The Walls Come Down: No Travel Betwen US and Europe for 30 Days

[Jub]

Must you continually kramer into this thread to demand the execution of thousands.

The alternative seems to be to simply continue to back down whenever a bunch of Americans with guns decide that the rules no longer apply to them. Look at how the Bundy's managed to get themselves involved in not one but two armed standoffs and managed to walk away completely scot-free. The most time anybody received for an armed occupation of government property was 37-months in federal prison and 3-years supervised release. You can literally do more time for non-violent drug offences than you'll get for destroying public property while armed.

I get the desire to preserve life and avoid another Waco, but at a certain point you have to stop giving ground to the various armed mobs that strongarm their way out of trouble in the US.

[loomer]

Must you continually kramer into this thread to demand the execution of thousands.

The alternative seems to be to simply continue to back down whenever a bunch of Americans with guns decide that the rules no longer apply to them. Look at how the Bundy's managed to get themselves involved in not one but two armed standoffs and managed to walk away completely scot-free. The most time anybody received for an armed occupation of government property was 37-months in federal prison and 3-years supervised release. You can literally do more time for non-violent drug offences than you'll get for destroying public property while armed.

I get the desire to preserve life and avoid another Waco, but at a certain point you have to stop giving ground to the various armed mobs that strongarm their way out of trouble in the US.

Fuck off, Jub. You're not advocating for just a crackdown. You're specifically advocating - in bad faith, I suspect, so no, I won't be debating you on it - for the summary execution of wounded, subdued captives. So, once again - go fuck yourself.

[Jub]

Fuck off, Jub. You're not advocating for just a crackdown. You're specifically advocating - in bad faith, I suspect, so no, I won't be debating you on it - for the summary execution of wounded, subdued captives. So, once again - go fuck yourself.

So when the shooting starts, if it does, why should the armed mob of idiots be treated any better than an ISIS agent, member of the Taliban, etc? What is the difference between those terrorist groups and their aims and a hypothetical situation where US citizens against the current lockdown start shooting because they don't like being told to stay put for their own good?

[loomer]

Fuck off, Jub. You're not advocating for just a crackdown. You're specifically advocating - in bad faith, I suspect, so no, I won't be debating you on it - for the summary execution of wounded, subdued captives. So, once again - go fuck yourself.

So when the shooting starts, if it does, why should the armed mob of idiots be treated any better than an ISIS agent, member of the Taliban, etc? What is the difference between those terrorist groups and their aims and a hypothetical situation where US citizens against the current lockdown start shooting because they don't like being told to stay put for their own good?

Newsflash, fuckwit: You aren't allowed to summarily execute wounded ISIS or Taliban fighters either.

[Jub]

Newsflash, fuckwit: You aren't allowed to summarily execute wounded ISIS or Taliban fighters either.

Yes, because soldiers never put in an extra round or two into a downed enemy just to be sure. The alternative is leaving the armed mob to deal with their own wounded even though that seems less humane. I wouldn't suggest that an armed and organized group be given succour or aid until the whole lot has surrendered or subdued.

[loomer]

Newsflash, fuckwit: You aren't allowed to summarily execute wounded ISIS or Taliban fighters either.

Yes, because soldiers never put in an extra round or two into a downed enemy just to be sure. The alternative is leaving the armed mob to deal with their own wounded even though that seems less humane. I wouldn't suggest that an armed and organized group be given succour or aid until the whole lot has surrendered or subdued.

Again, Jub, you're not saying 'well, if someone puts an extra round in, whatever'. You're specifically saying 'shoot to kill, and actively go person to person, shooting anyone who survives.'

You are literally advocating for war crimes, you fucking pissant shitbird.

[MKSheppard]

I'm just sitting here, thinking about the whole line of thought that goes:

"Hey, you know......lets antagonize heavily armed people with stockpiles of modern munitions that dwarf most small national stockpiles -- these aren't 40 year old fowling pieces owned by rich bluebloods for Foxhunts on the steeple, but WEAPONS UF WARRRRRRR."

*GALAXY BRAIN*

The people do have a right to protest, because get this, in the fucking 1600s during the Plagues and such, even the British Crown and the Mayor of London was intelligent enough to arrange for food to be delivered to houses placed under quarantine and locked for 40 days and nights.

The equivalent of this would be arranging for national payments of TrumpBux as long as the quarantine/lockdown lasts, because people need to pay notes and bills.

But no, all we get is like a one time payment of $1200 to $3000 depending on your tax situation. YES THIS WILL WORK OUT GREAT.

[MKSheppard]

In related news...

The coronavirus outbreak at the Smithfield pork processing plant in Sioux Falls, South Dakota has grown to 850 cases.

https://twitter.com/3amWaffleHouse/stat ... 6792177665

[Jub]

Again, Jub, you're not saying 'well, if someone puts an extra round in, whatever'. You're specifically saying 'shoot to kill, and actively go person to person, shooting anyone who survives.'

You are literally advocating for war crimes, you fucking pissant shitbird.

"I am a former infantryman in the US Army. During training we were always taught that you are allowed to shoot a wounded enemy while advancing on them and were taught to shoot at enemy on the ground as you approached them to ensure they were dead. Once you move past a wounded enemy, it is against Geneva convention to turn back and shoot them, which was known as "double tapping""

Is this a war crime too?

[loomer]

Again, Jub, you're not saying 'well, if someone puts an extra round in, whatever'. You're specifically saying 'shoot to kill, and actively go person to person, shooting anyone who survives.'

You are literally advocating for war crimes, you fucking pissant shitbird.

"I am a former infantryman in the US Army. During training we were always taught that you are allowed to shoot a wounded enemy while advancing on them and were taught to shoot at enemy on the ground as you approached them to ensure they were dead. Once you move past a wounded enemy, it is against Geneva convention to turn back and shoot them, which was known as "double tapping""

Is this a war crime too?

I told you I'm not debating you, fuckhead, and I meant it. I'm not here to provide jollies on your lunch break.

You are advocating for the systematic execution of subdued, wounded prisoners. Go fuck yourself.

[Jub]

I told you I'm not debating you, fuckhead, and I meant it. I'm not here to provide jollies on your lunch break.

You are advocating for the systematic execution of subdued, wounded prisoners. Go fuck yourself.

Wounded does not mean subdued. Unless the combatant is clearly down and out or actively attempting to surrender they are live targets.

I am advocating for treating any armed group that fires first as if the were an insurgent group that the US is actively fighting, this includes all the nasty parts of a fight that they don't show on the news.

[loomer]

I told you I'm not debating you, fuckhead, and I meant it. I'm not here to provide jollies on your lunch break.

You are advocating for the systematic execution of subdued, wounded prisoners. Go fuck yourself.

Wounded does not mean subdued. Unless the combatant is clearly down and out or actively attempting to surrender they are live targets.

I am advocating for treating any armed group that fires first as if the were an insurgent group that the US is actively fighting, this includes all the nasty parts of a fight that they don't show on the news.

No, Jub. You're advocating for, and I quote, 'humanely finish[ing] off the wounded'. You're not advocating for ordinary tactics, or for minimizing risk - you have specifically argued that hey, they should just go from person to person executing anyone who survives the fight. Not just those who aren't surrendering, not just those who continue to fight, not just those who might reasonably be held to pose a risk of injury or death.

So again - go fuck yourself, and fuck your attempts to disguise what you're actually arguing for. You are an intellectually dishonest little pissant and there is something quite seriously wrong with you.

[MKSheppard]

Half our politicans need to be executed.

ONE PAGE.

ONE FUCKING PAGE.

Authorizing emergency national quarantine income until lockdown is raised

BUT NO.

https://www.congress.gov/116/bills/hr74 ... 748enr.pdf

335 pages of fucking bullshit.

[loomer]

Half our politicans need to be executed.

ONE PAGE.

ONE FUCKING PAGE.

Authorizing emergency national quarantine income until lockdown is raised

BUT NO.

https://www.congress.gov/116/bills/hr74 ... 748enr.pdf

335 pages of fucking bullshit.

I don't recall if you yanks have an equivalent to delegated legislation, but that sure seems like a job for it if I ever saw one.

[Jub]

No, Jub. You're advocating for, and I quote, 'humanely finish[ing] off the wounded'. You're not advocating for ordinary tactics, or for minimizing risk - you have specifically argued that hey, they should just go from person to person executing anyone who survives the fight. Not just those who aren't surrendering, not just those who continue to fight, not just those who might reasonably be held to pose a risk of injury or death.

Why should assholes who've taken up arms because they can't follow some very simple rules to keep millions of people safe be treated as anything but the animals they are? Why should armed militia groups in the US be tolerated as if they serve a useful function?

I've made no bones about what I think of Americans being armed at all given that it took a literal plague to give us a March free of school shootings, but groups like the Bundy's or people protesting sensible orders to remain at home except for essential needs, yeah fuck them especially. The world is better off without them.

[loomer]

No, Jub. You're advocating for, and I quote, 'humanely finish[ing] off the wounded'. You're not advocating for ordinary tactics, or for minimizing risk - you have specifically argued that hey, they should just go from person to person executing anyone who survives the fight. Not just those who aren't surrendering, not just those who continue to fight, not just those who might reasonably be held to pose a risk of injury or death.

Why should assholes who've taken up arms because they can't follow some very simple rules to keep millions of people safe be treated as anything but the animals they are? Why should armed militia groups in the US be tolerated as if they serve a useful function?

I've made no bones about what I think of Americans being armed at all given that it took a literal plague to give us a March free of school shootings, but groups like the Bundy's or people protesting sensible orders to remain at home except for essential needs, yeah fuck them especially. The world is better off without them.

Fuck off with your lust for death, asshole. I'll say it once, and once only. You treat the wounded with compassion because it's the right thing to do, no matter what they've done. You treat the wounded enemy with care because that care is owed to all people, because to not do so is to surrender the values of kindness, justice, charity, and decency. The alternative is corrosive to those values and to the values of inclusive democratic orders. When someone is helpless, it is the act of a petty coward to further victimize them.

[The Romulan Republic]

Half our politicans need to be executed.

Says the man who just accused me of hysterics.

Let me guess which half you want executed. Somehow, I doubt its the ones who are blocking any aid to unemployed low income people stuck in their houses. No, your support for the militias and their Fuhrer makes it quite clear that your hand-wringing over the plight of the poor is just a smoke screen, to justify your desire to massacre Democrats in the name of protecting your precious guns.

Let me be clear: YOU ARE ADVOCATING THE EXTERMINATION OF PEOPLE WHO SHARE MY VIEWS AND ACTIONS. Your post is a direct, deadly threat against me and every person who shares any of my political views.

If it was up to me, you would be in prison for incitement of treason and terrorism. I will not advocate your death, despite your clear support for treason and war crimes against your fellow countrymen, because I'm a better person than you.

[bilateralrope]

The New Zealand Prime Minister just gave an update:
- We currently have an R0 of 0.48
- Of the 1,440 cases of Covid-19 we have, all but 8 were traced back to overseas contact.
- The lockdown will remain at level 4 until monday the 27th. On the 28th, we drop to level 3
- Level 3 will be in place for 2 weeks. Then reevaluated.

My guess is that the government didn't think that people could be trusted to stay home for ANZAC day if we dropped to level 3 on thursday.

[Jub]

Fuck off with your lust for death, asshole. I'll say it once, and once only. You treat the wounded with compassion because it's the right thing to do, no matter what they've done. You treat the wounded enemy with care because that care is owed to all people, because to not do so is to surrender the values of kindness, justice, charity, and decency. The alternative is corrosive to those values and to the values of inclusive democratic orders. When someone is helpless, it is the act of a petty coward to further victimize them.

So the US does this now, for all of it citizens? They treat all their wounded, sick, etc. because healthcare is a basic human right that should be freely accessible to all... Does being forced to ration insulin count as a wound? How about being denied life-saving surgery due to a preexisting medical condition?

In essence, you're giving these armed insurgents more rights than their law-abiding kin because of a misguided sense that offering aid to those that were just shooting at you is a virtue.

[loomer]

Fuck off with your lust for death, asshole. I'll say it once, and once only. You treat the wounded with compassion because it's the right thing to do, no matter what they've done. You treat the wounded enemy with care because that care is owed to all people, because to not do so is to surrender the values of kindness, justice, charity, and decency. The alternative is corrosive to those values and to the values of inclusive democratic orders. When someone is helpless, it is the act of a petty coward to further victimize them.

So the US does this now, for all of it citizens? They treat all their wounded, sick, etc. because healthcare is a basic human right that should be freely accessible to all... Does being forced to ration insulin count as a wound? How about being denied life-saving surgery due to a preexisting medical condition?

In essence, you're giving these armed insurgents more rights than their law-abiding kin because of a misguided sense that offering aid to those that were just shooting at you is a virtue.

Jub, again. You are advocating for going from person to person and shooting wounded people in the head. Stop trying to equivocate and evade and have the fucking guts to own your position and defend it for what it is. Because all this? This is irrelevant bullshit, and completely wrong. Because it's not giving them 'more rights' - it's respecting the same basic right that says that someone can't come over to your house and shoot you in the head because they think it would be a benefit to society. You're seriously fucking cooked.

[Jub]

Jub, again. You are advocating for going from person to person and shooting wounded people in the head. Stop trying to equivocate and evade and have the fucking guts to own your position and defend it for what it is. Because all this? This is irrelevant bullshit, and completely wrong. Because it's not giving them 'more rights' - it's respecting the same basic right that says that someone can't come over to your house and shoot you in the head because they think it would be a benefit to society. You're seriously fucking cooked.

Yes, because the alternative is giving those same people more rights than law-abiding US citizens or leaving them wounded in the streets.

[loomer]

Jub, again. You are advocating for going from person to person and shooting wounded people in the head. Stop trying to equivocate and evade and have the fucking guts to own your position and defend it for what it is. Because all this? This is irrelevant bullshit, and completely wrong. Because it's not giving them 'more rights' - it's respecting the same basic right that says that someone can't come over to your house and shoot you in the head because they think it would be a benefit to society. You're seriously fucking cooked.

Yes, because the alternative is giving those same people more rights than law-abiding US citizens or leaving them wounded in the streets.

Except it's not more rights, you fuckhead. Every citizen has the right to receive medical treatment when wounded and taken into custody - you might recognize it as a major part of the outrage whenever someone dies in custody because they didn't get that treatment. They also have the right not to be summarily executed by the cops, which you may also recognize as literally the reason there is outrage when the cops do that anyway.

Also, you're trying to justify an act of active murder because, what, sometimes people don't get insulin? They're not comparable, fuckwit, and it's a nonsensical argument. That's like me saying I can come burn your house down because sometimes people steal cars and don't get caught - the existence of a situation in which rights exist but are violated does not justify the further violation of those rights for other people. So, once again, you can go and fuck yourself and your lust for death.

[loomer]

Remote Indigenous communities in the NT are facing shortages and price spikes, and are calling for supply guarantees and subsidies. No big surprise there - it's a notorious issue at the best of times - but hopefully one of the outcomes of this crisis will be to resolve it in the long term.

[madd0ct0r]

Remote Indigenous communities in the NT are facing shortages and price spikes, and are calling for supply guarantees and subsidies. No big surprise there - it's a notorious issue at the best of times - but hopefully one of the outcomes of this crisis will be to resolve it in the long term.

Is that something a coop could address or is the normally higher price a factor of driving out to deliver and driving back?

[loomer]

Remote Indigenous communities in the NT are facing shortages and price spikes, and are calling for supply guarantees and subsidies. No big surprise there - it's a notorious issue at the best of times - but hopefully one of the outcomes of this crisis will be to resolve it in the long term.

Is that something a coop could address or is the normally higher price a factor of driving out to deliver and driving back?

A coop might be able to, but part of the cost is transportation - and you'd need the initial startup capital to fund the coop too.