Christianity and Star Wars??

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-05-12 01:52pm

According to this site, Star Wars is a piece of Christian propaganda and "Jedi" is apparently an acronym of "JEsus DIsciple."

But is there some truth, or is the webmaster just drawing conclusions from mere coincidences and seeing patterns which aren't there?? (or shouldn't be there)

Personally, I believe the latter. There is sci-fi which is far more obviously biblically influenced (although not necessarily evangelistic) - such as Warhammer 40K, where there is little difference between the story of the Horus Heresy, and that of Lucifer's rebellion and the Imperium of Man uses a lot of Roman Catholic imagery. (it even has an Inquisition!) However, unlike the Jedi, 40K's Imperium of Man has all the brutality of the church it's based upon.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-12 02:14pm

I think this should be moved to SLAM.

I also think that whoever wrote that article is a fucking moron.

EmperorMing · Post by **EmperorMing** » 2003-05-13 02:16am

I've seen comparisons like this when SW first came out.

Sounds like someone is trying to justify his religon...

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2003-05-13 03:11am

Actually GL said his movie is showing there is a God:

George Lucas spoke with Time magazine about his spiritual motivation for creating Star Wars: "I was trying to say in a very simple way, knowing that the film was made for a young audience, that there is a God and there is both a good side and a bad side. You have a choice between them, but the world works better if you’re on the good side. It’s just that simple."

Lucas apparently believes his offerings of the Star Wars saga to the world are God-directed. He is quoted by biographer Dale Pollock: "I am simply trying to struggle through life; trying to do God’s bidding."5

But all the other parallels are not from Lucas' intention, I suppose, because we all know Jedi evolved from a Japanese sound, not from Jesus Disciples. SW is not made by Lucas alone. The Zen teachings are in because of Yoda (and we know Yoda's teaching originates from Zen, one of the fillmakers recalled that from a speech with GL, I think(. There is more. Still, as Lucas said, if he was trying to say there is a God, the only question is, which God he was referring to. That is an easy answer, I suppose.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-05-13 03:19am

Moved to SLAM.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-05-13 03:40am

Since the Force resembles the Tao more closely than any other religion, I think it is absurd to believe that Star Wars is Christian. And the notion of the "noble sacrifice and redemption" being an exclusively Christian idea is just egocentrism.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-05-13 03:43am

Fundie criticism normally labels SW as being "pan-theistic", and abhorently un-christian.

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-05-13 04:35am

There ARE some biblical refferences in SW, you have to admit. Anakin's immaculate conception, Luke being named after a person in the Bible, uh...OK that's all I can think of.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-13 09:13am

Star Wars is Christian in the same way the Matrix is: It's based off the same basic plot that the myth of Jesus is, so of course fundie Christians cut out the middle and claim it's direct.

Darth Gojira · Post by **Darth Gojira** » 2003-05-13 09:27am

I hate it when people can't see the forest for the trees.
Darth Wong; I'm afraid a lot of Christians think that way. I am still looking for a good page on Mithraism to show my Christian family
Sir Nitram; you have it right on the mark. A lot of Christians (and even some Jews and Muslims) think that everything that their religion did was unique
.

That's it! *emails Grudge-Match his idea for a Jeshua vs. Kung Fu Tze match*

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-05-13 09:41am

Darth Wong wrote:Since the Force resembles the Tao more closely than any other religion, I think it is absurd to believe that Star Wars is Christian..

There are some holes in the SW-Christianity analogy:

Anakin is supposed to be "The Chosen One" like Jesus, but Jesus never became evil, at least not intentionally. Jesus neither had any children.

It's more likely that Star Wars draws upon universal mythical themes, rather than ones unique to Christianity.

The Imperial Creed of Warhammer 40K, on the other hand, is a by-the-book copy of medieval Catholicism. (Superstition, holy relics, the Sisters of Battle's obvious resemblance to heavily armed nuns, crusade mentality, the Inquisition, fanatical and militant monotheism, intolerance of everything alien, need I go on??)

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-05-13 12:50pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:There ARE some biblical refferences in SW, you have to admit. Anakin's immaculate conception, Luke being named after a person in the Bible, uh...OK that's all I can think of.

What about Darth Maul's resemblance to medieval depictions of the Devil??

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2003-05-13 03:49pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:There ARE some biblical refferences in SW, you have to admit. Anakin's immaculate conception, Luke being named after a person in the Bible, uh...OK that's all I can think of.

The immaculate conception is easy to explain in both cases: the mother didn't want people to know it was the milkman.

Macross · Post by **Macross** » 2003-05-13 04:21pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:There ARE some biblical refferences in SW, you have to admit. Anakin's immaculate conception, Luke being named after a person in the Bible, uh...OK that's all I can think of.

Immaculate conception and the idea of "The Chosen One" are not Christian ideas. As another poster pointed out, they are universal mythological concepts, and they appear in many myths that predate Christianity. Christinaity often took bits and pieces of other religeons and myths to make it more appealing to the people they were trying to convert. Im not even sure if Christiniaty ever came up with an idea that was truly its own.

It just really pisses me off when Christians try to take claim to ideas and concepts that predate their religeon by hundreds of years.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-05-13 04:48pm

There is no such thing as an immaculate conception. The reality is Mary was a sleeping arround or Joseph sampled the goods before marriage and denied knowledge due to Mary's dad being a big fucker.

Admiral Johnason · Post by **Admiral Johnason** » 2003-05-13 06:01pm

Darth Wong wrote:Since the Force resembles the Tao more closely than any other religion, I think it is absurd to believe that Star Wars is Christian. And the notion of the "noble sacrifice and redemption" being an exclusively Christian idea is just egocentrism.

Mike, don't mean to be rude, but GL say that it resembles Christianity because it is designed after it. I have that issue of TIme where he points out why and the little details.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-05-13 07:55pm

On another thought...if a woman did immaculately conceive, wouldnt the offspring be female? Where would the x chromosome come from?

oh...and "woo" for SW being pantheistic

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-05-13 08:38pm

Macross wrote:
UltraViolence83 wrote:There ARE some biblical refferences in SW, you have to admit. Anakin's immaculate conception, Luke being named after a person in the Bible, uh...OK that's all I can think of.
Immaculate conception and the idea of "The Chosen One" are not Christian ideas. As another poster pointed out, they are universal mythological concepts, and they appear in many myths that predate Christianity. Christinaity often took bits and pieces of other religeons and myths to make it more appealing to the people they were trying to convert. Im not even sure if Christiniaty ever came up with an idea that was truly its own.

It just really pisses me off when Christians try to take claim to ideas and concepts that predate their religeon by hundreds of years.

personally, Id love to see a list of what its done.

Queeb Salaron · Post by **Queeb Salaron** » 2003-05-13 09:01pm

Macross wrote:Immaculate conception and the idea of "The Chosen One" are not Christian ideas. As another poster pointed out, they are universal mythological concepts, and they appear in many myths that predate Christianity. Christinaity often took bits and pieces of other religeons and myths to make it more appealing to the people they were trying to convert. Im not even sure if Christiniaty ever came up with an idea that was truly its own.

It just really pisses me off when Christians try to take claim to ideas and concepts that predate their religeon by hundreds of years.

Immaculate conception originated in Ancient Greece. Athena was born of Zeus' head. And I'm pretty sure that that Zeus was conceived by one of the Titans. And the Titans were conceived by... um... Earth. I'm not up-to-date with my Greek Creation myths, but that's how I remember it. I could be wrong.

As for the concept of the Messiah, the Egyptians had worshipped a "God-man" for hundreds of years before Moses picked a fight with him. What was so special about Jesus? SON of God? Hah! Egyptian Pharoahs WERE gods. Take THAT, biznatch!

Heh. Ready? Jesus vs. Ra (the sun god, not the band): Who wins?

Arrow · Post by **Arrow** » 2003-05-13 09:19pm

Rye wrote:On another thought...if a woman did immaculately conceive, wouldnt the offspring be female? Where would the x chromosome come from?

Ya know, that's a good question. I'd like to see some try to answer that. I'll have to remember that.

Macross · Post by **Macross** » 2003-05-13 10:58pm

Queeb Salaron wrote:Immaculate conception originated in Ancient Greece. Athena was born of Zeus' head. And I'm pretty sure that that Zeus was conceived by one of the Titans. And the Titans were conceived by... um... Earth. I'm not up-to-date with my Greek Creation myths, but that's how I remember it. I could be wrong.

As for the concept of the Messiah, the Egyptians had worshipped a "God-man" for hundreds of years before Moses picked a fight with him. What was so special about Jesus? SON of God? Hah! Egyptian Pharoahs WERE gods. Take THAT, biznatch!

Heh. Ready? Jesus vs. Ra (the sun god, not the band): Who wins?

My mythology is a bit rusty, but I believe the immaculate conception goes back even farther then the Greeks, all the way back to Sumarian/Babylonian Mythology.

And the 12 Titans of Ancient Greece were born from Gaia, a mother earth goddess, and Gaia was born from Chaos (heres another example of immaculate conception). There is some question as to whether Chaos was an actual physical diety. Most sources describe him as a nothingness, a sort primordial universe, from which Gaia was born.

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-05-14 01:17am

Macross wrote:And the 12 Titans of Ancient Greece were born from Gaia, a mother earth goddess, and Gaia was born from Chaos (heres another example of immaculate conception). There is some question as to whether Chaos was an actual physical diety. Most sources describe him as a nothingness, a sort primordial universe, from which Gaia was born.

Well actually, that's kinda true...

Didn't the Earth come out of the insuing order that in turn came out of the chaos of the formation of the solar system, which came out of the chaos of a nearby dying star, etc etc?

finally a creation myth that makes some sense.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-14 01:21am

UltraViolence83 wrote:
Macross wrote:And the 12 Titans of Ancient Greece were born from Gaia, a mother earth goddess, and Gaia was born from Chaos (heres another example of immaculate conception). There is some question as to whether Chaos was an actual physical diety. Most sources describe him as a nothingness, a sort primordial universe, from which Gaia was born.
Well actually, that's kinda true...

Didn't the Earth come out of the insuing order that in turn came out of the chaos of the formation of the solar system, which came out of the chaos of a nearby dying star, etc etc?

finally a creation myth that makes some sense.

And following Gaia's creation from the chaos, rain fell on Gaia, and life came forth..

And after Earth formed and cooled, rain fell on the planet and became oceans, where life originated...

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-05-14 01:26am

See? It's not so hard. Now if only we could convice the fundamentalists of this world...

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-14 01:46am

UltraViolence83 wrote:See? It's not so hard. Now if only we could convice the fundamentalists of this world...

Pity it starts to fall apart after that.

Eh, we lived two thousand years too late, my friend.