BANNED ARSENAL FOUND!!!!

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-03-23 03:31pm

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/03/ ... 88685.html

Cruise missiles found in hidden bunker

British troops outside Basra have discovered cruise missiles and warheads hidden inside fortified bunkers as part of a massive arsenal abandoned by Saddam Hussein's disintegrating southern army.

Cases of rockets, giant anti-shipping mines and other ammunition are piled from floor to ceiling in dozens of bunkers at what is marked on maps as the Az Zubaya Heliport.

The most disturbing find was two Russian-made Al-Harith anti-shipping cruise missiles, each 6m long and 1m in diameter, and nine warheads, hidden in two enormous reinforced concrete bunkers.

Another missile, as yet unidentified, was found still crated up at the rear of one of the bunkers.

Some of the boxes are clearly marked with the names of British manufacturers.

The scale and possible implications of the weapons find took British forces by surprise and raised fresh questions about the extent of the Iraqi war machine and the ability of weapons inspectors to cope with the task of scouring such a vast country for prohibited ordinance.

The discovery of the missiles - date-marked 2002 - came as British troops from the Black Watch Regiment fought to secure the area around Iraqi's second city, Basra, in preparation for the capture of the city.

The vast complex, surrounded by chainlink fence and barbed wire, stands to the southwest of the town, defended by a network of earth works and with tanks and other armoured vehicles dug in to the surrounding area.

But the defenders have fled after coming under attack from coalition forces.

Outside the perimeter fence are about 40 bunkers packed with a mixture of RPGs and other ammunition. Inside, 22 larger fortified bunkers contain larger weaponry including the Al-Harith missiles.

The missiles, with Al-Harith 2002 stencilled in red paint on the side, and covered with cyrillic writing, were housed in 20-m-long concrete bunkers, 8m high, buried under earth and protected by sliding steel double doors 30cm thick.

Painted grey, the missiles have two wings, each about 60cm in span and three tail fins of a similar size. There was no indication of the nature of the warheads fitted and experts have been called in to examine the find.

Also housed inside the reinforced bunkers were what appeared to be large anti-shipping mines, 1m in diameter, and a host of other munitions.

On one box, written in English, were the words: "Contract AS Navy. 5/1980 Iran."

Corporal Steven Airzee said: "The initial sight was a shock. We were trying to figure out what they were. You have to wonder whether the weapons inspectors have been there because they looked pretty big."

The entrance to the heliport is decorated with a picture of Saddam Hussein in military uniform.

The area is surrounded by wrecked vehicles and abandoned sandbagged fox holes, some flying white flags, and is overlooked by a network of watch towers.

There are fears that weapons may have been taken from some of the bunkers which lie open outside the perimeter fence.

Lieutenant Angus Watson said they found the haul when they arrived last night.

"The complex is massive and we were surprised to find a lot of the kit intact, easily enough for a whole brigade," he said.

They also discovered hundreds of leaflets lying on the floor, dropped by coalition planes, urging the defenders to surrender. The leaflets, and evidence of an aerial or artillery attack, appear to have persuaded the defenders to abandon their posts without a fight.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-03-23 03:41pm

MKSheppard wrote: The most disturbing find was two Russian-made Al-Harith anti-shipping cruise missiles, each 6m long and 1m in diameter, and nine warheads, hidden in two enormous reinforced concrete bunkers.

I guess FOX was right after all, when they said that one of the
missiles launched at Kuwait the first day was an ASM...

theski · Post by **theski** » 2003-03-23 03:41pm

Shep I mean Drudge I mean Shep nice digging man.. I think this will the 1st many banned weapons that will be found.. To the shagrin of the "Let the Inspectors do their job group""

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-03-23 03:43pm

theski wrote:Shep I mean Drudge I mean Shep nice digging man.. I think this will the 1st many banned weapons that will be found.. To the shagrin of the "Let the Inspectors do their job group""

I have that feeling too. The Inspections were never particularly effective and probanly less so this time around.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-03-23 03:44pm

victoly.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-03-23 03:44pm

While they may have been delivered illegally under the weapons embargo, I'm pretty sure they're not illegal for Iraq to posses

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 2003-03-23 04:20pm

Something good to come out of a shitty day, heh?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-03-23 04:23pm

I thought we were supposed to be looking for WMD, not conventional weapons like anti-ship missiles. Is there something scandalous about these missiles that I'm not aware of?

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2003-03-23 04:29pm

Darth Wong wrote:I thought we were supposed to be looking for WMD, not conventional weapons like anti-ship missiles. Is there something scandalous about these missiles that I'm not aware of?

The UN greatly restricted the delivery of weapons to Iraq during the embargo as well as put restrictions on how far their missiles were allowed to go.

Right now, however, I haven't seen anything that indicates a violation of the embargo or the ceasefire in Shep's article.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-03-23 04:31pm

Darth Wong wrote:I thought we were supposed to be looking for WMD, not conventional weapons like anti-ship missiles. Is there something scandalous about these missiles that I'm not aware of?

Those missles? No

But ballistic missiles about 150 km in range are prohibited. That means Scuds and the Al Samoud missles are illegal.

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-03-23 05:26pm

I'm not familiar with international law, but I was wondering what the international reaction to finding WMD would be. If we demonstrate that Iraq violated the UN by having these weapons, but we do it by violating the UN and going to war, is our evidence admissable?
Like, if a cop enters your house, opens the closet and finds a bunch of pot, he can't get you for it (not immediately, at least) because he didn't have the proper warrants.

So do you guys think that other countries will jump aboard if (when) we find WMD?

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-03-23 05:29pm

Darth Wong wrote:I thought we were supposed to be looking for WMD, not conventional weapons like anti-ship missiles. Is there something scandalous about these missiles that I'm not aware of?

If they where shipped to Iraq in 2002 it means Iraq was violating the UN weapons embargo and so is another nation. But then that's been known for a while, its just there's never been physical proof of something actually reaching Iraq.

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2003-03-23 06:01pm

Robert Treder wrote: So do you guys think that other countries will jump aboard if (when) we find WMD?

I'm more interested to know what will they do if no WMD are found or proven to exist. Apologize to Saddam and leave? Sorry for the inconvenience, mate!

Many people will be quite angry with the U.S (and westerners in general) if that particular scenario happened.

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2003-03-23 06:11pm

I'm more interested to know what will they do if no WMD are found or proven to exist. Apologize to Saddam and leave? Sorry for the inconvenience, mate!

It ain't just about WMD's, you know. It's about ALL the UN sanctions that Iraq has violated. So far, evidence has been uncovered that he's violated a LOT of them. How come everyone only cares about the ONE sanction, then?

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2003-03-23 06:15pm

SPOOFE wrote: It ain't just about WMD's, you know. It's about ALL the UN sanctions that Iraq has violated. So far, evidence has been uncovered that he's violated a LOT of them. How come everyone only cares about the ONE sanction, then?

Because it's the one more worthy of an invasion. Saddam's threat to our security comes primarly from his alleged possession of WMD, which he can use on others or conveniently pass to a terrorist third party. Not all violations of UN sanctions are equivalent to war. Or else we should be advancing to Israel next, and plenty of other countries.

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2003-03-23 07:30pm

No wonder Russia was against this war, they didn't want us to find out they've been selling missiles to Iraq despite sanctions.

Nathan F · Post by **Nathan F** » 2003-03-23 07:34pm

Speaking of which, it has now been released that the Russians have been giving the Iraqis supplies up until only a couple weeks ago. I think they were setting up GPS jammers for them just recently.

theski · Post by **theski** » 2003-03-23 07:35pm

Any comment from Stas bush on the Russian involvement

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2003-03-23 07:37pm

Nathan F wrote:Speaking of which, it has now been released that the Russians have been giving the Iraqis supplies up until only a couple weeks ago. I think they were setting up GPS jammers for them just recently.

They think that the 'technicians' are still there now. It appears that the US goverment has lodged an official complaint to the Russian goverment.

theski · Post by **theski** » 2003-03-23 07:38pm

heres the link to the story http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,81917,00.html

Einhander Sn0m4n · Post by **Einhander Sn0m4n** » 2003-03-23 07:59pm

theski wrote:Any comment from Stas bush on the Russian involvement

LMFAO! Yeah Stas, WHAT do YOU think about this?!

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-03-23 08:08pm

Colonel Olrik wrote:
Robert Treder wrote: So do you guys think that other countries will jump aboard if (when) we find WMD?
I'm more interested to know what will they do if no WMD are found or proven to exist. Apologize to Saddam and leave? Sorry for the inconvenience, mate!

Many people will be quite angry with the U.S (and westerners in general) if that particular scenario happened.

It wouldn't matter, at least not from a legal standpoint. There's plenty more resolutions he has violated, and the cease-fire was broken long ago. And of course the UN resolution which directly resulted in Desert Storm calls both for liberating Kuwait and restoring peace and stability to the region.

Post by **weemadando** » 2003-03-23 08:13pm

False start by MKSheppard, second warning...

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-03-23 10:31pm

theski wrote:Shep I mean Drudge I mean Shep nice digging man.. I think this will the 1st many banned weapons that will be found.. To the shagrin of the "Let the Inspectors do their job group""

Actually, the French and anyone else who favors inspections can easily say that this is a good example of why we should allow the inspections to continue. They'll say that the inspectors would have found this if they had been given more time.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-03-23 10:32pm

Darth Wong wrote:I thought we were supposed to be looking for WMD, not conventional weapons like anti-ship missiles. Is there something scandalous about these missiles that I'm not aware of?

They might have been wearing dirty thongs or something.

Even if no WMDs are found, it would be possible to find other reasons to justify the invasion.

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