"Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

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The Romulan Republic
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"Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/max ... 9fd337a671
OTTAWA — It began with the singing of the old, less inclusive version of “O Canada.”

People’s Party of Canada Leader Maxime Bernier revealed his vision for immigration at a Mississauga, Ont. rally Wednesday evening, calling for a decrease in immigration and refugee rates.

Bernier also made a pitch for the construction of fences along specific areas of the Canada-U.S. border.

“Instead of making it easier to enter Canada and helping these illegal refugees, as the Liberal government has done,” Bernier said, “We will make it more difficult, by fencing off the areas where it takes place such as Roxham Road in Quebec.”

The Beauce MP pledged, should he become prime minister, to declare the entire length of the Canada-U.S. border an official port of entry “and send back to the U.S. anyone trying to enter illegally.”

It is not illegal for migrants to cross a border between official ports of entry if they’re seeking asylum under Canadian and international law.

Bernier later gave an unclear answer to the National Post about who would foot the tab for the pieces of border fence. “There’s no cost for that… It’s a question of declaring our sovereignty,” he said.

The Quebec crossing near Champlain, N.Y. is the site where 95 per cent of irregular border crossers entered into Canada to seek asylum in 2018. Approximately 40 per cent are children travelling with their parents, according to the United Nations Refugee Agency.

A majority of “irregular” border crossers are originally from Nigeria and Haiti. Statistics suggest Americans are the third largest group.

Despite Bernier telling the crowd that he believes “by and large, [Canada’s] immigration policy has been very successful,” he spoke at length about a cap for the number of immigrants the country takes in, decried “extreme multiculturalism” and globalism, and pledged to repeal the Multiculturalism Act.

“We will instead emphasize the integration of immigrants into Canadian society,” he said.

The Canadian Border Services Agency confirmed last month that 866 of the 45,000 “irregular” asylum seekers who have crossed the border since 2017 have been removed from the country after their claims were rejected.

“A People’s Party government will substantially lower the total number of immigrants and refugees we accept every year, from 350,000 to between 100,000 and 150,000, depending on economic and other circumstances,” Bernier said.

When Bernier ran for Conservative leader in 2017, he pledged to reduce the total number of immigrants to 250,000 a year.

Last October, Immigration Minister Ahmed Hussen announced Canada’s immigration cap will increase from 310,000 to 350,000 people by 2021. More immigrants are needed to provide businesses with the “skilled labour they need to spur innovation,” he said at the time.

Immigrants whose responses or background checks demonstrate that they do not share mainstream Canadian values will be rejected.
People's Party Leader Maxime Bernier

But long processing times for asylum claimants and insufficient funding for interim housing have earned the Liberals scrutiny from opposition MPs, as well as provincial governments.

A smaller intake of immigrants and refugees will allow resources to be redistributed, Bernier explained, which would allow a People’s Party government to increase funding for Canadian Security Intelligence Service, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and Canadian Immigration and Citizenship to conduct “thorough” interviews and background checks.

“Immigrants whose responses or background checks demonstrate that they do not share mainstream Canadian values will be rejected,” he said.

The promise is a departure from the position Bernier took during the Conservative leadership race when he called Kellie Leitch a “karaoke version of Donald Trump” for her proposal to screen newcomers with a “Canadian values test.” Of course, even if they don't spell it out, we all know the main target here is Muslims.

Bernier spent nearly an hour presenting his immigration policy to supporters at a venue popular for South Asian weddings. He attempted to dispel criticism that his party is harbouring racism and xenophobia by listing the names of some of the party’s candidates who represent “all races and religions.”

“I don’t care one bit about people’s race or skin colour. I have said many times that racists and bigots are not welcome in our party. We care about shared values, culture and identity,” he said.

“We have no lessons to receive from anyone about openness and inclusiveness.”

His comments come days after one of the party’s riding associations made a splash with a statement of their own.

Last week, the board of one of the party’s Manitoba riding associations quit en masse. The board announced its resignation with a letter explaining the “biggest problem” they faced were their own supporters.

We can't be a part of the party if this is the direction it's going. We're out. #ppc#elxn43#canpolipic.twitter.com/BFaok7bIEX

— PPC - Elmwood-Transcona (@ppcet) July 16, 2019
“Racists, bigots, antisemites [sic], and conspiracy theorists have large presence in the public conversation surrounding the People’s Party of Canada,” read the letter signed by five former members of the party’s Elmwood-Transcona riding association.

“None of these are things we would have expected you to stand beside during the leadership campaign. We are appalled to see it encouraged with a wink and a nod now.”

HuffPost Canada previously reported in the spring that organizers were encouraged to court votes from the Canadian Combat Coalition, a far-right association a senior party executive described as a “radical fringe group.”

Bernier made his mark during the 2017 Conservative leadership race with his libertarian ideas and call to abolish Canada’s supply management system. The self-described “Albertan from Quebec” lost the leadership to Andrew Scheer by a slim margin.

The Quebec MP quit the Conservative caucus last summer with some harsh parting words for his former colleagues, claiming the party had become “intellectually and morally corrupt.”

Within its first year, the party has established 338 riding associations across the country, attracting candidates such as Renata Ford, the widow of late Toronto mayor Rob Ford, and former Tory cabinet minister Steven Fletcher.

Voters are expected to head to the polls in late October.

With files from Ryan Maloney
I remember a time when you could cross the US/Canada border without a passport. Now we're talking about building fences to keep refugees from America out.

Some other highlights:

-Asylum seekers can cross legally between official points of entry under Canadian and International law. So we'll just declare the entire border an official point of entry so we can ban them from entering.

-Attacks on "extreme multiculturalism" and globalism.

-Repeal the Multiculturalism Act.

-A Canadian values test for immigrants. If you want to live here, you have to think what the state tells you its okay to think. This is a reversal of his prior position.

-A cap on immigration at between 100,000 and 150,000. This is down from the current cap of over 300,000, and an escalation of his prior pledge to cap immigration at 250,000. With the previous example, this demonstrates that his policies are becoming increasingly draconian, starting with modest xenophobia that will be palatable to the mainstream, then slowly pushing further. The same kind of steady creep of xenophobic policy we've seen in the US.

-Actively courting far Right extremist votes.

Thankfully he's not polling high (some of his own supporters, as noted above, have left in protest of the growing racism). But the very fact that a prominent national politician (who nearly got the Conservative nomination) is pushing these ideas will normalize and encourage them, and may motivate the Cons to move further Right to keep their voting base.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

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Securing the border actually is a valid point. His motivations, however are crap. I'm more concerned about smuggling then I am about "illegal immigration".

Multiculturalism and Globalism is happening. Period. The only way to stop it would be for every government and every corporation to agree to stop it. And that will never happen, as there is to much money involved.

Repeal the Multicultarism act? I'm not familiar with the particulars, but it's probably a bad idea. There may be the odd little thing that needs tweaking.

I don't like his 'testing for Canadian values', as that is subjective to the guy writing the test. However, I have no problem with immigrants having to read over a basic summary of Canadian and local Provincial laws, the fact all religious based laws have zero meaning here, and Canada's definiation of 'hate crimes'. I've run into people that were shocked to learn some of Canada's laws before.

Quite frankly, I think familiarizing yourself with the laws of any country you are going to is a good idea.

A cap on immigration isn't actually a bad idea in of itself, as it allows for better use of resources for the people that do immigrate. (i.e support services). However, his motivations are crap. I want to make sure immigrants that come in have a decent chance of succeeding, and not be forced into lifes of crime, or to live on government assistance.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by EnterpriseSovereign »

It would be fucking hilarious if he demanded that the USA paid for the wall! :twisted: :lol:
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

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Solauren wrote: 2019-07-25 06:58pm Securing the border actually is a valid point. His motivations, however are crap. I'm more concerned about smuggling then I am about "illegal immigration".
Agreed. I'm not against having border check points, and requiring people to cross there, to catch actual criminals. But I think that unless someone is a wanted fugitive or caught committing a crime (like smuggling) as they cross, we should generally let people cross freely (as Europe and Canada/the US did until fairly recently).
Multiculturalism and Globalism is happening. Period. The only way to stop it would be for every government and every corporation to agree to stop it. And that will never happen, as there is to much money involved.
Even that wouldn't stop it. Trying would throw the whole world into a depression. Refugees would still flee across borders because the alternative is death. Modern media would still transmit across borders. Terrorists would still attack across borders. Pollution would still effect the whole damn world. Its an interconnected planet, and nothing, ever, will change that reality. You might as well demand that people stop breathing.

The only question is how many people these cowardly little fuckers will hurt and kill trying to fight the inevitable.
Repeal the Multicultarism act? I'm not familiar with the particulars, but it's probably a bad idea. There may be the odd little thing that needs tweaking.
Yeah, I'm not sure about the details there myself, but given his track record, I'm pretty sure his reasons amount to "Make Canada Great Again".
I don't like his 'testing for Canadian values', as that is subjective to the guy writing the test. However, I have no problem with immigrants having to read over a basic summary of Canadian and local Provincial laws, the fact all religious based laws have zero meaning here, and Canada's definiation of 'hate crimes'. I've run into people that were shocked to learn some of Canada's laws before.

Quite frankly, I think familiarizing yourself with the laws of any country you are going to is a good idea.
I agree. I would attach one requirement to immigration besides entering at a proper point of entry, identifying yourself, and not being a criminal or wanted fugitive, and that would be that every immigrant should be required to take and pass an introductory course in Canadian (or American, as the case may be) law.

Then again, I think you should have to do that to graduate high school too.

But the state should not be allowed to tell you what you have to believe to live here. That is despotism in its purest form.
A cap on immigration isn't actually a bad idea in of itself, as it allows for better use of resources for the people that do immigrate. (i.e support services). However, his motivations are crap. I want to make sure immigrants that come in have a decent chance of succeeding, and not be forced into lifes of crime, or to live on government assistance.
We have a cap, and if anything its too low. Certainly lower than it needs to be. He wants to lower it dramatically, and given that he keeps expanding the amount by which he wants to lower it, I suspect the number he really wants is "zero" (or just let in the occassional rich white European, or whatever).
EnterpriseSovereign wrote: 2019-07-26 01:18pm It would be fucking hilarious if he demanded that the USA paid for the wall! :twisted: :lol:
Yeah, I'd enjoy seeing that shoved in Dickless's face (especially given that a lot of the surge in people crossing into Canada from the US illegally is a direct result of his policies), but as a duel citizen of the US and Canada who remembers when you could casually cross the border, I am not comfortable with the border between them being increasingly fortified.

The last thing I want is to have the situation in the US Southwest duplicated up here.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by Solauren »

The question with the immigration cap that has to be considered is simple economics.

Can we AFFORD more immigrants, and more refugees? And how much more can we afford, if any?

Any other concern is secondary to that. If we can afford to increase the limit to 500,000, without stressing government resources, I'm all for it. If we can't, then we probably shouldn't.

Someone immigrating to Canada that already has a job lined up costs nothing, and is actually a benefit to the Canadian economy. A family of 4 people that can't speak English and without job skills, unfortunately, costs to support until they get on their feet.
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Solauren wrote: 2019-07-26 10:08pm The question with the immigration cap that has to be considered is simple economics.

Can we AFFORD more immigrants, and more refugees? And how much more can we afford, if any?

Any other concern is secondary to that. If we can afford to increase the limit to 500,000, without stressing government resources, I'm all for it. If we can't, then we probably shouldn't.
Well, the current government, as noted in the OP article, seems to feel that increasing the cap from 310 to 350 per year (currently being implemented) will be an economic benefit (note that Canada prioritizes immigrants based on economic concerns, which is distinct from refugees/asylum seekers).

And Canada, at the moment, is not a struggling country, when compared to almost any nation on Earth (including the US). Sure, its not perfect, but there's no reason to think we are at or near our ceiling, other than xenophobia. There's an upper limit somewhere, and we might hit it if, say, shit well and truly hit the fan in the US and millions of Americans start fleeing the Second Civil War, but I don't see any evidence we're there now.
Someone immigrating to Canada that already has a job lined up costs nothing, and is actually a benefit to the Canadian economy. A family of 4 people that can't speak English and without job skills, unfortunately, costs to support until they get on their feet.
But may still prove a net gain in the long run, that would more than balance out the initial investment.

And I very much doubt most immigrants are lacking in job skills. What do you think they were doing in their countries of origin, sitting on their asses all day? Unfortunately, they may not have the certification to work in their former profession in Canada, which is where we get stuff like the cliche of the doctor who moves to Canada and ends up driving a cab.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

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The Romulan Republic wrote: 2019-07-26 10:16pm And I very much doubt most immigrants are lacking in job skills. What do you think they were doing in their countries of origin, sitting on their asses all day? Unfortunately, they may not have the certification to work in their former profession in Canada, which is where we get stuff like the cliche of the doctor who moves to Canada and ends up driving a cab.
The cliche, unfortunately, is all to real. And in many cases justified. Some countries just do not have anything resembling modern educational standards.

A perfect example would be this: My mother just broken her ankle last week. There are parts of the world were the local 'doctors', with local government certification, would have just decided it was better to cut her leg off then try to fix the ankle. They just don't have the education, skills, or in some cases knowledge that it's even possible, to put in 3 plates, 90 screws, and several pins in to rebuild and reinforce an ankle.

Fortunately, the higher educational institutions and certifications around the world are starting to share information, co-ordinate, etc, so that a Doctor from a country with internationally recognizes credentials, can move to a new country, write a few tests, and then get their certification approved in the new country.

As for transferable skills, it does really depends on what they were doing. In a lot of the poorer/less fortunate parts of the world, most of the labor is still manual. But, most of those jobs are done by automation here, and simply not in demand, or require you to have resources to start.
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Solauren wrote: 2019-07-26 10:34pm
The Romulan Republic wrote: 2019-07-26 10:16pm And I very much doubt most immigrants are lacking in job skills. What do you think they were doing in their countries of origin, sitting on their asses all day? Unfortunately, they may not have the certification to work in their former profession in Canada, which is where we get stuff like the cliche of the doctor who moves to Canada and ends up driving a cab.
The cliche, unfortunately, is all to real. And in many cases justified. Some countries just do not have anything resembling modern educational standards.

A perfect example would be this: My mother just broken her ankle last week. There are parts of the world were the local 'doctors', with local government certification, would have just decided it was better to cut her leg off then try to fix the ankle. They just don't have the education, skills, or in some cases knowledge that it's even possible, to put in 3 plates, 90 screws, and several pins in to rebuild and reinforce an ankle.

Fortunately, the higher educational institutions and certifications around the world are starting to share information, co-ordinate, etc, so that a Doctor from a country with internationally recognizes credentials, can move to a new country, write a few tests, and then get their certification approved in the new country.

As for transferable skills, it does really depends on what they were doing. In a lot of the poorer/less fortunate parts of the world, most of the labor is still manual. But, most of those jobs are done by automation here, and simply not in demand, or require you to have resources to start.
It would be nice to see more coordination and sharing of knowledge and skills, so that training in one country can carry over more readily to other countries.

Or, failing that, retraining programs to bring immigrants up to speed with Canadian guidelines. Because God knows we have a shortage of, for example, doctors here.

As to automation, that's a whole problem of its own, and the real economic threat (which oligarchs happily distract from by blaming immigrants, so the masses will be too busy fighting each other to realize who's automating all their jobs away).
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: "Build That Wall" comes to Canada.

Post by Solauren »

Unfortunately, some region of the worlds 'medical school' covers less then Grade 11 Biology here in Canada. That's not a little retraining, that's "needs to be trained from the ground up".
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
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