fucking savages

[Stravo]

Given all that we know about the regime, the brutality, the rape, the torture, feeding people to massive meat grinders, hanging women that wave to allied troops how can ANYONE be surprised about these actions?

[Darth Wong]

You know what's funny? If this had taken place in America in a time of peace, and the soldier was murdered and hung up for public consumption after being dragged around the streets, the only crime we could convict that man of is murder, because dead bodies have no rights. Hell, after the victim is dead, the body can be raped, mutilated, set aflame, chopped into little itty bitty pieces and served as an hors d'oeuvre, and the only thing we could get that bastard for is murder.

Actually, that's not true. Desecrating graves and dead bodies is a criminal charge, but a relatively minor one. While this action is obviously against the rules of war, it is nowhere near as significant an infraction as pretending to surrender and then opening fire, because the former action hurts a body which is already dead, while the latter action actually causes deaths (not to mention complicating future legitimate surrenders).

[Coyote]

Some pretty gruesome fates came to Soviet soldiers in Afghanistan, as I recall. For some "third world" fighters it is the only opportunity thay have to display any sort of power over such an overwhelming opponent.

Still, an explanation is not an excuse. They're still nasty shits.

Of course we heard lots of protest from the first Gulf War about US troops disposing of bodies in mass graves with bulldozers, but will the "-niks" protest the Iraqis desecrations of the dead, numerous Geneva Convention violations including what may turn out to be the execution of prisoners?

Probably not.

[Queeb Salaron]

Actually, that's not true. Desecrating graves and dead bodies is a criminal charge, but a relatively minor one.

IIRC, the only reason digging up graves is illegal is because it's tampering with private property, not because it violates the rights of the dead. I know it's specifically stated somewhere in one of the law books under my bed collecting dust. I'll have to go look it up...

While this action is obviously against the rules of war, it is nowhere near as significant an infraction as pretending to surrender and then opening fire, because the former action hurts a body which is already dead, while the latter action actually causes deaths (not to mention complicating future legitimate surrenders).

...I don't even think that's the topic at hand. The issue raised pertained to a dead body being dragged around the streets of Bagdhad and hung for all to see. The point I was trying to raise was that yes, it's a war crime to publicly display the bodies of dead soldiers, but in the US, there's no law condemning it. Not any Federal law, anyway. Maybe states have statutes that say things of the sort.

[Axis Kast]

Incorrect. To defile a dead body is technically trespassing and violation of private property. The body technically "belongs" as a legal bundle to the next-of-kin.

I also garantee that if you "found" a body on the street and began to do horrible things to it, you'd be arrested at once. I couldn't tell you the very exact charges in that case, but they'd be fairly hefty I'm sure.

[weemadando]

And as usual Ando makes excuses for any anti-US action no matter how barbaric. :roll:

*takes a bow*

Thankyou lord of the exaggeration...

It's abosultely revolting that they would mutilate a body and it certainly violates the rules of civilized warfare. I'm not suprised given the barbaric conduct of the Iraqis thus far. Of course one can always hope they'd behave civilly.

When did I say that it was acceptable to mutilate or defile bodies?

I didn't. So find some fucking proof of me saying it before you accuse me of it.

[Queeb Salaron]

Incorrect. To defile a dead body is technically trespassing and violation of private property. The body technically "belongs" as a legal bundle to the next-of-kin.

I also garantee that if you "found" a body on the street and began to do horrible things to it, you'd be arrested at once. I couldn't tell you the very exact charges in that case, but they'd be fairly hefty I'm sure.

See, that's not what I remember reading. Serial killers like Ted Bundy and Ed Gein who murdered numerous people and defiled their bodies, and people like Jeffry Dahmer who even went so far as to cannibalize their victims, were only brought up on a number of counts of Murder 1. There were no further charges filed. But maybe they didn't NEED to file those charges? It seems to me that they would have at least been brought to the table if they were stand-alone offenses just to bring out the maximum possible penalty, wouldn't they? Or maybe defilement of the corpse is included in murder 1? I don't remember.

[Axis Kast]

Trust me on this one. You defile a corpse, you are going to jail. It is now happening to two people who dressed up a corpse in NYC over Halloween and then dumped it under a bridge. That goes beyond tresspassing.

[Sam Or I]

Funny the US was planning to move to a "faster" lighter force as well. I wonder if they have changed there plans as well.

[Sam Or I]

Wrong thread, sorry

[Queeb Salaron]

Trust me on this one. You defile a corpse, you are going to jail. It is now happening to two people who dressed up a corpse in NYC over Halloween and then dumped it under a bridge. That goes beyond tresspassing.

Hm. I'll have to go research. I'll let you all know soon as I find something. Till then, accept my concession.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

As expected, Marina basically says "because they're really pissed off" in her own special way

and it only cost her $100,000 to learn how!

Probably, though it depends on what you count, and if I still believed in what my teachers had taught me I'd be repeating the same line as Queeb, Stas and WMA.

[Alex Moon]

As expected, Marina basically says "because they're really pissed off" in her own special way

and it only cost her $100,000 to learn how!

Probably, though it depends on what you count, and if I still believed in what my teachers had taught me I'd be repeating the same line as Queeb, Stas and WMA.

Where did you go to school?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Where did you go to school?

The Left Coast.

[Alex Moon]

Where did you go to school?

The Left Coast.

Well, you have my sympathies so far...

Cali, Oregon or Washington? That is, if you don't mind me asking.

[weemadando]

As expected, Marina basically says "because they're really pissed off" in her own special way :)

and it only cost her $100,000 to learn how!

Probably, though it depends on what you count, and if I still believed in what my teachers had taught me I'd be repeating the same line as Queeb, Stas and WMA.

Repeating the same line?

Well I never. And anyway, the teachers I've had never fed us a line, surprisingly enough.

And 100,000? Actually, my total debt for my degree is going to be about 20,000. Thats 20,000 AUSTRALIAN.

Sucks to have a shitty university scheme were you have to pay stupid amounts.

[nelson]Ha-Ha[/nelson]

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Well, you have my sympathies so far...

Cali, Oregon or Washington? That is, if you don't mind me asking.

Well, I'll admit that I'm addicted to coffee.

[Alex Moon]

Well, you have my sympathies so far...

Cali, Oregon or Washington? That is, if you don't mind me asking.

Well, I'll admit that I'm addicted to coffee.

::Hugs Duchess:: There there, it's going to be all right. Shhhhh, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone...

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Repeating the same line?

Well I never. And anyway, the teachers I've had never fed us a line, surprisingly enough.

I didn't mean to say one could mix-and-match words; even if one could in regard to arguments, you're much more polite than the other two named. But it's the outlook. You are, after all, a confessed Marxist.

[Sea Skimmer]

Where did you go to school?

The Left Coast.

And so the curtain of darkness descends once more...

Of course we heard lots of protest from the first Gulf War about US troops disposing of bodies in mass graves with bulldozers, but will the "-niks" protest the Iraqis desecrations of the dead, numerous Geneva Convention violations including what may turn out to be the execution of prisoners?

The US version of "mass graves" and the images that most people think of don't match. The US Army and Marines do somtimes buries enemy bodies by bulldozing a long trench, and lining the bodies up in it single stack, often markers are added for every single one after the trench is filled. Though even this isn't that common, individual graves are dug when possibul but there are simple health concerns that come along with the whole process.

Meanwhile the stereotypical mass grave is basically a big hole which you back a dump truck of corpses up to deep in the woods.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

::Hugs Duchess:: There there, it's going to be all right. Shhhhh, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone...

*hypertensive quiver* Must.. Kill... Birkenstockers....

[weemadando]

Repeating the same line?

Well I never. And anyway, the teachers I've had never fed us a line, surprisingly enough.

I didn't mean to say one could mix-and-match words; even if one could in regard to arguments, you're much more polite than the other two named. But it's the outlook. You are, after all, a confessed Marxist.

I am confessed Marxist because I like the theory. However, I acknowledge that the reality of things is very, very, very different.

[Joe]

::Hugs Duchess:: There there, it's going to be all right. Shhhhh, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone, the bad people are all gone...

*hypertensive quiver* Must.. Kill... Birkenstockers....

Birkenstock is a tool of the capitalist overclass which exploits cheap third world labor without providing adequate workplace safety and etc. etc.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

I am confessed Marxist because I like the theory. However, I acknowledge that the reality of things is very, very, very different.

So pictures of you marching down mainstreet in Hobart with a rifle and a red banner to seize the local government offices as you sing the Internationale will not be appearing shortly in my paper? *g*

[Queeb Salaron]

I didn't mean to say one could mix-and-match words; even if one could in regard to arguments, you're much more polite than the other two named. But it's the outlook. You are, after all, a confessed Marxist.

::Frowns:: Up to this point I thought I'd been nothing but polite... Maybe a tad bit extreme at times, but that's just my nature. Ah well. I suppose I'll try harder to be more civil. You have my sincerest apologies. ::Bows out for the time being::