Unified All German Axis (RAR)

[R.O.A]

In 1940, a mysterious being appears before Hitler. Explaining that his goals align with the Nazi's, he uses his dark powers to bestow a miracle upon Nazi Germany.

On the morning of October 1, 1940, the nations of Japan, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Thailand, Finland, and Iraq are all merged into Nazi Germany. The populations of each nation completely vanish and are replaced with Germans. These new Germans are essentially indistinguishable from the "normal" Germans and act as direct replacements for their predecessors. So, an elderly Japanese woman that vanished during the shift would be replaced by an elderly German woman on October 1. From a demographic standpoint, the populations before and after the change mirror each other except for when it comes to race/culture/ethnicity. Note that this also means that any Jewish populations living in the converted territories are now converted into ethnically German Jews. In addition the property of the former nations disappears, replaced with German property. So, one can find German style villages all across Italy and Japan, for instance. Evidence of the previous nations cultures exist outside of the converted nations untouched, but within the converted nations it is virtually purged. Millions of citizens across the new Nazi Germany use Reichmarks and speak German. It is as though the former nations never existed, save for geography, and that Nazi Germany is spread over a much larger area. The change does not affect client states under Nazi Germany's control. Nations that were not one of the original seven are not affected by the change directly, but could be affected by later effects (immigration, for instance).

From a military standpoint, each nation's armed forces also disappear. The armed forces of each replaced nation are replaced by German equivalents, so what were formally Italian tanks are replaced with panzers, Japanese infantry are replaced with German infantry ect. As an example, German forces in Japan appear armed with K98K's and MP-40's as opposed to Arisaka's and Type 100 submachine guns. The military of each country is totally integrated into the German command structure, so there is one Luftwaffe, one Kriegsmarine, one Heer, and one SS across the whole of the new Nazi Germany. The government of Nazi Germany suddenly expands to control all of the territories, with a similar structure as before, just larger. The same commanders and leaders (with the exception of all the new ones that will have to arise) of Nazi Germany are still in control (so Hitler, Himmler, Rommel ect. still exist).
The leadership of the seven replaced nations are fully dedicated members of the Nazi Party and will not betray the Fatherland. They are, however, less ambitious than Hitler and his inner circle and will obey their orders. The new branches of Nazi Germany are committed to carrying out any orders that they receive from the Party and will contribute any and all resources at their disposal. Hitler and co have the same objectives they had before, but now have a suddenly much larger and more organized force. They do not understand what has just happened, but they quickly realize the expanded potential they now have. The rest of the world also realizes the change and will have its own reactions.

The mysterious being flees and does not return. No additional conversions will occur, but no one is aware of this fact other than The Being. Now emboldened, does the new Nazi Germany have the strength to succeed where it failed in reality, or do the Allies rally together and crush them despite there advances?

[Alkaloid]

The axis failed because they didn't have the economic muscle to defeat the British Empire, let alone challenge the USA or the USSR. It had nothing to do with insufficient levels of Germaness among the non German members. This does not change that. This does nothing to change the fact that there is no way the can produce enough equipment to win.

Also it feels weirdly racist that you would even pose this question.

[Thanas]

A combination of those nations and naval forces would be able to defeat the brits. But why would they start a war like this in the first place then?

This is just silly.

[Adam Reynolds]

How would one address issues of replacements that don't exist, such as German replacements for Japanese aircraft carriers? The Japanese had the best naval aviators in the world in 1941 and the Germans had none. In surface vessels it is similarly bad for the Germans in the Pacific as the Bismark pales in comparison to the Yamato. Even the vaunted U-boats would have trouble as they were designed for the narrow Atlantic Ocean rather than the open waters and extreme distances of the Pacific. Though they might benefit by better tactics and doctrine than the Japanese submarine fleet(who were almost exclusively used against warships rather than supply lines). Replacing an island power with a continental one produces a military ill suited to fighting the largest naval war in history.

Though substituting for Italians would be harder for the Allies as the Italian military was designed to fight a war in 1935 rather than 1942 and was thus all but useless by the 1940s. Presumably if it were all German equipment and training, it would be superior. Their surface fleet, however, would encounter the same problems as substituting for the Japanese.

What about the new German Japanese and Italian ranking officers? Would they have an admiral as capable as Yamamoto? That might actually help in the Atlantic as well, though presumably different setting would throw him off enough to offset whatever advantages he otherwise had.

The axis failed because they didn't have the economic muscle to defeat the British Empire, let alone challenge the USA or the USSR. It had nothing to do with insufficient levels of Germaness among the non German members. This does not change that. This does nothing to change the fact that there is no way the can produce enough equipment to win.

And it wasn't like German industry was always a model of efficiency regardless, especially compared to the Soviets or Americans.

Though the unified Axis would out build the British Empire. Based on the oft cited industrial potential given by Kennedy in The Rise and Fall of Great Powers, this united Germany would have more industrial potential than anyone but America, though the United Kingdom and the Soviet Union together would still barely outdo them. United Axis Germany would have 20.4% of the world's industrial potential(OTL was 14.4% Germany, 3.5% Japan and 2.5% Italy*). Unfortunately for them the Soviets would still have 14%, the British 10.2%, and the United States 41.7%. As long as those alliances failed to shift, the Axis were ultimately doomed regardless of whether Germany was in charge everywhere or not. The Shep Solution to World War two might very well be the case, with mushroom clouds over all of Unified Germany throughout the world. One would bet that the Manhatten project would be rushed and the B-36 would have actually been built by 1946.

* This scenario would presumably change those figures, though not necessarily for the better for United Axis Germany. The problem is that in the case of Japan, their economy could not sustain a German level of industrialization given their lack of natural resources, especially while trying to build a large navy. This is why the Japanese army was so under equipped compared with the rest of the world, the navy got first dibs. And it wasn't like they really needed serious resources against the decentralized Chinese warlords with even less equipment or scattered island chains until they ran into the US Army and Marine Corps and properly prepared British Army.

Also it feels weirdly racist that you would even pose this question.

I have to agree. It is rather ignorant to believe that Germany was unquestionably better than the rest of the Axis. Each nation had a military structured to their strategic position and it would be rather foolish to assume that replacing them with the German military would actually give any advantages that wouldn't be outweighed by the disadvantages.

A combination of those nations and naval forces would be able to defeat the brits. But why would they start a war like this in the first place then?

I would assume that if all of the powers were unquestionably loyal to Hitler, they would jointly attack the Soviets rather than attacking America in the Pacific. This would rather complicate things politically for FDR who would be hard pressed in forcing America into the war, though it would be interesting if they were still able to put the economic stranglehold on German Japan as they did to Japan in OTL.

Given the limited effectiveness of the German surface fleet and some rather odd design choices, caused by the lack of institutional knowledge of how to properly build a surface navy, they might not do as well as the Japanese Navy in the same position. If they replaced Japan they would presumably have the advantages of having the vessels already built, though the quality would presumably be lower.

This is just silly.

I probably have given such a pointless concept far too much thought, far more than the original author.

[Thanas]

I have to agree. It is rather ignorant to believe that Germany was unquestionably better than the rest of the Axis. Each nation had a military structured to their strategic position and it would be rather foolish to assume that replacing them with the German military would actually give any advantages that wouldn't be outweighed by the disadvantages.

It is well established that German troops outfought those of their allies by a more than significant margin. So yes, replace the European ones with German troops and that changes a lot.

[Adam Reynolds]

It is well established that German troops outfought those of their allies by a more than significant margin. So yes, replace the European ones with German troops and that changes a lot.

I was mainly talking about the problems with Germans replacing the Imperial Japanese Navy. Obviously the Wehrmacht was almost always more effective that the rest of the Axis Powers in land warfare(and the Luftwaffe generally at least as good as all of them in the air). I was also primarily referring to the great powers in play(The big sixI mentioned from Kennedy). I hadn't really thought about the extra manpower of the rest of the European Axis Powers joining Germany. That would have a significant impact.

[K. A. Pital]

German Navy couldn't replace the IJN even in their wet dreams. However, in Europe that would massively improve the Axis chances.

[Purple]

Another thing to consider is that with a sizable German force on their border that they can't just brush off as they did the Japanese the Soviets would have to keep a sizable reserve on that border as well. The now German army in China really has to do nothing but exist to tie up a lot of Soviet troops and material.

[Welf]

This would change a few things. For example this would make Germans an almost Asian nation. I only found numbers by 1950, but for Europe this would mean a population of 149 mln (68 Germany + 4 Finland + 47 Italy + 8 Bulgaria + 22 Romania) and for Asia 108 mln (83 Japan + 20 Thailand + 5 Iraq). If Manchuko gets fully "converted" too, the Asian Germans would equal or even excel the European Germans (wiki claims for Manchuko a number of 31 to 50 mln). Even without Manchuria European Germany alone would outnumber the USA, and whole Germany would outnumber the USSR.
I think that would change the WWII, not so much regarding to the resources at hand, but how they were distributed. There wouldn't be an invasion in Greece, and this the attack on Russia wouldn't be delayed so much and the Russians would face a eastern front. This might be the difference that would allow the German army to capture Moscow.
What I wonder is how Hitler would do about the Japanese invasion in China. Hitler was mostly motivated by ideology and was obsessed with the fight against Russia. German relations with China were good, so it would be reasonably for Hitler to put an end to the Chinese war and focus on the USSR. Then again Hitler was never open to reason and didn't consider things like logistics and resources.
Another goodie for Germany would be the access to the Iraqi oil fields. Without the loss of manpower to the Greece invasion and with possible reinforcements in the back of the enemy the dessert war had a slightly better chance to be successful.

[Tribble]

It is well established that German troops outfought those of their allies by a more than significant margin. So yes, replace the European ones with German troops and that changes a lot.

I was mainly talking about the problems with Germans replacing the Imperial Japanese Navy. Obviously the Wehrmacht was almost always more effective that the rest of the Axis Powers in land warfare(and the Luftwaffe generally at least as good as all of them in the air). I was also primarily referring to the great powers in play(The big sixI mentioned from Kennedy). I hadn't really thought about the extra manpower of the rest of the European Axis Powers joining Germany. That would have a significant impact.

IMO the Finns gave a pretty good account of themselves considering how hopelessly outmatched they were. I don't think that replacing them with Germans would have made them more effective in warfare, though that would have meant that the Germans would have had several more divisions marching on Leningrad in 1941.

[Alkaloid]

A combination of those nations and naval forces would be able to defeat the brits. But why would they start a war like this in the first place then?

They'd certainly outnumber them if they all lined up in the one place to fight it out. Frankly though I doubt they'd strip their insanely isolate island kingdom of it's only serious defence to try it, the RN would agree and it would take the Kriegsmarine years to develop a naval doctrine and build the ships that would allow them to decisively defeat the Royal Navy surface fleet and FAA. This scenario pretty effectively neuters the best navy any of the Axis nations had.

How would one address issues of replacements that don't exist, such as German replacements for Japanese aircraft carriers?

Depends how generous you feel. If you aren't then nothing. If you are Graf Zeppelin class carriers with the navalized ME 109s and Stukas. Either way they are seriously outclassed.

I would assume that if all of the powers were unquestionably loyal to Hitler, they would jointly attack the Soviets rather than attacking America in the Pacific. This would rather complicate things politically for FDR who would be hard pressed in forcing America into the war, though it would be interesting if they were still able to put the economic stranglehold on German Japan as they did to Japan in OTL.

Please, the Nazis just used fucking black magic to forcibly conquer an uninvolved nation right on their doorstep. The USA joins the war in 1940.

It is well established that German troops outfought those of their allies by a more than significant margin. So yes, replace the European ones with German troops and that changes a lot.

Well yes, but they were also uniformly better equipped than the other European Axis nations. Tribble's probably right, if you calculate $ value for fighting effectiveness the Finns probably come out on top, but that has nothing to do with them being Finnish any more than the average German soldiers ability to advance supported by a tank was because of his Aryan racial purity.

[Adam Reynolds]

Another goodie for Germany would be the access to the Iraqi oil fields. Without the loss of manpower to the Greece invasion and with possible reinforcements in the back of the enemy the dessert war had a slightly better chance to be successful.

Regardless of what happened in the desert, the oil fields of Iraq could never be used in Germany or Italy as it would be all but impossible to get the fuel to Germany. And with a much larger industrialized United Germany, oil reserves would be an even bigger problem than for the OTL Axis powers.

Depends how generous you feel. If you aren't then nothing. If you are Graf Zeppelin class carriers with the navalized ME 109s and Stukas. Either way they are seriously outclassed.

If you were interested in being extremely generous, you could allow for the Germans to inherit Japan's institutional knowledge of how to build a proper navy and give them a high end surface fleet and carrier wings.

Please, the Nazis just used fucking black magic to forcibly conquer an uninvolved nation right on their doorstep. The USA joins the war in 1940.

Alternatively religous nuts are convinced that it is a sign from God that the Nazis are correct and thus fascism takes over in both the UK and US and the united fascists kill the Soviet Union and create racial purity globally with their head start. Quite a depressing idea.

Well yes, but they were also uniformly better equipped than the other European Axis nations. Tribble's probably right, if you calculate $ value for fighting effectiveness the Finns probably come out on top, but that has nothing to do with them being Finnish any more than the average German soldiers ability to advance supported by a tank was because of his Aryan racial purity.

The cause doesn't matter. Regardless of the value for money German troops were more effective. At Stalingrad the Red Army was able to successfully target the non-German divisions and destroy them first, leaving the German divisions somewhat more exposed. Such tactics would obviously fail here.

But this would worsen the resource concerns(especially oil limitations) that plagued the German and Japanese militarizes in WW2.

[Alkaloid]

If you were interested in being extremely generous, you could allow for the Germans to inherit Japan's institutional knowledge of how to build a proper navy and give them a high end surface fleet and carrier wings.

OP says their kit is switched out with existing German kit. Closest match is the Graf Zeppelin, the Bf 109Ts and the JU 97Cs. Otherwise we're just arbitrarily inventing new weapons for them.

Alternatively religous nuts are convinced that it is a sign from God that the Nazis are correct and thus fascism takes over in both the UK and US and the united fascists kill the Soviet Union and create racial purity globally with their head start. Quite a depressing idea.

Well, yes, but if that happened in the US we can conceivably say it happened in the UK as well and might as well pack up and go home. It's an idiotic scenario created by a nazi fanboy who want someone to tell him how awesome the germans really were at fighting wars, so we might as well tell him they weren't really aryan supermen betrayed only by the genetic weakness of their allies.

The cause doesn't matter. Regardless of the value for money German troops were more effective. At Stalingrad the Red Army was able to successfully target the non-German divisions and destroy them first, leaving the German divisions somewhat more exposed. Such tactics would obviously fail here.

But this would worsen the resource concerns(especially oil limitations) that plagued the German and Japanese militarizes in WW2.

Of course the cause matters. If someone is consistently winning fights where someone else isn't there's a reason for it. In this case yes, upgrading all the tanks in the axis forces to panzers (although i notice we aren't specifying what tanks. Do all the little Italian and Japanese tankettes become panver IVs. Or panzer Is? Because frankly the panzer I is a more sensible comparison) is obviously going to give them an advantage they didn't have.

[Welf]

Another goodie for Germany would be the access to the Iraqi oil fields. Without the loss of manpower to the Greece invasion and with possible reinforcements in the back of the enemy the dessert war had a slightly better chance to be successful.

Regardless of what happened in the desert, the oil fields of Iraq could never be used in Germany or Italy as it would be all but impossible to get the fuel to Germany. And with a much larger industrialized United Germany, oil reserves would be an even bigger problem than for the OTL Axis powers.

Yes I doubt too that the Iraqi oil be be any factor unless we assume a German victory in north Africa and the middle east. Also I now think the German-Iraq (Germaq?) will be occupied very quickly. The allied forces sent 150.000 troops to invade Iran, and in the new scenario they would send those first to Iraq, then Iran. It will delay the establishment of the Persian corridor by a few months I would assume and bind more troops needed in the USSR.

[R.O.A]

The axis failed because they didn't have the economic muscle to defeat the British Empire, let alone challenge the USA or the USSR. It had nothing to do with insufficient levels of Germaness among the non German members. This does not change that. This does nothing to change the fact that there is no way the can produce enough equipment to win.
Also it feels weirdly racist that you would even pose this question.

I apologize if I seem racist; that is not my intention. Generally speaking, the war was two diverse coalitions fighting each other. The Alies had a fair deal of cooperation between their members, whereas the Axis had a lot less cooperation between members. In this scenario, the Axis is now unified as Nazi Germany, and so the "balance of cooperation" as it were is in favor of the Axis. I agree that they failed in real life due to lack of economic power, but now their economic power is in one "box" as opposed to eight boxes.

OP says their kit is switched out with existing German kit. Closest match is the Graf Zeppelin, the Bf 109Ts and the JU 97Cs. Otherwise we're just arbitrarily inventing new weapons for them.

They have to work off what was available (what they could have built/were planning to build) so I would agree with them having Graf Zeppelin's with Bf 109's and Ju 87's. I would also think given their plans (for the real life ships) they would also have wings of Fieseler Fi 167 torpedo bombers as well. Of course, the Fieseler's might get quickly knocked out by the Allies in which case the Germans are going to want to swap them out for more Ju 87's or Bf 109's.

Well, yes, but if that happened in the US we can conceivably say it happened in the UK as well and might as well pack up and go home. It's an idiotic scenario created by a nazi fanboy who want someone to tell him how awesome the germans really were at fighting wars, so we might as well tell him they weren't really aryan supermen betrayed only by the genetic weakness of their allies.

I am not a Nazi fanboy. My thought process for this scenario was setup so that the Axis side of the war would be completely homogenous in its composition. I am not trying to imply that there is anything special about Nazi Germany or Hitler or the aryan race or anything like that. The reason I swapped all of the cultures out for more Germans was to make it easier for the one united faction to act. If everything had not been swapped fully, it would be Germans controlling foreign weapons that they would not be familiar with and thus not as effective with. They would also find themselves in foreign countries which would further complicate things. I considered the idea of swapping the Japanese or Italians and having them be the basis of the united Axis but ruled that out as I believe that a united Axis based on Germany would be the most effective based on the German ground forces. A Japan based swap would produce a superior navy but it would greatly nerf the German Panzer armies which would make them more vulnerable against the Soviets on the ground. As was previously mentioned, the Italians were behind in technology, and so making them the new power would nerf the Axis in several areas.

Of course the cause matters. If someone is consistently winning fights where someone else isn't there's a reason for it. In this case yes, upgrading all the tanks in the axis forces to panzers (although i notice we aren't specifying what tanks. Do all the little Italian and Japanese tankettes become panver IVs. Or panzer Is? Because frankly the panzer I is a more sensible comparison) is obviously going to give them an advantage they didn't have.

Agreed, the lighter Japanese and Italian tanks get swapped for units of Panzer Is. I would say that any Italian P40 tanks would be swapped with Panzer IV's but those were not ready until 1943.