Help in "Hitler wasn't a Christian" argument

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-04-27 12:35am

18. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

Everything was accomplished. Jesus died and was ressurected. Prophecies fulfilled.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-27 12:36am

HemlockGrey wrote:
18. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
Everything was accomplished. Jesus died and was ressurected. Prophecies fulfilled.

Wrong. The prophecies called for peace on Earth. Perhaps you failed history class, but that hasn't happened.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-04-27 12:43am

Wrong. The prophecies called for peace on Earth. Perhaps you failed history class, but that hasn't happened.

Which one?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-27 12:44am

HemlockGrey wrote:
Wrong. The prophecies called for peace on Earth. Perhaps you failed history class, but that hasn't happened.
Which one?

I already looked up one passage for your lazy ass; look it up yourself.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-04-27 12:49am

I'll look it up(although, since you're the one putting it forth...) but don't expect a reply until tomorrow. There are a hell of a lot of passages in the Bible and it's 1:00 in the morning.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-27 12:51am

HemlockGrey wrote:... since you're the one putting it forth...

Bullshit. You are the one claiming that all of the prophecies have been fulfilled. The burden of proof is on YOU, not me. You must list all of the prophecies and show that they have all been fulfilled.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-04-27 12:55am

Bullshit. You are the one claiming that all of the prophecies have been fulfilled. The burden of proof is on YOU, not me. You must list all of the prophecies and show that they have all been fulfilled.

Right, right. I'll get back to you on this.

Yogi · Post by **Yogi** » 2003-04-27 02:27am

It just got better.
I used Mr. Wong's quote on Hitler and the Viennese Christian Social movement. The response was essencially.

"Saying that the Viennese Christian Social movement was Christian, is like saying that Iraq's Republican Guard was Republican."

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-04-27 03:07am

Yogi wrote:It just got better.
I used Mr. Wong's quote on Hitler and the Viennese Christian Social movement. The response was essencially.

"Saying that the Viennese Christian Social movement was Christian, is like saying that Iraq's Republican Guard was Republican."

Respond with Ye olde "Concession Accepted". I'm sorry you have to be exposed to that kind of willful ignorance. [Bugs Bunny]What a maroon[/Bugs Bunny]

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-04-27 03:35am

Yogi wrote:It just got better.
I used Mr. Wong's quote on Hitler and the Viennese Christian Social movement. The response was essencially.

"Saying that the Viennese Christian Social movement was Christian, is like saying that Iraq's Republican Guard was Republican."

Then use Hitler's "By fighting the Jew I am doing the word of the Lord" quote from Mein Kampf.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2003-04-27 09:34am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:Then use Hitler's "By fighting the Jew I am doing the word of the Lord" quote from Mein Kampf.

The standard fundie response is that Mein Kampf is a discredited source that does not reflect Hitler's true beliefs, in spite of the fact that its an accurate road map for everything he did in his rise to power.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-04-27 12:00pm

Ted C wrote:
Simon H.Johansen wrote:Then use Hitler's "By fighting the Jew I am doing the word of the Lord" quote from Mein Kampf.
The standard fundie response is that Mein Kampf is a discredited source that does not reflect Hitler's true beliefs, in spite of the fact that its an accurate road map for everything he did in his rise to power.

Then there is only one thing to do:

REMIND THEM OF THE FACT THAT HITLER MADE SCHOOL PRAYER MANDATORY!!

Would an atheist do that??

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-04-27 07:32pm

Ted C wrote:
Simon H.Johansen wrote:Then use Hitler's "By fighting the Jew I am doing the word of the Lord" quote from Mein Kampf.
The standard fundie response is that Mein Kampf is a discredited source that does not reflect Hitler's true beliefs, in spite of the fact that its an accurate road map for everything he did in his rise to power.

Why would they say that? That's like saying a dictionary doesn't represent the rules of the English language. Oh, yes, they're getting desperate to prove their point.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-04-27 08:16pm

Wouldn't that be a grammar book as opposed to the dictionary?

XPViking · Post by **XPViking** » 2003-04-27 08:24pm

neoolong,

Wait a minute....

XPViking

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-04-27 08:25pm

XPVIKING: what DMZ are you south of? the one in Korea?

XPViking · Post by **XPViking** » 2003-04-27 08:27pm

Napoleon,

You are correct. Do you live in South Korea too?

XPViking

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-04-27 08:31pm

no im from New Jersey, the US. I was just wondering because it seemd interesting.

Sorry for the off topic stuff all. Lets return to the fact that hitler was a devout christian.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-27 08:44pm

All of the fundie objections to Hitler's Christian status stem from the basic assumption that it is impossible to sincerely believe in Jesus and be a bad person. Since they treat that as a FACT rather than a bigoted assumption of moral superiority, they can simply disregard any contradictory evidence because it is inconsistent with this known "fact".

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-04-27 08:46pm

too bad all the evidence is to the contrary. would be a much nicer world if all christians were nice people who didnt go around warmongering and killing people. Perhaps there would be fewer body bags in iraq right now if this were the case.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-04-28 12:02am

Darth Wong wrote:All of the fundie objections to Hitler's Christian status stem from the basic assumption that it is impossible to sincerely believe in Jesus and be a bad person. Since they treat that as a FACT rather than a bigoted assumption of moral superiority, they can simply disregard any contradictory evidence because it is inconsistent with this known "fact".

my mom's automatic response is, by your acts, you shall know them - with hitler being un-christian in the modern view, he doesnt get count.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-28 12:03am

Enforcer Talen wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:All of the fundie objections to Hitler's Christian status stem from the basic assumption that it is impossible to sincerely believe in Jesus and be a bad person. Since they treat that as a FACT rather than a bigoted assumption of moral superiority, they can simply disregard any contradictory evidence because it is inconsistent with this known "fact".
my mom's automatic response is, by your acts, you shall know them - with hitler being un-christian in the modern view, he doesnt get count.

So? The modern view is that misogynism is un-Christian too, does that make Paul un-Christian?

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-28 11:11am

Guy on Another Message Board wrote:Nazism was the antithesis of universal. It based everything on the supposed superiority of Germans, and drew its moral authority not from any concept of God, but from its position as the German state.

If he's trying to argue that Christianity is, by ANY stretch of the imagination, "universal," he's warped. For example, gays are routinely denied the same marital rights as heterosexual couples (as the French say, "d'uh"). Why? Because instead of operating under the pretenses of a superior state, Christians have ruled with a heavy hand under a similar "superior" moral code. Their reasoning is as follows: *Christians have the best moral code in the world. Therefore, Christians are the most superior beings in the world. Therefore, Christians should rule the world.* This was the inspiration for the Crusades and, to an extent, the Inquisition. And it is a belief that holds true today: Among other sects, Catholics believe (though they would never admit it) that their morality is certainly better than the morality of gays. Gays believe that marriage is a binding contract that symbolizes the affection felt between two people. Catholics see marriage as an insitution which provides the ONLY environment in which sex and childbirth are ok. Because Catholics believe that they are right about this, they will not let gays get married.

If anything, the lack of Hitler's universality was the very thing that MADE him Christian.

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2003-04-29 03:22am

IIRC, Hitler never was formally excommunicated from the Catholic Church.

He must not have deviated too far from the Pope at the time.

Now if a Christian is looking for a high ranking Nazi to paint as a pagan, Heinrich Himmler and his nutcase belief in the occult would be the one I'd turn to.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-29 08:55am

Glocksman wrote:IIRC, Hitler never was formally excommunicated from the Catholic Church.

I thought he was excommunicated, but only recently. Hmm. I'll take a look.

He must not have deviated too far from the Pope at the time.

Easy there, killer.

Now if a Christian is looking for a high ranking Nazi to paint as a pagan, Heinrich Himmler and his nutcase belief in the occult would be the one I'd turn to.

I think the Christians are so offended that such a terrible person considered himself a part of their ranks that they're scrambling for reasons to say that he was never a member in the first place, and that the Christians would have seen this coming a mile away, and God would have smote Hitler into oblivion if her were, in fact, Christian.

I mean, duh.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Help in "Hitler wasn't a Christian" argument

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