defend them, because this shit pisses me off too, but the assumptions and preconceptions are just too much.
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Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

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Do you think the NYPD is the only department of similar size in the world?
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Kamakazie Sith
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Joined: 2002-07-03 05:00pm
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Re: NYPD assaults a judge, intimidates witnesses, lies to DA

Post by Kamakazie Sith »

Thanas wrote:Do you think the NYPD is the only department of similar size in the world?
Of course not. As you know Germany Federal Police is around 30,000 officers and they don't have anywhere near the corruption problems that NYPD does. However, asking when can we consider this SOP for 35,000 officers is a very bold question. In fact, you actually went on to suggest it for the entirety of US law enforcement.
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