Israel orders mass 'evacuation' from Northern Gaza, humanitarian crisis certain to ensue

[loomer]

Starting to really look like the translation on the ground is more or less correct and that the IDF's official statement about an 'imprecise' translation indicates either that their own Arabic-speaking guys are shit at their jobs or that they are - and this is hard to believe - attempting to massage the truth for optics.

[loomer]

There are already credible allegations emerging of prisoner abuse.

The abuse lasted almost a whole day. Soldiers and settlers detained and handcuffed three Palestinians from the West Bank village Wadi as-Seeq, and for hours, according to the Palestinians, they were severely beaten, stripped to their underwear, and photographed handcuffed, in their underwear. Their captors urinated on two of them and extinguished burning cigarettes on them. There was even an attempt to penetrate one of them with an object.

At the same time, soldiers and settlers arrested leftist Israeli activists who were present, including a minor, cuffed them, threatened to kill them, and detained them for hours. Some of the activists were beaten. The activists say that in addition to the presence of people in uniform, at some point a young settler in civilian clothes was put in charge of guarding them.
...
The Palestinians who spoke with Haaretz said that the settlers and soldiers detaining them said that the Shin Bet security service was expected to arrive. Then more men arrived in a civilian car, and questioned them while abusing them severely. In response to inquiry by Haaretz, the Shin Bet denied that their men were present at the site or were involved in the incident.

Haaretz spoke with six witnesses to the incident, three Palestinians and three Israeli activists. Two of the Palestinians who experienced the worst abuses sent numerous photographs of the bruises, signs of blows, and burns – not all of which are published here out of regard for the privacy of the interviewees.

...
At the same time as these incidents, in another part of the village, five Israeli leftist activists, including a minor, were detained for hours. Three of them, who spoke with Haaretz on the condition of anonymity, had gone to the village that morning to help the residents who were being forced to leave.

According to the activists, when they heard that settlers had attacked Palestinians at the entrance to the village, they drove there. “When they saw us, they began chasing us,” says T., one of the activists. “Some of them were in uniform or half uniform-half civvies, but their vehicles were civilian.”

The Israeli activists managed to videotape this stage of events, and send it in real time to other activists who were at home at the time. The video reached Haaretz as well but is not being published in order to protect the activists...

The IDF spokesman said in response: “An IDF force arrived at a farm in the area of Wadi Zik in the sector of the Benyamin Regional Brigade, following a report regarding a number of Palestinian suspects. The force caught the suspects, and after searches, found a knife and axe on them. The detention and conduct of the force in the field contravened what is expected of soldiers and commanders in the IDF. The incident is under investigation by the commanders, from which multiple discrepancies have arisen. Following the preliminary investigation, the decision was made to oust the commander of the unit which made the arrest. Under the circumstances and in view of the seriousness of the suspicions, it was decided to open an Investigative Military Police investigation. In every confrontation, IDF forces are expected to act to separate the parties in order to maintain security and order in the district.”

The Shin Bet stated, “The Shin Bet has nothing to do with the incident described. No parties on behalf of the Shin Bet were present, and it is not being handled by the Shin Bet.”

No responses have arrived from Neria Ben Pazi or the police.

I don't think I need to outline that these are crimes against humanity.

[Broomstick]

In sum: be careful of drawing any long-term conclusions from the response to an event that has split the staunchest supporters of Israel outside of Israel itself down the middle. I'm used to hearing arguments at local Jewish events, the old saw "two Jews three opinions" has some truth to it, but I've never seen so much shouting and literal table-pounding.

IDK, Bibi seems to have speed run the GW Bush 2001 to GW Bush 2005 course in about... two weeks.

https://twitter.com/ettingermentum/stat ... 0168266780

I was speaking about the American Jewish community. Your poll doesn't specify demographics but given it's breaking things down by political party I'm assuming Americans at large. That's apples to oranges and not relevant to what I said.

[Broomstick]

Saudi Prince slams Hamas, Israel, and The West

Can't say the Prince is wrong about any of that.

The wording of flyers and voice messages received by the inhabitants of Gaza is being disputed by the IDF. Al Jazeera's claim (and that of a good number of others on the ground) is that it warns that anyone found in Gaza City will be presumed to be a terrorist, be likely to be designated a terrorist, or be considered a collaborator (with all that entails), while the IDF's claim is that it basically just says 'you'll probably get caught in the crossfire and die'. Could any of our Arabic reading members take a look and see which translation is closer?

Regardless of translation I don't trust the Israeli government and by extension the IDF to be anything other than indiscriminate. Too many are enraged and out for revenge, and too many favor genocide in the current Israeli regime.

More and more, I'm wondering if the Israeli leader is not just using the attack as an excuse, that some will find palatable, just to annihilate that area and everyone in it. Possibly with the intention of claiming and building in it.

Smovitch and ben-Gvir, both in Netanyahu's government, are open advocates of genocide and ethnic cleansing. Those are the people Netanyahu chose as part of his current government. Draw your own conclusions.

[Ralin]

Smovitch and ben-Gvir, both in Netanyahu's government, are open advocates of genocide and ethnic cleansing. Those are the people Netanyahu chose as part of his current government. Draw your own conclusions.

Yeah but isn't that him making alliances with people significantly more extreme than him for the purpose of staying in power and out of jail? I was under the impression that he was pretty squarely a slow oppression gradual ethnic cleanser (and probably drawing it out indefinitely to keep the Other around as a unifying threat) who panders to the load them on the trains and send them to the camps ethnic cleansers.

As with Putin, this seems like it has implications for who is likely to replace him if he is deposed and they are not good ones.

[Solauren]

Smovitch and ben-Gvir, both in Netanyahu's government, are open advocates of genocide and ethnic cleansing. Those are the people Netanyahu chose as part of his current government. Draw your own conclusions.

Yeah but isn't that him making alliances with people significantly more extreme than him for the purpose of staying in power and out of jail?

His motivations don't matter. He's still allied with them. It's like somone saying 'it's okay to ally with the KKK, as they are getting me votes'.

I was under the impression that he was pretty squarely a slow oppression gradual ethnic cleanser (and probably drawing it out indefinitely to keep the Other around as a unifying threat) who panders to the load them on the trains and send them to the camps ethnic cleansers.

Which is typical for dictator scumbags.

As with Putin, this seems like it has implications for who is likely to replace him if he is deposed and they are not good ones.

Again, typical dictator scumbags. Put someone else that is actually worse in position to replace them if you are removed via force, so the rest of the world does what it can to keep the 'lesser of two evils', in place.

[Ralin]

His motivations don't matter. He's still allied with them. It's like somone saying 'it's okay to ally with the KKK, as they are getting me votes'.

It's relevant to his intentions.

[MKSheppard]

https://twitter.com/lookner/status/1715794187809939847

Bloomberg: Israel dropped new leaflets on Gaza City today, saying in part, "whoever chooses not to evacuate would likely be designated as a member of a terrorist organization."

[LadyTevar]

Israeli Airstrike in West Bank city of Jenin

Israel carried out an air strike in Jenin in the northern West Bank early on Sunday, saying Hamas was using a mosque as a "terrorist compound".

Palestinian Authority officials said two people died when the Al-Ansar mosque was hit.

Although the Israeli military regularly raids targets in the West Bank, it rarely uses air strikes there like it does against Hamas-controlled Gaza.

Pictures from the scene showed rubble and significant damage to the building.

The Israeli military said those killed were from the Hamas and Islamic Jihad groups and were organising an "imminent terror attack".

It said the compound they were using was under the mosque and had been in use since July. It released images of what it said were entrances to the compound, alongside images of weapons, computers and security measures pictured at the site.

The IDF did not confirm whether a plane, helicopter or drone had been used in the Jenin strike on Sunday, but Israeli media reported that it was a fighter jet.

The reports said if confirmed it would be only the send time in about two decades that a fighter jet had hit a target in the West Bank.

The Palestinian Authority health ministry says two other Palestinians were killed by Israeli forces in the West Bank overnight. It brings the total number of Palestinians killed in the West Bank since 7 October to 89.

The Palestinian Authority (PA) runs parts of the West Bank. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas is the leader of the PA and is from the Fatah political party.

The Gaza Strip is run by Fatah's rival Hamas, which carried out deadly attacks on Israeli military posts and kibbutzes near Gaza on 7 October, killing more than 1,400 people and taking more than 200 hostages into Gaza.

Israel has been carrying out an intensive air bombardment of Gaza ahead of an expected ground offensive there and has vowed to destroy Hamas as an organisation.

The Hamas-run health ministry in Gaza says 55 more Palestinians in Gaza were killed in Israeli air strikes overnight and more than 4,300 have been killed in total since 7 October, more than half of them women and children.

Didn't someone just warn Netanyahu NOT to start a war with West Bank as well?

[Darth Yan]

https://twitter.com/lookner/status/1715794187809939847

Bloomberg: Israel dropped new leaflets on Gaza City today, saying in part, "whoever chooses not to evacuate would likely be designated as a member of a terrorist organization."

They can't leave though in most cases; it's basically saying they plan to commit genocide.

[Gandalf]

What exactly in Netanyahu's anticipated outcome here?

I can only assume his plan is to use this as a pretence to ethnically cleanse and then take some of Gaza in the name of security. However, this is done so violently as to encourage Hamas or similar to take up arms again in time, justifying a repeat of this episode. It reads like a smarter and more cynical version of the Bush II crusade.

[MKSheppard]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-e ... rcna121513

Michigan has one of the largest Muslim and Arab American populations in the country, and they say their support for Biden was instrumental to putting him over the top in the critical swing state in 2020. But now, Ramadan and other Democratic leaders in the state were hearing nothing but frustration with Biden — and threats to not vote for him again.

In a series of more than a dozen roundtable discussions with Muslim community leaders in the two weeks since the Oct. 7 attack by Hamas, Ramadan said the main takeaway is that “people are very disappointed.” They say they “will not forget what President Biden did and why he lied to them,” he added.

FYI, there are about 3.7 million Arab Americans now per the 2020 census. Against this as of 2020 the American Jewish population is 7.6M.

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads ... s-to-grow/

At the same time, our projections suggest that the U.S. Muslim population will grow much faster than the country’s Jewish population. By 2040, Muslims will replace Jews as the nation’s second-largest religious group after Christians. And by 2050, the U.S. Muslim population is projected to reach 8.1 million, or 2.1% of the nation’s total population — nearly twice the share of today.

[LadyTevar]

Posted without comment, because anything I say right now will break IVP.

Israeli Settler Violence Surges in West Bank

Abed Wadi was getting dressed for the funeral when the message arrived.

It was an image, forwarded to him by a friend, of a group of masked men posing with axes, a petrol canister, and a chainsaw, with text printed on the image in Hebrew and Arabic.

"To all the rats in the sewers of Qusra village, we are waiting for you and we will not mourn you," the text said.

"The day of revenge is coming."

Qusra was Wadi's village, in the northern part of the West Bank near Nablus. The funeral that day was for four Palestinians from the village. Three had been killed the previous day - Wednesday 11 October - after Israeli settlers entered Qusra and attacked a Palestinian family home.

The fourth was shot dead in clashes with Israeli soldiers that followed.

The following day, the Qusra villagers were preparing to set out for a hospital half an hour away and return with the bodies of the dead. To do so, they would need to travel across land that is dotted with Israeli settlements, where the risk of violence, high even in ordinary times, has risen dramatically in the two weeks since the Hamas attack that launched a war with Israel.

Wadi put his phone down and continued getting dressed. There were four men in refrigerators in the hospital who needed to be brought home. He was not going to be deterred by a threat, he said. He had heard too many.

There was no way for Wadi to know that, in a few hours' time, hardline Israeli settlers would confront the funeral procession and his own brother and young nephew would be shot dead.

"If we had delayed one or even two days, what good would it have done?" Wadi said, sitting in the shaded courtyard of his family home in Qusra.

"Do you think that the settlers would have left this place on the second day?"

According to the UN's humanitarian office, the week that followed Hamas's murderous attack was the deadliest for Palestinians in the West Bank since it began reporting fatalities in 2005, with at least 75 Palestinians killed by the Israeli military or settlers, and incidents of settler violence up from an average of three a day to eight.

In one raid on a Palestinian refugee camp, and a rare air strike in the region, on Thursday 12th, Israeli forces killed at least 12 people, Palestinian officials said, and Israeli police said one officer was killed.

There was "a real risk" of the occupied territory "spiralling out of control", the UN said this week.

Palestinian residents of the West Bank say that while the world's attention is drawn to the unfolding disaster in Gaza, Israeli settlers are taking advantage by entering villages and expelling, and even killing, Palestinian civilians.

In at least three cases, according to video footage or eyewitness testimony from villagers, the settlers have been wearing military uniforms or accompanied by the Israeli military in their attacks.

The first three men who died in Qusra had gone to defend a family in a house on the outskirts of the village, after settlers approached the house and began throwing rocks at it, several residents told the BBC.

They say the settlers then opened fire at the Palestinian neighbours who came to assist, killing two teenagers and a young man - Hasan Abu Sorour, 16, Obayda Abu Sorour, 17, and Musab Abu Reda, 25 - and gravely wounding several others. Moath Odeh, aged 21, was killed later in clashes with soldiers.

Among the wounded were a father and his six-year-old daughter, who lived at the house, who were shot in the face and in the abdomen respectively, according to two people who received the dead and wounded at a nearby medical clinic.

One of those assisting at the clinic was Amer Odeh, a cousin of two of the victims. It fell to Amer to call Said Odeh, the father of 17-year-old Obayda.

"I told him, your son is lightly injured," Amer said, in an interview alongside Said in Qusra on Tuesday. "I could not give him this shock over the phone."

Said rushed to the medical centre. "They told me that my son was injured but there was no way for me to see him at that moment," he recalled, his eyes shiny with tears.

"I told them I wanted to see my son now, and I entered that room and I saw that by the grace of God he had been martyred."

The following day was set to be the funeral for the four victims. Abed Wadi put the image of the masked men with axes and chainsaws out of his mind and joined the funeral convoy bringing the bodies back from the hospital to Qusra.

As the cars and ambulances made their way along the Nablus-Ramallah road, the convoy was ambushed by hardline Israeli settlers. In the clash that followed, according to video footage and eyewitness testimony, settlers pelted the convoy with stones, some members of the funeral convoy threw stones back, and the Israeli settlers and soldiers responded with live fire.

In the "chaos and heavy, random gunfire," Abed Wadi lost track of his brother, Ibrahim, a 63-year-old local politician with the Fatah Movement, and Ibrahim's son Ahmed, a 24-year-old law student. Video footage of part of the confrontation appears to show Ahmed and others running away from the gunfire, before Ahmed is cut down by bullets on the road.

"They told me my nephew was shot twice in his stomach and once in his neck, and my brother was shot in his waist, towards his heart," Wadi said.

"There were no weapons in our funeral convoy," he said. "Usually we would fly the Palestinian flag from the cars but we did not even fly our flag, because of the fear."

Residents in Qusra told the BBC this week that fear had permeated the village. Last weekend was the beginning of olive season in the area, but residents who depend on the harvest for their income said they would not go to the groves on the outskirts of the village for fear of settlers shooting.

There had already been a significant increase in violence by Israeli settlers this year, even before the Hamas attack, according to UN data, with more than 100 incidents reported each month and about 400 people driven from their land between January and August.

Israeli human rights organisation B'Tselem told the BBC that since the attack, it had documented "a concerted and organised effort by settlers to use the fact that the entire international and local attention is focused on Gaza and the north of Israel to try to seize land in the West Bank".

Partial data compiled by B'Tselem, covering the first six days after the Hamas attack, recorded at least 46 separate incidents in which it said settlers threatened, physically attacked or damaged the property of Palestinians in the West Bank.

"A lot of shepherding families and communities have fled because they were threatened in the past week by settlers," said Roy Yellin, a spokesman for B'Tselem. "Settlers have been giving residents a deadline to leave and telling them if they don't they will be harmed. And some villages have been totally emptied out."

One of those villages was Wadi al-Siq, near Ramallah, previously home to a Palestinian Bedouin community of about 200. "For months we have been facing harassment and attacks from settlers day and night, but since the start of the war the attacks increased," said Abdul Rahman Kaabna, 48, a farmer from Wadi al-Siq.

On 9 October, a group of approximately 60 settlers, many dressed in military uniforms, attacked the community, according to three now-exiled residents. "They attacked us with weapons and terrified everyone," Kaabna said. "Then they gave us one hour to go out with our sheep and threatened us to death if we didn't leave."

The residents walked more than 10km (6.2 miles) to escape, said another resident, Ali Arara, 35. "The settlers stole everything from our homes," he said. "My daughter was terrified. They beat us and left us with nothing."

According to B'Tselem and Yesh Din, another Israeli human rights group which monitors West Bank violence, the intimidation and forced displacement reported in Wadi al-Siq has been repeated in communities across the territory since 7 October.

In one of the most shocking incidents caught on film in the past week, an Israeli settler entered a Palestinian village called Al-Tuwani near Hebron and shot an unarmed Palestinian resident in the stomach at point blank range, while an Israeli soldier appeared to look on.

The incident began when two armed settlers, accompanied by a soldier, attacked a home on the outskirts of the village, according to three residents including the homeowner.

"Three Israelis came to my house, they were armed, and one was wearing the uniform of the army," said Musab Rabai, 36.

"One of the settlers came into the house, pushed me and beat me on the head with the gun and told me he was going to shoot me."

Neighbours responded to Rabai's shouts for help, he said. Among them was Zakriha Adra, a father of four. Video footage filmed by Adra's cousin, Basel, shows the settler who allegedly beat Rabai and the Israeli soldier standing a short distance away from the group of Palestinian neighbours. The armed settler then suddenly approaches Adra, strikes him with his rifle and shoots him in the stomach from just a few feet away.

Throughout the encounter, Adra appears to be holding his arms by his sides in a non-threatening manner.

According to the family, Adra is now in hospital in critical condition. "He survived but the bullet has done a lot of damage inside his stomach," said Basel, his cousin.

Musab Rabai, whose house was attacked, said the shooting had been a culmination of days of threatening behaviour and property destruction by the settlers.

"Since Saturday they have been standing around the village armed with guns and using a bulldozer to destroy trees," he said. "The men here in the village have been sleeping in shifts, only a few hours each, so there is always someone awake in case the settlers attack."

The BBC asked the Yesha Council, the umbrella organisation for the settlers in the West Bank and elsewhere, to comment for this story but they declined. Moti Yogev, the acting head of the Binyamin Council, which also represents settlers in the region, said that violent settlers "belonged to the fringes" of the settler community. "If they do exist, they should be dealt with like any other criminal," he said.

The Israeli military and Israeli police force did not respond to multiple requests for comment.

"The most tragic thing is that the violence by these extreme settlers does not produce any response from the Israeli military," said Dov Khenin, a former Israeli politician turned peace activist. "And the violence has its own purpose, to get rid of these small Palestinian communities, to eject them from their homes."

The fear for many Palestinians now is that the situation in the West Bank will only get worse. Israel's National Security Minister, Itar Ben Gvir, announced last week that the government would purchase 10,000 rifles to arm Israeli civilians, including those in West Bank settlements - a move that threatens to further blur the lines between armed settlers and members of the military in the occupied territory.

In Qusra, Abed Wadi said he had heard the news about the 10,000 rifles. He shook his head. "It won't change anything for the people of Qusra," he said.

Wadi was sitting in his courtyard, surrounded by posters bearing the image of his brother, his nephew, and the four other men from the village who were killed last week.

"We have always seen the rifle in the hands of the settlers, they have been shooting at us for a long time," he said.

But something had changed, he said. It seemed as though the settlers had become more aggressive, more radical. "Farm houses are being burned, olive trees cut down, cars broken into, land is being stolen," Wadi said.

"And this is just our village. If you were to look to the next village and the next village, you would find anger and pain in every one," he said. "And you would see no end to it."

[Broomstick]

So... the Arab Muslims are disappointed in Biden and threatening to never vote for him again. Sure, it's a free country, those that are citizens can vote however they like.

But if it comes down to Biden vs. Trump again are those same Muslim Arabs really going to vote for the anti-Muslim Trump? You know, the guy who wanted to ban all immigration from majority Muslim nations. Someone much more pro-Israel, pro-Netanyahu than Biden ever was or likely will ever be?

[Gandalf]

Or they stay home, making it harder for Biden to get sufficient votes.

[MKSheppard]

But if it comes down to Biden vs. Trump again are those same Muslim Arabs really going to vote for the anti-Muslim Trump?

Think longer term. Think beyond Trump. Think beyond this current war.

Before 9/11, the GOP was making outreach to the Islamic community, viewing them as a counterweight to the Democrat dominance of the Jewish community. By 2030, expect there to be a massive fight over POC/minority/value rankings in the totem pole with everyone doing a zero sum game of musical chairs.

Madness? هذه ديترويت

[Zaune]

So... the Arab Muslims are disappointed in Biden and threatening to never vote for him again. Sure, it's a free country, those that are citizens can vote however they like.

But if it comes down to Biden vs. Trump again are those same Muslim Arabs really going to vote for the anti-Muslim Trump? You know, the guy who wanted to ban all immigration from majority Muslim nations. Someone much more pro-Israel, pro-Netanyahu than Biden ever was or likely will ever be?

Continually having a choice between they guy who's doing nothing but paper over the cracks and the guy who's trying to burn the place down for the insurance makes it really hard to motivate yourself to go out and vote for anyone after a while.

[LadyTevar]

So... the Arab Muslims are disappointed in Biden and threatening to never vote for him again. Sure, it's a free country, those that are citizens can vote however they like.

But if it comes down to Biden vs. Trump again are those same Muslim Arabs really going to vote for the anti-Muslim Trump? You know, the guy who wanted to ban all immigration from majority Muslim nations. Someone much more pro-Israel, pro-Netanyahu than Biden ever was or likely will ever be?

Continually having a choice between they guy who's doing nothing but paper over the cracks and the guy who's trying to burn the place down for the insurance makes it really hard to motivate yourself to go out and vote for anyone after a while.

However.... I'll go vote for the paper-hanger because I DO NOT WANT the world burned down.

Because refusing to vote just gives the worst option more power.

[Ralin]

However.... I'll go vote for the paper-hanger because I DO NOT WANT the world burned down.

Because refusing to vote just gives the worst option more power.

Gotta be some limit to how many times you're willing to do that. Because voting isn't just strategic. It's saying that someone should be in charge and represents you.

Voting for the least bad candidate has its place. But I'm going to find it really hard to justify voting for the guy whose reaction to Israel gearing up to revenge bomb the fuck out of Gaza was to send a couple aircraft carriers there to make it clear to anyone thinking of intervening that he has Israel's back.

[Steve]

Alternative take: it prevents a wider explosion and gives him leverage to compel Israel to do things like allow more aid in, and reportedly the Israelis are even being blunt that the US is pushing them on that.

But it's not a reason-based political position, it's an emotional one, a gut one.

[Darth Yan]

Biden grew up believing the racist fantasies Zionists out out and is trying to maintain what he believes even as it crumbles

[Gandalf]

However.... I'll go vote for the paper-hanger because I DO NOT WANT the world burned down.

Because refusing to vote just gives the worst option more power.

Refusing to vote does yield the space to those who do, but at the same time, the party refusing to do anything to secure a voter yields the voter to those who do. A party can't tell people to go fuck themselves, and then expect those same people to turn around and vote said party in.

If the Democrats want more votes from the Arab Muslim community in 2024, then they should work for them.

[LaCroix]

Just found out a fact that, in hindsight, the only possible scenario.

All Hamas websites are hosted in Russia.

[Ralin]

Just found out a fact that, in hindsight, the only possible scenario.

All Hamas websites are hosted in Russia.

So?

[Broomstick]

It enables them to spread propaganda and venom without restraint. Hence, the social media cesspit becomes even more shit.