relics

Dennis Toy · Post by **Dennis Toy** » 2003-04-12 12:02am

the TNG episode with scotty was good however there are a few thing i didn't like...

the way the TNG crew treated scotty, first they brush him aside and not use his expertise, then laforge snaps at him 2 times telling him he was in the way, and picard makes him feel useless in the holodeck. You think that they would want the advice from someone who saved the federation 100 times over while there grandparents were shitting in their diapers. Scotty was someone who had 50+ years of engineering experience and no one wanted his input.... that was foul...

And why arent there reporters or historians who would want to report on him, interview him or see what he has to say.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 01:30am

I agree, Scotty has a reputation that should have enamored respect. Expecially from Geordi! If you were an engineer and you have the chance to actually talk and work with Werner Von Braun would you treat him him like Geordi did Scotty? I'm sure half of his textbooks at the academy had some(if not all) material writen or poineered by Scotty! He treated Zepheran Cochran better than he did Scotty! My 2-bits

BrYaN19kc · Post by **BrYaN19kc** » 2003-04-12 01:50am

This episode is one of my favorite in the the entire series. Do you really think that Picard made Scottie feel useless? I didn't think so, I kinda thought he treated him with a kind of deep respect, especially with their chat about the Star Gazer and the Enterprise.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 01:54am

BrYaN19kc wrote:This episode is one of my favorite in the the entire series. Do you really think that Picard made Scottie feel useless? I didn't think so, I kinda thought he treated him with a kind of deep respect, especially with their chat about the Star Gazer and the Enterprise.

I think Picard was the only one who didn't talk down to Scotty.

seanrobertson · Post by **seanrobertson** » 2003-04-12 11:16am

Isolder74 wrote:
BrYaN19kc wrote:This episode is one of my favorite in the the entire series. Do you really think that Picard made Scottie feel useless? I didn't think so, I kinda thought he treated him with a kind of deep respect, especially with their chat about the Star Gazer and the Enterprise.
I think Picard was the only one who didn't talk down to Scotty.

Absolutely.

LaForge came around after awhile, but he was being a dick at first too (even though, yes, he was busy).

It's Scotty! Be nice to him

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-12 12:35pm

I just saw that episode for the first time last night.

Fantastic.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-04-12 02:30pm

I liked that episode, i have it somewhere in VHS. The best bit was when Scotty was standing outside the holodeck drunk. "I want the Enterprise, NCC 1701. No bloody A,B,C or D."

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-12 02:46pm

It's wonderful that they build a modern replica (not to mention an increadibly lovely one) of the E-nil bridge set just for that one scene, too.

Oh, and the Dyson Sphere was nice, too. But it just pales to Scotty. Nothing could have competed with Scotty in that episode.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 02:51pm

One of the best parts is when Scotty goes to Ten Forward and orders Scotch and gets Synthahol andthrows a fit about the Scotch not having any kick. Data had to help him raid the Captian's secret stash.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-12 02:55pm

Actually, it was Guinan's collection of alcoholic beverages for special occasions and guests.

Picard only gave her the bottle of Aldeberan (I think) Whiskey.

And I'd hardly call taking one bottle "raiding"...

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 02:57pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Actually, it was Guinan's collection of alcoholic beverages for special occasions and guests.

Picard only gave her the bottle of Aldeberan (I think) Whiskey.

And I'd hardly call taking one bottle "raiding"...

And he has it there for everyone to enjoy when even Data was clueless as to what it was!

Burak Gazan · Post by **Burak Gazan** » 2003-04-12 03:06pm

That episode really mis-used Scotty. We see ensign redshirt acting like he'd rather be flossing his teeth rather than talking with Montgomery Scott. Now, I know starfleet spends (wastes) time teaching its potential commanders all sorts of useful things like archeology, art, drama......but come on! Can you imagine, today, if somehow you could bring Bill Halsey back to talk with a group of junior officers. Or George Patton to lecture at West Point. Or Nelson at Dartmouth. Or......you get the picture. They would be swarmed, probably worshipped! These guys are legends, just like Scotty is a legend. Scotty has probably forgotten more than LaForge will ever learn, yet he acts as though he can't be trusted changing a lightbulb. Maybe, sonny, if you let Scotty look at this 24th century POS, and after he recovers from seeing how you and your sweetie Brahms have buggered things up, he MIGHT be able to sort things out.....

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 03:25pm

Burak Gazan wrote:That episode really mis-used Scotty. We see ensign redshirt acting like he'd rather be flossing his teeth rather than talking with Montgomery Scott. Now, I know starfleet spends (wastes) time teaching its potential commanders all sorts of useful things like archeology, art, drama......but come on! Can you imagine, today, if somehow you could bring Bill Halsey back to talk with a group of junior officers. Or George Patton to lecture at West Point. Or Nelson at Dartmouth. Or......you get the picture. They would be swarmed, probably worshipped! These guys are legends, just like Scotty is a legend. Scotty has probably forgotten more than LaForge will ever learn, yet he acts as though he can't be trusted changing a lightbulb. Maybe, sonny, if you let Scotty look at this 24th century POS, and after he recovers from seeing how you and your sweetie Brahms have buggered things up, he MIGHT be able to sort things out.....

That was kind of my point they spend their time talking to simulated versions of Legends(like Einstien) and when a real legend shows up they treat him with a total lack of respect. Perhaps they are so used to interacting with simulated versions of legends that when the meet the real thing they are disapointed.

Luke Starkiller · Post by **Luke Starkiller** » 2003-04-12 04:11pm

Isolder74 wrote:
Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Actually, it was Guinan's collection of alcoholic beverages for special occasions and guests.

Picard only gave her the bottle of Aldeberan (I think) Whiskey.

And I'd hardly call taking one bottle "raiding"...
And he has it there for everyone to enjoy when even Data was clueless as to what it was!

That is where Data doesn't know what it is and says" It is...it is...green" right? Scotty has the exact same line in an episode of TOS. The one where they go through th barrier on the way to the Andromeda galaxy. Just goes to show that Trek writers used to care about TOS.

Sir Sirius · Post by **Sir Sirius** » 2003-04-12 04:33pm

Darth Pounder wrote:I liked that episode, i have it somewhere in VHS. The best bit was when Scotty was standing outside the holodeck drunk. "I want the Enterprise, NCC 1701. No bloody A,B,C or D."

LOL, one of my favourite Trek quetes of all time.
"N-C-C-1-7-0-1. No bloody A, B, C or D."
Another good one: "Synthetic Scotch. Synthetic commanders"¨
One more: "I was driving starships while your great-grandfather was still in diapers"

<Starts to reminesce about the good old days when Trek was worth watching...>

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-12 04:44pm

Luke Starkiller wrote:That is where Data doesn't know what it is and says" It is...it is...green" right? Scotty has the exact same line in an episode of TOS. The one where they go through th barrier on the way to the Andromeda galaxy. Just goes to show that Trek writers used to care about TOS.

Wanna know what's really weird about that?

Braga wrote "Relics".

....

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 05:22pm

Sir Sirius wrote:"Synthetic Scotch. Synthetic commanders"

I think Scotty was saying, what kind of world did I wake up into where everything is fake.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-04-12 06:07pm

I'm still wondering how they got the transporters to work through shields...oh, wait, it was Braga. That explains it

.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-04-13 10:25am

If Braga wrote that episode then maybe it's Berman alone who deserves that good beating? Braga may just have saved homself with "Relics".

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-04-13 11:36am

Darth Pounder wrote:If Braga wrote that episode then maybe it's Berman alone who deserves that good beating? Braga may just have saved homself with "Relics".

I don't think so. It was one of the worst character assasinations I've ever seen. The Scotty I am familiar with would NEVER barge into another engineer's engine room and start poking into such important systems as the dilithium chamber without asking. That was bullshit.

The Scotty I was familiar with wouldn't mope around the new ship and say he's "too old" to learn anything new. He would grab every tech manual he could and lock himself in a room and lose himself in the new technology.

This is just a continuance of the destruction of TOS characters to attempt to give TNG legitimacy. In "Unification", FIVE MINUTES after meeting Picard (fucking PICARD??) Spock tells him he reminds him of Kirk? Bull-fucking-shit.

How about "Generations"? The only reason Picard needed Kirk was for punching out Soran? What? If I ever needed Kirk, it would be for his ability to outmaneuver his opponent, or talk an android brain into a coma.

Fuck post-TOS-Trek. Fuck it in the ass sideways with a rusty water pipe.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-13 11:55am

The Dark wrote:I'm still wondering how they got the transporters to work through shields...oh, wait, it was Braga. That explains it .

Actualy we have seen repeated instances of beaming through shields. This trend started towards the end of TNG. It seems that ships can beam through their own shields or allied shields, but not enemy ships. Another logical explination is the 60 year old ship had shields that could be penetrated by modern transporters.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-13 11:57am

Lord Poe wrote:
Darth Pounder wrote:If Braga wrote that episode then maybe it's Berman alone who deserves that good beating? Braga may just have saved homself with "Relics".
I don't think so. It was one of the worst character assasinations I've ever seen. The Scotty I am familiar with would NEVER barge into another engineer's engine room and start poking into such important systems as the dilithium chamber without asking. That was bullshit.

The Scotty I was familiar with wouldn't mope around the new ship and say he's "too old" to learn anything new. He would grab every tech manual he could and lock himself in a room and lose himself in the new technology.

Actualy they portrayed Scotty quite well. The whole point was that Scotty had attempted to retire and that was not setting well with him. Combine that with the fact that he suddenly was put forward 60 years, Scotty was a little disoriented. Notice towards the later half of the episode Scotty was getting back to normal. Hell, he even said he wasn't ready to retire by the end of the episode.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-04-13 06:01pm

Well Scotty does go on to get re-adjusted. According to several sources i've seen Scotty is one of the engineers behind designing the Soverign Class Star Ship.

Mutant Headcrab · Post by **Mutant Headcrab** » 2003-04-13 11:36pm

This episode made me realize exactly what it was Trek was missing. Its missing the one thing that would keep any ship in the fleet from exploding (other than new core designs). That's right, every ship needs a hard-livered, Scotsman for an Chief Engineer. Scotty was the best damn engineer Star Fleet had ever seen. Now look at the Chiefs these days. A blind guy, a half Klingon chick, some.....country hick sounding guy...I could go on about this for a little more. Now If youll excuse me, I feel like buying a drink for a Scotsman.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2003-04-13 11:45pm

Burak Gazan wrote:Can you imagine, today, if somehow you could bring Bill Halsey back to talk with a group of junior officers. Or George Patton to lecture at West Point. Or Nelson at Dartmouth. Or......you get the picture. They would be swarmed, probably worshipped! These guys are legends, just like Scotty is a legend.

That is exactly how it would have been in real life. Anybody remember the 1999 MLB All Star Game? It was held at Fenway Park that year, in part to commemorate the 40th anniversary of the retirement of Ted Williams, the last man to hit .400 (.406 in 1941) in baseball. In the middle of the ceremonies honouring past legendary figures of the game, out onto the field, seated in a golfcart, was the Splendid Splinter himself. Williams came back to Fenway and did something he never did since 1940 and that was to tip his hat to the crowd. And Williams was mobbed by everyone on the field; not only the retired greats but all the present All-Stars. You saw Sammy Sosa, Mark McGwire, Ken Griffey Jr., Barry Bonds, Tony Gwinn, Roger Clemens, all these superstars gathered around Ted Williams and treating him like a god, because of what he represented. It took officials a full five minutes to clear the field so that the actual game itself could begin. The ovation lasted a full minute after Williams was driven back into the clubhouse.

All that for some old man who had been long gone from baseball before most of the people in that park, including the players, had even been born but they all knew the Living Legend in their midst.