Houthi Rebels Lauch Two ASMs at US Warship

[Patroklos]

Yeah, probably not a good idea. We were sort of back burnering this one but probably not anymore:

Two missiles targeted a US warship off the coast of Yemen on Sunday but missed the vessel, hitting the water instead, a Pentagon spokesman says.

The missiles were fired at the USS Mason from Houthi-controlled territory in war torn Yemen, Capt. Jeff Davis said. The US ship, a guided-missile destroyer, deployed "onboard defensive measures" and was undamaged, he said.

The warship was in international waters more than 12 nautical miles (22 km) offshore, in the southern end of the Red Sea, north of the Bab el-Mandeb Strait, according to a defense official.

"We assess the missiles were launched from Houthi-controlled territory in Yemen. The United States remains committed to ensuring freedom of navigation everywhere in the world, and we will continue to take all necessary steps to ensure the safety of our ships and our service members," he said.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/10/politics/ ... index.html

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/10/10 ... -gulf.html

A few things to unpack from this:

1.) The proliferation of such weapons to non state actors is worrisome. Hezbollah hit a patrol craft a few years ago with the same missile, the Houthis destroyed an auxiliary of the UAE a couple weeks ago. Now this.

2.) The Houthis are Iran's creatures, so this has serious potential for escalation. I am sure the Iranian leadership is sighing in relief that a US warship wasn't actually hit by what is obviously their weapon.

3.) What now? The Saudis have been getting some push back lately for their air campaign. Do the gloves come off?

[K. A. Pital]

Glad to see the US suffer for its support of Saudi islamist scum.

[Broomstick]

US military ships have taken hits before without the US going apeshit into a war, the USS Cole being an example.

The outcome of an actual hit depends a lot on who wins the upcoming election - I think Clinton would be more likely to handle this like the Cole bombing and Trump more likely advocate a violent response. Prior to the election, I think Obama would also be more inclined to handle this like the Cole as well.

[FTeik]

Glad to see the US suffer for its support of Saudi islamist scum.

What suffering? The missiles hit the water.

Also considering the bad press S.A. has gotten over its recent conduct in Yemen, is it really certain, that the missiles were fired by Houthi-rebels and we are not looking at another "Tonkin-incident"? The suspected weapons of mass-destruction in Iraq also haven't been found yet ... .

[Iroscato]

Glad to see the US suffer for its support of Saudi islamist scum.

Did you even read the article or did your programming kick in and make you reflexively spout an anti-US soundbite?

[K. A. Pital]

No, I know the missiles missed.

But the very fact US is targeted - even inadvertedly - for its collusion with Saudi islamist mass murderers and IS financiers is delightful.

Yes, I will take every opportunity no matter what to underscore the ties between the US and Saudite mass murderers who have been the architects of the "Salafist principality" in Syria and of many other things that have happened in the Middle East.

[Simon_Jester]

I have to wonder what was going through the minds of the missile battery crew and whoever ordered them to fire. Possibly "fuck you!" was about the limit of it...

[Broomstick]

But the very fact US is targeted - even inadvertedly - for its collusion with Saudi islamist mass murderers and IS financiers is delightful.

Because dead Americans aren't real people, right? It's attitudes like yours that keep wars going.

It's not like Saudi export of hate hasn't come home to roost in the US before. How nice to know that if I ever get caught in a terrorist bombing you'll "delight" in my maiming and/or death. Fuck you.

Attack my government for piss-poor decisions if you will, but don't be fucking gleeful over real people dying.

[K. A. Pital]

The fact that the US as a country has continued to collaborate with the Saudis over their Middle Eastern adventures from funding Syrian and Libyan jihadists to bombing Yemen, despite the fact Saudi-funded terrorists have successfully killed a lot of Americans, just prove that the US regime is a clear danger to its own citizens.

I consider the US troops to be invaders and occupiers themselves, therefore I shall not be deterred by claims "but they are people too". Every occupant soldier is also a human being.

But decolonization must proceed, and indeed it has, disregarding the colonizers. So must proceed the new decolonization, when the world frees itself from the US empire once and for all.

Also the US must understand that it will be held responsible for all the actions of its satellite states at some point in history. And this point may come faster than thought.

[The Romulan Republic]

Some of us take a rather dim view of those who advocate and excuse terrorism and murder, by any side.

[K. A. Pital]

Some of us take a rather dim view of those who advocate and excuse terrorism and murder, by any side.

US troops are occupiers who invade and bomb other nations, or allies of fascist agressors (allies of Saudi Arabia). That makes them legitimate targets. Not the civilians, of course, but the military. But I am sure that in your world, a military attack on a legitimate target is "terrorism".

As your view of me is already dimmer than the blackest night, I also see no point to your comment.

[Raj Ahten]

Frankly there is no reason for the Houthis to not target US warships. The US is already engaged for all intents and purposes on the Saudi side. We've been providing intelligence, munitions and other logistical help. They already believe they are at war with the US and with good cause. We like to think our pseudo wars aren't real back here in the US as long as any of our guys don't get killed but people on the ground tend to have a different view on things.

[Highlord Laan]

No, I know the missiles missed.

But the very fact US is targeted - even inadvertedly - for its collusion with Saudi islamist mass murderers and IS financiers is delightful.

Yes, I will take every opportunity no matter what to underscore the ties between the US and Saudite mass murderers who have been the architects of the "Salafist principality" in Syria and of many other things that have happened in the Middle East.

My your local Chechen and/or Muslim population discover a supply of pressure cookers, shitstain.

[Iroscato]

No, I know the missiles missed.

But the very fact US is targeted - even inadvertedly - for its collusion with Saudi islamist mass murderers and IS financiers is delightful.

Yes, I will take every opportunity no matter what to underscore the ties between the US and Saudite mass murderers who have been the architects of the "Salafist principality" in Syria and of many other things that have happened in the Middle East.

My your local Chechen and/or Muslim population discover a supply of pressure cookers, shitstain.

Come again?

[Simon_Jester]

Pressure cookers are commonly used as the casings for improvised fragmentation bombs, due to their thick metal walls.

That being said, If Yemeni rebels want to fire missiles at the ships of a belligerent power actively seeking to bring about their ruin, it would be poor form for me to label it as "terrorism." It seems an unproductive use of their time and missiles, unless they know something about the ship's mission that I don't. But they are within their rights to do so, and "belligerent power seeking to bring about our ruin" is sufficient reason to shoot back.

I wouldn't want to live in a world where it was unacceptable to shoot back at the armed forces of a nation which is actively attacking you and undermining you in the middle of a war zone.

The problem, Stas, is that your cackling glee at watching people shoot at Americans, and the language you use which utterly fails to distinguish between civilians and military in preference to identifying "the US" as a monolithic body... Bluntly, you sure sound like you'd be in the streets cheering another round of the 9/11 attacks. Maybe you wouldn't, but you sound like it, and that justifiably offends the Americans in the audience.

[Iroscato]

Pressure cookers are commonly used as the casings for improvised fragmentation bombs, due to their thick metal walls.

I see. Just Laan doubling down on being a massive, swinging bellend then.

[Patroklos]

US military ships have taken hits before without the US going apeshit into a war, the USS Cole being an example.

The outcome of an actual hit depends a lot on who wins the upcoming election - I think Clinton would be more likely to handle this like the Cole bombing and Trump more likely advocate a violent response. Prior to the election, I think Obama would also be more inclined to handle this like the Cole as well.

I am not sure your comparison is appropriate. The Cole was attacked by a non state terrorist group, the Houthis are a territory holding rebel group who have taken over Yemen proper. The method of attack is Alison different in character. In that light they are more like the pre 2001 Taliban and as such I would draw comparison with the Stark and Samuel B Roberts incidents.

In the case of the Stark Iraq was a pseudo ally at the time so there isn't much you can do except call it an accident, which it probably was.

In the case of the Samuel B Roberts it caused operation Praying Mantis which ended up with several sunk or damaged Iranian warships.

[K. A. Pital]

My your local Chechen and/or Muslim population discover a supply of pressure cookers, shitstain.

The Chechen rebellion, even if I find it entirely distasteful IS-like band of jihadists, was fully within their legal rights to attack the Russian army. Your point was? I forgot. This is not about Houthis attacking a US warship because it was near Yemen, where their Saudi islamist buddies are bombing cities and blowing up civilians to establish themselves as a Sunni jihadist superpower? Then about what?

To sum up: attacks on military targets are legally acceptable, even if done by horrible people. That aside, the US is also on the horrible people's side here.

[Simon_Jester]

Pressure cookers are commonly used as the casings for improvised fragmentation bombs, due to their thick metal walls.

I see. Just Laan doubling down on being a massive, swinging bellend then.

To be fair, he was talking to someone who badly, badly needs to read Frances Harper's "Do Not Cheer, Men Are Dying."

But I don't actually disagree with Stas on the core theme that warships are military targets, and that we have given the Yemeni rebels ample reason to fire on our warships. We cannot operate in a permanent state of war against the Yemenis and expect them not to retaliate when and as they can.

[cosmicalstorm]

The ship hit a couple of weeks ago was targeted with RPGs from smaller boats. The C802 video seems like a forgery.

Considering the Saudis are dropping US made bunker busters into Yemeni cities I understand the Houthis if they attack US ships, albeit possibly not a productive move as a good hit could make Americans froth at the mouth and demand justice bombs.

Warnerd writes about Yemen
https://pando.com/2015/03/28/the-war-ne ... lusterfck/

“The people of the south know very little about Yemeni politics and do not really understand the Saudi political approach toward Yemen. All they know is that a threat has emerged in Yemen.” The Houthi are being bombed now by the Saudi AF, which is in a way the sincerest form of Saudi flattery. The Saudis are afraid of these Shia Yemeni. One of the reasons that “…people of the [Saudi] South know very little about Yemeni politics” is that the Saudi rulers make sure they don’t get any information. The last thing the Saudi authorities want is for the Shia of SW Saudi Arabia to remember that they were once part of a huge, powerful Shia kingdom that stretched south to the Indian Ocean. Najran was once part of that kingdom. It’s only been Saudi territory since 1934, when the Saud family leased the province from Yemen on a 20-year term. They kept it when the term expired, because by that time Saudi Arabia was rich and closely allied with the US and Britain, while Yemen was weak and poor.

[Sea Skimmer]

1.) The proliferation of such weapons to non state actors is worrisome. Hezbollah hit a patrol craft a few years ago with the same missile, the Houthis destroyed an auxiliary of the UAE a couple weeks ago. Now this.

Ummdid you forget how they had an air force when the war began, that being a prime reason why the Saudis and UAE got involved, when said air force began bombing Aden, and extensive gun armed shore batteries, and fired several ballistic missiles in the past 48 hours alone, and not random SCUDs but many of them accuratish SS-21s. The Houthi are only 'rebels' because of the fiction of North and South Yemen having become a unified country. In reality they do and always have controlled the majority of the important crap in the country, the majority of the population and have the direct backing of the former president who was overthrown in a rather messy way. The fact that they now also have some not entirely obsolete anti ship missiles from Iran does not change much at all. They should have had some Styx missiles when the war began in fact, which are much more destructive then a C-802 if they do hit, but its probably none were operational at the time the Saudis began bombing such storage facilities. Simply too old.

2.) The Houthis are Iran's creatures, so this has serious potential for escalation. I am sure the Iranian leadership is sighing in relief that a US warship wasn't actually hit by what is obviously their weapon.

I highly doubt they would actually care. Though closer US involvement would make it far harder for them to continue to smuggle weapons into north Yemen.

3.) What now? The Saudis have been getting some push back lately for their air campaign. Do the gloves come off?

What gloves? Also the Saudis would have loved it if a US flagged ship had been hit, since that would have ensured the US would get back into this war and do what the Saudis and UAE don't have the manpower or expertise to do, secure the Red Sea coastline via drone patrols, observation points and probably the occupation of some of the Red Sea Islands as artillery bases. I expect them to take no serious action in response to this at all, they don't have many resources to divert from the land war, and probably desperately hope the next poorly aimed missile the Houthis fire hits something juicy like a Chinese destroyer. That's what the Iranians would really fear.

[Sea Skimmer]

The ship hit a couple of weeks ago was targeted with RPGs from smaller boats. The C802 video seems like a forgery.

This giant hole is not RPG-7 damage. This is exactly what we would expect a 500lb killhead missile to do to ship. Lucky for the grab bag of Eastern European civilians crewing her at the time they were mostly on duty when the missile struck the accommodation block.

Claims she was carrying fuel and ammo though not supported by the damage, the fires in that case would certainly sunk the ship. May have been carrying non munition war material, or actual aid as claimed.

[Patroklos]

What gloves? Also the Saudis would have loved it if a US flagged ship had been hit, since that would have ensured the US would get back into this war and do what the Saudis and UAE don't have the manpower or expertise to do, secure the Red Sea coastline via drone patrols, observation points and probably the occupation of some of the Red Sea Islands as artillery bases. I expect them to take no serious action in response to this at all, they don't have many resources to divert from the land war, and probably desperately hope the next poorly aimed missile the Houthis fire hits something juicy like a Chinese destroyer. That's what the Iranians would really fear.

I wasn't talking about the Saudis...

[Sea Skimmer]

Then I'm not sure what you mean. You actually think Obama will do something over zero US damage? Why? The Houthi are in fact keen to deny this even happened, because they want attention to stay on that funeral massacre. Its not clear they even meant to target a US flagged warship. I mean I see no reason why they would not, but its not clear what means they used for targeting. Firing a bearing only launch on some distance optical sighting off a mountain top..hard to know if they won't claim it. So notmuch basis todo anything.

Reports were made earlier in the war by Houthi sources of having attempted SSM attacks on Egyptian and Saudi ships, but nothing ever came of it. This may well have been true, because the fact is you can miss really easily with this sort of weapon.

Exactly this same situation took place in the 1980s, Iran did once fire Silkworms ata US cruiser, after Ray-Gun had threatened to bomb the sites, but they missed so badly it was simply covered up for years.

From the Saudi standpoint meanwhile, this threat could actually do some serious military and economic damage to them. The ballistic missile threat is also still no joke. Video is around of them using8 round Patriot salvos at the incoming warheads to try to ensure kills. The cost of this war is tremendous for them.

[Broomstick]

Frankly there is no reason for the Houthis to not target US warships. The US is already engaged for all intents and purposes on the Saudi side. We've been providing intelligence, munitions and other logistical help. They already believe they are at war with the US and with good cause. We like to think our pseudo wars aren't real back here in the US as long as any of our guys don't get killed but people on the ground tend to have a different view on things.

It's not the targeting of US military vessels and personnel that offends me - under the circumstances described in the OP, and as noted in another post, that is an entirely reasonable position for the Houthi to take.

My objection is to the DELIGHT in death and destruction. The applauding of killing.