Moral Problem: Dune Encyclopedia From UI Library

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 11:27am

Okay, earlier this month, I checked out The Dune Encyclopedia from the Main Library of the University of Iowa. As some of you know, this book has been out of print in English for years, and can fetch anywhere from $100-$300+ on places like eBay, and is a pretty rare find in general.

The thing is, the book is due tomorrow, but I REALLY want to keep it. Now, I am willing to pay for the fee of "losing" the book, and my parents don't really have a problem with me doing something like that (my mom once did the same thing for a book from a local public library).

So, I'm wondering what the general opinion here would be. Should I tell them that I lost the book and pay the fine, return it and try to find it somewhere else, or return it and wait until next term (Fall 2003) to decide what to do?

Thank you for your time.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-04-28 11:29am

How many pages does it have? You can always just make copies of each of the pages (takes a while, but it will still probably be cheaper than buying on EBay without any of the moral issues that would come with stealing the book).

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 11:32am

It's about 530 pages. Photocoping it would cost either $40 or $80 dollers (depending on if I can fit one or two pages per sheet), and would take hours.

Plus, I'm one of those people that prefer to have the actual item than a copy of it.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-28 11:35am

Hmmm... Keep it and sell it. Or just keep it. But if you do sell it, remember to take all the library tags off, and cover up any of the stamps that the library might have put on it. If word gets out that the book was stolen before you pay the fine, it's theft with intent to sell, and that's a federal crime (I b'leev). I don't think the library, local authorities, or eBay would really care all that much that the book was stolen, but if you sold it to some uber-fundie "theft breaks the 8th commandment!" type, it might get reported. But whatever. You can pay the fine and THEN sell it.

Ooh, OR set the auction close to some date in the future, after you're scheduled to pay the fine. That way you can pay and get paid in the same day.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 11:37am

Um, why the fuck would I SELL something I want to KEEP in the first God damned place, you retard?!

Nice that you're not fucking paying attention...

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-04-28 11:40am

In that case, I would return the book.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2003-04-28 11:44am

Durran Korr wrote:How many pages does it have? You can always just make copies of each of the pages (takes a while, but it will still probably be cheaper than buying on EBay without any of the moral issues that would come with stealing the book).

That would be copyright theft.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2003-04-28 11:44am

Not a big fan of theft/deceit here.

Have you considered asking the library if they would sell it to you for a reasonable price?

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-04-28 11:46am

Besides the theft issue, it's probably the only way other Dune fans on your campus could see the book.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 11:48am

The thing is is that it's a university library, so I don't know if they would sell it to me.

Well, I'm headed out now to pick up a book at Iguana Comics, so I might swing down by the Main Library and ask about if they would possibly allow me to buy it. If they say no, then I might go over tomorrow when it's due and ask how much the lost fee would be (when there's another person at the counter).

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-04-28 11:50am

PainRack wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:How many pages does it have? You can always just make copies of each of the pages (takes a while, but it will still probably be cheaper than buying on EBay without any of the moral issues that would come with stealing the book).
That would be copyright theft.

Absolutely, but it's one thing to steal it entirely, than to simply make a copy of it and return it to its original owners.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-04-28 12:28pm

I wouldn't steal it. It's a pretty shitty thing to do.

XaLEv · Post by **XaLEv** » 2003-04-28 02:15pm

You can easily download it. It may not be the same as having a tangible copy of it, but it's better than the alternative IMO.

Post by **Lagmonster** » 2003-04-28 02:33pm

Actually, Spanky, if you head round to the library you might be surprised - they might sell to you. Libraries will often do so. The alternative would be to ask your fellow SD.net pals if they've seen it at a used book store nearby, and pay to get it and ship it.

At any rate, it'd be a darnsight better than stealing.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-28 04:15pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Um, why the fuck would I SELL something I want to KEEP in the first God damned place, you retard?!

Nice that you're not fucking paying attention...

Hmm. Way to try and establish superiority. I never said that you wanted to sell it. (Though it is possible to take that "it fetches $100 - $300 on eBay" comment out of context, I'll let that little detail slide.) I was suggesting you do something completely different altogether. Besides, with the $100 - $300 that you'll get for the book, you could afford to buy ANOTHER copy of the book on eBay, one WITHOUT the date-cards, stamps, and other wear-and-tear faults that come with library books.

Now when you get your head out of your ass long enough to actually think things through throughly, come back and talk to me. Until then, Spanky, piss off and grow up.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 04:20pm

That sounds just as moronic (not to mention exactly the same) as your first comment.

Again: If I actually ended up keeping the book, there is no way in hell I would want to sell it. End.

Oh, I stopped by the Main Library today and asked if it was possible for me to buy a book from them. They said no, which makes sense for a university library.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-28 04:29pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:That sounds just as moronic (not to mention exactly the same) as your first comment.

You obviously didn't understand it the first time, so I tried my own patience to try and explain myself better. That's why it sounded exactly the same, dumbass. Maybe if I don't use big words, you'll understand a bit better. Or does "understand" have too many syllables for you? Maybe.... if.... I.... type.... really.... slowly...........

Again: If I actually ended up keeping the book, there is no way in hell I would want to sell it. End.

Then why mention how much it would go for on eBay?

BTW, if you read my original post, it says, "...or just keep it." Good to see you're paying attention.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-04-28 04:31pm

other people want to read it as well you little egoist.
don´t steal it, esspecially if it´s the only copy the library´s got.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 04:35pm

I mentioned eBay because the DE is a hard to find book, and as an example I mentioned how much people are willing to pay for it. That's all and nothing more.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-04-28 04:38pm

salm wrote:other people want to read it as well you little egoist.
don´t steal it, esspecially if it´s the only copy the library´s got.

::Looks around:: Egoist? I think you have your adjectives mixed up. Hedonist, certainly. Maybe even a capitalist in this situation. But not an egoist.

As for other people wanting to read it, well fine. Leave a nice little note on the shelf of the library as to where they can call to find it. Besides that, I don't know of any libraries around that have that particular book, so I don't even know that anyone would miss it unless they were looking for it.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2003-04-28 04:41pm

Well, considering you'd be paying the fee they're asking for as appropriate compensation, I don't see it as stealing.

You should have gone in and asked how much the fee would be. If it turned out it was way more than what you were willing to pay, just return the thing tomorrow.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-04-28 04:45pm

Queeb Salaron wrote:
salm wrote:other people want to read it as well you little egoist.
don´t steal it, esspecially if it´s the only copy the library´s got.
::Looks around:: Egoist? I think you have your adjectives mixed up. Hedonist, certainly. Maybe even a capitalist in this situation. But not an egoist.

As for other people wanting to read it, well fine. Leave a nice little note on the shelf of the library as to where they can call to find it. Besides that, I don't know of any libraries around that have that particular book, so I don't even know that anyone would miss it unless they were looking for it.

ok, where i come from an egoist is a person who cares only for himself. spanky wants to STEAL a book which other people want to read as well from a library. after stealing the book other people wont be able to read it anymore. what the hell? if that´s not egoistic what else could wanting something so badly that you deny it to others be?

btw it´s not an adjective, it´s a noun!

Morat · Post by **Morat** » 2003-04-28 04:48pm

Well, it would be best to avoid stealing. However, if you must steal the book, then either copy the pages or download it from the internet. At least this way you aren't hurting the library or the college's student body.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-04-28 04:50pm

Salm, does it matter that I said I'd pay the fine?

Morat: I already said that to photocopy it would cost either $40 or $80, and I want to have the actual physical book.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-04-28 04:50pm

Darth Utsanomiko wrote:Well, considering you'd be paying the fee they're asking for as appropriate compensation, I don't see it as stealing.

You should have gone in and asked how much the fee would be. If it turned out it was way more than what you were willing to pay, just return the thing tomorrow.

DUH! the book is hard to get. the library will either not get it again or it´ll at least take them some time (knowing uni libraries it´ll take a long time). and because of that, people who want to read it wont be able to just because some collector guy had to steal it. it´s not about the money, it´s about the wasted availability.

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Moral Problem: Dune Encyclopedia From UI Library

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Moral Problem: Dune Encyclopedia From UI Library