Doctor Who S36E12: The Doctor Falls (spoilers)

[Iroscato]

Well fuck me sideways and call me Davros. Great end to a pretty awesome season

[Bedlam]

Yeah, I'm a little split about the Bill not realising she was a cyberman bit, having all her lines done in the artificial voice would be interesting but I guess you just couldn't get the same pathos as getting the actress to show the full emotion.

The Master / Missy's path... well the John Simm's version was just crazy and self destructive enough to do that, in a way you have to admire how he sticks to his (lack of) principles right to the end.

The final bit, well I don't see why this version of the doctor is so suicidal and / or afraid of moving on. Has he previously been shown to be so clingy?

The very end, well, now we have 6 months to wait to find out what's going to happen. I did for a moment wonder if the last scene was actually in a TV studio to fit with the 'Adventures in Time and Space' show but it looks like it's actually going to be a very unexpected multi-doctor story.

[DaveJB]

The final bit, well I don't see why this version of the doctor is so suicidal and / or afraid of moving on. Has he previously been shown to be so clingy?

Ten wasted a whole regeneration just because he didn't want to change his appearance and personality; Twelve's little freakout is nothing by comparison.

Going back to the classic series, Four clearly wasn't too pleased about the prospect of an imminent regeneration, but by the time it actually happened there wasn't a whole lot he could have to to prevent it, seeing how he'd just been dropped 200ft from a radio telescope. And it just so happens that One was originally scripted to spend his final moments refusing to give in to his imminent regeneration, but there wasn't time enough to record the line, which ended up completely altering the mood of his regeneration scene. Makes me wonder if Moffat found out this little tidbit, and decided to make an entire episode around it.

[RogueTwo]

Overall a pretty decent episode, ties up Season 10 nicely. Loved the interactions between the master and Missy, as well as Bill's (if a bit deus ex machina) ending. Would be nice to see what happened to Nardole in the xmas special as it seemed that he pulled the short straw in terms of dramatic endings.

The final bit, well I don't see why this version of the doctor is so suicidal and / or afraid of moving on. Has he previously been shown to be so clingy?

I wondered that too, I guess after losing Bill and being abandoned by Missy he felt that he'd had enough? As far as I could see he doesn't know that Bill survived or that Missy decided to change. Although 12 seems very willing to sacrifice himself anyway this season (oxygen, extremis, pyramid, eaters of light and finally this). Hopefully they'll explain it more as he talks to the first doctor at christmas.

[The Romulan Republic]

Okay, I pretty much loved the Doctor's plea to the Master/Missy, which is one of the best Doctor speeches I've seen. And the acting was pretty good all across the board. Damn, I'm going to miss Capaldi when he's gone, as well as some others.

However, the Usual Moffatisms have long since gotten very tired, and in particular, again, am I the only one creeped the hell out by the fact that Moffat has made romanticizing death, and particularly romanticizing suicide, one of the major recurring themes of his work on Who?

Edit: As to the final scene... well, I'm really not sure what to say about that. I'm surprised Moffat would go there, though I probably shouldn't be. I guess we'll just have to wait and see how it plays out at Christmas.

On another note, it does annoy me that it looks like they're systematically killing off as much of the cast as possible before the new guy takes over. I mean, maybe they want to "start with a clean slate" or some such nonsense, but its needless, and Bill in particular deserves better. I don't think I've ever grown to like a new companion so much, so quickly (well, besides maybe Rory). Shame.

At least with Capaldi, I can reasonably hope that he'll be brought back for a multi-Doctor special someday, and get a chance to show what he can do under a better head writer.

[Bedlam]

On another note, it does annoy me that it looks like they're systematically killing off as much of the cast as possible before the new guy takes over. I mean, maybe they want to "start with a clean slate" or some such nonsense, but its needless, and Bill in particular deserves better. I don't think I've ever grown to like a new companion so much, so quickly (well, besides maybe Rory). Shame.

At least with Capaldi, I can reasonably hope that he'll be brought back for a multi-Doctor special someday, and get a chance to show what he can do under a better head writer.

It's hardly the first time that a new production team wanted a clean slate when coming in to Who, it happened with the third and 11th Doctors as well. Personally I'd rather have one amazing series with Bill rather than stretch it out to two or three and have a drop in quality just to pander to fans who like her. Plus given how she went it hardly impossible to have her back again (although I'd prefer they didn't). I be honest I'd like a general rule of each companion not lasting more than a year, or a year and a half.

I think Nardol got a fairly good exit, it would have been nice to know something more about him and maybe have more of an arc for him even an episode where he got to be the core character.

The issue with Capaldi coming back in the future is his age, he's 60 next year, which doesn't automatically mean he won't come back but give it 5 or 10 years and it starts to build up.

[madd0ct0r]

That's two pairs of super powered teen girls running around the galaxy now...

I was very slightly irked by the pilot being able to fly the tardis, what grade repair oil was that stuff?

That is literally the only thing I can complain about. I'm going to run an rpg in that setting.

[The Romulan Republic]

On another note, it does annoy me that it looks like they're systematically killing off as much of the cast as possible before the new guy takes over. I mean, maybe they want to "start with a clean slate" or some such nonsense, but its needless, and Bill in particular deserves better. I don't think I've ever grown to like a new companion so much, so quickly (well, besides maybe Rory). Shame.

At least with Capaldi, I can reasonably hope that he'll be brought back for a multi-Doctor special someday, and get a chance to show what he can do under a better head writer.

It's hardly the first time that a new production team wanted a clean slate when coming in to Who, it happened with the third and 11th Doctors as well. Personally I'd rather have one amazing series with Bill rather than stretch it out to two or three and have a drop in quality just to pander to fans who like her. Plus given how she went it hardly impossible to have her back again (although I'd prefer they didn't). I be honest I'd like a general rule of each companion not lasting more than a year, or a year and a half.

I think Nardol got a fairly good exit, it would have been nice to know something more about him and maybe have more of an arc for him even an episode where he got to be the core character.

The issue with Capaldi coming back in the future is his age, he's 60 next year, which doesn't automatically mean he won't come back but give it 5 or 10 years and it starts to build up.

Maybe this is partly because I missed some episodes this season, but one season is not a very long time to get to know a character. Especially when Who seasons are only twelve episodes long.

I'm not saying they should have kept her around forever, but to my mind, two seasons is generally a good standard/minimum. One to get to know the character, establish who they are, etc. And one to build on that, explore their personality in more detail, get to show them in their element, etc.

As to Capaldi's age... well, the First Doctor's actor was basically the same age, and he came back. And medical technology/life expectancy then was not what it is now.

I did grow to like Nardol, yeah. Mostly, as with Bill and Twelve and Missy, that's down to the actor, not the writing.

[Eternal_Freedom]

I found that a surprisingly satisfying end to the season.

Frankly, Twelve's reaction to an imminent regeneration is not new. Two and Four were definitely not happy, though in Two's case that was because it was enforced. As noted, One was supposed to protest it, Ten obviously angsted about it, and Eight wasn't exactly pleased that he had to change, though that was more anger at what he had to change into.

I think the Doctor is fed up with changing, with having to find out who he is over and over again.

And honestly, his stubborness here was both a) much shorter than Ten's and b) a very different tone to it. Ten was whiny "I don't want to go" whereas Twelve is more "do not go gentle into that good night."

[DaveJB]

If anything, Doctors Five and Eleven are more the exception to the rule, as they were the only ones especially accepting of their imminent deaths - in Five's case because he was willing to lay down his life to save Peri, and in Eleven's case because he'd spent centuries preparing himself for perma-death, and certainly wasn't going to complain about getting a whole new regeneration cycle.

[The Romulan Republic]

Something that just occurred to me-

Most main New Who companions get at least one and half to two season.

It is, in light of that, rather unfortunate that both the black companions have gotten only a single season. I'm sure its not intentional, but its more than a little reminiscent of the old cliche of "the black character dies first." Though granted, Martha didn't die- in fact I liked her exit, in that she's the only one who didn't get some big melodramatic tearjerker, or overly-drawn out departure. She just realized she had other things she wanted to do with her life, and moved on- by far the most mature companion exit I've seen.

[Crazedwraith]

Something that just occurred to me-

Most main New Who companions get at least one and half to two season.

It is, in light of that, rather unfortunate that both the black companions have gotten only a single season. I'm sure its not intentional, but its more than a little reminiscent of the old cliche of "the black character dies first." Though granted, Martha didn't die- in fact I liked her exit, in that she's the only one who didn't get some big melodramatic tearjerker, or overly-drawn out departure. She just realized she had other things she wanted to do with her life, and moved on- by far the most mature companion exit I've seen.

Rose, two. (One per doctor) Martha, one. Donna, one. Amy/Rory, two and a half. Clara two and a half. Bill, one.

Not so much length of Tenure but everyone save Martha was hyped up a super special and meaning full and it was a tragedy when they died except didn't. They sort of subverted that Martha and sounds like they did it big time with Bill. (I've not seen twelve on broadcast since the stupidity of the Missy finale. But I might catch up if the latest series ever come to netflix)

I figure they were just trying to try some new with the companian but it is odd that happens to be the only two times they've had black women as companions in NuWho.

[DaveJB]

Early in the season they actually did seem to be dropping a few hints that Bill's background was more complex than it might first appear, and that there was some particular significance to how her mother died, but that all seemed to get swept under the rug after the Monks storyline. Possibly Moffat intended for Bill's story arc to unfold over a longer period, but then he got told to get rid of her (and presumably also Missy) at the end of the season in order to have a soft reboot under Chibnall, and ended up not having the time to bring it to a proper conclusion.

[Parallax]

I think a better ending for Bill would have been an unhappy sacrifice based one, rather than a trope ridden happily-ever-after piece of Disney nonsense.
She finds the Doctor, who is unable to stand by this point, and protects him from Cyber blast after cyber blast. The Doctor uses the old key+sonic trick from Father's Day to summon the TARDIS, all the while Bill is fending off as much fire as she can (taking brutal punishment in the process) while the Doctor continues to get struck occasionally.
The TARDIS arrives a short distance away, the Doctor suffers a direct hit and more or less collapses as he triggers the level wide self destruct. Bill carries/drags the Doctor towards the TARDIS. The doors are locked. Bill whispers a plea and the doors open. She pushes the Doctor inside and, as her cyber form gives out, mumbles "I waited."

Boom.

The TARDIS then does what it has done before and aids the regeneration process. The Doctor's resistance to change is based on his failure to save Bill.
No need for Magic Future Oil that seems superior to even Time Lord tech.

Missy remembers to carry a spare dematerialisation circuit but not shooting his/her future self? That's a fairly big loophole for future Master appearances.

[bilateralrope]

Missey and The Master killing each other was good. The Master using a weapon that he claims will prevent regeneration was not. Is Moffat really expecting future authors to never want to use a future regeneration of The Master ?

The two other big things that annoyed me were:
- Adding the fully metal cybermen.
- Water girl being someone else that can easily fly the TARDIS. Probably better than the Doctor because she didn't have any trouble around a black hole.

[JLTucker]

Can someone explain the final scene to me?

[Parallax]

Spoiler

The TARDIS takes the Doctor to an unknown location, as evidenced by the Doctor yelling at it.
The Doctor goes outside.
A mysterious figure approaches.
The Doctor yells out "I am the Doctor!"
The figures steps forward and says "No, I am the Doctor, the original you might say!"

Where are they, exactly? No idea. The Death Zone? Inside the Doctor's mind? A random planet? Is the figure just a projection of the TARDIS? Guess we'll just have to wait and find out.

[B5B7]

Martha has also had several episodes where she reappears.
Like bilateralrope I call the pilot water girl.

RE: the question about the final moments, an additional detail: Spoiler

The old man who says he is the original doctor is the Doctor from the original 1960s Doctor Who, the first doctor, though played by a different actor naturally.

[Soontir C'boath]

Spoiler

It's too bad they couldn't find someone who had a more similar accent to Hartnell's or at least studied his mannerism because other than the costume, I was put off. Also sorry, but I've type cast this guy as the Frey who killed Starks and that will not be suspended as I watch the Christmas Special

I really wish they had kept to only the Mondasian Cybermen and in the end, they were just relegated to back fill for the most part to keep Bill at the fore. Big Finish's Spare Parts did more justice for them than the two parter. It really shows the problem with the 45 minute format in how condensed things have to be and it sacrifices depth. Which is weird since Doctor Who used to come out in 4-25 minute episodes.

[NecronLord]

Where are they, exactly? No idea. The Death Zone? Inside the Doctor's mind? A random planet? Is the figure just a projection of the TARDIS? Guess we'll just have to wait and find out.

For some reason I thought they'd gone back to The Tenth Planet, with the Antarctic environment.

[Parallax]

That could be possible, yes. Except that by that time the first Doctor was quite frail and he'd have the two companions with him in any outside scenes.

[DaveJB]

As I recall, the dialogue from the closing moments of that story seemed to imply that the Doctor hurried to the TARDIS ahead of his companions (Ben and Polly), to the point where he very nearly took off without them, so it's possible that he could have briefly lost them in the snow. It's difficult to tell whether that's what actually happened, however, on account of the fact that the episode in question is missing.

[Dartzap]

Spoiler

I presume that if you pay attention to Nardols little tidbits throughout the series, one is meant to assume he is a rebuilt version of Dorium Maldovar?

Not that I mind, he was a funny character!

[Bedlam]

Missey and The Master killing each other was good. The Master using a weapon that he claims will prevent regeneration was not. Is Moffat really expecting future authors to never want to use a future regeneration of The Master ?

Actually, to me the biggest thing is that Missy never flat out states she's the next incarnation of the master after Simms, there could be a dozen versions between the two of them any of which can turn up later.

[DaveJB]

Pfft. Being shot dead is nothing to the Master. Both the John Simm and Anthony Ainley incarnations managed to come back from being burned to ashes, so a blast bad enough to prevent immediate regeneration should only be a minor obstacle to overcome by comparison.