Effects of a Universal Resource

SF: discuss futuristic sci-fi series, ideas, and crossovers.

Moderator: NecronLord

Post Reply
User avatar
KraytKing
Jedi Knight
Posts: 584
Joined: 2016-04-11 06:39pm
Location: US East Coast

Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by KraytKing »

In this universe, humanity has struck out into the stars, developed FTL travel, and colonized several hundred systems. Along with other technological advances, we have developed a way to turn energy into matter, and vice versa. We've also developed ways to convert land into an energy magnet, collecting all the various forms of of energy floating around in space and beaming it to distribution modules. This renders the land completely uninhabitable. Between the two advances, we now have a way to produce virtually infinite amounts of anything, from warships to Nerf guns to medicine. Also important, all naval warfare is done by semi-intelligent drones directed by humans from home. Instantaneous communication has also been developed. How does this affect economics, warfare, exploration, and politics? What does the galaxy look like?

By the way, if any of you have heard of the game Particle Fleet: Emergence by Knuckle Cracker, you know exactly what I'm talking about.
If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.
--Mace

The Old Testament has as much validity for the foundation of a religion as the pattern my recent case of insect bites formed on my ass.
--Solauren

I always get nervous when I hear the word Christian.
--Mountain

Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
User avatar
The_Saint
Jedi Knight
Posts: 798
Joined: 2007-05-05 04:13am
Location: Under Down Under

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by The_Saint »

KraytKing wrote:How does this affect economics, warfare, exploration, and politics? What does the galaxy look like?
Have you read any of the Culture novels by Ian M Banks?
All people are equal but some people are more equal than others.
User avatar
madd0ct0r
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 6259
Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by madd0ct0r »

Who owns the means of production?
"Aid, trade, green technology and peace." - Hans Rosling.
"Welcome to SDN, where we can't see the forest because walking into trees repeatedly feels good, bro." - Mr Coffee
User avatar
KraytKing
Jedi Knight
Posts: 584
Joined: 2016-04-11 06:39pm
Location: US East Coast

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by KraytKing »

madd0ct0r wrote:Who owns the means of production?
I'm asking you. If this was developed by a technology conglomerate, who owns it now? How would this galaxy differ from others in fundamental societal structure?
If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.
--Mace

The Old Testament has as much validity for the foundation of a religion as the pattern my recent case of insect bites formed on my ass.
--Solauren

I always get nervous when I hear the word Christian.
--Mountain

Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by Simon_Jester »

Specifying a few key technologies isn't going to give us all that much information. You're making an awful lot of soup out of very few oysters here.

I will also note that "universal resource" isn't a very good word for this phenomenon of being able to effortlessly manufacture everything. When I saw the thread title I assumed you meant some single natural resource that is used for literally everything, or if there was a single substance that could do anything (but might have limited availability).

...

Are you trying to predict what society in an interstellar civilization looks like a long time after this ability to make anything is developed? Or has this ability only just emerged?
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
User avatar
KraytKing
Jedi Knight
Posts: 584
Joined: 2016-04-11 06:39pm
Location: US East Coast

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by KraytKing »

Building things takes time, about a minute per cubic foot of naval steel (the standard shipbuilding material). A completely converted planet can produce about .1% of it's tonnage in warships per year after distribution. I was just wondering how rulers would maintain power, given that anyone with a distributor can build massive naval power very quickly, and replace destroyed craft in weeks from virtually infinite supplies. And what would the economic system be based on, given that there is no need for laborers aside from the officers commanding war fleets?
If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.
--Mace

The Old Testament has as much validity for the foundation of a religion as the pattern my recent case of insect bites formed on my ass.
--Solauren

I always get nervous when I hear the word Christian.
--Mountain

Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
User avatar
madd0ct0r
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 6259
Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by madd0ct0r »

The rulers of the UK are not the people who own shares in the companies that own the shipyards.
And the economic system could look like pharaohs over a huge drugged to placidity underclass, crammed into hyper dense habitats to free land up for conversion or it could be the extreme of every person an artist that William Morris hoped for and the Culture novels depict. On the scale of hundreds of solar systems and ecosystems and trade routes, probably everything at once
"Aid, trade, green technology and peace." - Hans Rosling.
"Welcome to SDN, where we can't see the forest because walking into trees repeatedly feels good, bro." - Mr Coffee
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by Simon_Jester »

Yeah.

Militaries exist as a cultural and strategic extension of societies, they don't just float in a vacuum having battles with each other (although playing cheap space 4X games on Steam might make you think otherwise). Nobody's going to risk their lives on violent conflict unless they have something worth fighting for. And I can't think of a single instance of a successful "rebel without a cause" conqueror who somehow assembled a military and carved out an empire without first establishing themselves as the fighting leader of a society willing to fight for them.

So fixating on how warships are manufactured is entirely missing the point. The technology to build the warships should be treated as a given, which will be used much the same way by everyone. Just as radically different pre-industrial societies all used the same art of blacksmithing to make iron weapons, or as radically different 20th century nations at war all used the same industrial techniques to build fighter planes and submarines.

The real question is how the production technology affects the social structure, which happily is what Maddoc is talking about.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
User avatar
KraytKing
Jedi Knight
Posts: 584
Joined: 2016-04-11 06:39pm
Location: US East Coast

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by KraytKing »

But if a battle can be fought without losing a single life, and if losses can be replaced indefinitely, then the situation may be different. And if I had invented a way to build massive fleets of warships that fast, I certainly wouldn't be keen on sharing it. Personal power is plenty of motivation, especially if there is little to no risk of death.
If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.
--Mace

The Old Testament has as much validity for the foundation of a religion as the pattern my recent case of insect bites formed on my ass.
--Solauren

I always get nervous when I hear the word Christian.
--Mountain

Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
User avatar
LaCroix
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 5196
Joined: 2004-12-21 12:14pm
Location: Sopron District, Hungary, Europe, Terra

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by LaCroix »

KraytKing wrote:But if a battle can be fought without losing a single life, and if losses can be replaced indefinitely, then the situation may be different. And if I had invented a way to build massive fleets of warships that fast, I certainly wouldn't be keen on sharing it. Personal power is plenty of motivation, especially if there is little to no risk of death.
You are asking the wrong question.

What are they fighting for?

Societies fight for a gain - usually access to finfite ressources.
The technology has made every ressource infinite.
Why would someone use vast ressources to wage a war against someone with equal infinite ressources if there is no gain? A single big asteroid belt has all the ressource you would need to have everyone live in utter luxury for a lifetime.
Space travel is available to everyone - if they don'T like some place, they can leave and create their own place - with no real hardship, as their tech allows them to insta-colonize any place they like.

There is no gain that can be had by violence.

The only reason for space fleet battles between random factions will most likely be a recreational sport, knowing humans.
A minute's thought suggests that the very idea of this is stupid. A more detailed examination raises the possibility that it might be an answer to the question "how could the Germans win the war after the US gets involved?" - Captain Seafort, in a thread proposing a 1942 'D-Day' in Quiberon Bay

I do archery skeet. With a Trebuchet.
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by Simon_Jester »

I mean, there would be a very small number of people who are crazy and have a desire to rule the universe. People whose desires cannot be satisfied by "look at how rich you are and how much luxury you have," and who will desire to dominate others. And they might use this technology to create weapons and coerce others into doing their will.

Thing is, such people are a minority. A very small minority. Most people have no desire to dominate others on that level. And since the goal of these people is one that brings them into conflict with literally everyone everywhere, the odds are good that they will be crushed and defeated. This is regardless of how advanced weapons technology looks.

People don't like being oppressed and dominated. If technology makes it possible for nearly anyone to start making weapons, the only social systems that survive will be those that can exist with the consent of the people living in them.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
vengence
Redshirt
Posts: 43
Joined: 2012-02-15 05:37am

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by vengence »

Is there a size limit for the land required? Like does it have to be on a planet or can you catch a random asteroid or moon and convert the surface into an energy magnet?
User avatar
KraytKing
Jedi Knight
Posts: 584
Joined: 2016-04-11 06:39pm
Location: US East Coast

Re: Effects of a Universal Resource

Post by KraytKing »

Any size body will do.
If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.
--Mace

The Old Testament has as much validity for the foundation of a religion as the pattern my recent case of insect bites formed on my ass.
--Solauren

I always get nervous when I hear the word Christian.
--Mountain

Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
Post Reply