Payday 2

[Chardok]

Hey all - Long time! Through my D&D Podcast group, I've recently gotten hooked (Hard) on Payday 2. Now - I'm not a super big fan of online multiplayer gaming. (I find the communities to be generally toxic and unwelcoming)But man, is this ever a great game! Totally Left 4 Dead co-op type experience with dynamic environments that can change from mission to mission, a deep (and ridiculous) upgrade system, and just tons of faceshooting fun. I generally roll with a normal group and rarely play with Randos, but I will say that I've not experienced one single A-hole when I have. The community is welcoming and is more than willing to help out nooblets, and, even if you suck hardcore like I do, are happy to laugh off your idiotic moves without berating you.

All that said - it's biggest strength is also it's biggest flaw. You *have* to play it online. It's near-impossible to play solo on account of the friendly AI being utterly shit. The GOTY will almost certainly be on sale soon, as the annual celebration of the game (Dubbed Crimefest) is coming up soon (I got my GOTY for 4 bucks) but if any of you want to join me on a cop-smashing, safe-picking, Drug-fueled international romp, feel free to add me on Steam. Username is what you would expect it to be.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

You can play solo, but it helps a lot to know what you're doing on a given heist and be reasonably high level. Most stealthable heists can be stealthed solo on Overkill and sometimes even Deathwish, though it helps to have a Ghost-focused build (which is less of an issue now with multiple build sets).

I haven't played in awhile, so I haven't stayed up to date on the newer heists. It's a fantastic game though and definitely one of the best of the "4-player-co-op" genre.

[Chardok]

You can play solo, but it helps a lot to know what you're doing on a given heist and be reasonably high level. Most stealthable heists can be stealthed solo on Overkill and sometimes even Deathwish, though it helps to have a Ghost-focused build (which is less of an issue now with multiple build sets).

I haven't played in awhile, so I haven't stayed up to date on the newer heists. It's a fantastic game though and definitely one of the best of the "4-player-co-op" genre.

I'm running with a Ghost/Fugitive/Crook deck build. Dodge/Speed FTW! I just got the ability to pick safes open and that has been a godsend. I managed to fully stealth/solo Framing Frame (3-day art heist/drug frame-up mission) on Normal ONLY. IT's insanely difficult because stealth is so very, very broken in the game. You basically have to be perfect, and have favorable mission layout (for the uninitiated, asset/item/guard/camera/other security placement is randomized between several possible locations on each map.)

[Mr Bean]

Hmm Payday 2, I've heard of that game could it be... oh yes the one I invested 640 hours of my life into.

FYI as a Longtime Payday 2 veteran, playing offline is quite possible except for one massive issue... AI can't carry bags. I'm sorry but this makes some heists (I'm looking at you Big Bank) which have 15+ bags and a fair distance to travel as pretty much impossible. Playing online however is fine, just beware people who have the "bad" infamy levels. IE Infamy 5 and Infamy 25, because the game stores everything locally it is a crazy easy to hack game meaning it's quite possible to run into someone who has all of the skills and a button on their keyboard which murdered every police officer on the map.

Just leave those people games, don't talk to them... Also once you have hit infamy a time or time consider looking into mods much like Skyrim there are many "good" mods. Here is a semi-instructional video for example.

Aside from those "quality" mods there are also useful mods which do everything from make the UI better or improve gun sounds to things like Hoxhud (Dev approved) which simply make the game better.

Also a last note, in the past it was One paid DLC to one free DLC nowadays it's six paid DLC to six free DLC in a giant chunk during Crimefest so minus a free thing or two in March this is likely the entire batch of free Payday 2 updates during Crimefest over the next week.

That said most Payday 2 DLC goes on sale for like 90% off inside of six months, they rely on early adopters for the profit base then let everyone else get it cheap half a year later.

[Chardok]

I've run the calculations, and all the DLC I *didn't* get with the GOTY will be 16 bucks during crimefest.

Also - Add me, you filthy animal.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

I'm running with a Ghost/Fugitive/Crook deck build. Dodge/Speed FTW! I just got the ability to pick safes open and that has been a godsend. I managed to fully stealth/solo Framing Frame (3-day art heist/drug frame-up mission) on Normal ONLY. IT's insanely difficult because stealth is so very, very broken in the game. You basically have to be perfect, and have favorable mission layout (for the uninitiated, asset/item/guard/camera/other security placement is randomized between several possible locations on each map.)

Nah. There's a few heists where RNG will fuck you over (Big Bank, Big Oil, GO Bank come to mind), and some random placements/guards can make it easier or harder on most heists, but most are still perfectly doable.

That said, Framing Frame is one of the harder ones, especially if you go for the gold in the vault (though if you've gotten that far you might as well just grab it). For stealth practice, do Ukrainian Job or Jewelry Store, then move up to Diamond Store. Shadow Raid is like one big stealth playground, and is also great for fine-tuning your stealth technique once you've mastered the basics - Shadow Raid can be solo'd on Overkill/Deathwish for quite a lot of cash and XP.

The standard bank variations can be solo stealthed, but it's a lot harder without a partner. You can RNG the vault in back and do it relatively easily, but 50% of banks are going to have the vault in front which almost necessitates a partner so that you can control both the tellers and the rest of the civvies at the same time. Even then, there are ways to manage, such as Control Freak.

[TheFeniX]

I think you need 3 people with Cable Guy Aced to pacify a deathwish bank without killing anyone. We give it a go every once in a while, but I still haven't pugged anything but loud missions. The problem is some missions just aren't worth the payout and are only worth doing once, at least IMO. Sticking with Deathwish Banks and Diamond Stores is easy money. We go loud on transports and Mallcrashers when we get bored, as mallcrasher Overkill+ has a lot of money if you can saw the ATMs quickly, do the damage, and get out.

Go Bank Deathwish is still our heel. Fucking all the way to the vault open, I say "watch for the lasers" for like the 5th fucking time. "Watch for the wha- BRRR BRRR BRRR!" It's like a raid boss fight and there's that one guy who just doesn't fucking get it.

[Mr Bean]

Easy money remains the HRT banks because from normal to Deathwish there is only ever four guards and with insider you can get a keycard to get the camera guy. These days I "steath" banks with hand grenades, flamethrowers and an ecm, as long as I have three people with me so we each get a pager. As long as everyone answers pagers you can control the bank (IR murder everyone inside) within fifteen seconds.

Easy money mission remains however Hoxton Breakout, or a twenty minute Cook Off since even on overkill that's a million per bag every three minutes or so.

[Chardok]

Shadow Raid can be solo'd on Overkill/Deathwish for quite a lot of cash and XP.

You are fucking craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazy.


I tried that with a group of multi-infamied stealthers for *hourrrrrrrrrrrrrrs* last week. Never ever made it. not once. For my money - Rats is the money shot if you need raw cash and Framing frame for XP

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Well, it helps to use a minor exploit. Spoiler

If you stand on the corner of the roof where the chopper can land when Bane announces its arrival, the chopper will always be an artifact crate rather than a bunch of guards. Extra guards can make it almost impossible to complete on Overkill+ since you need your limit of 4 kills to clear out the camera operator and 3 of the guys inside the warehouse.

[TheFeniX]

Easy money remains the HRT banks because from normal to Deathwish there is only ever four guards and with insider you can get a keycard to get the camera guy. These days I "steath" banks with hand grenades, flamethrowers and an ecm, as long as I have three people with me so we each get a pager. As long as everyone answers pagers you can control the bank (IR murder everyone inside) within fifteen seconds.

Not knocking that playstyle, because it's obviously relevant and a good way to do it, but that's specifically why I'm adverse to pugging. I actually prefer to bait out guards (harder, obviously on DW) and handle the civvies with Cable Guy or Control Freak. I really don't care to do murder-all stealth unless I don't have the manpower to do it otherwise. However, with more manpower, means the quicker and dirtier solution is actually easier in some areas.

[Chardok]

In one pug group, we stealthed Ukranian job easy peasy. I think we *may* have stealthed that one bank with the impact drill? if not it was some other bank thing. It was beautiful to watch. I was quite useful then (I hadn't infamied yet), because I had a saw with a silent motor and a full mastermind tree with gambler.

Or was it crew chief?

Whatever.

[Gaidin]

Shadow Raid can be solo'd on Overkill/Deathwish for quite a lot of cash and XP.

You are fucking craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazy.


I tried that with a group of multi-infamied stealthers for *hourrrrrrrrrrrrrrs* last week. Never ever made it. not once. For my money - Rats is the money shot if you need raw cash and Framing frame for XP

Were you all running around in there? Easy way to get spotted, that. Everybody needs a job, get the bags to the van. Get the bags to the zipline. One person in the warehouse until and unless you're bothering with the keycards. But good lord, until you take out camera man and thin out the right guards, multiple people derping around the warehouse is an awesome way to get caught.

[Mr Bean]

Shadow Raid can be solo'd on Overkill/Deathwish for quite a lot of cash and XP.

You are fucking craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazy.


I tried that with a group of multi-infamied stealthers for *hourrrrrrrrrrrrrrs* last week. Never ever made it. not once. For my money - Rats is the money shot if you need raw cash and Framing frame for XP

Were you all running around in there? Easy way to get spotted, that. Everybody needs a job, get the bags to the van. Get the bags to the zipline. One person in the warehouse until and unless you're bothering with the keycards. But good lord, until you take out camera man and thin out the right guards, multiple people derping around the warehouse is an awesome way to get caught.

There are four distinct jobs in Shadow Raid, Camera man, 2nd level warehouse guy, outside guy and sewer guy.

1. Camera guy takes the alleyway ladder parkour his way over to the roof then takes either the stairs or the railing route down to camera room and kills the camera guy
2. 2nd floor warehouse guy follows camera guy but focuses on finding a crowbar then opening and if possible bagging) all the 2nd floor loot
3. Outside guy parkours his way into the outer yard and starts opening containers and tossing money bags over the wall to the van
4. Sewer guy takes the thermite burns his way into the warehouse backrooms to create an escape route and then begins looting the warehouse and tossing everything into the sewer for transport back to the van or the ziplines.

Only one guy in each area and warehouse 1st floor guy is on his own for a reason since his route is shortest (Toss it in the sewer bam invisible) and because of the amount of stuff to open.

[Chardok]

I DID IT!!! Solo'd that bitch on Overkill!!!! WOO! It was like *art* I know every inch of that place, now. There's a little alcove on the side with the crane that her a stairway up to the yard (Which I cleaned out effortlessly), the hardest part was finding the crowbar since I took so much time casing the joint that The guards went into stationary mode (which I had no idea was a thing, but it is.)

[Gaidin]

So is anybody screwing around with Crimefest stuff yet? I haven't gotten to because oh my god they changed my god damn arsenal. The fuckers.

[Mr Bean]

So is anybody screwing around with Crimefest stuff yet? I haven't gotten to because oh my god they changed my god damn arsenal. The fuckers.

The payday 2 Community is in a state of ultimate salt at the moment because the very first reward of Crimefest announced was... micro-transaction DLC.

Keep in mind Payday 2 and DLC has had a odd history but in brief....
For the first year it was one free DLC to one paid DLC until it became two paid dlc to every free dlc.
For year two it was one paid dlc every two months and an entire month of free DLC in Crimefest, the game devs set goals and when achieved unlocked free dlc.

For year three everyone imaged it was going the same, paid dlc every two months then a big helping of free dlc during Crimefest except... the very first bit of "free" dlc announced was PAID CSGO style skins complete with rarity tiers and the extra kick in the balls... the skins affect gun stats something not even CSGO skins do.

Hell look at the forums and subreddit where top vote getting threads have titles like "Fuck you overkill" and "Lets change the name to Pay2Day" and various Overkill related petitions.

TL:DR Crimefest is a once a year thing that Overkill does to make lots of free DLC for Payday 2, however the first Crimefest announcement this year was for something not only not free but micro-transaction based. (Fooking drills costs 2.50$ per crate, each crate contains ONE skin)

[Chardok]

Beyond the whole "Buy a drill to open the thing" piece - the "Safe" takes up at LEAST 1/3rd of your chance to get some regular-ass weapon mods/loot/etc. .

This is how great games die. I mean - it's the most crass, disgusting money-grabby thing they could've done. Pay to win (or pay to enhance) mechanics in a PREMIUM (read: Full Priced not free games) are *NEVER* okay. Even if it was just cosmetic, you're creating a system of haves and have-nots that, like it or not, will make the game far more unpleasant for the have-nots because no matter how strong-willed you are, you are going to be constantly assaulted with the ZOMG COOL WEAPONSKIN LOLOL, and that just has no place in a game as community-driven and, dare I say, community focused (until now) as Payday 2 is.

For my money, Chains' reaction in the opening cinematic to Vlad's "New opportunity" is poetic and disgusting at the same time. On the one hand, he basically tells Vlad to fuck off, but on the other hand, he gives him a handful of coins.

I prefer to think of his reaction as Fully "Fuck off.", and I really hope this is a giant Troll by Overkill.

Please, please, let this be a troll....

[Chardok]

as a side note: All the example "premium" or whatever weapon skins I've seen are stupid.

On another note: I hate the new customization screen. It needlessly eats up system resources and, you know what? I don't really care what my weapon looks like after I customize it, anyway. I can count the number of times I've looked at my modded weapon on one hand - using zero fingers. I look at how a mod affects my weapon's stats, not the appearance.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Yeah, I've been a big fan of Payday for a long time now, but this is... yeah. I liked their DLC model even if the Western Ninja BBQ Chivalry packs were getting gimmicky and stupid, but this "buy a drill for $2.49 to open your safe!" thing is officially fucked. And the new UI is goddamned annoying, I have to scroll through pages of my weapon mods now instead of being able to easily see them all.

[Chardok]

I am still going to buy all the DLC packs I'm missing from the GOTY during this sale, because I *do* want to support Overkill in a fashion I'm comfortable with, and I want to encourage them to continue making games, just not like this. There's nothing out there like Payday and I definitely don't want it to go away.

[Mr Bean]

I am still going to buy all the DLC packs I'm missing from the GOTY during this sale, because I *do* want to support Overkill in a fashion I'm comfortable with, and I want to encourage them to continue making games, just not like this. There's nothing out there like Payday and I definitely don't want it to go away.

So yeah... Day 2 arrived oh hey look six of the twenty challenge rewards were revealed and hey they were masks....

Very low quality masks
Look I love the Ukrainian job as much as the next guy but, all of the free masks are glitchy as fuck which the premium masks are as hell are not. Godamn it Overkill your fucking up all the things.

[Chardok]

Godamn it Overkill your fucking up all the things.

Preach.

ALL. THE. THINGS.

[Gaidin]

How bout a heist?

[Chardok]

How bout a heist?

We got Aftershock, which is fairly half-assed, but seems to indicate that they kind of knew the Microtransactions were going to cause the community to burn the whole fucking thing down around them. In it, you secure the LITERAL SAFES that you get from cards from trucks that are stuck on an LA freeway after a giant earthquake.