Scimitar class Warbird

[Kamakazie Sith]

I would have thought cruising the Galaxy with a black hole would be a good way to alert other starships of your presence. Even a cloaking device should not be able to mask gravitational fluctuations. Perhaps ST does not have the best gravitational sensors, or maybe they just don't look for discrepencies like that to take place.

Or maybe the engine emissions are well balanced as to avoid your presense being detected. Ref. TNG "Face of the Enemy"

[Master of Ossus]

How can the engines be doing something to make it appear as if there is no mass where there is actually substantial mass? I'm not saying you're wrong, Kamakazie, I'm just saying that it would have to be through some completely unknown process. I'll have to watch the episode again. You might be right (in a technobabblish way), but I don't see how that would be possible.

[Typhonis 1]

They do use an artificial singularity so they may not have the same problems.Though I could be wrong

[Master of Ossus]

They do use an artificial singularity so they may not have the same problems.Though I could be wrong

What are you talking about? Are you saying that an artificial singularity does not bend space time? Or are you saying that it may not damage the ship because it is artificial, or what?

[Devils Advocate]

Yeah, b/c ILM is no longer doing the FX, they got Digital Domain. Why? They aren't at all innovative compared to ILM.

Ah the voices of the ignorant how they do say such uninformed things with such conviction...

Whens the last time ILM won an academy award? Seems the last time they were up at the plate (TPM) they got bitchslapped by "The Matrix".

Digital Domain did a host of effects for "Lord of the Rings Fellowship of the Ring" and is working on "The Two Towers" which will beat AOTC for the fx Oscar this year.

Place your bets now.

Digital Domain has beaten ILM the last two times it went against them for the Oscar for fx. "What Dreams May Come" and "Titanic".

Sorry but Digital Domain IS more innovative and just plain better than ILM.

[Master of Ossus]

First of all, I did not write that, for the record. Second of all, the FX I've seen in Nemesis aren't even up to par with TPM. They really aren't even up to par with other movies from even earlier than that. That does not mean that ILM is a better company, but it does indicate that whoever is doing the FX for Nemesis is not shooting par for the course on this particular movie.

[RayCav of ASVS]

Yeah, b/c ILM is no longer doing the FX, they got Digital Domain. Why? They aren't at all innovative compared to ILM.

Ah the voices of the ignorant how they do say such uninformed things with such conviction...

Whens the last time ILM won an academy award? Seems the last time they were up at the plate (TPM) they got bitchslapped by "The Matrix".

Digital Domain did a host of effects for "Lord of the Rings Fellowship of the Ring" and is working on "The Two Towers" which will beat AOTC for the fx Oscar this year.

Place your bets now.

Digital Domain has beaten ILM the last two times it went against them for the Oscar for fx. "What Dreams May Come" and "Titanic".

Sorry but Digital Domain IS more innovative and just plain better than ILM.

Ahem....

I hereby label thee as a Troll and hereby give yee thee *PLONK!*

[Patrick Degan]

In the episode where quantum life forms had accidentally nested their young within a Romulan power core ("Timescape", I believe), Deanna Troi took Picard and Data to the engineering section aboard the time-locked Romulan Warbird and went right to where the reactor was. The episode established that the quantum singularity core is located within the ship itself.

Therefore, the huge empty space middle of the Warbird seems to have no purpose from any engineering standpoint. The only thing I can think of is that it allows access for the shuttlebay but it seems that you could as easily just have a ship with a standard configuration and a large shuttlebay. Perhaps disruptor banks are located at hardpoints on the inner wing surfaces, but again it seems a standard single-hull configuration could give a warship omnidirectional offensive coverage.

Perhaps the purpose of the empty space is to facilitate boarding action and capture of smaller starships? But again, what's the point? Especially as you'd be risking the danger of the captured vessel self-detonating right inside your own ship.

In the end, it seems only rationale for the TNG Warbird's design is that it "looked cool".

[RayCav of ASVS]

In the episode where quantum life forms had accidentally nested their young within a Romulan power core ("Timescape", I believe), Deanna Troi took Picard and Data to the engineering section aboard the time-locked Romulan Warbird and went right to where the reactor was. The episode established that the quantum singularity core is located within the ship itself.

Therefore, the huge empty space middle of the Warbird seems to have no purpose from any engineering standpoint. The only thing I can think of is that it allows access for the shuttlebay but it seems that you could as easily just have a ship with a standard configuration and a large shuttlebay. Perhaps disruptor banks are located at hardpoints on the inner wing surfaces, but again it seems a standard single-hull configuration could give a warship omnidirectional offensive coverage.

Perhaps the purpose of the empty space is to facilitate boarding action and capture of smaller starships? But again, what's the point? Especially as you'd be risking the danger of the captured vessel self-detonating right inside your own ship.

In the end, it seems only rationale for the TNG Warbird's design is that it "looked cool".

Just because the QS is located within the ship itself, doesn't mean that the large space still isn't related to it in any way.

[DarkStar]

One theory is that the cavernous open area was to allow the creation of a tight (i.e. cloakable) warp field. The armored outer section of the nacelle when compared to the open inner section may support this view.

[Patrick Degan]

Just because the QS is located within the ship itself, doesn't mean that the large space still isn't related to it in any way.

Hmm... perhaps, but I don't see how. If the ship doesn't have to take in interstellar matter to help maintain the singularity, then it doesn't serve any purpose as a collection sink.

But, if that empty space does indeed act as a huge Bussard sink, then there might be some rationale for it. But even there, I think I could have come up with something more sensible which could be incorporated into a single-hull configuration.

[RayCav of ASVS]

Just because the QS is located within the ship itself, doesn't mean that the large space still isn't related to it in any way.

Hmm... perhaps, but I don't see how. If the ship doesn't have to take in interstellar matter to help maintain the singularity, then it doesn't serve any purpose as a collection sink.

But, if that empty space does indeed act as a huge Bussard sink, then there might be some rationale for it. But even there, I think I could have come up with something more sensible which could be incorporated into a single-hull configuration.

Perhaps its gravity related? I suppose they can't negate the gravitational effects, but can still use technobabble to "redirect" it into the open space.

[Tsyroc]

I would have thought cruising the Galaxy with a black hole would be a good way to alert other starships of your presence. Even a cloaking device should not be able to mask gravitational fluctuations. Perhaps ST does not have the best gravitational sensors, or maybe they just don't look for discrepencies like that to take place.

In the episode of DS9 where O'Brien is jumping back and forth through time they actually do track a cloaked warbird in part because of the singulairy used to power it. The FX on the sensor data really gives it away.

To clarify my earlier comments. I know that officially the Warbird is supposed to be powered by a artificial singularity but I've never seen or read anything that said that was why there was all that empty space inside the Warbird.

Thing is, if you think about it is just like most other ST warp capable ships except it is semi-inclosed. What I mean is that the typical warp capable ship has nacels of sorts that are attached to the ship in (typically) a "U" or "V" connection. The Warbird was one of the earliest ships on Trek to connect the space under that "U".

[Devils Advocate]

First of all, I did not write that, for the record. Second of all, the FX I've seen in Nemesis aren't even up to par with TPM. They really aren't even up to par with other movies from even earlier than that. That does not mean that ILM is a better company, but it does indicate that whoever is doing the FX for Nemesis is not shooting par for the course on this particular movie.

Sorry I screwed up the quote tag. T'was HooliganJedi who made the error not you.

As far as quality of FX goes the main consideration is budget. If you have the best fx house in the world doing your fx on a shoestring budget, it wont amount to a lessor fx house doing the same fx on a massive budget.
This being the point it is not an indication of Digital Domains quality which has proven to be superior to ILM.

[Master of Ossus]

I would have thought cruising the Galaxy with a black hole would be a good way to alert other starships of your presence. Even a cloaking device should not be able to mask gravitational fluctuations. Perhaps ST does not have the best gravitational sensors, or maybe they just don't look for discrepencies like that to take place.

In the episode of DS9 where O'Brien is jumping back and forth through time they actually do track a cloaked warbird in part because of the singulairy used to power it. The FX on the sensor data really gives it away.

To clarify my earlier comments. I know that officially the Warbird is supposed to be powered by a artificial singularity but I've never seen or read anything that said that was why there was all that empty space inside the Warbird.

Thing is, if you think about it is just like most other ST warp capable ships except it is semi-inclosed. What I mean is that the typical warp capable ship has nacels of sorts that are attached to the ship in (typically) a "U" or "V" connection. The Warbird was one of the earliest ships on Trek to connect the space under that "U".

So I was right! The singularity gives away the position of the warship, even while it is cloaked. That makes sense, as a singularity must have gravity associated with it. Okay. One now wonders why everyone has such difficulty in detecting capital ships.

[Cpt_Frank]

Because their sensor systems suck!
Honestly, their sensors are disrupted by virtually anything so it wouldn't surprise me, considering how unreliable ST tech is, if they were extremely inaccurate.