Ages (?) of civilizations in the Republic and Alpha Quadrant

[Rathark]

http://www.theforce.net/timetales/tt1-1/sect1-1.shtml

c. 999,989 BSW4


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According to Dr. Corellia Antilles, this is the approximate point at which xenoarchaeologists and xenoanthropologists estimate the majority of the known galaxy begins keeping detailed historical records, though items from this time period tend to prove indecipherable to New Republic era historians.


Conjecture based on From the Files of Corellia Antilles. Borrowed from Nathan Butler's Timeline.

From: Larry Jeung (jeung@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU)
Subject: Re: Why do aliens speak species?/Bajorans
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
View: Complete Thread (14 articles) | Original Format
Date: 1994-08-31 03:53:56 PST


In article <5IzxmeY.ajer@delphi.com>, Alara Rogers <ajer@delphi.com> wrote:
>Most other races seem to be a good bit older than us. (Certainly the Vulcans
>are.) We appear to be the young turks of the galaxy

I agree on all the above.

>(it's even been implied
>that the Bajorans had an empire ten thousand years ago.)

While none of the episodes have stated that the Bajorans once had an
empire*, in "Ensign Ro" Picard said that the Bajorans already had a
thriving civilization when humans were not yet erect. According to the
latest paleoanthropological evidence like "Lucy", the ancestors of
humans first stood erect about 4 million years ago; these ancestors are
called the australopithicines (Unfortunately, both the Star Trek
Chronology and the Star Trek Encyclopedia incorrectly state that the
first erect hominid species was Homo Erectus, the former dating this
species at 250,000-500,000 years ago, and the latter dating it at
25,000 years ago; according to the latest evidence, this species
appeared earlier, perhaps 1-2 million years ago). This means that
Bajoran civilization was thriving at least a whopping 4 million years
ago. This implies that this civilization is either incredibly stable,
or has collapsed and was reborn innumerable times; however, Picard also
said in "Ensign Ro" that the Bajorans have always been a peaceful
people, which means that if their civilization had ever collapsed it was
probably due natural disasters and pestilence rather than
self-destruction.

[Rathark]

Here's another quote implying that the Borg have been going strong for at least 3 billion years. Why they can't assimilate a much younger civilization like the Voth (20 million years?) is anyone's guess; but it would seem that the Borg have remained rather static over the eons. Are they so lacking in creativity that they need to adopt new ideas from younger civilizations, hence their constant assimilation?

From: James Dixon (James.Dixon@f572.n107.z1.ieee.org)
Subject: Chronology (long)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek
View: Complete Thread (4 articles) | Original Format
Date: 1991-10-15 07:15:11 PST


STAR TREK CHRONOLOGY (VERSION 4)
.
.
.
.

3,000,000,000 B.C.
An advanced, extragalactic(?) race creates a series of planet-killers:
automated "doomsday machine" robot weapons of immense size and power
to combat the Borg. The collective consciousness of "the Many" are
transcribed into the final such machine [DMa, ST 3, GN 8].

[Darth Wong]

c. 999,989 BSW4
According to Dr. Corellia Antilles, this is the approximate point at which xenoarchaeologists and xenoanthropologists estimate the majority of the known galaxy begins keeping detailed historical records, though items from this time period tend to prove indecipherable to New Republic era historians.


Conjecture based on From the Files of Corellia Antilles. Borrowed from Nathan Butler's Timeline.

Since that passage describes the official estimate of scientists in the SW galaxy who have presumably done a fair bit of research to get the figure, it seems pretty reliable.

in "Ensign Ro" Picard said that the Bajorans already had a thriving civilization when humans were not yet erect ... This means that Bajoran civilization was thriving at least a whopping 4 million years ago

And this one follows the traditional Trekkie modus operandi of over-analyzing off-hand comments. How do we know Picard is speaking literally? He might have been referring to the ascendance of homo sapiens 30,000 years ago over the neanderthals, he might have simply been exaggerating, or he might simply be wrong.

[Darth Wong]

Here's another quote implying that the Borg have been going strong for at least 3 billion years. Why they can't assimilate a much younger civilization like the Voth (20 million years?) is anyone's guess; but it would seem that the Borg have remained rather static over the eons. Are they so lacking in creativity that they need to adopt new ideas from younger civilizations, hence their constant assimilation?

That's not a canon source, and besides, the figure is simply nonsensical. If those planet-killers have been running amok for billions of years, there shouldn't be any inhabitable planets left in our galaxy. Besides, the planet-killers are hardly built well enough to last that long; you can destroy one with a 100 megaton explosion! Jango Fett could take one of those things out by himself, and still have more than 90% of his payload left over.

[Patrick Degan]

Here's another quote implying that the Borg have been going strong for at least 3 billion years. Why they can't assimilate a much younger civilization like the Voth (20 million years?) is anyone's guess; but it would seem that the Borg have remained rather static over the eons. Are they so lacking in creativity that they need to adopt new ideas from younger civilizations, hence their constant assimilation?

Hmm...rather like the writing staff for a current-day SF franchise produced by Paramount.

[seanrobertson]

And this one follows the traditional Trekkie modus operandi of over-analyzing off-hand comments. How do we know Picard is speaking literally? He might have been referring to the ascendance of homo sapiens 30,000 years ago over the neanderthals, he might have simply been exaggerating, or he might simply be wrong.

Hmm...I dunno. He had an extensive background in archaeology ("The Chase," the first episode with Vash/set on Risa, among others),
so he should probably at least have his facts straight.

Exaggeration is a definite possibility...Picard's usually pretty much
a straight-talker, but he's known to round off here and there where
it suits a conversation; e.g., his observation that a Federation
starship would require 100 years at maximum speeds to return home from the Barzan wormhole's terminus in the Delta Quadrant. We know from
VGR it's more like 70-75 years. One could suggest Picard was being
strictly factual in the above scenario, but that'd require a significant
increase in max. warp speeds. I don't think they'd improved that
much from late TNG to early VGR...the E-D, after all, could manage
9.9 in running from the Borg IIRC (and was capable of a very risky 9.8 on her test run to Farpoint Station, running from Q, or so said Data).

Though the exact time frame since which the Bajorans might be
similarly "rounded off," I would have to take Picard literally when he
said the Bajoran civilization has "flourished" since about 4 million BCE,
give or take a few million years. He has the background, so he
should know this; and even if it wasn't something he studied in school,
he'd probably know it from his intense interest in the "Bajora" (see
Picard's first dialogue with Cmdr. Sisko in "The Emissary").

The big if in my mind is, what in the hell does "flourish" mean?
You could say that any number of human civilizations, pre-dating
industry by thousands of years, were "flourishing." That's a non-quantifiable, useless statement...it *certainly* doesn't mean the
Bajorans were out tending to an interstellar empire!