Samurai Armor becomes all the rage (RAR!)

[Purple]

I'd rather take a halberd my self. T'would look much snazzier. And it would be a great help to me when suffering through public transit.

[Elheru Aran]

"I say, sirrah! A most jolly jest indeed!"

Is that... moustache armour?

Verily, and not only that...













(same helmet as above but from a side view: )










Game of Thrones has *nothing* on these sumbitches. Granted the majority of these are parade armours, so most certainly not for battle... but still, damn.

Oh, and LaCroix? Yeah, I know that's Henry VIII's too. We owe the fat fucker a debt of gratitude in that area. Single-handedly ensured that we'd have a lot of armour left over for our benefit, and got the Greenwich Armouries started up.

[Elheru Aran]

Oh, and Purple? If you can wear samurai armour, you can wear this stuff. Samurai armour isn't that much lighter than this. Crusaders and Conquistadors fought in full armour with minimal effects, and re-enactors in Australia do the same. It's all a matter of getting accustomed to what you wear. I for one will take a suit of Gothic plate any day over that piddly lacquered lamellar. A well fitted harness with proper under-garments should be no worse than wearing a slightly heavy dress suit, and move with your body much better. These suits were made and fitted with an extraordinary understanding of biomechanics and ergonomics.

And if you can make samurai armour out of plastic, you can make this stuff out of plastic too. The articulation and fitting are the difficult part, but if you have the money to do Samurai armour, you have the money for that (you think all that lacing up takes only a few minutes or something?). The primary issue would be fitting small, fine pieces like gauntlet plates or fine articulation such as necks-- not sure you could get plastic fine enough to not be too bulky and still be strong enough to take repeated wear. That might require something more like carbon fiber or HDPE.

(Edit to note: I'll knock off the posting images for the night and probably the remainder of the thread. Don't want to turn this into a no-56K zone)

[Purple]

Oh, and Purple? If you can wear samurai armour, you can wear this stuff. Samurai armour isn't that much lighter than this. Crusaders and Conquistadors fought in full armour with minimal effects, and re-enactors in Australia do the same. It's all a matter of getting accustomed to what you wear. I for one will take a suit of Gothic plate any day over that piddly lacquered lamellar. A well fitted harness with proper under-garments should be no worse than wearing a slightly heavy dress suit, and move dy much better. These suits were made and fitted with an extraordinary understanding of biomechanics and ergonomics.

And if you can make samurai armour out of plastic, you can make this stuff out of plastic too. The articulation and fitting are the difficult part, but if you have the money to do Samurai armour, you have the money for that (you think all that lacing up takes only a few minutes or something?). The primary issue would be fitting small, fine pieces like gauntlet plates or fine articulation such as necks-- not sure you could get plastic fine enough to not be too bulky and still be strong enough to take repeated wear. That might require something more like carbon fiber or HDPE.

(Edit to note: I'll knock off the posting images for the night and probably the remainder of the thread. Don't want to turn this into a no-56K zone)

That's all fine and well but you can't get away from the fact that even the best fitted suit of armor designed specifically for you is still going to be heavy and hot. Also if it's an enclosed helmet it'll give you trouble breathing, hearing and limit your peripheral vision. Not fantastic if you have to get around in traffic. And of course the fact that in a proper suit of plates a lot of the pieces have to be precisely fitted thus driving up the cost. And that's before we get to the fact that you can't put the armor on without help. Just imagine the lines in front of the company bathroom...

As for your examples I'll note that the average human is neither a trained warrior or even a moderately fit reenactor. I certainly could not get around my day to day stuff with even so much as 10 extra kilograms of weight bolted onto me no matter how well it's distributed.

The way I see this Zor basically described "armor" as coming into fashion all of a sudden. So I imagine what this means is that it becomes the new suit and tie. So this ain't something you will only wear for a couple of hours of intensive combat. It's something you have to walk around in all day long and perform activities such as sitting in a heated office space, chatting with idiots, typing on a computer, going to the toilet etc. And for all of that I'd much rather have something like this:


That's the 2nd image from the OP. Notice that it's basically just a shirt with an armored apron and a small skirt. Also an optional funny hat. I'd much rather have one of those than any of the other stuff posted on this thread because those actually look like something you could wear 24/7, put on and take off on your own and would be relatively cheep to boot. My ideal look is the guy without the hat. You could make those things out of plastic or something and have the whole set not weigh more than a kilogram or two.

[R.O.A]

I actually wore my Tanko Kabuto to work once during a Haloween party. I tried to take customer service calls while wearing it but could not fit my headset inside of it. I would take part in the Samurai Armor craze while it was popular, but I think the vast majority of people would be wearing lighter plastic or leather armor. My helmet, being made of iron, is excellent as armor but I would never attempt driving in it.

[Titan Uranus]

If you want to wear armor as everyday clothing, chainmail is going to be the most comfortable type, outside of winter in any case.

[Lord Revan]

true but even chain mail is gonna be really uncomfortble for most people in everyday use, there's a reason why modern days even when used protective gear tends to be as minimal as it's safe to be and even back in the days neither knight nor samurai wore their armor outside of combat (be it on actual battle or simulated/ceremonial). The everyday wear for Samurai for what I can gather is fairly normal looking kimono (granted one probably made from the best possible materials by the best possible craftsmen) and knights wore cloth garments as well for everyday use (what that exactly was depends on the era and country obviously).

[Highlord Laan]

I show up in this and call him a plebe.

[FaxModem1]

Out of curiosity, how expensive is this armor that is apparently sweeping humanity? Do people who can't afford Armani samurai armor wearing knock offs? Do hipsters walk around wearing football armor and helmets that they bought from goodwill stores? Are second chance vests and flak jackets also fashionable now? Will people who want to spend within their means buy stuff from Army/Navy stores?

Do Wal-Marts now have a line of affordable off-brand armor, for the blue collar worker?

How extra crowded are elevators, now that everyone has rather large shoulders and an extra 20 to 30 pounds of weight on them, minimum?

Do car companies start designing larger interiors for armor wearing drivers and passengers, or are there armor storage compartments now added?

Do people start carrying bladed weapons with them as well, or are they plastic replicas?

[Joun_Lord]

I'd probably go around in my stormtrooper. Maybe have the chance to buy some better and cheaper armor if armor is suddenly all the rage.

Probably just to piss off some sticklers I'd wear historical style armor but an assortment. Something like a Spartan helmet, Roman lorica chest piece, Euro gauntlets, and those nifty samurai toe boots. I did the same thing back in HS while doing jr-ROTC (with military uniforms rather then armor of course, I'm a Mountaineer American so I got plenty of camo but not much armor) and the response from some of the people with no sense of humor was hilarious

And I'd probably enjoy living in the armored society for however long it lasts. I'd love to go around casually wearing full body armor and not looking like a freak.

[LaCroix]

A fitted suit of armor will be well in the 2000+ dollar range. You could make a pre-sized suit for 1-2000 $, but good luck with it.
Samurai armor will be even more expensive, even for non-fitted ones - you could use a hyraulic press to mass-produce plate armor at pretty much the price of the metal, bringing the suit down to a few hundred $ (I'd wager you could even do it for less than 100$ - 2m² steel sheet, 1mm, (~16kg) can be bought for ~40$), but the lacing of dozens or hundreds of lamellae per Japanese part is mostly manual labor, so they will always stay more expensive.

[Gaidin]

The way I see this Zor basically described "armor" as coming into fashion all of a sudden. So I imagine what this means is that it becomes the new suit and tie. So this ain't something you will only wear for a couple of hours of intensive combat. It's something you have to walk around in all day long and perform activities such as sitting in a heated office space, chatting with idiots, typing on a computer, going to the toilet etc. And for all of that I'd much rather have something like this:

Makes me think you have the right idea as this sounds more like a fashion statement than anything. Sounds like all our modern combat gear is still geared toward "what works" not towards "what's in fashion". So next question: who cares about the plate mail?

[The Vortex Empire]

If you want to wear armor as everyday clothing, chainmail is going to be the most comfortable type, outside of winter in any case.

Not really, chainmail puts all the weight onto your shoulders, plate armor is much more evenly distributed.

[Purple]

If you want to wear armor as everyday clothing, chainmail is going to be the most comfortable type, outside of winter in any case.

Not really, chainmail puts all the weight onto your shoulders, plate armor is much more evenly distributed.

IIRC you are supposed to wear chain with a belt so that the weight does not sit on your shoulders but your waste.

A fitted suit of armor will be well in the 2000+ dollar range. You could make a pre-sized suit for 1-2000 $, but good luck with it.
Samurai armor will be even more expensive, even for non-fitted ones - you could use a hyraulic press to mass-produce plate armor at pretty much the price of the metal, bringing the suit down to a few hundred $ (I'd wager you could even do it for less than 100$ - 2m² steel sheet, 1mm, (~16kg) can be bought for ~40$), but the lacing of dozens or hundreds of lamellae per Japanese part is mostly manual labor, so they will always stay more expensive.

Forget steel. Think cheap plastics.

[muse]

When in Rome...

Wear a toga?

[LaCroix]

Forget steel. Think cheap plastics.

Even with cheap plastic you won't get much below the price of stamped steel. It would be lighter, but not necessarily cheaper. 2 m2 steel are much more than you need for a simple suit, since those don't cover all of your body.

And I doubt cheap plastics would work, you'd need something a bit stronger simply to hold up to actually wearing it. Especially for a non-fitted suit. Nobody buys a single use suit. Immagine showing up in a suit that has parts falling off while walking...

[Purple]

Even with cheap plastic you won't get much below the price of stamped steel. It would be lighter, but not necessarily cheaper. 2 m2 steel are much more than you need for a simple suit, since those don't cover all of your body.

And I doubt cheap plastics would work, you'd need something a bit stronger simply to hold up to actually wearing it. Especially for a non-fitted suit. Nobody buys a single use suit. Immagine showing up in a suit that has parts falling off while walking...

It's about practicality. The suit needs to be easy to put on and remove, easy to wear and preferably machine washable. Minimal maintenance and all that. Honestly I imagine that the most likely setup would be that they'd take the Ashigaru armor from that image I quoted and make it into something you wear over your regular clothes. And for that you really don't need too much durability. And of course I can't imagine the cheap versions would have any sort of historical accuracy. You and I'd be wearing made in China plastic suits glued onto a cloth backing with some cheap suspenders.

[LaCroix]

You and I'd be wearing made in China plastic suits glued onto a cloth backing with some cheap suspenders.

I wouldn't. I have standards.

If I had to wear armor, I'd rather make my own than a crap plastic one that breaks if I sit down the wrong way.

[Gaidin]

You and I'd be wearing made in China plastic suits glued onto a cloth backing with some cheap suspenders.

I wouldn't. I have standards.

If I had to wear armor, I'd rather make my own than a crap plastic one that breaks if I sit down the wrong way.

Are you saying there aren't bendable plastics out there?

[Elheru Aran]

You and I'd be wearing made in China plastic suits glued onto a cloth backing with some cheap suspenders.

I wouldn't. I have standards.

If I had to wear armor, I'd rather make my own than a crap plastic one that breaks if I sit down the wrong way.

Are you saying there aren't bendable plastics out there?

I think he's running with Purple's assertion that the cheaper suits wouldn't be made with more flexible plastics. Something like that.

If that was the approach that was taken, I could see there being varying levels of quality. You have your Walmart type shitty cheap garb, Target and department stores for higher end wear, and then fancy brand names for serious polish. Something like that.

Metal would be quicker and easier, and possibly cheaper than plastic, though. Once the forms were established, stamping machines could turn out plate far quicker than lacing together lamellar. So really the samurai thing is just a goofy fad, eclipsed by the glory of European harness.

[Purple]

European armor, at least in the form you want is way too heavy and encompassing to wear on a regular basis though. You can't do office work in a full Maximilian. The only stuff you could wear is chain (which would be way too heavy) or the Renaissance style breastplate and helmet combo.

[Thanas]

Yes, you can do full office work in full plate. It is surprisingly easy to carry. 15-25 kgs. Meanwhile I wear a 4kg coat and a 12kg Backpack with little problem each day when I go to work.

EDIT: BTW, modern soldiers wear combat loads of up to 20-35kg anyway.

[Elheru Aran]

The way the weight is distributed on plate makes it surprisingly easy and mobile to wear (provided it is fitted well). Badly done plate is a burden, certainly, but if it's only for dress, then weight would be even less of an issue, and a certain amount of customization could be built in by having, for example, staggered rivet holes. Short limbs? Rivet the arms together on the short holes. Long limbs? Rivet on the last hole. That kind of thing.

In other words, Purple knows fuck-all about historical European armour except what he's read in 5 minutes of Google.

[Purple]

Yes, you can do full office work in full plate. It is surprisingly easy to carry. 15-25 kgs. Meanwhile I wear a 4kg coat and a 12kg Backpack with little problem each day when I go to work.

I was not talking about walking a short distance but using it as a functional suit for your whole day. That's something not even medieval knights did because it's just not practical. The armor has to be stuffy and warm by virtue of being enclosed. And the air holes you get are small unless you pop open the visor. And that gives you -5 on your fashion roll. And of course everything you touch you do through large gloves. And whilst the inside is leather and should thus not impede your feeling you'll still not want to use them for stuff like a touch screen phone. And lets not go into having to change in and out of it every morning. As far as I know you can't even put certain pieces on without someone to help you by design.

EDIT: BTW, modern soldiers wear combat loads of up to 20-35kg anyway.

Modern soldiers tend to be on the high end of physical fitness. Most humans less so. Like your backpack and coat thing. That much weight would basically make me unable to move.

In other words, Purple knows fuck-all about historical European armour except what he's read in 5 minutes of Google.

I know more than you think. Much less than anyone who has worn it but certainly more than you think. I have researched it somewhat in the past. So I am not arguing this from the idiotic position of the guys who think full plate was 500kg heavy and knights needed cranes to get on horses and garbage like that. I am just saying that as far as practical everyday wear full plate isn't.
But let's just get to what you posted in no particular order.

1. If this is going to be the next all day suit than the only people who are going to afford a fitted piece are those that can afford a fitted suit today. Everyone else has to buy non fitted retail. And out of those most people won't be using designer brands either but will like they do for other articles of clothing opt for cheaper alternatives. And that means essentially getting stuck with cheap LARP grade armor you got from a Chinese guy in a mall somewhere.

2. Weight is always an issue if you are, like most people in the western world unfit. Most people can probably lift 25kg but can't carry it all day every day just for a fashion trend. In fact even if they can they won't because that would be a very stupid thing to do. Very few people will ever buy a full 25kg suit of anything to wear no matter how fashionable.

Bottom line is that for anything to be practical everyday fashion you have to be at least as comfortable and easy to wear as what is worn today.

[Thanas]

I was not talking about walking a short distance but using it as a functional suit for your whole day.

I have carried similar loads for day.

But in the end, you should trust the reenactors who actually practice for hours in those things. They manage it just fine.