Batman vs. Wolfram and Hart.

[The Romulan Republic]

A couple of scenarios featuring my favourite caped crusader, and my favourite urban (or is that suburban?) fantasy franchise.

For the purposes of this thread, I'm going to make it Affleck Batman/DC Cinematic Universe.

Scenario One: Season One of "Angel". Batman finds out that Wolfram and Hart is representing the Joker* (thus explaining why he's put in Arkham instead of executed), and is suspected of jury tampering. He decides to raid their offices in LA to see if he can find any evidence for Gordon. He will have access to any and all Bat gadgets and vehicles appearing in Batman v Superman (yes, since "Angel" season one takes place nearly twenty years earlier, he should have less-advanced tech., but I'm hand-waving that for the sake of practicality). He will have Alfred on the phone for tech. support if need be. For the sake of this scenario, we will assume the Batman has a vague knowledge of the supernatural, enough to know that Wolfram and Hart has assets that are not human, and to know that things like vampires and psychics exist.

Scenario Two: As above, except the raid on W and H takes place in season five, with Angel as CEO.




*I'm going to imagine that its Ledger's Joker, though, because I detest Suicide Squad, and don't much care for its take on the Joker.

[Batman]

Movieverse me already knows the supernatural (or at least the supernormal) exist thanks to the Kryptonians and Enchantress so him accepting vampires and stuff shouldn't require much assuming.

[The Romulan Republic]

Movieverse me already knows the supernatural (or at least the supernormal) exist thanks to the Kryptonians and Enchantress so him accepting vampires and stuff shouldn't require much assuming.

Well, I added that in because these scenarios would take place in 1999/2000 and 2003/2004, respectively, in keeping with Buffyverse chronology. Meaning that Batfleck would be a young vigilante at the start of his costumed career, most likely, and would have yet to encounter a Kryptonian or Enchantress.

Though since magic evidently exists in the DC Cinematic Universe, and has been around for a while, its entirely possible he might have run into something earlier in his career, if not on the same power level.

[Batman]

Fair enough.

[The Romulan Republic]

Anyway, it occurs to me that maybe I should give a bit more data on Wolfram and Hart, and its internal security.

Wolfram and Hart, of course, is one of the major supernatural powers of the Buffyverse. Its the front for a trio of immortal super demons (Old Ones) from the dawn of time, known as the Wolf, the Ram, and the Hart, but usually just referred to as "The Senior Partners". It has assets in multiple dimensions, and ruled (through its proxies, the priesthood) over the entire dimension of Pylea (basically a Medieval fantasy world) for a time. Its main offices on Earth appear to be in LA, though it has branches in major cities around the world (Angel and Spike visit one in Rome in the series' fifth season). They've also got orbital weaponry as of season five (the possibility of using some sort of orbital weapon to assassinate a target is discussed).

Its public persona is as a (notoriously corrupt) law firm, which defends both magical and non-magical clients, including organized crime figures and politicians. It has been associated with past US Presidents, and one of its plots, as I recall, involved using magic to turn a politician running against one of its clients into a pedophile to sink his campaign. Its also known for using threats, assassination, and magic to target juries or witnesses to derail cases. Large-scale memory alteration spells, at least, are within its capability.

Its secret agenda is to basically engineer corruption and despair on Earth, a sort of slow-burn apocalypse. Or so some of its people claim. Its hard to know with Wolfram and Hart. One of their executives claimed that they were behind various past atrocities, including the Spanish Inquisition. They aren't adverse to shutting down other factions' attempts to bring on the apocalypse, though.

The security of the LA office is somewhat less impressive. As of season one, the mundane security includes the usual security cameras and assorted guards (not much different than you'd expect in any corporate office building, except for the fact that the guards carry stakes for dealing with vampires).

Magical security includes vampire detectors (creatures that sense if a vampire sets foot on the premises, though they can't distinguish the number or locations of individual vampires), and mind readers (to make sure none of their own employees are double-crossing them). The first is unlikely to be a factor here. The latter could be. In fact, Wolfram and Hart uses psychics for intelligence purposes quite frequently.

They've also got some sort of demonic beastie guarding their high-security vault, though the right magical concoction can put it down instantly. I don't recall anything else about its combat capabilities, besides it being vaguely humanoid.

Season five... I'd expect the mundane security to be similar. Magical security includes a giant worm beast, IIRC, that Wolfram and Hart had hidden in the building as a failsafe, though I doubt it would activate for Batman's intrusion. Plus Angel's inner circle, who are mostly supernatural in various ways, and all formidable combatants (at this point Gunn, Wesley, Lorne, possibly Fred, Spike, Illyria depending on when it is in the season). Late season would also have Hamilton IIRC, who's got superhuman strength and durability above that of most Buffyverse vamps.

At various points during the series, we also see that Wolfram and Hart has a commando team, complete with their own vehicles and helicopter transport, but they... suck. Really, really suck. As in, they got taken out by a mortal guy with a sword. Any version of Batman would likely make short work of them.

Season four showed that as a fail safe, if someone storms the building and massacres the employees, they will be resurrected as zombies. Also not likely to be brought into play against Batman, but I figured I'd mention it for the sake of completeness.

Edit: I actually think Batman might have an easier run of it in season five, though, mainly because Angel is less likely to straight up kill him for breaking in.

[FaxModem1]

I'd imagine it'd look somewhat like this:

Wayne Enterprises faces Bankruptcy
Click on Lex News to find out more.'

'Bruce Wayne arrested for murder:
Gotham Gazette

'Wayne Family Butler found dead'
Daily Planet

Things like this are standard fare for the demonic law firm, and due to his lack of attention to his public image, where Bruce Wayne is most vulnerable.

[Q99]

I will note wanting to kill Batman and succeeding are two very different things. Even the more powerful demons will have problems with him escaping.

[FaxModem1]

I will note wanting to kill Batman and succeeding are two very different things. Even the more powerful demons will have problems with him escaping.

They don't need to kill him, tying him up in pointless court battles for years would make things extremely difficult for him.

Heck, depending on how this version of Robin died, the murder could be pinned on Bruce.

[Solauren]

Yeah, Batman vs Wolfram and Hart beyond a simple break and enter operation is a bad idea for the Batman.

vs a Demon: I'd give it to Batman
vs a Multi-dimensional DEMON LAWFIRM: I'm going with the lawfirm.

[The Romulan Republic]

I'd imagine it'd look somewhat like this:

Wayne Enterprises faces Bankruptcy
Click on Lex News to find out more.'

'Bruce Wayne arrested for murder:
Gotham Gazette

'Wayne Family Butler found dead'
Daily Planet

Things like this are standard fare for the demonic law firm, and due to his lack of attention to his public image, where Bruce Wayne is most vulnerable.

I thought Bruce (or at least most depictions of him) put a great deal of effort into crafting his public image.

Granted, that image is as an idiot playboy, which may work against him if Wolfram and Hart wants to engineer scandals.

If they kill Alfred, though... the gloves come off. This is a version of Batman who can be pushed into violating the no killing rule if you hurt the people under his protection, and if he feels that the threat can't be stopped any other way.

Unfortunately, his odds of killing the Senior Partners are worse than his odds of killing Superman (in fact, as I recall from the comics, part of the lore is that Old Ones CAN'T die permanently- kill one, and they'll eventually reemerge in some way).

But even if he's aware of the scope of the problem, I don't expect that to stop him. Remember, this is a Batman who decided to wage a one man war on Superman.

It also partly depends on weather Wolfram and Hart thinks they can use him in some way. One of the recurring ideas on "Angel" was that Wolfram and Hart could probably have killed Angel any time they wanted to... but didn't, because he was part of their prophecies and they were more interested in corrupting him.

[Elheru Aran]

W&H are quite possibly one of the few entities in fantasy fiction that can plan further into the future than Batman... they have millennia of experience playing the long game. I'm not sure he can really match them on those terms. Even the Angel gang weren't sure they'd make it. If he just confronts them in the short term it might work out for him, particularly if they decide they aren't that concerned about him and/or can use him.

[The Romulan Republic]

Yup. The scenario as stated in the OP is more "Can Batman successfully break into Wolfram and Hart's office/derail a particular case of their's?" Not, "Can Batman win a multi-dimensional war against Wolfram and Hart?" The latter, I think, is more in the Justice League's... league.

Edit: Hmm, I'll file that away as another vs. scenario to post, but I'll probably save it for after Justice League hits theatres, and we have a better sense of the team capabilities.

[FaxModem1]

If it's just a matter of getting a file from their office, he's going to get into the building fine. Getting Evil Flo from GEICO, I mean Archives to cooperate, or finding the right file, that'll be tricky.

Remember that it took Lilah a while to find out something specific about Angel's past. And she works there.

I'm sure Batman could infiltrate. Surviving the aftermath, that's another issue.