UK Mps get 10% payrise after freezing public sector

[madd0ct0r]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 93123.html

MPs have been given a 10 per cent pay rise - a week after George Osborne imposed a 1 per cent pay freeze on all other public sector workers.

The increase - from £67,060 to £74,000 - will be back-dated to May 8, the day after the General Election.

Beggars belief. Setting their wage to that of a nurse or similar would go a long way to concentrating the mind on the housing crisis.

[Titan Uranus]

No, they'd just be even more hooked into the rich fuck welfare system and be even more dependent on their friends and owners.

[Captain Seafort]

You do, I hope, realise that MPs get no say on what they get paid.

[madd0ct0r]

I'm not sure any level of payrise solves that.

Well, I'm sure they could legislate against it.

[Purple]

You are not seriously saying that any sane adult human being smart enough to become a MP would vote to cut his own wage?

[Dartzap]

Its depressing for two reasons 1) shite that timing after the continued pay freeze, 2) that's how much they need to ve paid to stave off the lure of bribery/corporate money.

[Hillary]

I'd be very in favour of paying them more but banning them from second jobs. If an MP is doing his job properly, it's a hell of a commitment and I don't begrudge them earning a commensurate salary.

[NoXion]

Its depressing for two reasons ... 2) that's how much they need to ve paid to stave off the lure of bribery/corporate money.

Doesn't seem to be fucking working, does it?

[Sinewmire]

I'd be very in favour of paying them more but banning them from second jobs. If an MP is doing his job properly, it's a hell of a commitment and I don't begrudge them earning a commensurate salary.

Reminds me of what Douglas Adams said about rhino poachers.

If you pay the poacher enough that he does not need to poach, then he will shoot rhinos and get paid twice.

It doesn't tend to be second jobs, but jobs they get after being a politician. People who relax emissions regulations finding themselves cushy jobs with energy companies, that sort of thing.

[Tanasinn]

Rape children, destroy your country's economy, steal from the poor, still get a pay raise.

[B5B7]

You do, I hope, realise that MPs get no say on what they get paid.

In Australia we have a similar system, and one hears the same rubbish always said - "Oh, the MPs salaries are determined by an independent tribunal". Yeah, and who appoints the members of this independent body, and what are their conditions of appointment?
It is quite possible for MPs to refuse to accept a salary rise. We have had some MPs do this.

[madd0ct0r]

You are not seriously saying that any sane adult human being smart enough to become a MP would vote to cut his own wage?

If that mp wishes to seek re-election or embarrass the government they oppose then yes.

[The Grim Squeaker]

Shame that there's a pretty tight correlation between wages and lower corruption in parliament members. It's almost as though anyone who qualifies could get a better paying job elsewhere anyway..
e.g. Singapore with extremely high wages, and excellent performance and low corruption.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general ... d-MPs.html

In 2015, Ipsa found that MPs’ pay has "slipped further to 78 per cent of their equivalents in the public sector". An MP's £67,060 basic salary pales in comparison to the public sector average, or that of a headteacher or colonel.

[Starglider]

Eh, the UK civil service has about 850 staff who earn more than 100k per year. 74k (+expenses) seems reasonable for what is essentially a professional legal job combined with lots of PR. MP salaries are a small fraction of what the UK legislature costs to operate, so this is not the best place to focus cost-saving zeal.

[madd0ct0r]

Oh, I'm not arguing that it's an ideal place for cost saving. I'm arguing its obscene the tory goverment mps are able to impose drastic paycuts and redundancies on the rest of the public sector but are comfortably insulated from ever feeling deprivation themselves.

In a highly related note, private rent in London has increased (by my calcs) at slightly over 3% per year.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... ine-report

So given the public sector there are locked to 1% salary, and housing rent is, on average 72% of income AND MPs are sheltered from that by their housing allowance, it's a pretty ugly image of disntaced elites.

[Starglider]

Oh, I'm not arguing that it's an ideal place for cost saving. I'm arguing its obscene the tory goverment mps are able to impose drastic paycuts and redundancies on the rest of the public sector but are comfortably insulated from ever feeling deprivation themselves.

On the contrary, MPs are very likely to be suddenly made redundant (at 5 days notice, albeit with a decent redundancy package) and experience significant deprivation, at least compared to a typical middle class job at that salary;

He was especially struck by the plight of some of the Tories defeated in 1997, when 160 lost their seats in the New Labour landslide. "One drank himself to death, two or three more suffered from alcohol problems and depression, another was so broke he had to take his kids out of school," he says. His response was to form an association of ex-MPs, a support group that aims to help members once their 15 minutes of fame - or perhaps their eight and a half years of infamy - is over.

Ashton paints a grim picture for those who have been defeated at the polls. "The shock of losing is traumatic," he says. "You learn that you've lost at midnight, your opponents are singing and chortling, it's a cruel, ruthless arena."

Reducing MP salary and benefits will increase the need to be independently wealthy or (more likely) funded by corporate sponsors and rich patrons.

So given the public sector there are locked to 1% salary, and housing rent is, on average 72% of income AND MPs are sheltered from that by their housing allowance, it's a pretty ugly image of disntaced elites.

This is one of many good arguments for moving the UK government out of London.

[K. A. Pital]

One drank himself to death, two or three more suffered from alcohol problems and depression, another was so broke he had to take his kids out of school...

Music to my ears.

[Simon_Jester]

The problem, Stas, is that in the nature of things legislators are subject to being fired on short notice.

If in addition to that they are also financially vulnerable as a result of losing their job, that does in fact make them more vulnerable to corruption.

So I cannot afford to cackle at the thought of Tory parliamentarians suffering financially, being abruptly thrown out of their homes or being unable to pay their childrens' school tuition, immediately after losing an election. Not if, at the same time, I am complaining that the current crop of parliamentarians are taking bribes.

At least, I cannot do both these things at once unless I am an idiot.

Service in parliament should come with a stable enough severance package (if not an outright pension) that parliamentarians don't have to worry about money while living a normal middle-class lifestyle for at least a few years after leaving office. That would cost the government, but it wouldn't cost the government nearly as much as the alternative would.

[K. A. Pital]

I think that the UK Tories deserve worse things than Darwin awards for stupidity. Drank himself to death? Don't fucking drink, moron. If everyone who had greater difficulties in life than a bunch of Tory morons drank themselves to death, not only would I not be speaking to you, but probably 99% of the world population would have killed themselves. Depression? How about these fuckers get a taste of their own medicine - what they once gave to the unemployed workers. People affiliated with the poisonous Thatcherist policies deserve worse things, verily. Cannot afford school? Well the whole Anglo-Saxon private education system that leaves individuals up to their neck in debt unless they earn tons of money is bullshit.

Frankly, were it some other people than the bunch of social darwinist motherfuckers otherwise known as "Tories", I would not have the same glee. But who lives by the sword dies by the sword.

I feel that making your deputees into guaranteed wealthy capitalists (let's be honest, these income levels pretty much are capitalist minus the associated risk) is not what is needed in the fight against corruption.

Denmark is top of the anti-corruption ratings, but it also pays MPs around twice the average wage, just like the UK. You are looking for answers in the wrong place. Britain as a whole is coopted by oligarchs, very simple.

[Starglider]

The political affiliation of the MPs is incidental; due to the timing of that particular study. The article makes it clear that the same issues apply to MPs of all parties (and there are many more online with the same conclusions).

[madd0ct0r]

Which mps just voted to freeze wages of other public servants?

[His Divine Shadow]

Rape children, destroy your country's economy, steal from the poor, still get a pay raise.

Ahh, the 1%'ers version of the Genghis Khan mantra.

[madd0ct0r]

The problem, Stas, is that in the nature of things legislators are subject to being fired on short notice.
.

I forgot to dispute this. UK governments have a five year term. There is typically plenty of speculation about the election date, and typically a couple of months of campaigning. I would not call it short notice. In fact I'd say a 4 year garunteed job is pretty fantastic, and plenty of time for the prudent to save

[K. A. Pital]

Not only that, but with a wage three times higher than the median you kinda start to wonder how the hell these idiots manage to let all this money go down the drain. When ordinary people manage to make savings even with 12-15 k Euro annual wages, I can't help but laugh at the poor MP narrative.

[Starglider]

The median wage in London is 35K GBP; a combined income of 70K just about suffices to buy our old house (a 3-bedroom terrace in a slum 15 miles out). I guess 74K GBP / year seems like a lot if you live in Northumberland, where you would have to be a senior legal partner, an exec director of a medium-sized company or a 3rd division footballer to earn that salary. Amusingly the usual wealth distribution is actually reversed for MPs, because MPs from the north get the large salary (relative to local living costs) plus the London living allowance, whereas the MPs from the London area get a much smaller salary (relative to local living costs) and no allowance. This is the opposite of the usual Civil Service London salary weighting. The specialised nature of modern politics also favours older MPs, who can retire immediately after leaving office, or young MPs, who have a better chance of restarting an alternative career if they drop out.