What a load of shit...

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-05-20 11:04pm

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... May18.html

Tracking Hate Groups Aids Terrorism Fight
Federal Agents Turn to Domestic Front

By Maria Glod and Jerry Markon
Washington Post Staff Writers
Monday, May 19, 2003; Page B01

Armed federal agents slipped silently into place around Byron Calvert Cecchini's Leesburg home. They pounded on the door, rousing the self-described white supremacist from bed. For several hours, the agents scoured the house, loading his computer, Rolodex and files into a Ryder truck.

The FBI began investigating Cecchini because of his ties to one of the largest neo-Nazi groups in the United States. In an affidavit seeking a warrant for the pre- dawn raid this year, an agent wrote that Cecchini had a "violent criminal history" and probably owned weapons.

Agents found no weapons, but they found something they were looking for -- T-shirts with a Nike swoosh logo that substitutes the word "Nazi" for Nike. Cecchini is facing possible charges of trademark violations, said law enforcement sources, who spoke on the condition that they not be named.

"You prosecute what you can prosecute," one law enforcement source said.

It is a tactic being used with increasing success nationwide as authorities step up efforts to curb domestic hate and terror groups: prosecute any illegal activity by known extremists and, at the same time, work to infiltrate potentially dangerous groups to guard against future attacks.

Even as dismantling al Qaeda remains the clear priority of terrorism task forces, agents have been ordered to be vigilant about domestic groups. "The focus on international terrorism is obvious, but September 11th has made us examine all security issues," a law enforcement official said. "You can't make the number one goal preventing attacks against the U.S. and not look at a danger that could be posed here at home."

The terrorism task forces are homing in on all groups, including militia movements and even environmental and animal rights organizations.

But the efforts have had the greatest impact on neo-Nazi and white supremacist groups. In recent months, prominent white supremacists have been indicted in several states, including Pennsylvania, Georgia and Washington, and news of their arrests has resulted in a frenzy of anti-government exchanges on neo-Nazi and other racist Web sites.

In Pennsylvania, an Aryan Nation member who expressed anti-Semitic beliefs on the Internet in an open letter of support to Saddam Hussein was indicted on weapons charges in March. And a leader of the White Knights of Pennsylvania is accused of plotting to bomb abortion clinics.

"The government's efforts in investigating domestic terrorism have stepped up since September 11th," said Mary Beth Buchanan, the U.S. attorney in Pittsburgh who chairs Attorney General John D. Ashcroft's advisory committee of U.S. attorneys. "We are taking every incident much more seriously, and we are analyzing it more closely."

Weapons charges also were filed against a Washington state man with ties to the white supremacist group Christian Identity and a Wisconsin man who came to the attention of authorities when he e-mailed photos of himself holding an AK-47 while standing in front of a flag with a swastika.

"The radical right from coast to coast is in near-hysteria over the arrests," said Mark Potok, who tracks extremist groups for the Southern Poverty Law Center.

The White Revolution group postponed a February meeting, explaining on its Web site that leaders believed the government was "eager to use any pretext against white nationalists to arrest or raid or detain us."

On another Internet site, Edgar J. Steele, a lawyer who has represented the Aryan Nation, wrote: "There is a roundup taking place . . . how long before they get to you?"

On his Web site, www.tightrope.cc, Cecchini talks about the "persecution" of those who share his views. "If any government thinks it can stop an idea whose time has come with pre-dawn raids and lengthy prison sentences, they have miscalculated," he wrote.

Cecchini, a former National Alliance member who broke with the group and created Tightrope, acknowledged that his views are offensive to many. He said, however, that he is not a danger to anyone and is "absolutely not involved in anything illegal."

"I don't mind being called a racist or a Nazi," Cecchini said in an interview. "I'm not offended if people don't like what I think."

Tightrope's Web site, which is rife with anti-Semitic and racist language, includes a "lynching section" with graphic photos. In "healthier times," Cecchini wrote on the site, rapists and killers were "almost sure to face the ruthless wrath of a mob of enraged Aryan men both willing and able to inflict a horrible death."

On the Tightrope site, Cecchini compares nonwhites to the snakehead, a predatory fish found in a Crofton pond last summer that threatened to wipe out native species.

"It's still legal to be a member of a group and associate with whoever you want to associate with and have views that may be unpopular," Cecchini said in the interview. "This is still America."

David Trainor, an attorney for Chester Doles, a Georgia National Alliance member facing trial on weapons charges, said he's concerned that his client was investigated because of his affiliation with white supremacist groups. According to court records, Doles, who has a prior conviction that bars him from owning firearms, was arrested after an informant reported seeing him with weapons.

"Is he partly being prosecuted because of his membership in the National Alliance? The answer is yes," Trainor said. "I think that the basis for going after him is his words."

Law enforcement officials say that they are not trampling on free speech rights but that they must keep close watch over groups or individuals who advocate violence. "We make sure that we don't unnecessarily curb an individual's right to exercise their free speech, but you have to listen to what they say and watch what they do to see if they stepped over the line into criminal activity," Buchanan said.

Federal law enforcement officials say fighting domestic terrorism has always been a priority, if somewhat less visible in recent years amid the highly publicized war against al Qaeda and other international terrorist groups.

In response to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, the number of FBI-led joint terrorism task forces rose from 44 to 66. The Justice Department's 93 anti-terrorism task forces, run out of every U.S. attorney's office, coordinate the effort and keep in touch with officials at Justice headquarters in Washington.

The result is a much larger number of people investigating terrorism. More agents on the street means more domestic terrorism suspects are scooped up, along with those suspected of aiding al Qaeda or other international groups.

"Even as we fight the war on international terrorism and work to prevent another attack like September 11th," said Bryan Sierra, a Justice Department spokesman, "the Department of Justice is also making every effort to shut down hate groups and homegrown terrorists before they, too, can act violently on their hatred."

In a February 2002 statement to a U.S. Senate committee, Dale L. Watson, then the FBI's chief of counterterrorism and counterintelligence, named the National Alliance, World Church of the Creator and Aryan Nation, among others, as groups that present a "continuing terrorist threat."

Although federal agents use such tactics as electronic surveillance and wiretapping to fight all forms of terrorism, there are differences in how they confront the homegrown variety. Finding informants is easier, they say, because there are no language and cultural barriers, such as those that have hurt the government's efforts to infiltrate al Qaeda.

According to court records, FBI agents from Philadelphia recruited a confidential informant who provided the details that led to the March indictment of David Wayne Hull. Pennsylvania authorities said Hull is a member of White Knights of Pennsylvania and has ties to the Ku Klux Klan. According to court documents, an informant said Hull, who is charged with firearms violations, wanted to buy grenades and spoke of a plan to bomb abortion clinics.

Daniel Levitas, who wrote "The Terrorist Next Door," a book about Timothy McVeigh, said right-wing extremist groups have a record of carrying out violent acts. But in most cases, he said, their "rhetoric is wildly disproportional" to any real violence.

Cecchini said he has committed no crimes and thinks the authorities were "intelligence gathering."

"I guess I'm out of step with the current age, but all through history, a lot of the views I hold were mainstream. . . . Now we're the wackos and the criminals," Cecchini said.

Metro researcher Bobbye Pratt contributed to this report.

*********************

You know, that charge is BULLSHIT. I mean christ, what are they doing
about the loads of tee-shirt vendors in DC on the National Mall who
sell Calvin and Hobbes teeshirts illegally?

Get them for the real stuff, such as weapons charges, such in the case
of the National Alliance member who was prohibited from accessing
firearms due to a past conviction.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-05-20 11:11pm

That...isnt legal....

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-05-20 11:25pm

how can they arrest someone for their beliefs? he doesnt appear to have advocated outright violence against anyone.

Axis Kast · Post by **Axis Kast** » 2003-05-20 11:49pm

How is this legal? The man committed copyright violation. Like the FBI said, you get him for anything you can.

The man is a self-admitted racist member of a neo-Nazi organization. The same people who burn crosses in their spare time. How the fuck can you continually defend these asscaps?!

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-05-20 11:58pm

The man did commit the crimes he's being charged with. So freaking what? So long as they did it legally I have no problem with some peice of Neo-Nazi trash getting tossed into the slammer.

Nailing people for minor crimes is not a new tactic. They nailed Capone for tax and mail fraud after all. That they use it for potential domestic terrorists isn't suprising.

And Shep, before you claim these people are harmless I'd like to remind you these are the same sort as Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols. Why not nail them for crimes they did commit?

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-05-21 12:04am

the question is "did they have a warrant?"

I hate nazis with an all-consuming loathing hatred. But without a warrant, the FBI was out of bounds according to the constitution.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-05-21 12:09am

I see absolutely nothing to suggest they didn't have a warrant, and something to support the fact that they since they filed an affidavit for one.

The Albino Raven · Post by **The Albino Raven** » 2003-05-21 12:17am

how can they arrest someone for their beliefs? he doesnt appear to have advocated outright violence against anyone.

Not quite... Here's what the article said about the man's website

Tightrope's Web site, which is rife with anti-Semitic and racist language, includes a "lynching section" with graphic photos. In "healthier times," Cecchini wrote on the site, rapists and killers were "almost sure to face the ruthless wrath of a mob of enraged Aryan men both willing and able to inflict a horrible death

Thats a euphamism for "I wanna kill people I don't like". If the Feds can find a way to prosecute him, I must say, good for them. There comes a point where ones morals, in this situation, morals about using the legal system correctly and justly, are outweighed by one's self interests, and since criminals find loopholes in the law, by working inside the law, you are guarnateed to fail. Morally, I take some objection to it, but it is fair in this case.

The Albino Raven · Post by **The Albino Raven** » 2003-05-21 12:19am

Since they are actually charging him with something that he did that was illegal, (and actually, rather serious in terms of the penalty) then I am ok with it. I will say I am not ok with people being detained without being charged however. (e.g. some Arab Americans post 9/11)

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-05-21 12:49am

Stormbringer wrote: And Shep, before you claim these people are harmless I'd like to remind you these are the same sort as Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols.

Oh so now we're going to arrest people for crimes they're going to commit
in the future or possibly will commit in the future?

The part of the article that did catch my eye was the "copyright violation BS".

You ever been to Washington DC? Let me tell you, the Street vendors who sell
tee shirts near the national monuments commit copyright violations on a
scale that this pissant racist never will reach in his life, and they're left
alone, despite brazen violations of copyrights (calvin and hobbes in particular).

This tack of finding even the most minimal bullshit to haul someone off
to jail spanks of sloppy police work. Oh gee, here's a white supremacist,
ooh, he might be armed, so lets get the SWAT team to take him down!

And what do you have to show for it, just a bunch of bullshit books
(which isn't a crime), and you end up with egg on your face.

Oh no, he had a bunch of teeshirts with the Nike lettering on the logos
replaced with "Nazis"! Let's get him for copyright violations!

Piss-Poor Police work all around here.

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2003-05-21 01:50am

Oh no, he had a bunch of teeshirts with the Nike lettering on the logos
replaced with "Nazis"! Let's get him for copyright violations!

That's not even a copyright violation. It sounds like a parody to me, and parody is protected speech under the 1st amendment.

Rubberanvil · Post by **Rubberanvil** » 2003-05-21 02:16am

Glocksman wrote:

That's not even a copyright violation. It sounds like a parody to me, and parody is protected speech under the 1st amendment.

As much as I hate the Neo-Nazis, the T-shirts with a Nike swoosh logo that substitutes the word "Nazi" is also a parody item.

The crack-up do me bothers as it is stirring up a hornets nest right when the last thing the Government needs is for them to go batshit.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-05-21 03:35am

You know what they got Al Capone on? Tax Fraud.

They found a bad guy and got him with what they could. Sleazy tactic, but he's off the streets.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-05-21 03:39am

Calling something a parody does not necessarily make it a parody. It has to be perceptible as an object intended for either humourous purposes or serious criticism, neither of which apply to this Nazi bullshit.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-05-21 03:43am

CaptainChewbacca wrote: They found a bad guy and got him with what they could. Sleazy tactic, but he's off the streets.

Like you should be talking here, CaptainChewtoy.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-05-21 03:52am

MKSheppard wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote: They found a bad guy and got him with what they could. Sleazy tactic, but he's off the streets.
Like you should be talking here, CaptainChewtoy.

Oh the things I could say if I hadn't made a promise to a good man...

*walks into the mists*

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2003-05-21 05:31am

MKSheppard wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote: They found a bad guy and got him with what they could. Sleazy tactic, but he's off the streets.
Like you should be talking here, CaptainChewtoy.

Don't carry grievances to other threads. He has agreed to drop the subject.