Rogue One (Spoilers)

[FedRebel]

Looking at the SFX with the old analysis eye, I'm betting this film ends up being extremely problematic for working into a larger sketch of how things operate. I'll bet a dollar that the propagation rate for the shockwaves from those superlaser blasts is way off. That said, who gives a flying fuck

Versus debaters. I imagine that some of them hated this movie simply because it undermined their precious calcs.

On that, The Devastator taking to Rebel ships to it's shields like a champ...ships accelerating to a hyperspace jump. Flip side is that Imperator I's have an apparent glass jaw once they lose their shields.

It's the space battle that will draw the attention of debaters, can already hear the acolytes of the nameless one using the Hammerhead's ramming action as 'proof' that phasers can dice a Star Destroyer like a a hot knife wielded by a Benihana chef through butter. Of course the other side would counter that the Devastator's arrival is proof that a single ISD could absorb being rammed by the entire Jem'Hadar fleet without so much as losing a paint chip

[Kojiro]

One thing that has been bothering me slightly re firing on the archive. What was the purpose of annihilating it like that? There couldn't have been more than a handful of rebels left down there, certainly not enough to warrant destroying such a repository of data (in addition to other effects of the blast). If they're worried about plans being transmitted, just destroy the dish. Surely any fighter could do the job and then the plans are impossible to get off planet short of physically moving them. Plus you don't end up destroying a massive freaking archive of data. But if you *are* going to destroy it in an attempt to stop a broadcast, for the love of Jeff hit the damn thing. Jyn and Cassain had enough time to take an elevator to the ground and stumble out and have a seat on the beach. As a means of stopping the transmission it was terrible and if the transmission has gone through destroying it serves no purpose.

[Captain Seafort]

It's the space battle that will draw the attention of debaters, can already hear the acolytes of the nameless one using the Hammerhead's ramming action as 'proof' that phasers can dice a Star Destroyer like a a hot knife wielded by a Benihana chef through butter.

On the other hand, it would be interesting to see someone run calcs on the acceleration the Hammerhead's engines were able to impart to a ship several orders of magnitude more massive than it.

[Eternal_Freedom]

On the subject of versus debates, one good thing that this film gives us is a clear and explicit planetary shield. No more EU sources needed. Also, SW tech is able to open gaps in their shield, so no more "they must oscillate so phasers could pass right through" crap.

[Captain Seafort]

On the subject of versus debates, one good thing that this film gives us is a clear and explicit planetary shield. No more EU sources needed. Also, SW tech is able to open gaps in their shield, so no more "they must oscillate so phasers could pass right through" crap.

We got unambiguous planetary shields in TFA. TFA also indicated that they cycle on and off somewhere in the petahertz range or slower - certainly "slowly" enough that a small, fast ship in hyperspace can pass through them, given a fair amount of luck and a sufficiently insane pilot to try it.

[Eternal_Freedom]

Yeah but that was in the sequel era and on a special superweapon, now we get them in Ot era Epmire worlds. More to the point, we actually see them rather than being told about them.

[Kojiro]

Also, SW tech is able to open gaps in their shield,

That's not explicitly proven. What we saw was a physical barrier preventing the shield from closing, and when the barrier was removed the shield snapped shut. It could be the shield needs to be turned off to reinsert the barrier, that it can prevent a full closure but no necessarily penetrate it once up.

[Eternal_Freedom]

True. Still, combine that with Trade Fed chips being able to launch fighters (and fighters flying into their hanger) while the rest of the ship is fully shielded in...sigh...TPM and the evidence mounts.

[Captain Seafort]

That's not explicitly proven. What we saw was a physical barrier preventing the shield from closing, and when the barrier was removed the shield snapped shut. It could be the shield needs to be turned off to reinsert the barrier, that it can prevent a full closure but no necessarily penetrate it once up.

That's not the impression I got, as point of the rebels' little game of ISD-snooker was to destroy the shield gate in order to open the shield and allow the plans to be transmitted.

[MKSheppard]

It was an extremely fun bad movie. So fun that you don't really catch on to how bad it is until afterwards.

My big beef with it on retrospective thinking through is the entire arc on Scarif made little sense.

As someone who's worked in a semi controlled industry for several years running; you know people by sight through their distinctive tics and mannerisms.

Nobody on the landing pad crew on Scarif noticed that the Imperial Officer who boarded the Shuttle left about ten minutes later with a sudden ten-o-clock bearded stubble?

Furthermore; if they were using the dead guys clothes to gain access to the base, how come the base security systems didn't RFID tag the code cylinders of the dead guys and sound an automated alert/lockdown once they tried to enter an area that the dead guys weren't authorized to enter?

I've faced this at work frustratingly enough. My ID Card back when it was working, only enabled me to access the front door; all other door scanners wouldn't work, meaning I'd have to travel the long way around the building to get back in if those doors were hard locked.

So...how did they get all the way to the central archival core using the code cylinders of joe buttfuck redneck imperial officer who does nothing but wake up, shit, shower, shave, go to his designated work place, the mess hall, his quarters, and then leave the base to go surfing on his off hours?

It's why once I started thinking of it as a tabletop WEG RPG D6 campaign, it wasn't so insulting.

[Gandalf]

My one nitpick with the movie as a whole, is that they had Leia and the Tantive IV at the Battle of Scarrif. The end scene with Vader should have had him chopping his way to the bridge to deny the rebel flagship from transmitting the Death Star plans *beyond* Scarif -- failing to get there in time, but noting the system or direction that the transmissions were made.

But then how would one score the cheap nostalgia points of having Leia show up?

[Kojiro]

That's not the impression I got, as point of the rebels' little game of ISD-snooker was to destroy the shield gate in order to open the shield and allow the plans to be transmitted.

I'm certainly not a fan of the idea that a crashing ISD overloaded the shield, but what I saw was barriers retracting (and X-wings smooshing). I fully admit I don't know the mechanics for reopening the hole, but it seems closing it is as simple as removing the blockage. After all if destroying the gate was the key, you'd think we'd have heard something to that effect or it coming under fire from the cap ships. I could be wrong though, perhaps the barriers are made of some stupidly dense material or something that allows them to super slowly penetrate the shield.

As someone who's worked in a semi controlled industry for several years running; you know people by sight through their distinctive tics and mannerisms.

A friend pointed out to me that every Imperial is a clean looking white guy. Cassian wandering around a secret Imperial base would have been like a scruffy looking Latino wandering around a secret Nazi base- he'd stick out like a sore thumb.

[Shroom Man 777]

Bodhi was an Imperial...

[Kojiro]

True enough, and I can put his disheveled look down to being captive a few days (though the long hair is very odd for an Imp I would think?). But doesn't that undermine the whole Space Nazi thing? Or is it a matter cake and eating it too? Where the Imps are Space Nazi white supremacists, the heroes are all non-white males (and a white female) and the only cross over happens to be the only non white Imperial we've ever seen? Unless there's another I'm not familiar with?

[Galvatron]

FWIW, the new EU has at least two prominent non-white female Imperials so far: Ciena Ree and Rae Sloane.

[NecronLord]

A friend pointed out to me that every Imperial is a clean looking white guy. Cassian wandering around a secret Imperial base would have been like a scruffy looking Latino wandering around a secret Nazi base- he'd stick out like a sore thumb.

As a European, I'm not primed to notice all "Latinos" - I for one didn't actually notice his race; if you'd asked me ten minutes ago I would have said he was 'white.' I don't see why Imperials, also being non-Americans, would particularly notice his race either.

And facial hair was in fashion everywhere in the Empire and tolerated by their uniform regulations.

[Shroom Man 777]

I guess it depends on their deployment? Like modern US and Western militaries. Grooming standards might be periodically set aside if these front line guys are so busy and they end up growing enormous beards. Maybe Imperials occupying Wookie territory had to grow considerable hairs as part of local cultural considerations!

[Kojiro]

[As a European, I'm not primed to notice all "Latinos"

Sure, but you're also not part of an organisation referred to commonly as 'space nazis', nor are you on a secret military base during a civil war. But again, that's kinda my point. Either the empire are these white supremacist stand ins for Nazis or they do have a variety of racial types. Which to me, spanning a galaxy, it seems inevitable they would have every shade under two suns working for them. But let's be honest, the portrayal of Imperial officers is consistently as clean cut whites (mostly males) with British accents. So far as I know anyway. Hence the comparison, but if they're multi racial that comparison falls apart.

And facial hair was in fashion everywhere in the Empire and tolerated by their uniform regulations.

It's not facial hair that sets him out, it's the disheveled look. The army and police have a similar policy here where you can have facial hair-but only if it's neat and orderly. Kallus has glorious chops but they're neat chops. Conversely Cassian's facial hair is messy and his hair is uneven and he's supposed to be an officer.

[Shroom Man 777]

If we follow the theory that a lot of the Scariff personnel are actually fuckups who did a lot of asslicking to get a cushy post in an impregnably-shielded world that happens to be a tropical paradise with bitchin' waves and exotic local foods known as coco-nuts...

[Kojiro]

Eh, perhaps. More like the children of influential Imperials (or the Imperials themselves) looking to stay out of the line of fire, some combination there of. Who knows at this point? It's odd because I always pictured the Empire not as space nazis but as space colonial British. A bunch of old white dudes with English accents trying to control an Empire and stop a rebellion (a rebellion of Americans no less). Somewhere along the way it changed though. What's clear though is R1 goes out of its way to diversify the Rebellion (which is only proper) but doesn't do so for the Imperials. Which I'm fine with- make them racists (certainly colonial Brits were), it's be the least of the Empire's crimes but be consistent with it. They can't be space nazis right up until you need them to overlook something and it's glaring when that something relates to security of a top secret military base.

[Shroom Man 777]

So they might have mistaken Cassian as some Moff's galactic backpacker son who's chilling in Scariff and earning money for his lodgings by doing Imperial officer duties. Troopers from backwater and bluecollar worlds resent him cause he's privileged af.

[Galvatron]

Apparently, the Empire's humanocentrism has also noticeably diminished in the new EU:

Nevertheless, some non-humans were known to occupy lofty roles within the Empire, such as the Chagrian Mas Amedda, who served as the Empire's Grand Vizier, the Pau'an Grand Inquisitor, three other Inquisitors known as the Seventh Sister, the Fifth Brother, the Eighth Brother and Grand Admiral Thrawn.

And that's just so far. We have yet to see any examples besides Mas Amedda in the films, but the TV shows are canon too. Additionally:

According to Jason Fry, the Lucasfilm Story Group had worked out that the Galactic Empire in the new canon universe was not "openly or uniformly" xenophobic. However, he reasoned many staunch Imperials like the Servants of the Empire antagonist Janus Fhurek were also committed xenophobes. In addition, Fry explained that the Empire in the new canon timeline was not misogynistic; citing the presence of female Imperial characters in John Jackson Miller's A New Dawn novel and the Disney XD TV series Star Wars Rebels.

So there you go.

[Shroom Man 777]

Hey just because they have some good examples - some Uncle Jar Jars and head house-Gungans - doesn't mean systematic discrimination doesn't exist. Wookie enslavement was still canon too in SW Rebels!

[Galvatron]

Have you changed your mind about the mothballs yet?

[Tribble]

Apparently, the Empire's humanocentrism has also noticeably diminished in the new EU:

Nevertheless, some non-humans were known to occupy lofty roles within the Empire, such as the Chagrian Mas Amedda, who served as the Empire's Grand Vizier, the Pau'an Grand Inquisitor, three other Inquisitors known as the Seventh Sister, the Fifth Brother, the Eighth Brother and Grand Admiral Thrawn.

And that's just so far. We have yet to see any examples besides Mas Amedda in the films, but the TV shows are canon too. Additionally:

According to Jason Fry, the Lucasfilm Story Group had worked out that the Galactic Empire in the new canon universe was not "openly or uniformly" xenophobic. However, he reasoned many staunch Imperials like the Servants of the Empire antagonist Janus Fhurek were also committed xenophobes. In addition, Fry explained that the Empire in the new canon timeline was not misogynistic; citing the presence of female Imperial characters in John Jackson Miller's A New Dawn novel and the Disney XD TV series Star Wars Rebels.

So there you go.

Well it would make sense, while the Emperor may dislike non-humans he's not stupid and knows talent when he sees it.