Super Battle Droid vs Data

[Omega-13]

TWO SCENARIOS :

SCENARIO ONE : A borg cube, with no drones on it. It has its share of open spaces and hallways, data has a phaser rifle, and the super battle droid its own wrist blaster

SCENARIO TWO : Both are trapped in the same turbo lift, neither has its weapon, hand to hand

[Mr Bean]

1. Depends on Armor, Data's Faster but that Phaser might not do anything aginst it leading to a Slaughter or he might tag the Body Core killing it

2. Disngage Motor Control and Falls on Data Not enough room from him to dodge all that tonnage

[Omega-13]

1. Depends on Armor, Data's Faster but that Phaser might not do anything aginst it leading to a Slaughter or he might tag the Body Core killing it

2. Disngage Motor Control and Falls on Data Not enough room from him to dodge all that tonnage

DAta is faster at what? I don't see him being faster at targetting, he has to control his arms, and then the direction of the weapon, the droid doens't have to do that,
The phaser can damage equipment around the droid, or shoot the floor out, maybe data could make it walk into a trap, he's pretty smart
I'm not saying DAta would win on the borg cube, but he has a good chance,

As for hand to hand combat, could Data tear a superbattle droid apart?

[Mr Bean]

Physicaly, no I don't think Data can't tear it apart, but it has things like cooling lines and what-not that he COULD tear and "kill" it, And I mean Data(Who can run at human speed ) is phyiscaly faster

And unlike Black Driod, White Data can jump

[Omega-13]

Physicaly, no I don't think Data can't tear it apart, but it has things like cooling lines and what-not that he COULD tear and "kill" it, And I mean Data(Who can run at human speed ) is phyiscaly faster

And unlike Black Driod, White Data can jump

I've watched the battle scene a million times, i've never seen any cooling lines or hydrolic lines on the super battle droid, it looks all inclosed

[Isolder74]

1> Battlw Droid

2> Data

I'll explain later since i'm late for class

[Master of Ossus]

I think that in normal combat scenarios, the super battle droid would win because of its much higher rate of fire. In melee combat, I think Data would win easily. He appears to be both significantly stronger and faster than the super battle droid.

[Kamakazie Sith]

I think that in normal combat scenarios, the super battle droid would win because of its much higher rate of fire. In melee combat, I think Data would win easily. He appears to be both significantly stronger and faster than the super battle droid.

Agreed. The high rate of fire from the blaster would probably give Data no choice but to remain under cover. IIRC those blasters seemed fairly accurate to.

[Omega-13]

Well I agree that the super battle droid would win in the cube, it would be setting its blaster on fully automatic, and basically blasting everything in site, data would be pinned. But i don't agree that Data would totally win in the turbo lift,
1. Data has a weight disadvantage, he's about the same weight as a human

2. Data might be bullet proof to 5.56 mm rounds, but his skin is still soft, which means that internal systems could stil be crushed from applied weight.

3. Size of the arms and pistons seem to be huge, 3P0 was lying on the ground during the battle, and R2 came over and got his head, well the shoulder socket of the battle droid was huge, you could sort of see the huge pistons and hydrolics, I think those would rip him apart,


Clone Troopers were hiting battle droids, and hitting them off their feet, but UNLIKE normal battle droids, and Droideka's, they weren't blowing apart, just falling over with a few sparks, (don't even know if they were shut down or not) Super Battle Droids can also deflect blaster bolts from smaller guns, as seen in the same battle scene

[Master of Ossus]

The real problem for the SBD is that it was not designed for melee combat. Its joints don't articulate very well, and it does not appear to have overwhelming strength. I think that if it came down to a slugging match, Data would beat it.

[Omega-13]

The real problem for the SBD is that it was not designed for melee combat. Its joints don't articulate very well, and it does not appear to have overwhelming strength. I think that if it came down to a slugging match, Data would beat it.

how do you know it isn't good at melee?
how do you know it doesn't have over whelming strength? we never saw it do anything

data would beat it based on what?

[Master of Ossus]

Data would beat him based on the fact that the SBD has no apparent ability to fight in melee combat. If it was designed to fight in melee combat, I would criticize its design more. After all, fighting with its hands is really completely secondary to its role. Seeing as how it has built in ranged weapons, its ability to fight in hand-to-hand combat would be purely secondary, and would almost certainly add cost to the units without any appreciable gains in combat effectiveness.

[Omega-13]

Data would beat him based on the fact that the SBD has no apparent ability to fight in melee combat.

obviously not against jedi with light sabres, why would they try?

After all, fighting with its hands is really completely secondary to its role.

so infantry don't know hand to hand combat now?

Seeing as how it has built in ranged weapons, its ability to fight in hand-to-hand combat would be purely secondary,

just like a infantry soldier, armed with a ranged combat weapon m16...his hand to hand is secondary, moving on.

[Master of Ossus]

The point is that the SBD would never be separated from its weapon. Its weapon is built into its arm! Therefore, it really should not be very well prepared for melee combat, as it would really have no reason to ever engage in fighting using its fists. It should be able to rely on its repeating blaster cannon for all of its combat needs. Think about it. Money spent making the droid ready for melee action would not significantly improve the droid's combat performance. It is unlikely to run out of ammunition, from what we can tell, and it is capable of using battle droid blaster rifles, if it is ever in an emergency. That is really enough of a contingency plan, when you think about it.

Incidentally, the SBD did punch a battle droid out of the way to clear a firing lane, but that appeared to be the extent of its observed melee capabilities. It was not very impressive.

[Kamakazie Sith]

so infantry don't know hand to hand combat now?

That's not what he is saying. The SBD only hand to hand demonstration was when it backhanded a Basic Battle Droid, and that wasn't very impressive.

In fact the whole design of the SBD seems to be around range weapons. It's heavy armor for example, it's heavy blaster. It was designed to fight against soldiers armed with weapons. It could probably deal with a regular humonoid but Data is a completely different.

Data has done many things that are much more impressive than knocking the head of a BBD. Maybe the SBD is stronger than Data but we've not seen much and that which we have seen is not impressive....considering a Gungan was able to flick the head of droid with his fingers and it fell off.

[Omega-13]

so infantry don't know hand to hand combat now?

That's not what he is saying. The SBD only hand to hand demonstration was when it backhanded a Basic Battle Droid, and that wasn't very impressive.

In fact the whole design of the SBD seems to be around range weapons. It's heavy armor for example, it's heavy blaster. It was designed to fight against soldiers armed with weapons. It could probably deal with a regular humonoid but Data is a completely different.

Data has done many things that are much more impressive than knocking the head of a BBD. Maybe the SBD is stronger than Data but we've not seen much and that which we have seen is not impressive....considering a Gungan was able to flick the head of droid with his fingers and it fell off.

oh c'mon, stop BS'ing this here

the battle droid is an infantry weapon, of course they can go melee, they have ranged weapons, just like todays soldiers, they have armour, just like todays soldiers (not as much, but as much as we can put on a human) do you see soldiers going hand to hand over their rifle? NOOO, we don't, same with the SBD, it used its blaster instead of going hand to hand with JEDI WITH A LIGHTSABRE,

give me a break

[Kamakazie Sith]

oh c'mon, stop BS'ing this here

the battle droid is an infantry weapon, of course they can go melee, they have ranged weapons, just like todays soldiers, they have armour, just like todays soldiers (not as much, but as much as we can put on a human) do you see soldiers going hand to hand over their rifle? NOOO, we don't, same with the SBD, it used its blaster instead of going hand to hand with JEDI WITH A LIGHTSABRE,

give me a break

Nobody is BSing anything Omega. We or at least I am not even questioning why they didn't go melee against the Jedi......that is obvious. However, when it did backhand a BBD it was NOT impressive......that is the extent of it's HtH abilities. You are trying to give it more....

Now when Episode III comes out hopefully we will see something more.

[Master of Ossus]

If you continue to ignore the point then I may be liable to begin flaming you.

It takes a considerable amount of resources to make a droid capable of engaging in melee combat. It needs a more powerful system of hydraulics (or whatever SBD's use), better joints, and weapons. All of those cost money.

The SBD was clearly designed for fighting at range. Its built-in weapon appears to be its primary armament. To make a droid designed for long range combat capable of fighting hand to hand is really pretty pointless, given the amount of money that such an upgrade would cost. It also would grant no real advantage in actual combat, since the droid's repeating blaster is built in and appears to be very effective.

Now, in order to fight in melee combat, the SBD would need a weapon. It has no weapons other than its fists, and if it can reach a target with its fist, it can certainly do so with its repeating blaster. Now, we see that its joints do not appear to articulate very well, and we also see that the droid does not have any additional weapons that are apparent. This indicates that as it is the droid is expected to fight in combat within acceptable parameters with just its repeating blaster. This indicates that that weapon is very reliable and not likely to run out of ammunition before the droid is destroyed. All of this leads me to believe that the droid is designed only to fight at range.

Further, why would the droid need to know melee combat? The barrel of its weapon does not extend far beyond the range of its fists, and so it can be used without very much room to maneuver. Even if engaged by a target using melee weapons, the blaster should still be able to operate freely, and the costs associated with equipping such a droid for melee combat would be greater than the potential benefits of preparing it for such actions once the droid was engaged in combat.

Your assumption that droids equipped for ranged fighting are also good at hand-to-hand is also COMPLETELY bogus. Look at the Droideka, for crying out loud! That system is clearly not built for fighting in melee action, and in most respects is analogous to the SBD. Why should we assume that the SBD is better at melee combat than has been shown, when it can be inferred from all of my evidence that it is likely not cost-effective to prepare the droid for melee action, and my other example clearly indicates that melee combat is not considered of great importance for battle droids.

[Howedar]

One need only look at the SBD's joint structure to tell that it would be poor at melee combat.

[Captain Cyran]

SBD's are not meant for melee combat, as for my proof look at the two posts above mine. As for the "well infantry fight hand-to-hand" argument, it is a moot point. There are very few similarities between a SBD and Star Wars battle tactics and Infantry with Earth tactics, and melee combat is not one of those similarities.

[Omega-13]

Give me a f*cking break, you guys are shouting un-suported non sense,

huge additional resources and costs to give a droid additional programming to do hand to hand if it needs to? It doesn't need 55 weapons to know how to use its hands if its blaster gets destroyed,

Give it a rest,
my favourite part by kamakazi Sith, that what we saw was the extent to what it can do, i love that line, I picked up a fork, i guess thats ALL i can do, even though i have the size and weight that would indicate i can do more

great job

[Omega-13]

One need only look at the SBD's joint structure to tell that it would be poor at melee combat.

vs something that weighs less, and has much less durable armour,
its not fighting equals

[Captain Cyran]

As I see it Omega...Your the one who is shouting un-supported nonsense. There is NO proof that they do have any melee abilities. Plus it makes no sense what so ever to waste money on a hand-to-hand combat program that you can put into something like ohh say, building a second SBD. Like I said before, tactics between modern earth and SW are very different. Your point about it is the same as infantry now is COMPLELETELY bogus. They both have ranged weapons and they both wear armor...the similarities end there. Try pointing out something other then that to prove your point.

[Omega-13]

As I see it Omega...Your the one who is shouting un-supported nonsense. There is NO proof that they do have any melee abilities. Plus it makes no sense what so ever to waste money on a hand-to-hand combat program that you can put into something like ohh say, building a second SBD. Like I said before, tactics between modern earth and SW are very different. Your point about it is the same as infantry now is COMPLELETELY bogus. They both have ranged weapons and they both wear armor...the similarities end there. Try pointing out something other then that to prove your point.

bullshit it ends there,
the battle droids (both models) are the primary infantry, supported by "armour"
the infantry has a lot more in common with present day earth than not.

what is unsupported? We know it can bash around normal battle droids, we know that it has hands, and we know its an infantry

[thecreech]

As I see it Omega...Your the one who is shouting un-supported nonsense. There is NO proof that they do have any melee abilities. Plus it makes no sense what so ever to waste money on a hand-to-hand combat program that you can put into something like ohh say, building a second SBD. Like I said before, tactics between modern earth and SW are very different. Your point about it is the same as infantry now is COMPLELETELY bogus. They both have ranged weapons and they both wear armor...the similarities end there. Try pointing out something other then that to prove your point.

I don't want to add any fuel to the fire here but in all honesty i would agree with the above statment... first off you never see them punch other than one of them that knocked over a regular battle droid but that doesn't mean a thing. They are very stiff and straight foward, they are designed to shoot. Do you also asume that a regular battle droid can fight in CC also? I see that point you are trying to make but it canon doesn't prove it.