An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
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An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
Working on a historical fiction story, and trying to come up with a heavy duty AC unit for the mid 1800's.
Have studied modern AC and the mech work inside seems rather straight forward. In terms of Tech, I don't see anything really that shouldn't be able to be built in the 1850's or so, except... Except something to POWER the thing, the compressor and fan motor. What could you use to drive such things? Clockwork? Wind or Water power?
Curious to ask the more Engineering inclined on the board
Have studied modern AC and the mech work inside seems rather straight forward. In terms of Tech, I don't see anything really that shouldn't be able to be built in the 1850's or so, except... Except something to POWER the thing, the compressor and fan motor. What could you use to drive such things? Clockwork? Wind or Water power?
Curious to ask the more Engineering inclined on the board
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
You could just use a steam engine, water would work as well, but wind I think would be to inconsistent for it to function well, both the compressor (in some cases pretty much a fancy fan) and fan can be done with just getting stuff to spin.
Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
Here is a low tech solution that was actually used:
Cut up huge blocks of ice when the winter is strong. Preferably from Scandinavia. Then store a whole huge cellar full of ice. It will never melt.
Take out single ice block if you need to cool something down.
Cut up huge blocks of ice when the winter is strong. Preferably from Scandinavia. Then store a whole huge cellar full of ice. It will never melt.
Take out single ice block if you need to cool something down.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
For some reason I thought the heat from the steam engine would somehow screw up the AC.StandingInFire wrote:You could just use a steam engine, water would work as well, but wind I think would be to inconsistent for it to function well, both the compressor (in some cases pretty much a fancy fan) and fan can be done with just getting stuff to spin.
Of course given modern AC's work in 100+ weather in Deserts and such, I guess it doesn't mater.
ANd guess I should have given a bit more info, since the area where I'd be writing is in the south west US around Phoenix Az.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
No matter. Those ice blocks were shipped all around the world in ships. How else do you think southerners invented so many cocktails with ice in the 19th century?
Really, all you need is a large enough cellar.
Really, all you need is a large enough cellar.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
Well I assume the setup would have the steam engine be outside so the only heat it would add to the system would be what conducts along the axles or belts to the AC unit (which should be minimal).Crossroads Inc. wrote: For some reason I thought the heat from the steam engine would somehow screw up the AC.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
^ This. As long as the heat generating bits are outside the bits that are supposed to be cool you're good. In fact, modern refrigerators and air conditioners both generate heat while cooling.
There were types of refrigeration in the early 1800's. The used toxic gases like ammonia and some others as refrigerants. Aside from that, you'd need something that could power a fan compressor but that could, as noted, be a steam engine. If you have steady running water you could use a water wheel of some kind. Wind power isn't as steady, but if you just need cooling as opposed to reliably freezing temperatures it still might work. You'll have some cycling between cold and colder but for, say, cooling human habitations it could still be sufficient.
Evaporation cooling systems have been used for thousands of years in desert areas, including Arizona. You might want to look into those as well.
There were types of refrigeration in the early 1800's. The used toxic gases like ammonia and some others as refrigerants. Aside from that, you'd need something that could power a fan compressor but that could, as noted, be a steam engine. If you have steady running water you could use a water wheel of some kind. Wind power isn't as steady, but if you just need cooling as opposed to reliably freezing temperatures it still might work. You'll have some cycling between cold and colder but for, say, cooling human habitations it could still be sufficient.
Evaporation cooling systems have been used for thousands of years in desert areas, including Arizona. You might want to look into those as well.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
You don't really need a fan to run your AC unit unless you plan on making it around the size of a modern one. In the old days they simply ran a ton of pipes through the building and pumped ammonia or cold brine through them, letting convection do the rest of the work. This is what they did in warehouses & meat packing plants to keep things cool. So what you'd need is a few hundred metres of pipes in your walls & ceilings, a compressor & condenser on the outside, a pump to move the fluid, and a steam engine or waterwheel to run the pump & compressor.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
Or, in that era, a treadmill and some slaves.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
It is possible to make an air conditioner that runs directly off a steam ejector, employing evaporation to absorb heat. These are still built factory new today and were used extensively by the railroads until diesel locomotives took over.
You can also make an air conditioner that works directly off a burner via using that heat to evaporate ammonia out of water to absorb heat in a cycle. These are actually somewhat common in the world running off of natural gas, but any other intensive source of heat will work. Phase change is a wonderful thing like that. This is also linked into why Sterling engines work but that's another story.
Electrical compressor based air conditioners dominate because they are very safe, need no exhaust pipe, and generally convenient, not because other systems wont work or can't be usefully efficient. If you want something like modern AC in the 1850s then a steam system seems most likely. Making a system that runs off a compressor like modern electrical ACs would be very difficult in that era. Power is not the issue, the precision machining of such a high pressure cylinder is. It might be possible, it might not be, I am not sure.
You can also make an air conditioner that works directly off a burner via using that heat to evaporate ammonia out of water to absorb heat in a cycle. These are actually somewhat common in the world running off of natural gas, but any other intensive source of heat will work. Phase change is a wonderful thing like that. This is also linked into why Sterling engines work but that's another story.
Electrical compressor based air conditioners dominate because they are very safe, need no exhaust pipe, and generally convenient, not because other systems wont work or can't be usefully efficient. If you want something like modern AC in the 1850s then a steam system seems most likely. Making a system that runs off a compressor like modern electrical ACs would be very difficult in that era. Power is not the issue, the precision machining of such a high pressure cylinder is. It might be possible, it might not be, I am not sure.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
You only see those in the mid east for a reason, they don't work as dehumidification systems, and they exploited the fact that the desert night air was very cool to help keep all the duct work from heating up. Neat, but its not going to work anywhere, and its not anything I'd call 'heavy duty' as called for in the premise.
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Re: An efficient air conditioner without electricity?
boom.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_refrigerator
played around with this concept myself for a off grid cooler in vietnam. Never built one though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_refrigerator
played around with this concept myself for a off grid cooler in vietnam. Never built one though.
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