Ukraine War Thread

[Thanas]

Revisiting Crimea, looks like it is even more of a shithole (and building a bridge is more challenging than thought):

Russia's Soul: What Crimea Says about Putin's Future


President Vladimir Putin made himself immensely popular among Russians by annexing the Crimean Peninsula. But with the situation in eastern Ukraine volatile, it remains unclear how the move will ultimately be judged. A trip through Crimea provides some answers.

Just as the wait in a 12-kilometer (seven-mile) traffic jam starts to become unbearable, a young hippy and the Russian national anthem provide some relief. The heat is staggering, reaching up to 60 degrees Celsius (140 degrees Fahrenheit) inside the cars while the white disk of the son hangs directly overhead at the Kerch Strait, which separates the Russian mainland from the Crimean peninsula.

The young woman in a halter-top jumps out of a Volkswagen stuffed with sleeping mats, backpacks and music instruments. Another woman pulls out a flute and a bearded man produces a maraca. The woman begins to dance and curious onlookers quickly gather. One of them, a retiree from Moscow, has ridden his bicycle 1,800 kilometers "to finally see Crimea." A Porsche driver from St. Petersburg is standing next to him.

Then Alexei, the fourth musician, plays the national anthem on his guitar: "Russia -- our sacred homeland, Russia -- our beloved country." The wind carries bits of the lyrics down to the ferry docks at Port Kawkas. The strait is the bottleneck through which tourists must pass to reach Crimea, now that the war has made the route through eastern Ukraine impassable.

Alexei and his friends are part of a band from Krasnodar in southern Russia. But despite their sex, drugs and rock 'n' roll look, they prove to be supporters of Russian President Vladimir Putin. "It's wonderful that the president has brought Crimea back to Russia," says Lena, the dancer.

The overwhelming majority of Russians view Crimea as an ancestral Russian territory and see Putin as their hero, ever since his special forces took Crimea in early March without firing a single deadly shot. One of the spectators, a woman from the Volga region, is wearing a T-shirt with Putin's portrait and the words: "The most polite of all people."

"Polite people" -- it is a term Russians use to describe the soldiers who seized Crimea as well as Putin, who annexed the peninsula in violation of international law. It is a move that has dramatically ratcheted up tensions between the West and Russia. Sanctions imposed by the US and Europe mean, among other things, that Russians will no longer be able to eat American chicken or French Camembert. But for the moment, Russians are still scoffing at the sanctions.

Bringing Crimea "into its home port after a long, difficult and exhausting journey," as Putin put it, helped boost the president's popularity ratings in Russia to above 80 percent. Nevertheless, if Putin stumbles because of the escalating conflict in eastern Ukraine, his strong position in Moscow could begin to unravel -- his fate could ultimately be decided by the peninsula and the consequences of its annexation.

In May, it seemed as if Putin might pull off a repeat of his Crimea coup in eastern Ukraine. The region is home to many Russians, living in cities like Luhansk and Donetsk, and they too feel drawn to Russia and reject the new leadership in Kiev. Like the Crimeans, they too held a referendum.

Loyal to Moscow

The poll, though, was chaotic and not particularly representative. In Donetsk, announced results indicated that 89 percent had voted to secede from Ukraine, in Luhansk the number was an astounding 96 percent. The actual result was likely much lower and Putin decided against an invasion at the time. Instead, he supplied the pro-Russian separatists with weapons and cadres loyal to Moscow.

A war between Ukrainian troops and the separatists has raged since. In recent days, pro-Russian fighters have been losing ground, and it seems to be only a matter of time before the Ukrainian military enters Donetsk. But can Putin allow this to happen? Hardly anyone in Russia would understand it if he did.

Moscow tipped its hand last week, hinting at the possible deployment of "peacekeeping troops" in eastern Ukraine and facilitating the replacement of the Moscow-born "premier" of the "People's Republic of Donetsk" with a Ukrainian -- paving the way for the separatists to formally request aid from the Kremlin. This week, the Russians have assembled an aid convoy, allegedly under the auspices of the Red Cross, to provide relief to civilians in eastern Ukraine. The convoy is set to arrive at the Ukrainian border on Wednesday afternoon and Kiev has said it will block the trucks from entering for now, amid widespread suspicion that it is nothing but a Trojan horse.

It is a dangerous game being played by Putin. The opportunities for an intensification of the conflict are many, yet he also knows that should Kiev regain control of eastern Ukraine, they could be encouraged to try to reverse the annexation of the Crimea.

Indeed, the peninsula could come to define his legacy. He hopes to turn it into an economic miracle, evidence that Russia is rich and Ukraine is poor, and that an authoritarian government is more effective than the democratically elected government in Kiev.

So far, though, the annexation has caused nothing but trouble. The peninsula is now largely isolated. By air, it can only be reached via Russian carriers while by road travelers must sit in the traffic jam at the Kerch Strait. The result is that tourists are staying away. Furthermore, Ukrainian banks there have been forced to close their branches and international cards only work at a small number of cash machines.

Still, the Crimean Peninsula is now Russian and Putin plans to fly there on Thursday for a well-orchestrated, extraordinary session of the Duma in Yalta to hammer home the point. The Crimea annexation, Kremlin officials insist, "is non-negotiable." But a trip across the Crimea shows that the prosperity and stability promised by Moscow are still a long way off.

At the Kerch Strait

Improving access, though, is priority number one, and it has fallen to Svyatoslav Brussakov to make it happen. As deputy mayor of Kerch, a city of 145,000 people, Brussakov is part of an expert commission assembled to prepare the construction of a €5 billion bridge across the strait.

It would be a monumental structure, says Brussakov. And the idea is not a new one: During World War II, Hitler envisioned the construction of a bridge at the site and even started the project, but it was left unfinished when the German retreat out of Russia began in 1943. Plans for a bridge were revived during the Soviet era, but they were never implemented due to horrendous costs and technical difficulties. Because of silt and porous rock, the massive supports would have to be driven 80 meters (262 feet) below the sea floor to reach bedrock. "But Putin will do it," says Brussakov. "When our president wants something, it happens." Putin wants to dedicate the bridge in 2018, which is also, coincidentally, the year of the next presidential election.

Brussakov raves about his city's future prospects. Kerch, he says, is one of Europe's oldest cities, with an 8th-century church near the waterfront promenade. For now, though, he is left hoping that tourists from Western Europe will return one day. The European Union's economic blockade has made the peninsula more of an island than ever before and cruise ships from Europe are no longer docking at Crimean ports. Last week, even the Russian low-cost carrier Dobrolet cancelled service to Crimea because the sanctions forbid European companies from servicing the airline's fleet.

As a precaution, Ukrainian oligarch Rinat Akhmetov halted construction of an almost-finished cement factory outside Kerch. The new Russian leadership doesn't want an oligarch from Ukraine on the island, creating an opportunity for major Russian companies and oligarchs, which have already been involved in Crimea for a long time. Oil multinational Lukoil built a resort complex in Crimea, while financial and media magnate Alexander Lebedev built a luxury hotel in Alushta.

"Kerch used to be the wart on the ass of Crimea," says Brussakov. "But now the city is the gateway to a vacation paradise for the millions who come by car."

In the Artek Youth Camp

As it did for the Winter Olympics in Sochi, the Kremlin is relying on loyal, longstanding allies to complete its new, major projects in Crimea. Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Kozak heads the group in charge of all projects in Artek. And there are reports in Moscow that Putin even called oligarch Roman Abramovich and asked him to invest in a vacation camp in Artek, 200 kilometers west of Kerch.

Artek is one of the great myths of the Soviet Union. Some 1.5 million children have passed through the camp since it was founded in 1925. Yuri Gagarin, the first person to travel to outer space, went there seven times to give talks. Former Soviet leaders Nikita Khrushchev and Leonid Brezhnev visited the model facility, as did former Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi and Vietnamese revolutionary leader Ho Chi Minh. East Germany modeled its Wilhelm Pieck Pioneer Republic on Werbellin Lake, built in 1950, on the Artek camp.

But funds were cut so drastically under Ukrainian rule that the camp was forced to close in November 2013. Putin now plans to build something bigger and better in its place.

Alexei Kasprzak, 34, has a smartphone in each of the front pockets of his jeans as he climbs onto a dilapidated 10-meter tower above the empty swimming pool at Artek to demonstrate what a challenge modernizing the site will be. Broken tiles litter the bottom of the swimming pool and cats roam through the ruins.

"It looks like Chernobyl," says Kasprzak, who was appointed manager of Artek two months ago, with its 400 buildings, 10 dining halls, hospital, 11 athletic fields, seven kilometers of idyllic shoreline and small port. The site is surrounded by blue bays, cliffs and cedar trees. "It's the size of Monaco," he says. "We have all the conditions to turn it into Russia's top vacation camp, perhaps even the best one in the world."

Artek was always more than a vacation spot. It was a symbol. That is one reason why Moscow decided to send Kasprzak there. Years ago, he was a member of the "President's Thousand," a group of young cadres in the giant eastern realm, a representative of modern, cosmopolitan Russia. He could just as well be running a company in New York, London or Madrid. For Kasprzak, the vacation camp's past is mainly a marketing opportunity, including the 20-meter statue of Lenin, which former President Mikhail Gorbachev dedicated on a hill above Artek in 1985.

"You are part of a great history," Vera Bondareva tells a group of young people from a bedroom community north of Moscow during their visit to the museum in Artek. Normally fixated by their iPads, the teenagers are paying rapt attention to the woman, who, at 65, is old enough to be their grandmother.

Bondareva is filled with enthusiasm as she talks about her own youth. In those days, she says, the train ride from her hometown of Gorky, now called Nizhny Novgorod, took a day and a half. It was the early 1970s, and the Communist Party had sent her to Artek to work as a leader of the pioneer youth groups there. She recalls falling asleep as she gazed out of the train window at a landscape of snow and ice. "I woke up in Crimea. It was January, but everything was green," she says.

Crimea has been a Russian vacation spot since Catherine the Great captured the peninsula from the Ottoman Empire in the 18th century. In 1820, poet and nobleman Alexander Pushkin extoled the bay where Artek is located as a "beguiling picture, with luminous mountains and roofs that look like beehives from a distance." Revolutionary poet Vladimir Mayakovsky described the peninsula as an "exact copy of paradise" in 1928. Dissident and winner of the Nobel laureate Alexander Solzhenitsyn viewed Crimea as "Russia's natural southern border."

Crimea is now eternally Russian once again, says Bondareva as she begins channeling the passion of her youth, railing against the Americans, "who incite revolutions in any country where they have an embassy but no vassal government." Ukraine should go ahead and join Europe and Conchita Wurst, she says. "But then the Europeans should pay for this broken country. Putin is paying for us, thank God."

Bondareva is enthusiastic about the new young director, as are most of the 1,400 employees at the Artek collective. By annexing Crimea, Putin is reuniting two poles that long supported his rule: those nostalgic for the Soviet era and the cosmopolitan modernizers. Bondareva represents the former group and Kasprzak the latter.

At the Sevastopol Naval Base

Sirens are sounding in an atomic bomb proof facility deep beneath the rock at the southern end of the city. In Balaklava Bay, it becomes clear what Putin's main goal was in annexing Crimea: Sevastopol provides Russia's navy access to the Black Sea.

The siren spectacle attracts hundreds of tourists to the military museum each day. Submarines were stationed at the base in the Soviet era and Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin, while serving as Russia's ambassador to NATO, proposed that the return to Balaklava "in response to the advance of the Western military alliance."

Rogozin's suggestion could now soon become reality. New, state-of-the-art submarines could be stationed at the base by early next year, says Moscow military expert Pavel Felgenhauer. If it happens, it means that missiles could quickly be aimed at cities in Western Europe.

At the exit from the military museum, there is a view of the villas and hotels owned by former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovich and his family. He has been permitted to keep his real estate holdings, unlike current Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko, whose shipyard in Sevastopol is to be nationalized.

The excursion boats in the port of Sevastopol are only half full these days; the number of tourists throughout the island has dropped by 50 percent. The children of refugees from eastern Ukraine now stand on the waterfront promenade and do handstands for hours, hoping to earn a few rubles. There are posters everywhere advertising the parliamentary and city council elections in mid-September.

A Crimean Tatar on the promenade is railing against Putin. Like many others in her ethnic group, she fears a new wave of repression. Stalin had the Crimean Tatars deported because of their collaboration with the German Wehrmacht, and it was only under Gorbachev that the Tatars, a Muslim Turkic people, were allowed to return to the island.

President Putin already scored a minor victory on the city's main street, which is named after an admiral in the former czar's fleet. McDonald's, the American fast-food chain, has closed its local restaurant. It will soon be replaced by a different fast food restaurant called "Rusburger," or "Russian Burger."

Three students are sitting on a bench in front of the closed restaurant. "We think it's good that Crimea belongs to Russia," one of them says, "but Putin could have let us keep McDonald's."

[K. A. Pital]

A 'shithole' as opposed to what? The great shithole of Ukraine, with a life standard about equal to the Central Asian stans, or marginally better? I mean, how did you come to that conclusion on the basis of the article? Or, the shithole Ukraine's 20-year management of the peninsula turned it into?

I've been there. Many times. The 'shithole' is pretty much comparable to the average post-Soviet state. Better in many ways, too, thanks to the climate.

[fgalkin]

Does anybody really think that Russia will close her airspace? There are international treaties and (more importantly) hundreds of millions of income via flyover dues at stake. So far Putin has avoided damaging the direct income of the state.

Awww, Thanas, you're so cute. You think that the Lufthansa group or AF/KLM are indispensable? Any slack in flights to Asia and the loss of income to Russia will be picked up by Asian airlines increasing flights to Europe to compensate.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Siege]

There's some reports come out that Igor Strelkov has been "badly wounded". The rebels are denying it though. Not sure how critical he is to their efforts, but it'd be a PR blow at the very least.

[K. A. Pital]

Not sure how critical he is to their efforts...

Very. The situation there was basically anarchy and competing groups from private security corps vying to be the new 'lords of the realm'. Strelkov tried to form an actual small army out of them. Not sure how successful he has been overall, but the chain of command has improved since he arrived in Donetsk.

[Siege]

I knew he did sort of unify the rebel command structure, but I'm not certain if at this point in time he's a kind of supreme commander or more of a figurehead.

Meanwhile in Kiev the Ukrainian government continues its tradition of drafting sketchy laws:

Reporters Without Borders and Freedom House have called on Ukrainian authorities not to pass a draft law that would give the government power to censor domestic and international media.

The two rights organizations released statements on August 12 criticizing a proposed law that would give Ukraine's National Security and Defense Council "draconian" powers to shut down and restrict media considered as threatening to "security and national interests."

Ukrainian lawmakers approved the first draft of the bill on August 12.

Freedom House president David Kramer said while Ukraine is being subjected to "an unprecedented barrage of inciteful and willfully misleading stories on the airwaves, the Internet, and in print, this bill does not strike the right balance between security and human rights."

Johann Bihr from Reporters Without Borders said the draft law "gives the (authorities) exorbitant powers to order the broadest forms of censorship on the basis of extremely vague criteria and with no safeguards."

Liberty!

[Thanas]

Yeah, that's obviously BS.

Does anybody really think that Russia will close her airspace? There are international treaties and (more importantly) hundreds of millions of income via flyover dues at stake. So far Putin has avoided damaging the direct income of the state.

Awww, Thanas, you're so cute. You think that the Lufthansa group or AF/KLM are indispensable? Any slack in flights to Asia and the loss of income to Russia will be picked up by Asian airlines increasing flights to Europe to compensate.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Doubtful, considering the relative number of flights and capacities.

[mr friendly guy]

Indeed, the peninsula could come to define his legacy. He hopes to turn it into an economic miracle, evidence that Russia is rich and Ukraine is poor, and that an authoritarian government is more effective than the democratically elected government in Kiev.

Ukraine is more democratic than Russia? Granted Russia has its problems but last time I checked they didn't overthrow their elected president, er I mean the president didn't flee on his own volition.

Even prior to the events of Maidan, wasn't Ukrainian politics somewhat characterised by jailing of political opponents? This article smacks of a not too subtle propaganda piece.

[cosmicalstorm]

Might be invasionnight. Possible fire of e-bomba over Donetsk.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B3G_eminho0

[Thanas]

Even prior to the events of Maidan, wasn't Ukrainian politics somewhat characterised by jailing of political opponents? This article smacks of a not too subtle propaganda piece.

As much as Russia was, see Yukos, all the reporters killed and the opponents put behind bars? Nevertheless, Porochenko was elected democratically, nobody really doubts that. He also is not as authoritarian as Putin.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Even prior to the events of Maidan, wasn't Ukrainian politics somewhat characterised by jailing of political opponents? This article smacks of a not too subtle propaganda piece.

As much as Russia was, see Yukos, all the reporters killed and the opponents put behind bars? Nevertheless, Porochenko was elected democratically, nobody really doubts that. He also is not as authoritarian as Putin.

Are you really going to call that sham of an election when parties were banned and what not, really democratic? When half of parliament is empty etc.? And turnout in the East, notwithstanding the rebel cities, was poor?

I honestly find it utterly hilarious that you would happily/desperately find any form of legitimization for an illegitimate government. Smells of what the US supports in Egypt, Philippines under Marcos etc. I guess the EU should be glad to be slowly rising to the level of the United States when it comes to this sort of nonsense.

[K. A. Pital]

Yeah, as much as Putin's an authoritarian jackass, he doesn't make 'legitimate elections' with half the parliament empty and deputess beaten. Hilarious.

Also, "Yukos" is a private corporation and repressions against the oligarchs clearly mean Russia is not democratic because oligarchs... because... ?

[Thanas]

Are you really going to call that sham of an election when parties were banned and what not, really democratic? When half of parliament is empty etc.? And turnout in the East, notwithstanding the rebel cities, was poor?

I honestly find it utterly hilarious that you would happily/desperately find any form of legitimization for an illegitimate government. Smells of what the US supports in Egypt, Philippines under Marcos etc. I guess the EU should be glad to be slowly rising to the level of the United States when it comes to this sort of nonsense.

The presidential election has been declared as democratic and fair by all international observers. Even Russia legitimized it. And the turnout in the east is not really the fault of Poroshenko either, is it?

You got no case to complain here.

Also, "Yukos" is a private corporation and repressions against the oligarchs clearly mean Russia is not democratic because oligarchs... because... ?

Are you seriously that desperate to legitimize Putin that you think this trial was the hallmark of a legitimate government? Or have you forgotten what regularly happens to activists who don't like Putin's social order, like the nude protestor who is now searched by Russia for fucking in a museum? Or Pussy Riot? Russia is not a democracy. It is a leader-state, where a charismatic leader has all the power. There is nobody who can say no to Putin.

[Thanas]

And in a great show how Putin is to blame for most of this, here is what just happened last night:

Aid convoy stops short of border as Russian military vehicles enter Ukraine
Armoured personnel carriers and support vehicles cross the border, while the 280-truck convoy comes to a halt separately

The white trucks of humanitarian aid rumbled through Russia in a convoy stretching for miles, moving slowly southwards on the M4 highway, amid a landscape of fertile fields and Ladas stopped at the roadside – their boots overflowing with watermelons for sale.

But, while the trucks came to a halt well short of Ukraine's border, a different Russian convoy did make the crossing into Ukrainian territory late on Thursday evening.

The Guardian saw a column of 23 armoured personnel carriers, supported by fuel trucks and other logistics vehicles with official Russian military plates, travelling towards the border near the Russian town of Donetsk – about 200km away from Donetsk, Ukraine.

After pausing by the side of the road until nightfall, the convoy crossed into Ukrainian territory, using a rough dirt track and clearly crossing through a gap in a barbed wire fence that demarcates the border. Armed men were visible in the gloom by the border fence as the column moved into Ukraine. Kiev has lost control of its side of the border in this area.

The trucks are unlikely to represent a full-scale official Russian invasion, and it was unclear how far they planned to travel inside Ukrainian territory and how long they would stay. But it was incontrovertible evidence of what Ukraine has long claimed – that Russian troops are active inside its borders.

It was also ironic given the attention to the huge convoy of humanitarian aid that moved slowly southwards on the M4 highway on Thursday. As the convoy moved closer to the stretch of border controlled by pro-Russian rebels it was hard to escape the feeling that Moscow's aid convoy had the potential to turn into a slow-motion disaster, perhaps even prompting a moment that could push Ukraine and Russia out of the messy conflict fought by proxies into full-blown, open engagement.

According to Moscow, the convoy is a goodwill gesture, packed with much-needed aid for the residents of eastern Ukraine. In Kiev's view, the convoy is at best a cynical ploy; at worst, a kind of Trojan centipede, winding its way into the country at a border point no longer controlled by Ukrainian forces, the nature of its cargo taken only on trust.

The humanitarian convoy stalled for 24 hours in the city of Voronezh during Wednesday, but set out at dawn on Thursday.

At one point, with President Vladimir Putin more than two hours late to address a gathering of top Russian officials in newly annexed Crimea, and the first lorries in the convoy taking the turnoff from the main M4 highway towards rebel-controlled Luhansk in Ukraine, there were whispers that perhaps Putin's announcement was being delayed to announce that the trucks would enter Ukraine whether or not the country's authorities gave the green light, a move Kiev has said would be seen as an invasion.

In the end, the convoy ground to a halt shortly after the turnoff, still about 20 miles from the border and, over a period of two hours, the vehicles parked in neat lines, throwing up clouds of dust.

Russia's foreign ministry has said there are 262 vehicles in the convoy, including 200 carrying aid. Some of the drivers put the number at 270. Already, the start of a field camp had been erected on the site, with a dozen large tents and a shower area where the men could wash off the grime and sweat of the long journey.

The trucks could be stacked with weapons, some said. Others claimed they could be carrying advance supplies for a later Russian invasion using the ground troops that have hovered in border areas. There was also a suggestion that the circus around the mysterious convoy could distract attention from other Russian moves, a fear apparently justified given the military column that crossed the borderon Thursday night.

The hundreds of men driving the trucks in the convoy were all dressed in identical khaki T-shirts, shorts and caps, and there was certainly something military about their bearing.

For some observers, the large convoy moving with obvious top-level coordination and accompanied by numerous vehicles with official Russian military plates brought back memories of the "little green men" involved in the annexation of Crimea back in March. Wearing green uniforms without insignia, those men claimed to be local volunteers, although they were clearly highly trained Russian special operatives. Despite denying their presence all through the annexation, Putin later admitted that Russian military units had been involved.

But, with their easy manner, lack of discipline and in some cases physiques that hinted more at beer halls than special forces training grounds, the "little brown men" of the aid convoy are clearly not the highly trained elite troops used in the annexation of Crimea.

In general, the men did not want to speak about who they were or how they had come to be involved in the convoy. One said he was a volunteer from a non-governmental organisation, but clammed up when asked for the name of the organisation.

"I'm being paid to do a job here, not to stand around talking to journalists," he said when pressed, and then looked sheepish when reminded he had just claimed to be an unpaid volunteer.

Others said they were military veterans but claimed not to be serving currently. It is possible the convoy was assembled using the semi-official method Russia has used to find volunteers to fight for rebel separatists in eastern Ukraine – phone calls from military veterans' organisations offering work.

Those at the site were dismissive of fears in Ukraine that the convoy may be carrying secret military cargo. Two of the men in brown, who would not give their names but said they were "in charge of the cargo", offered to open any of the trucks picked at random and show what was inside. Men scrambled to untie the cords securing the tarpaulin on two of the trucks chosen by the Guardian and other journalists at the site.

Inside one were white sacks filled with buckwheat, while the other contained stacked cardboard boxes. Three men pulled the tape from one of the boxes to reveal newly packed sleeping bags. As the tarpaulin was pulled away, the original military green of the trucks was revealed; their exteriors apparently only recently painted white.

Nobody would say how long they planned to be there: a few hours or several days. Neither was it clear whether a decision had been taken in Moscow to move only with approval from the International Committee of the Red Cross, or whether a decision would be made to move ahead regardless, if diplomatic wrangling takes too long.

A lone car with diplomatic plates and Red Cross insignia arrived at the location of the convoy on Thursday afternoon. Two men inside confirmed they were Red Cross officials based in Moscow but refused to give any further information about whether they had travelled with the convoy, what plans there were for inspection, or whether more representatives were on the way. On Thursday evening, the organisation tweeted that "initial contact" with the convoy had been made, and there were "many practical details to be clarified".

The trucks do indeed appear to contain humanitarian aid, and there is undoubtedly a grim situation in major towns in eastern Ukraine, as thousands don't have water and electricity, and are sheltering in basements to avoid shelling. Nevertheless, Kiev's concern about the convoy, with its thinly disguised military undertones, is understandable. Two military helicopters accompanied the convoy south, and flew just a few dozen metres from the ground as it came to a halt. The head and tail of the convoy included a number of vehicles with official Russian military plates.

Separately, there were several military transporters loaded with artillery and tanks visible on the main M4 road during the day. Locals say the sightings have been ever more frequent in recent months, with Ukraine accusing Moscow of shelling its territory from inside Russia, and transporting heavy weaponry across the border, including perhaps the BUK missile system which is believed to have been used to shoot down a Malaysian Airlines passenger jet last month.

The armoured column seen by the Guardian appeared to be further evidence of Russia's incursions, which the Kremlin has repeatedly denied.

So Putin lied about Russian troops being in Crimea. Many here did believe them. They were wrong.
Putin lied about Russian troops not firing at Ukrainian troops.
Putin lied about Russian troops not giving heavy weapons to the rebels, including the misssile system that just shot down 300 civilians.
Putin lied about Russian troops not violating Ukrainian territory.

And on the same day where Putin is in Crimea and demanding an end to this oh so terrible brother's war [which he absolutely had nothing to do with, of course], Russian military forces cross into Ukraine, most likely to deliver more aid to the Russian-controlled rebels.

Right.

There is one outside force escalating this and it clearly is not the west.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

The presidential election has been declared as democratic and fair by all international observers. Even Russia legitimized it. And the turnout in the east is not really the fault of Poroshenko either, is it?

You got no case to complain here.

I do have. Because the system that brought him into place was not democratic and fair and quite frankly, why should I trust so-called international observers when they are hardly neutral?

Are you seriously that desperate to legitimize Putin that you think this trial was the hallmark of a legitimate government? Or have you forgotten what regularly happens to activists who don't like Putin's social order, like the nude protestor who is now searched by Russia for fucking in a museum? Or Pussy Riot? Russia is not a democracy. It is a leader-state, where a charismatic leader has all the power. There is nobody who can say no to Putin.

Moving the goal-posts much? First he questions your use of oligarchs, next you drag out pussy riot? All the oligarchs in Ukraine and Russia are serial tax evaders, including Poroshenko, which is something that in most Western nations would have been illegal but hey, if that's your thing...

[Thanas]

Moving the goal-posts much?

How the fuck is that moving the goalposts? When you can be jailed for protesting in a church then or for political activism then that is not a sign of a good democracy.

I do have. Because the system that brought him into place was not democratic and fair and quite frankly, why should I trust so-called international observers when they are hardly neutral?

But do you trust the Russian president when he says that Poroshenko is the legitimate president?

All the oligarchs in Ukraine and Russia are serial tax evaders, including Poroshenko, which is something that in most Western nations would have been illegal but hey, if that's your thing...

Moving the goalposts much? In any case, why is that important here now? It clearly is legal for Putin's friends to evade taxes, so...letting Putin get more influence is clearly the solution here?

[Thanas]

Meanwhile, the "toothless" sanctions are set to cost Russia up to 200 billions over the next three years. Rosneft has already asked the state to purchase 31 billion dollars of shares to offset their financial troubles (as they are unable to refinance in the west), whereas the Rosselkhozbank needs a high nine figure amount of money to remain operational. It is possible for them to get the money from China but it is unclear for now how they will do that.

Link is in German, as the financial times article is behind a paywall.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

How the fuck is that moving the goalposts? When you can be jailed for protesting in a church then or for political activism then that is not a sign of a good democracy.

Because you first bring up the Yukos case and then you drag out more stuff. Honestly, I have no fucking idea what you are arguing about, but clearly you have a distaste for Putin which is emotional to an extreme while glossing over all the excesses of your side.

But do you trust the Russian president when he says that Poroshenko is the legitimate president?

Erm. Why should I? You seem to think that I regard Putin as blameless in this affair, but I do not.

But hey, continue cheerleading for your side.

Moving the goalposts much? In any case, why is that important here now? It clearly is legal for Putin's friends to evade taxes, so...letting Putin get more influence is clearly the solution here?

You are the one who brought up the Yukos corruption case not me. You tell me why that is important. Of course Putin's friends get to evade because they are the ones who help keep him in power. Did the West not help some of the cronies that put him into power when they supported Yeltsin?

[Thanas]

How the fuck is that moving the goalposts? When you can be jailed for protesting in a church then or for political activism then that is not a sign of a good democracy.

Because you first bring up the Yukos case and then you drag out more stuff. Honestly, I have no fucking idea what you are arguing about, but clearly you have a distaste for Putin which is emotional to an extreme while glossing over all the excesses of your side.

Yeah, because I have never argued against the fascists there or said they were not engaged in human rights abuses. You can stop that stuff right now, I even linked to the reports of the UN. Heck, I've criticized the Ukrainian side a lot more than you have criticized Putin.

Erm. Why should I? You seem to think that I regard Putin as blameless in this affair, but I do not.

But hey, continue cheerleading for your side.

You mean, like you continually defend everything Putin does?

You are the one who brought up the Yukos corruption case not me. You tell me why that is important. Of course Putin's friends get to evade because they are the ones who help keep him in power.

It is important because you cannot frame this as Russia being better and therefore having a right to do what they did. They are not. They are a bunch of thugs interfering in the affairs of another country with military means. Which is where I draw the line. If you were against Iraq then you have to be against what Putin is doing because it is no better in principle.

[K. A. Pital]

Are you seriously that desperate to legitimize Putin that you think this trial was the hallmark of a legitimate government? Or have you forgotten what regularly happens to activists who don't like Putin's social order, like the nude protestor who is now searched by Russia for fucking in a museum?

Oh fuck off Thanas, there are much worse things that I saw happen to activists in Russia. The fact that Hodorkovsky or whatever got the sharp end of the stick is nothing; he's just an oligarch, and because of that all the Western media got psychotic about Putin; when social activists or left-wingers were thrown in jails, maimed, or even killed, your media were silent as usual.

I never ever thought that Russia is a democracy, just look at my post history here. In fact, how the hell do you think I ended up wandering across the world in a seemingly aimless fashion, instead of being in Russia, huh?

But your media are also silent about people being killed or maimed in Ukraine. They were before; and they will be again after the current fuss dies down. The whole media wave served to support the integration-favoring movement, and once that political goal is served, there will no longer be reports about detained, tortured, or killed people (I am judging by Georgia; after Saakashvili started tear-gassing and batoning protesters and there were quite horrible torture videos released from Georgian prisons, there was no media wave, no fuss... nothing).

You think you are on a moral high horse? Well here's the deal: go to Russia or Ukraine and try to do some left-wing politics there. For starters, you can try joining an independent trade union. Or forming one. If you are still healthy and alive in 2-3 years from the start, you can very well lecture me on how wrong I am by saying both regimes are stinking shitpiles (and one is less careful about concealing it, simply by the virtue of being more poor).

How the hell do you think Ukraine got about the same number of ultra-wealthy as Russia with having less than a third of the population and no oil and gas to speak of? Why the hell do you think wages in the Ukraine were on par with Chinese even 5 years prior, and must be lower than these by now?

And do you think with Yanukovich's former minister in charge that state somehow is new? Reformed? And that he was 'democratically elected'?

My ass was democratically elected. Post-Soviet nations are not democracies; stop judging them as such. They are worthless sacks of shit.

[Thanas]

Are you seriously that desperate to legitimize Putin that you think this trial was the hallmark of a legitimate government? Or have you forgotten what regularly happens to activists who don't like Putin's social order, like the nude protestor who is now searched by Russia for fucking in a museum?

Oh fuck off Thanas, there are much worse things that I saw happen to activists in Russia. The fact that Hodorkovsky or whatever got the sharp end of the stick is nothing; he's just an oligarch, and because of that all the Western media got psychotic about Putin; when social activists or left-wingers were thrown in jails, maimed, or even killed, your media were silent as usual.

Nope, I read a lot about the Russians clamping down on the left-wing or social activists. A lot of that in the German Süddeutsche Zeitung, which is a mainstream newspaper. So this whole "media gets silent" is bullshit.

I never ever thought that Russia is a democracy, just look at my post history here.

Cool. So what makes the actions of Putin more agreeable to you than the actions of the Government in Kiev then?

But your media are also silent about people being killed or maimed in Ukraine. They were before; and they will be again after the current fuss dies down.

Bullshit, just go take a look at the recent Tagesschau articles and those in the print press. You must not have watched any news media the last day, almost no day goes by without the media mentioning dead civilians and humanitarian catastrophes and highlighting the UN report about abuses being committed.

And do you think with Yanukovich's former minister in charge that state somehow is new? Reformed? And that he was 'democratically elected'?

My ass was democratically elected. Post-Soviet nations are not democracies; stop judging them as such. They are worthless sacks of shit.

And the solution when they try to move closer to Europe to become richer and a better nation is to encourage seperatism?

[Mange]

The story about the Russian [r]aid convoy becomes more and more bizarre. Now the Russian Foreign Ministry is accusing Ukraine for preparing to ambush and destroy the convoy and then blame it on the separatists: Russian Foreign Ministry statement (translated via Google)

Apparently, this information comes from the separatists who have claimed to have captured one of seven teams that are to "carry out" this action...

[Thanas]

Ukraine is now claiming they intercepted and destroyed the russian military convoy that crossed into their territory during the night, but that Russia continues to arm the rebels. The situation gets more strange each hour.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... -territory

Ukraine claims to have destroyed Russian military vehicles in the country's east, a day after a column was spotted moving across the border.

Ukraine's president, Petro Poroshenko, told David Cameron in a phone call on Friday that a column of Russian armoured vehicles had been destroyed. Russia has denied the vehicles were even in Ukraine.

A statement from Poroshenko's office said: "The president informed [Cameron] that the information was trustworthy because the majority of those machines [Russian military vehicles] had been eliminated by the Ukrainian artillery at night."

It added: "The president expressed concern over the situation on the border, particularly, over the fact that the inflow of Russian arms and military machines in Ukraine through the open part of the border continued."

The Guardian and Daily Telegraph reported on Thursday that correspondents had seen 23 Russian armoured personnel carriers, supported by fuel trucks and other military logistics vehicles, crossing into Ukrainian territory. It was impossible to verify the destination or ultimate fate of the convoy, or monitor how long it stayed on the other side of the border.

Separately, Nato said it had observed the Russian incursion. "What we have seen last night is the continuation of what we have seen for some time," said the Nato secretary general, Anders Fogh Rasmussen.

[K. A. Pital]

The story about the Russian [r]aid convoy becomes more and more bizarre. Now the Russian Foreign Ministry is accusing Ukraine for preparing to ambush and destroy the convoy and then blame it on the separatists: Russian Foreign Ministry statement (translated via Google)

Apparently, this information comes from the separatists who have claimed to have captured one of seven teams that are to "carry out" this action...

The convoy is clearly a ploy (even in Russia everyone's pretty much sure of that!); if they let it in, it could've been attacked and then intervention follows. So Ukraine took the best options they had and they closed the border posts, and aren't letting the cars in (for now). But I am not certain that Russia will not find another pretext to intervene, as the rebels are constantly asking for it.

Nope, I read a lot about the Russians clamping down on the left-wing or social activists. A lot of that in the German Süddeutsche Zeitung, which is a mainstream newspaper. So this whole "media gets silent" is bullshit.

Who the hell even reads newspapers in this day and age?

So what makes the actions of Putin more agreeable to you than the actions of the Government in Kiev then?

Nothing. I said both deserve to walk off a cliff; but at least Putin doesn't pretend much to be all that democratic; or when he does, he does it in a more civilized way, without banning even parliamentary (read: toothless) opposition parties, y'know. Putin, like I said, is an authoritarian jackass. But somehow you seem to be under the illusion Ukraine's government isn't more of the same. Or that Yeltsin wasn't like Putin (he very much was - the country was simply falling apart, so he had a lot less options to crush the opposition, but it wasn't all that safe, see 1993). I mean, in the Ukraine the opposition has turned to separatism and is now being shot at, shelled with artillery gunfire, aerial bombardment and all that stuff that is like what happened in Chechnya. But of course, Yeltsin was a democrat. And Poroshenko is a democrat. You guys stink, did anyone tell you that?

You must not have watched any news media the last day, almost no day goes by without the media mentioning dead civilians and humanitarian catastrophes and highlighting the UN report about abuses being committed.

Oh it is not over yet, the fuss. But very soon it will be.

And the solution when they try to move closer to Europe to become richer and a better nation is to encourage seperatism?

I can't seriously believe you are saying that when I see people from places like Bulgaria working like slaves for 300-400 Euros living in fucking basements in your very center of Europe. "Better nation" my fucking ass, it is just like the Tajik slaves that are working for the same money in Moscow. The Europeriphery is just the same old hell; in fact, it is so miserable people barely find any difference between that and living in Russia. And this is damning. Because living in Russia sucks.

[Thanas]

Who the hell even reads newspapers in this day and age?

ARD and ZDF are not newspapers and I'll have you know that newspapers are widely read in Germany.

Nothing. I said both deserve to walk off a cliff; but at least Putin doesn't pretend much to be all that democratic; or when he does, he does it in a more civilized way, without banning even parliamentary (read: toothless) opposition parties, y'know. Putin, like I said, is an authoritarian jackass. But somehow you seem to be under the illusion Ukraine's government isn't more of the same. Or that Yeltsin wasn't like Putin (he very much was - the country was simply falling apart, so he had a lot less options to crush the opposition, but it wasn't all that safe, see 1993). I mean, in the Ukraine the opposition has turned to separatism and is now being shot at, shelled with artillery gunfire, aerial bombardment and all that stuff that is like what happened in Chechnya. But of course, Yeltsin was a democrat. And Poroshenko is a democrat. You guys stink, did anyone tell you that?

Can you honestly tell me with a straight face that the opposition in the Ukraine is the seperatist movement? Because I find very little in the way of personal continuity there.

And you might think they are the same, but how does Putin not come off vastly worse here? He is meddling in other states. The seperatism is clearly illegal under international law. There was no oppression being planned or measures being taken to oppress the minority. And it is largely supported by Russia.

Oh it is not over yet, the fuss. But very soon it will be.

After the fighting is over, the fuss will be over. Yes. What is so enraging about that?

I can't seriously believe you are saying that when I see people from places like Bulgaria working like slaves for 300-400 Euros living in fucking basements in your very center of Europe. "Better nation" my fucking ass, it is just like the Tajik slaves that are working for the same money in Moscow. The Europeriphery is just the same old hell; in fact, it is so miserable people barely find any difference between that and living in Russia. And this is damning. Because living in Russia sucks.

Yeah, and there is no way this will not change, because after all the EU has no programs designed to combat that, right? It is not like there is a huge track record of people getting better like Poland, the baltics, Czech Republic, Croatia, Slovenia....nope, you just pick the poorest and youngest member of the EU to proclaim the whole thing as a failure. Which is really dishonest.