Why Europe wants a hard Brexit to hurt

[K. A. Pital]

If Brexit helps the left to win in Britain, then so be it. But I am not sure... I think the neoliberal elite will try to cure the antisocial character of the economy simply with more ultracapitalism.

[Simon_Jester]

A rebalanced economy that is socially useful instead of a global parasite would be good, and I don't think a housing price crash would be an unfair thing either.

It's uncertain to me whether Britain can rebuild other sectors of its economy while its trade with Europe is in the process of collapsing, though..

I'm reminded of a man who takes shelter from a rainstorm under a tree, figuring that when this tree is soaked through, he'll just find another one to protect him...

If Brexit helps the left to win in Britain, then so be it. But I am not sure... I think the neoliberal elite will try to cure the antisocial character of the economy simply with more ultracapitalism.

Aren't you usually an accelerationist at times like this?

[K. A. Pital]

I am. That's why I also spoke out in favor of a hard Brexit in the original Brexit thread and dismissed the silly alarmist claims that a nation will be destroyed just because Britain will trade under WTO rules. I simply don't think it (hard Brexit) will immediately help the left. But as something which hurts the neocolonial EU, it should undeniably happen in the hardest possible way.

That aside, democratic aspirations should be followed through even if utterly regressive. Otherwise people will never learn. There is a severe lack of class consciousness even now.

[Thanas]

Meanwhile, the hope of British idiots that the trade organisations will push Europe to accept fair trade for fear of losses does not seem to be happening.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... ver-brexit

Two of the largest German trade associations have come out in support of Angela Merkel taking a firm stance during negotiations over Britain’s exit from the EU, even if it comes at a short-term cost.

Speaking at a briefing in Brussels, the presidents of the Association of German Chambers of Commerce and Industry (DIHK) and the German Confederation of Skilled Crafts (ZDH) said that granting Britain an opt-out from the four freedoms – free movement of goods, services, capital and persons – could amount to the “beginning of the end” of the single market.

“You cannot say: ‘I take part on three counts but not on the fourth,’” said the DIHK’s Eric Schweitzer. Untangling the unity of the four freedoms, he argued, “creates the risk that the whole of Europe would fall apart”.

“The economic consequences would be dramatic. The single market has played an important part in us having growth and prosperity in Europe.”

Hans Peter Wollseifer, the president of the ZDH, said he agreed with his counterpart from an economic point of view, but warned that the rest of Europe should not let the UK “drift off too far”. The EU had to learn from Brexit, Wollseifer said, and “maybe be a bit more restrained in passing laws and regulations that affect even the smallest business”.

The ZDH represents more than a million businesses and over 5m employees in Germany.

Last week, the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, appealed to businesses and lobbyists in Germany to support her stance during upcoming negotiations with Britain, telling an audience of business leaders that any exception to the EU’s single market rules would represent “a systemic challenge for the entire European Union”.

Markus Kerber, the leader of Germany’s largest industry group, the BDI, said recently that trade, investments and single-market solidarity with the rest of the EU were more important than the volume of business German companies do with Britain.

[Vendetta]

I am. That's why I also spoke out in favor of a hard Brexit in the original Brexit thread and dismissed the silly alarmist claims that a nation will be destroyed just because Britain will trade under WTO rules. I simply don't think it (hard Brexit) will immediately help the left. But as something which hurts the neocolonial EU, it should undeniably happen in the hardest possible way.

That aside, democratic aspirations should be followed through even if utterly regressive. Otherwise people will never learn. There is a severe lack of class consciousness even now.

Hard Brexit probably hurts the EU as an institution less than a pleasant halfway house would, because it scares the other waverers back into line.

(Brexit won't help the left in the UK because the left in the UK is incapable of finding its arse in the dark with the aid of a torch and a map.)

[Atlan]

Have any major MNCs actually announced a move?

I know for a fact that Lush cosmetics is moving it's major fabrication facility to Germany. And offering to help any employees who wish to migrate along, but they are moving.

[Xisiqomelir]

So I know this is just posturing, but I find it lamentable that the EU Powers-that-Be need to behave this way in public.

It betrays both weakness, because of the reaction, and fear, because of the obvious purpose of preventing plebiscites in other member states.

Everyone would be better served if Juncker had laughed Brexit off and said they'd be better off without, and then demonstrated it economically.

[LaCroix]

Actually, thats what the EU is doing (minus the we're better off, we'd actually like to have them stay, but you know).
But the "Powers that be" are insisting that if they leave, they leave.
Britain, otoh, wants to leave, but keep all the benefits, and give a two fingered salute to all the responsibilites.
It will be a harsh wakeup call for the negotiators arriving at Brussels.

[Vendetta]

It will be a harsh wakeup call for the negotiators arriving at Brussels.

Sorry, we're sending Liam Fox, David Davis, and Boris Johnson. Facts slide off them like greasy shit.

This is going to be messy.

Like greasy shit.

[madd0ct0r]

A rebalanced economy that is socially useful instead of a global parasite would be good, and I don't think a housing price crash would be an unfair thing either.

It's uncertain to me whether Britain can rebuild other sectors of its economy while its trade with Europe is in the process of collapsing, though..

I'm reminded of a man who takes shelter from a rainstorm under a tree, figuring that when this tree is soaked through, he'll just find another one to protect him...

Sorry, missed this.

The UK has quite a complex economy, with capability in many many sectors. http://atlas.cid.harvard.edu/explore/tr ... show/2014/
http://atlas.cid.harvard.edu/explore/pr ... show/2014/
The only sectors with zero exports in 2014 seem to textile and onions.

It's not really about rebuilding, as expanding. An awful lot of sectors have been ignored not becuase they are not profitable, but becuase they aren't quite as profitable as claiming expenses when managing someone else's money. When I talk about rebalancing, I mean where the investment and development isn't so focused on fintech and rising housing prices. The construction industry has not seen productivity gains seen pretty much everywhere else in the economy. The fact that it's seen as a refugee for the boring and those incapable of keeping up in Canary Wharf dosen't help.

See table 2.1 and figure 2.1 of https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... alysis.pdf

I don't know if it'd actually happen though.

[His Divine Shadow]

Yeah I'm pretty sure the UK could manage a good outcome economically speaking with decent growth for all, not just the financial parasites, but not with the tories in charge.

[K. A. Pital]

Tory idiots will sell their country to the highest bidders once the flow of cash and coke from the City dries up.