Are teachers overpaid?!

[Stravo]

Can annyone from our international contingent chime in with how well teachers do outside of the states?

[Zaia]

Can annyone from our international contingent chime in with how well teachers do outside of the states?

Yes, I'd be particularly interested in hearing about Australia, since if it's at all humanly possible, I'd like to live and teach there one day.

[Vympel]

Can annyone from our international contingent chime in with how well teachers do outside of the states?

Yes, I'd be particularly interested in hearing about Australia, since if it's at all humanly possible, I'd like to live and teach there one day.

We have a shortage of teachers. Complaints about pay level all the time. Government initiatives promising to fix it.

Same old .....

[Keevan_Colton]

I think its a universal thing...

[Tsyroc]

Personally I think most teachers are underpayed.

Here's the current pay scale for the school district in Iowa that I graduated from. Bettendorf Schools

Based on that I don't think they are paying their teachers well enough. I always thought that was the case when I went to school there. It seemed to me that a lot of teachers suplemented their income by coaching sports or teaching a lot of summer school.

Here's the pay scale for the main school system where I live now. Tucson Unified Schools

On the surface the pay in Tucson seems a bit more reasonable but there's a lot they don't tell you. Tucson schools are definately overcrowded and unlike Iowa we have a fairly active gang problem.

The cost of living in Tucson is higher than in Iowa but I'm doing pretty well making the equivalent to what the lower end teachers are making, although I didn't have to put in as many years as they did to get there. What looks nice to me about the various pay scales is that there are automatic raises based on time. For someone who didn't get even a cost of living raise last year and isn't likely to get one this year either that looks pretty nice. Now if I hadn't heard all the horror stories about parents and their kids.

[EmperorChrostas the Cruel]

One imporant little factto add to the pile. Most tacher spendagood percentage oftheir own PERSONAL income, on school supplies, as the district can't pay for them. Stupid useless things, like pencils, and paper.
Yes they can write these thing off on their taxes, but they never get all their money back.

This bit about getting paid 12 months, to work 9 months out of the year is BS.
Teachers only get paid for when they work, and most opt into a program where there have their paid splitup, over 12 months, else there is a 3 month period where they don't receive any pay.
My mother Teaches, and is retiring this year.
Most of the problems inher work comefrom BAD parent!
The rest come from STUPIC PC bullshit regulation.
Too many of todays parents want to be friends with there children, not parents.(the little monsters suffer from a bad case of "selfesteemia")
Too many administrative a-holes want a lawsuit proof set of rules, with regulations replacing judgement.


In my day, understanding WHY a child was misbehaveing, was not as important as letting the hild know this behaviour was unacceptable

Now they want to know WHY is Jonny shitting in the urinal. Understanding has supplanted disipline. They children almost run the class. One disruptive child ca make the whole class suffer, and there is NOTHING the teacher can do about it.

Case and point, my Mom had one little bastad, who kept saying, litteraly, "Fuck you bitch, I can do what I want!" It took her MONTHS to get rid of him!

[Crazy_Vasey]

Can annyone from our international contingent chime in with how well teachers do outside of the states?

From memory teacher wages in the UK start out at £17,000 a year for a fresh out of uni graduate and after 5 years the average is around £22,000

Not bad in the north where living costs are low but I wouldn't want to try and live in London on that.

[EmperorChrostas the Cruel]

Fuck, I have GOT to get a new key board. The sticking and not working keys are making me look like an illiterate!
( if I don't use serious muscles and pound the keys!)

[Tsyroc]

I almost find it amusing how much kid's get their asses kissed in schools these days. I actually went to a grade school where the principal was permited to paddle students. He even had a special board with a knot hole in it. I don't think it was a particularly good form of punishment because one of the kids that I know who got paddled was more pissed about it than anything. I do think the threat was a good deterent though.

From what I've heard around here it sounds like it's pretty hard to even suspend students because the parents might make a court case out of it instead of just dealing with their kid.

[Tsyroc]

From memory teacher wages in the UK start out at £17,000 a year for a fresh out of uni graduate and after 5 years the average is around £22,000

Not bad in the north where living costs are low but I wouldn't want to try and live in London on that.

Converted that appears to be in the same ballpark as what US teachers get paid.

[phongn]

One imporant little factto add to the pile. Most tacher spendagood percentage oftheir own PERSONAL income, on school supplies, as the district can't pay for them. Stupid useless things, like pencils, and paper.

At my high school we were required to take a research class, and my teacher was constantly having to buy supplies - not merely pencils and markers but more expensive stuff like lab-grade supplies and such. They aren't cheap.

The county gives a kickback to teachers whose students do well on AP tests, but that usually doesn't cover everything - and research is not an AP class (though he might get something for the students who're selected to go to ISEF or the state science fair).

[Hamel]

This whole thing makes me wonder if parents are telling their kids outright to act like assholes in class. You really, really have to go out of your way to act as badly as some kids do these days~ Probably has a lot to do with the "me me me" individualism garbage they stuff into kids' brains

[Hamel]

I also think that, more than simply pay, teachers don't get enough appreciation for what they do. During my school years, most of the recognition was given by the good students that loved the teachers; the community didn't give a bawlsak.

[neoolong]

This whole thing makes me wonder if parents are telling their kids outright to act like assholes in class. You really, really have to go out of your way to act as badly as some kids do these days~ Probably has a lot to do with the "me me me" individualism garbage they stuff into kids' brains

I would think it is more of an attitude that kids pick up from their parents about teachers not relaly being important.

[Hamel]

muh stuff

I would think it is more of an attitude that kids pick up from their parents about teachers not relaly being important.

I've seen that too, and I can't fathom why a parent would sell that kind of idea to his/her own child

[Knife]

This whole thing makes me wonder if parents are telling their kids outright to act like assholes in class. You really, really have to go out of your way to act as badly as some kids do these days~ Probably has a lot to do with the "me me me" individualism garbage they stuff into kids' brains

I agree with you.

[The_Nice_Guy]

Can annyone from our international contingent chime in with how well teachers do outside of the states?

Well, in Singapore teachers are considered to be pretty well paid, as the government here recognises that since we have nothing but people, we had better put in good money to make sure kids grow up smart.

Education takes up a hefty chunk of the budget, but everybody agrees that's the way it should be. The only furious debates we have on education here are on the system itself, which is another issue entirely.

Just for comparison, when I graduate, hopefully with a 2nd upper, I'll get about $3000 a month after I get the teaching diploma(take note I have already served my military time in National Service). Most university graduates get about $2500 in their first job. A well paying job is anything above $2500.
http://www1.moe.edu.sg/teach/salary.htm

The pay of teachers follows the pay grade scheme of civil servants in general, with some modifications. The monetary rewards are quite good, and it entices talented people into education.

So I would say that underpaid teachers is definitely not an universal given. Logical and pragmatic governments would recognize the importance of education and act accordingly. Certainly, the Singapore government is one of the most coldly logical and pragmatic ones around.

The Nice Guy

[Kelly Antilles]

A guy here at work's wife is a teacher. She teaches special ed, ie. the problem kids. She had one kid who cussed her out violently (no, not turrets). She called the principal to call the police. Well, she and her aide spent the next four hours SITTING on this boy until the police arrived. The assistant principal was sitting ON HIS ASS IN THE ROOM not helping.

She has these problems all the time.

[jegs2]

Teachers in modern times have nothing in the way of authority or disciplinary powers. My dad suffered a brain anurism after 25 years of teaching. The Broward County School Sytem screwed him over, giving him only partial retirement, since the anurism didn't kick in while he was teaching. He sued and lost -- Broward County can afford really nice lawyers. My mom is still teaching, and after nearly 20 years of teaching, she makes less than me, and I will be eligible for retirement from the Army before she will be able to retire from teaching.

[Andrew J.]

I agree; schools need competitive wages, and they also need more rigorous qualifications, so that there are fewer bad teachers.

[Sea Skimmer]

I am assuming the salaries are based off of public schools, and I would be interested in what the private sector pays for a comparison. All and all though, I am for teachers making substansially more cash in their respective marketplace.

Private schools actually tend to pay less the public.

[Tsyroc]

I am assuming the salaries are based off of public schools, and I would be interested in what the private sector pays for a comparison. All and all though, I am for teachers making substansially more cash in their respective marketplace.

Private schools actually tend to pay less the public.

That's been my experience here as well (one of the guys I work with, his wife is a teacher at a private school). They generally have smaller classes and the parents are a little more interested in their kids but the pay is a bit less.

[Queeb Salaron]

Amen! Preach on.

I thought it'd lead to some interesting discussion, considering Falk's Music & Arts thread (I wonder how that vote turned out, btw...hmmm)....

Falk IMed me and told me that the bill passed. The arts dept. budget was not increased this time around. ::Sighs:: A cryin' shame, if you ask me.

[Queeb Salaron]

Ahem... I mean the bill did NOT pass. ::Glares at the hole where the edit button should be::

[Queeb Salaron]

We have a shortage of teachers. Complaints about pay level all the time. Government initiatives promising to fix it.

Same old .....

::Makes note:: Bad stuff all over. Is there anywhere that teachers have it GOOD?